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Dogra "unsung hero?"

rvwnk : 8/13/2011 3:20 pm
The Unsung Hero In The Nnamdi Asomugha Acquisition: Ben Dogra

"The Eagles went into free agency knowing what they wanted to pay for Asomugha and they wouldn't go any higher than that. They expressed their interest and intentions to Dogra and they requested that their interest be kept secret from the public. Dogra complied and never mentioned the Eagles to anyone--not even his client--until the very last minute. Jon Tamari of the Philadelphia Inquirer also points out that Dogra "didn't even tell his assistant who reviews contracts about the possible deal until after it was announced."

I was a real estate broker who earned a living representing office tenants against landlords. I know something about what it means to putt your client's interests ahead of your own. I strongly believe that Ben Dogra keeping Nnamdi Asomugha in the dark about the Eagle offer is clearly not living up to his responsibilities. He was clearly representing the Eagles primarily and not Nnamdi. Nnamdi might have wanted to end up somewhere else all things being close to equal. Once he knew what the Eagles were planning to pay, he could have insisted on giving another team to have the opportunity to match.

The circumstances make me think that Dogra used the same technique in negotiating with the Giants. Steve Smith had a good relationship with the Giants. If he and his agent had spoken to the Giants about what they needed to pay, they would at least have bid higher. The fact that that didn't happen certainly makes it look like Steve Smith was kept in the dark when he visited the Giants.

Ben Dogra's tactics indicate that his priority was making the Eagles happy, not his client Steve Smith. The article in an Phily publication, trys to make Ben Dogra look like an "unsung hero". I think, instead, it makes him look like someone. lacking in integrity, who in this instance put his own financial interests ahead of his clients.
Makes  
MookGiants : 8/13/2011 3:23 pm : link
him look like an awful agent. Something is very, very fishy here.

He should have his clients interests, and only his clients interests, in mind when negotiating.

That's proven not to be the case
Talked about it a bit yesterday  
Pizbo : 8/13/2011 3:33 pm : link
Whatever happened, you can bet that Reese and other GM's have taken notice.

You can argue that Dogra was in a pinch but he really wasn't, all it takes is a phone call.
got a link...  
Dan in the Springs : 8/13/2011 3:40 pm : link
for those quotes?
story here  
GMenLTS : 8/13/2011 3:42 pm : link
.
Link - ( New Window )
That's two instances...  
BigBlue779 : 8/13/2011 3:47 pm : link
I said it yesterday- if it turns out that he didn't relay that 35m offer to Smith early last year or the Giants intentions to possibly match any offer last week he will be in deep shit both professionally and financially with the potential of being sued.

Now we hear he isn't telling clients of offers- what would have happened if the Eagles turned around and said no thanks at the last minute- and there was a mega deal on the table the whole time that came to light.

This is just the tip of this iceberg. Two things will happen. Dogra will wise up and be more discreet - maybe stop keeping offers from clients- OR- his ego will keep him doing the same thing - and he will go down in flames- and it will be a HUGE black eye to the sport
Can someone  
muhajir : 8/13/2011 4:18 pm : link
Link all of this to Steves Facebook or twitter so he can fire this guy??
How does one equate  
sphinx : 8/13/2011 4:20 pm : link
Sports Illustrated's Peter King tweeted that Dogra thinks of his client first and then himself.

and

All of this is more reason to appreciate what Ben Dogra did for the Eagles.?

If he was my agent  
mrvax : 8/13/2011 4:38 pm : link
I'd fire him. Putting a team's interest above the player he represents is failing in his position.

What if the Pats offered 5M this year for Steve Smith and he will never know about it?
Why wouldn't Dogra  
CT Charlie : 8/13/2011 5:36 pm : link
want the most money for his client? Aren't agents paid a percentage of the total package?
You guys don't understand...  
eagles nut : 8/13/2011 5:44 pm : link
how the Eagles work. In most cases, they're not going to allow an agent to use them as a negotiating tool with another team. There's no shopping of an offer. They told Dogra that if it leaked they were interested in Asomugha, then any interest they had would cease to exist. They had had some discussion with Dogra about Asomugha but their contract offer wasn't sufficient. Asomugha really wanted to play with Philly and that's what eventually led to a deal. Now I don't know if Asomugha could have made more elsewhere or not but if Dogra had played any games such as the Eagles are offering this much money, can you top it then the Eagles would no longer be involved. It's likely the same deal with Smith. The Eagles were willing to make a fair possibly above-market deal to Smith but that offer was probably a one-time thing that had to be immediately agreed to and it was gone if they tried to see if the Giants would match.

