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I like Wilson but we should have gone with Glenn

NoGainDayne : 4/27/2012 10:46 am
Don't get me wrong Wilson would have been at the top of my short list after Glenn, I really like him but the fact of the matter is you can always get RBs later and the position of starter is filled already by Bradshaw.

Our run blocking was bad last year, plain and simple. We lost our 2nd best run blocker to boot and it's not as if Glenn wasn't a good value at our spot, he was. A 4 year starter in the SEC and a guy that steps in and really helps us with a weakness. Not to mention Beatty is charged with protecting by far our most valuable asset and he has proven to be inconsistent in various ways. Having a guy that could start or move to RT letting DD move to LT if needed would be prudent. I know the staff is high on Brewer but Glenn is an elite OL talent and the last one available in this draft.

The bottom line is this is all about Eli, Eli thrives off the play action and nobody was respecting our play action game last year. Sure, we can get a guard in later rounds, but not one that you can say, hey, this guy is going to come in start from day 1 and really help our run game.

IMO the Wilson pick is even mitigated by the fact that we have not addressed the problems with our run blocking. We've been letting our OL age and it's the lifeblood of any offense, I hope it doesn't catch up with us.
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My question is,  
Big Blue '56 : 4/27/2012 10:47 am : link
why did every team pass on him in Rd 1 Iirc, many had him going rather early
I agree with you  
Jay on the Island : 4/27/2012 10:48 am : link
I am not questioning Reese but when Glenn and Konz fell to us I was thrilled and shocked when they took Wilson. I know very little about Wilson and I was watching highlights last night after he was selected and I really like the pick.
Agree  
jeff57 : 4/27/2012 10:48 am : link
The problem with the run game was mostly due to the line not opening up holes. Another running back is not going to change that. I would have picked Glenn and the gotten a RB later on.
our o line is so old  
jintz4life : 4/27/2012 10:48 am : link
with our projected starters average age of 29
you are assuming  
UConn4523 : 4/27/2012 10:49 am : link
we won't go OL later in the draft when we almost certainly will. Beatty and Snee were 2nd round picks, everyone else is round 4 or 5 or UDFA. We've done well not overpicking on o-line and I see no reason to change our approach. We will find a guy we like + we have Brewer who they are high on.
With how things shook, I'd have probably preferred OL too, but  
Riggies : 4/27/2012 10:49 am : link
Wilson has the potential to be one of those playmaking backs that make a QB's life easier -- he's the first homerun hitter as a pass catcher they'll have back there in a long time -- and he's one of those RBs that has a chance to still produce behind a less than stellar OL.
Who is the last 350 lb ol  
chris r : 4/27/2012 10:50 am : link
Who has been successful?
We could go OL later on  
jeff57 : 4/27/2012 10:51 am : link
But doesn't mean they'll be as good as Glenn.
I agree  
nicky43 : 4/27/2012 10:51 am : link
Many here keep saying we need to really make this draft count because Eli is starting his PRIME and only has so many years.

Well... then lets make sure we can protect him. We need way more depth and TALENT in the O-Line so we can at least make a hole for the RB.

I admit Wilson looks good after watching the video on him and I'm fine with the pick but really wished we would have addressed the O-Line first.



Glenn has been overrated from the get-go...  
Milton : 4/27/2012 10:51 am : link
There is so much more to being a top OL than having long arms and a good size/speed ratio for your position. Physically, Glenn is the Giants prototype, but mentally he isn't. I would rather Schwartz, J. Martin, or even Silatolu (who may not be the sharpest dude, but has the mental stamina, attitude, and toughness you like in an OL.
I'm sure the Giants agree  
frets : 4/27/2012 10:51 am : link
They must be kicking themselves and I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Reese fired before he screws up the rest of this draft
100% agree  
Stu : 4/27/2012 10:52 am : link
That said, in Reese I trust.
chicke or egg with regards to the running game  
Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy : 4/27/2012 10:52 am : link
Our OL wasntb blocking well but our RBs were also very poor last season. Jacobs was so inconsistent with his burst, some days he looked like the Jacobs of '06 other times he looked ready to retire. And Bradshaw is a warrior, but I have no idea how he was playing with messed up feet like that.

I agree that it's all about protecting Eli and I hope we draft a guard one of these next couple rounds, but I think getting a RB who actually has plus speed will help a lot. How many times did we see Jacobs get tripped up after 7 yards when he could've easily gone 30 yards? It happened so often seemingly atleast once a game. Jacobs turned a lot of 3 yard runs into 7 yard runs during his time with us, but he also turned a lot of 20 yard runs into 7 yard runs. Wilson won't be getting tripped up from behind as easily and that changes the teams offensive chemistry a lot.
I'm psyched to have Wilson  
NoGainDayne : 4/27/2012 10:52 am : link
the work ethic, the athleticism. (clocked at 4.29 at one point at VT) He seems to have great hands too and the production is there. No complaints about him.