Basically the Eagles and Dogra are able to do business with each other because he understands how they works and they have a long-term trust factor with him dating back to the Jon Runyan deal. Runyan had verbally agreed with the Eagles and the Titans tried to get back into it at the last minute by offering a little more but Dogra and Runyan kept their word.
The Jets  
giantsfan39 : 8/13/2011 5:49 pm : link
deal was 3 year 30 million. Asomugha went where the money was. He wanted to play for Philly is bullshit.
Was Jerry Jones & Cows  
mrvax : 8/13/2011 6:01 pm : link
a victim of Dorga too?
Asomugha wanted to be a Cowboy - ( New Window )
Will the beating end  
tinopuno : 8/13/2011 6:01 pm : link
if this horse revives?
Why wouldn't Dogra want the most money  
rvwnk : 8/13/2011 6:09 pm : link
There is more to being an agent than just dollars. Steve Smith hopefully cares about his relationship with the Giants, and probably doesn't like the way he left. The Giants were waiting for another opportunity to bid, and their being deprived of that chance. That leaves both Giant's management and Giant fans with a bad taste in the mouth.

Dogra appears to have been playing the role of the Pied Pipper. Leading his quality players to the Eagles while keeping them unaware of what he knew was going to happen, until after it happened. That way, he was more confident that he could deliver them. Along the way, his silence may have cost his players money, by eliminating possible competition. If the Giant's knew it would take a $2 million guarantee to resign Smith, how do we know they wouldn't have paid it?
eagles nut  
BigBlue779 : 8/13/2011 6:14 pm : link
So basically you are saying that the Eagles don't negotiate with prospective free agents...that they just "make an offer" and say take it or leave it and don't you dare try to leverage it or it's off the table.

If you really think that then you are as naive as Vince Young calling a team that has 0 Lombardi's a dream team.

Dogra's in a sticky spot- if ANY of this is true, he runs the risk of losing not only his agent credentials but his law license as well.

To answer the question as to why he would be willing to withhold offers from clients there are many reasons, #1 and most likely is a nice yearly kickback. While a standard agent commission on a 10 million dollar contract is nice, knowing that you have a steady 1 million yearly PLUS perhaps a higher under the table commission for any clients that you steer to one specific franchise (ahem...Eagles)...could be more lucrative.

I'm telling you I don't care about Steve Smith being an Eagle- in fact I feel terrible for him since he is going to wind up ruining any possible career that he has left by being rushed onto the field by a questionable medical staff of a team that essentially signed him to a 1 year deal to try to squeeze any last drop of juice from the orange and then throw away the remains.

What I do care about is that this reeks of something much much bigger and worse...something that could potentially kill a franchise. Think the 49ers of the 90's x 100.

Serious Serious stuff.

Like I said in my post, yesterday ....  
Manny in CA : 8/13/2011 6:24 pm : link
I smell a rat.

Sure the agent gets a percentage of what the player gets, (so it makes sense to deliver him to the highest bidder); but what if the Eagle told him ...

"You deliver all these guys to us, keep them away from everybody else, and we'll make worthwhile for YOU [wink]; now run-along little puppy, and keep this to yourself".

So, OK then, he's just not screwing the Giants, Dallas and who else ? No wonder he feels the need to be so stealthy.
He is an unsung hero for the Giants  
KWALL : 8/13/2011 6:29 pm : link
Giants didn't have to spend money on Smith. It's time to move on with Cruz and the others at WR3.
the whole point is  
jake : 8/13/2011 6:31 pm : link
that the agent is in the pocket of the eagles in this case because he is holding their confidence but not doing it for another team that may make a bid, for instence suppose the cowboys offered $3mil garuarnte he would go back to the eagles and tell them about a higher bid and let the make a counter offer meamwhile the cowboys don't know there's another bid out there so they are in fact biding against themselves so in this case only one side knows what's going on and not the other side because he will never tell the cowboys of another bid, something smells to high heaven and i think it deserves some kind of investigation
Eagles don't negotiate  
rvwnk : 8/13/2011 6:39 pm : link
I didn't say that the Eagles don't negotiate, I said that it appears that they got cooperation from an agent, that doesn't share all the information he has with the people he is supposed to be working for. That is quite different than what you suggested in your recent post.
All your guys' lame conspiracy theories  
eagles nut : 8/13/2011 8:17 pm : link
are just whining because the Eagles have acquired quality players. As far as Asomugha goes, the fact that the Eagles said that their offer was off the table if it leaked they were interested in Asomugha is documented in the media with actual quotes from the players involved. As far as Smith goes, I don't have anyway of knowing what actually was involved in the negotiations but teams generally discuss parameters with agents but as far as a formal offer goes it often includes a time limit so the agent simply doesn't shop that offer to another team. Look at all the free agents the Eagles signed. Were there media reports of any of them beforehand except for Babin with the well-established Washburn connection? It came out after he re-signed with Dallas that the Eagles made a run at signing Doug Free but everything else was top secret security level wise. If the Eagles negotiating strategy wasn't as I suggest, then how do you account for that?

Specifically relating to Asomugha, the one poster who said the Eagles simply offered Asomugha the most might be correct. It is true that Asomugha said Philly was his first choice but I'm sure a lot of players/agents tell teams they were their first choice and vice versa. I haven't seen anything concrete on what the Jets were offering. Dallas was reportedly in the $10M+/year range if Jerry Jones can be believed. I realize there are different posters with different opinions here, but it's kind of funny to hear an argument that Philly wasn't the team Asomugha wanted to play for and it was all about money while at the same time reading arguments that Asomugha's agent must have been screwing him and not telling him of other team's allegedly richer offers.
eagle fan  
GMenLTS : 8/13/2011 8:30 pm : link
go away?
Eagle Nut says lame theories?  
rvwnk : 8/13/2011 9:26 pm : link
Ben Dogra admits that he kept the Eagle's future offer from the guy he was working for along with everyone else. Why would he do that? Why would he follow the instructions he received from the Eagles to the letter. He doesn't work for them? Why didn't he tell his true employer what he knew until the last moment?

Do you think that it was appropriate for Ben Dogra and the Eagles to be working together, while Ben Dogra was pretending to be working for the player? Both Dogra and the Eagles should be embarrassed for behaving inappropriately imo.





why do  
MookGiants : 8/13/2011 9:26 pm : link
we let any Eagle scumbag fans on this site? Fuck you eagles nut, and fuck every cock sucking Eagle fan on the planet
there's really no other way to spin dogra right now  
GMenLTS : 8/13/2011 9:33 pm : link
other than he is in the eagles' back pocket

you can try and spin it another way, but every action and result from his clients and himself paint a pretty clear picture.

That's OK though. Karma's a bitch.
I can understand Dogra keeping the offer from the media  
Greg from LI : 8/13/2011 9:47 pm : link
That makes sense. Teams do operate that way.

What makes no sense at all is why he kept the offer away from his client.
WIll never understand why Eagle fans would post on a Giants MB.  
arcarsenal : 8/13/2011 10:07 pm : link
I wouldn't waste 2 seconds of my life on an Eagles board let alone register and post on one.
Ben Dogra's Karma  
rvwnk : 8/13/2011 10:17 pm : link
I bet Ben's Karma is that he won't close to signing one of his clients up with the New York Giants next year.

Does anyone think that Steve Smith may choose a different agent to represent him in the future. (If he has any desire to possibly sign back up with the Giants in the future, he probably needs to illustrate that he was unhappy with how the Giants were treated without respect.
Greg  
Milton : 8/13/2011 10:25 pm : link
Quote:
What makes no sense at all is why he kept the offer away from his client.
Maybe because clients can't keep their mouths shut and he was afraid that word would get out and the Eagles would rescind their offer.

The Giants did the same thing when Plaxico's former agent shopped their offer in 2005. They pulled it. Plaxico had to fire his agent and hire a new one before the Giants would resume negotiations. And how do you think the Giants felt when Rod Coleman's agent took an offer that they had agreed on and shopped it to Atlanta?

The Eagles are smart and Dogra is doing what's best for his clients. And the Patriots are the same way. It's understood by agents that if the Patriots interest in one of their clients becomes public, any possible deal is off the table.
Milton  
MookGiants : 8/13/2011 10:26 pm : link
I think he's talking about Smith not being made aware of the Giants offer to Smith during the season before he got hurt
Mook  
Milton : 8/13/2011 10:36 pm : link
We really don't know the details of that supposed offer. There were a bunch of rules in the old CBA that made it damn near impossible to give an extension to one of your players during the uncapped year. If Dogra didn't tell Smith about it, it was probably because it was a bad deal in terms of the guaranteed money.

With it being an uncapped year and the lockout looming, Smith was just in the wrong place at the wrong time (like a lot of guys around the league) for negotiating a contract extension. From everything I read last year, it was pretty much understood that Smith would have to wait until free agency to get a reasonable deal. The shame of it was that he got seriously injured in 2010.
"Word would get out"  
rvwnk : 8/13/2011 10:52 pm : link
"Maybe because clients can't keep their mouths shut and he was afraid that word would get out and the Eagles would rescind their offer."