BB56. Guards just fall, but only to a certain point. I mean you read the scouting reports on Snee (34th) pick and they sound similar to Glenn. Even a guy like Mankins @ 32 didn't have the scouting report that Glenn did. Guard is definitely more of a luxury especially because you can get starters in the mid rounds, teams with needs at "sexier" positions always try to fill those first.
nicky43  
Milton : 4/27/2012 10:53 am : link
I'm an OL-first guy, too, but you can't reach for one. There are some interesting OL still available in round two and later.
So... what helps the running game more?  
Neverend : 4/27/2012 10:53 am : link
A very good complementary back?

Or a potential dominant left guard?


People will have their opinions on both

but I'd have to go with taking a future guard who you can win with inside for the next 15 years. I'm happy with Wilson though, either would've been fine with me
Carl Nicks is 345  
jeff57 : 4/27/2012 10:54 am : link
He's not too shabby.
Disagree  
FatHeadTommy : 4/27/2012 10:54 am : link
Problem with the run in part was that BJ got slow. He couldnt get to a hole fast enough. Bradshaw plays hurt and that also has to reduce his speed to the hole even though he runs incredibly hard. This kid is a stud and he is going to light it up in NY. A much classier version of TIKI. He is only 20. At 24 or 25 he will be even stronger and tougher than he already is. Watch him guys and enjoy.

We'll get line help tonight.
I don't mind Glenn but there are plenty of questions about him.  
Vin_Cuccs : 4/27/2012 10:55 am : link
He was a OT at Georgia but some seem to think that he is an OG in the NFL. If that is the case, there would be a transition, and even so, he doesn't really fit what the Giants usually look for at OG.

And if you did keep him at OT, he is a RT only. Would a 1st round pick on a RT only prospect be smart when RT prospects usually go lower in the draft?

I like Wilson and I like Glenn but I'm going to trust Reese here. And this is coming from a guy who thinks that maybe they should have went with Stephen Hill.
frets, yeah we won a superbowl  
NoGainDayne : 4/27/2012 10:55 am : link
but it doesn't mean EVERY decision we make is right. Sure will I admit that if it's me up against the Giants staff they will be right more often than me, uh, duh...

But to use that for a basis for not questioning any moves ever is ridiculous. Should we just rule out all dissenting opinions and make everyone pledge allegiance to the Reese?
THe OL  
djm : 4/27/2012 10:56 am : link
played much better in december and beyond. It could use an infusion of talent but the RB position was desperate for talent. Wilson brings the talent in spades. We needed some shiny.

Trust the process. Beatty is fine at LT. Someone capable will emerge at RT. The interior is fine. Boothe, Snee and Baas are as solid as we can hope for. Petrus pushing them and maybe we grab someone today that helps out.

I don't care if this has been posted before  
BBI4LIFE : 4/27/2012 10:56 am : link
because I love it.
Speed kills. - ( New Window )
In Reese I trust  
Optimus-NY : 4/27/2012 10:57 am : link
Giants have earned my support. This year's draft is stocked with Offensive Linemen. They'll get one.
"make everyone pledge allegiance to the Reese?"  
jeff57 : 4/27/2012 10:57 am : link
That's apparently what some people on her want. Why don't we just shut down the board for the duration?
don't be surpirsed if they draft a Guard and tackle both this year  
Optimus-NY : 4/27/2012 10:57 am : link
.
I think Glenn is gonna have back problems  
Phil in LA : 4/27/2012 10:58 am : link
I've seen a lot of pictures where he looks top heavy. Though, if he keeps falling, I'm still interested.
i'm an accountant and not a scout  
GiantsFan84 : 4/27/2012 10:59 am : link
but to me wilson needs to be damn good to justify this pick. it seems like every year running backs come out of nowhere and do well. heck detroit signed kevin smith off the street last year and he played great.

so to me if you invest a 1st round pick in an RB you believe him to be a special talent. I hope wilson is just that. but if he's not than this was a bad pick.

i like our GM i like our team i'm not bashing the pick or the player. i personally don't agree with talking RB's in round 1 unless they are a special talent.
it's funny  
djm : 4/27/2012 11:00 am : link
but every year we go through this process where fans get all worked up over a position being passed over in the 1st round. We needed this or we needed that....should have taken this OL or should have taken the TE...

There are 6-7 draft picks remaining. Positions you desired last night will be drafted tonight and tomorrow. The Giants have nailed many draft picks in rds 2 and beyond. Trust the process.

I like that Reese prefers to draft play makers in the 1-2 rounds. He goes after the mudders later on. It's a process that works.
Both Glenn...  
FatMan in Charlotte : 4/27/2012 11:00 am : link
and Martin were going to be question marks on whether or not they'd play best at Guard or Tackle.