An agent is employed by a player and the "employer" is entitled to know what the agent knows. If he doesn't, then the player has no imput into what his how he wants to proceed. The agent doesn't have the right to pretend he is the player's father and make a decision like leaving the player out of the loop.

I'd like to Ben explain to Steve Smith that he didn't include him in the loop because he was afraid Steve Smith would screw things up. How do you think Steve would react to being informed that his agent thought he was going to screw things up.

If you read the quotes from those involved...  
Milton : 8/13/2011 10:53 pm : link
The Giants made Smith a "conservative" offer, meaning they made him an offer with the assumption there was no real market for him and that they could dictate the terms of the deal in a way that protected the Giants, but not Smith. They felt they had all the leverage and were taking advantage of the fact, given there was no telling if Smith would ever be the same.

Dogra told the Giants there was a market for Smith (without telling them the team) during Smith's last visit, but the Giants just thought it was agent talk. Now after the fact, Coughlin is complaining that nobody told the Giants there was competition. But the Giants were told, they just didn't believe it.

This was a case of the Giants misreading the market and not wanting to pay any more than they thought was necessary for one of their own. Reese claims that the Giants made reasonable offers to all of their players, but if the offer they made Smith was so reasonable, why are they complaining after the fact that they weren't given a chance to match a competitive offer?

The Giants should've made Smith a competitive offer from the get-go. For four years he played under a late second rounders contract, while performing like a first round pick and helping the team win a Super Bowl (and then getting injured "in the line of duty" at the most inopportune time). The Giants should've rewarded him. Instead they low-balled him because they thought they could get away with it.

This one is on the Giants, not Smith, and not Dogra. When Smith was asking for loyalty, the Giants said it's strictly business. Now we have Smith saying it's strictly business and the Giants (or their fans) claiming "where's the loyalty?" Loyalty is a two-way street.
rvwnk  
Milton : 8/13/2011 10:57 pm : link
Quote:
I'd like to Ben explain to Steve Smith that he didn't include him in the loop because he was afraid Steve Smith would screw things up. How do you think Steve would react to being informed that his agent thought he was going to screw things up.
He probably said, "thank you and here's your cut," but it's between the two of them. I doubt you'll be reading that Smith fired Dogra any time soon. Or ever.
I doubt you will hear that Smith fires Dogra  
rvwnk : 8/13/2011 11:31 pm : link
Unless Smith fires Dogra, it is strong evidence that he is okay with they way the Giants were treated by his agent. If Steve Smith has injuries for the best part of this year, I think Smith would be well served to preserve an alternative to the Eagles, If the Eagles decide to change their offer to Smith after a weak first year in Phily, he might welcome the option of having Giant's interest as well.
No real market for him  
rvwnk : 8/13/2011 11:49 pm : link
"The Giants made Smith a "conservative" offer, meaning they made him an offer with the assumption there was no real market for him and that they could dictate the terms of the deal in a way that protected the Giants, but not Smith. They felt they had all the leverage and were taking advantage of the fact, given there was no telling if Smith would ever be the same."

The Giants thought they had a good relationship with Steve Smith. Tom Coughlin stated that he thought Steve Smith was going to be a lifetime Giant. No the Giants didn't assume that no one would bid against them. They just assumed that he wanted to return to the Giants and therefore would give the Giant's a chance to match any offer. They were surprised that they didn't get a chance to match.

If Ben Dogra wanted to get the highest amount of money for his client, he could have told the Giants that they were going to talk to the Eagles. That would have persuaded the Giants to bid a higher number. Why did he say they were just going to talk to some other team? Its a much more potent threat when you include a name. If you don't name a team, it misleads the team into assuming it is just an agent talking. I suggest he did it that way because he wanted to make the deal with the Eagles.
Milton  
schristo5278 : 8/14/2011 12:00 am : link
You mention loyalty in this whole thing...towards the end of saying Smith and Dogra have no fault in this whole debacle but it's all the Giants fault.

The Giants organization has no right to ask for loyalty from Smith. They didn't give him the offer he wanted and he or his agent made a business decision.

The Giants fans however do not have to abide by the same rule. The fans have no say in the negotiations. There's no control on any of our part. The only thing we can do is be loyal to our players...particularly one who spent years saying he loved the Giants fans and he would do anything to remain a Giant and sending pictures of empty trophy cases to the Eagles, and so on and so on. The fans constantly supported him during recovery...go through the ridiculous amount of twitter and facebook posts. The fans remained loyal then the guy who preached about loving his fans and doing anything to remain a Giant said I'm going to the division rival because I want more money....

The fans have every right to be upset with him..we all understand he followed the money and its just business but football and the Giants is not about business to us...The Giants fans reacted much the way you would expect..let down by someone they trusted...

Everyone likes to compared Smith to LeBron but let's be honest...Smith is nowhere near that same league. The closest thing you can compare here in every sense is Johnny Damon going from the Sox to the Yankees. It's jumping shit to a division rival for the money..
schristo  
Milton : 8/14/2011 4:18 am : link
Fair enough. Only Kevin Boss seemed to truly give a shit about the fans when he was making his decision.
lmao  
JoeD1 : 8/14/2011 9:43 am : link
this is why i love checking in on this site.


This is by far the best conspiracy theory next to George Bush knocked downt he tower...what's next?

http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/

congrats this post made the front page on my eagles home board. you ugys should check it out its the anti-iggles phan site, not so many dipshits

Hi mook! Tell your mother i said hello as well
This idea...  
Gatorade Dunk : 8/14/2011 10:04 am : link
that anyone who shops the Eagles' offer will have that offer rescinded is ridiculous. There's no way that is the case across the board. For Smith, perhaps - he's a somewhat fungible property with health-related question marks. But if you're going to tell me that the Eagles were going to all of a sudden decide that they weren't going to sign the top CB in free agency on principle because of a negotiating tactic, that's lunacy.

Dogra complied with the Eagles' style likely because they have cap room and are loading up for a run, which meant that by helping to deliver Asomugha, he could call in a favor on other clients, such as Smith.

I'm not saying it's an underhanded scheme by Dogra (I think shit like this happens all the time where teams and agents do each other favors that ultimately leverage one client's value against another), but spare me the bullshit about the Eagles' top secret security clearance negotiating.
LMAO  
CarolinaGreen : 8/14/2011 10:44 am : link
You guys are all a bunch of pathetic losers. Either you're dumb or you just don't hear so good. Nnamdi said he wanted to come tho the Eagles since March. He said he did his research and found that the Eagles were the best organization and he wanted to play for WINNERS. Stop crying and whining like a bunch of little girls. We have dominated you for the last 3 years and we just got even better. Deal with it! Smith was tired of getting curb stomped by the Eagles every year so he jumped ship. If you can't beat em, join em. His agent even told the giants that there was another team that was very interested and the Giants sat on their hands. Don't hate the agent, hate your front office. Oh and by the way... nice game against the Panthers hahahahahaha Losers
Oh yeah one more thing  
CarolinaGreen : 8/14/2011 10:45 am : link
Go fuck yourself MookGiant!!!
So, let's keep eaglesnut and JoeD1 for thoughtful postings  
Kyle : 8/14/2011 10:54 am : link
and kick CarolinaGreen and Mook to the curb.
Haters gonna hate  
CarolinaGreen : 8/14/2011 11:02 am : link
Commence to hating
Hate all you want - ( New Window )
You come here to post a hateful post, then post that picture  
Kyle : 8/14/2011 11:03 am : link
in response to criticism. Rofl.
obvious troll is obvious  
GMenLTS : 8/14/2011 11:04 am : link
and Joe, you just crossed the line bringing up a family members. Keep it between you and mook.
Whatever make you feel better about yourself Kyle  
CarolinaGreen : 8/14/2011 11:09 am : link
I'm glad I could brighten your day with an over-enthusiastic laugh. Go roll around on the floor some more funny guy
If I'm laughing at your actions, you're the "funny guy", not me  
Kyle : 8/14/2011 11:26 am : link
You're not very bright.
JoeD1  
giantsfan39 : 8/14/2011 2:49 pm : link
You love checking in on this site because you are a fucking loser. Go back to your own board fucking moron.
Oh no  
MookGiants : 8/14/2011 2:56 pm : link
JoeD brought out the mom joke.

Die in a fucking fire you cocksucker.
Please tell me  
kevbow85 : 8/14/2011 6:29 pm : link
how a client's best interest is solely tied to money? Cuz that's what you're makin it seem like with this silly conspiracy theory. Nnamdi made it clear to his agent his first choice was to play in Philly, even if it meant turning down more dollars. So essentially Dogra was just doing what his client wanted. Sounds to me like he's looking out for his client. And in the end, Nnamdi still had to sign his contract. So if he was in anyway unhappy about going to Philly or the financial agreement, he didn't have to sign it. Nnamdi and his agent knew what they wanted, and they did everything they could to make it happen
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