That alone could be enough to pass on a guy at 32.
Vin  
NoGainDayne : 4/27/2012 11:00 am : link
Glenn started 28 games at LG in college and 4 at RG. He could step in just fine at LG. Nicks is 6-5 343 and Glenn is 6-6 345. A lot of guards are in the 6-3 area, Glenn has a bigger frame that can support more weight. He was great in pass protection both at G and T...
overrated? mike garafolo  
Neverend : 4/27/2012 11:00 am : link
said the giants had glenn rated higher than wilson

dont understand the need to completely diminish his value and downplay his talents. we all knew if we picked him you guys would be gushing over him
You're right.  
Randy in CT : 4/27/2012 11:01 am : link
We should definitely listen to a guy who's watching TV over a team of scouts, coaches and GMs who put millions of dollars into the scouting process.

Oh, no. YOU shouldn't consider that you're dead wrong and ignorant of most of the data that the team has access to.

Please proceed in educating us and the Giants organization?
Randy  
cosmicj : 4/27/2012 11:03 am : link
you're right. Every post on BBI should just confirm every move the Giants make. It would make BBI a lot shorter and easier to get through.
I would have liked Glenn  
UConn4523 : 4/27/2012 11:06 am : link
but I am happy we have a playmaker at RB. I personally think RB is a bigger need than OL as well. Beatty had a freak injury and Baas was dinged from the get go but played well in the playoffs. We also have Brewer in the mix with Petrus getting solid PT last year.

We will take a guy in the mid rounds and add a body or 2 as an UDFA. We won't reach on an OL.
djm  
NoGainDayne : 4/27/2012 11:06 am : link
my point was that we aren't going to get a road grader at the end of round 2. You get the mauler type guards 15-45, that's almost always where they go. Snee is our only potential pro bowl lineman at this point and to me, when you have a QB like Eli behind center, especially one that thrives off the play action like he does, you get that man as many pro bowlers in front of him as you can.

Besides, this would be moot if our run blocking hadn't already proved to be underwhelming. It's been falling off the cliff the last couple of years and KM was our 2nd best run blocker, even on the decline.

Part of the decision making revolves around  
mfsd : 4/27/2012 11:09 am : link
the difference between the talent of a guy available in the 1st round, vs. the value of other guys at that position in later rds

We obviously thought Wilson was a cut above any other RB that might be available later...and we wanted a RB

If we don't take an O-Lineman in Rd 1, it could be b/c we see others of reasonably comparable value available later on

Just my opinion
Let me just pre-empt all further who are you to question Reese  
NoGainDayne : 4/27/2012 11:09 am : link
or the Giants organization comments...

Reese and the Giants organization are smarter, more well informed, and know tons more about football than I do.

All that being said, am I allowed to present a logical thought out point even if my capacity to make cogent points pales in comparison to that of Reese and the other gods of our lands?
Couldn't agree more with this thread  
NYG2302 : 4/27/2012 11:10 am : link
And my echoes last night were falling on deaf ears. And I was getting crap for it.

Simply put, its fine and dandy that we got a stud at RB. I know that we needed help there.

But without an O-line that will open up holes for them, I don't see what the point is.
I believe the Wilson pick was also because of our return game.  
Blue21 : 4/27/2012 11:10 am : link
He's explosive, elusive, and a threat to go the distance whenever he touches the ball.He could shorten the field for our offense.
Calling Glenn...  
FatMan in Charlotte : 4/27/2012 11:11 am : link
a mauler or a road-grader means people haven't watched much tape of him. The Giants would have picked him based on potential, but he wasn't dominant at the college level.

Glenn was better at being a wall keeping people out than he was a guy who opened up holes. His main weakness is that he doesn't use his strength to push forward with power and he lacks lower body strength.

That isn't a roadgrader or a mauler. It is a large guy who can stop people from getting to the QB, but who will have to learn the more significant skills needed at the pro level.
i dont know if any of this has been mentioned yet but i have 2 points  
robbieballs2003 : 4/27/2012 11:12 am : link
One, from his scouting reports he is a very poor run blocker. A guy that is around 350 cannot be a poor run blocker if he expects to be a top pick.

Two, he is 350 pounds. The giants like OL that can pull, get out in space and block. He has trouble pulling.

So, you think he is a good prospect and we should have drafted him and that is fine because it is your opinion but you have to ask yourself how he fits into the Giants system and I don't think it is a match.
More than anything we are trying to win a superbowl here  
NoGainDayne : 4/27/2012 11:13 am : link
and I've really got no problems with Boothe or our other starters so much so that I do not think we can find someone to jump in front of them in the 2nd round. The point is, why not take someone that can jump in front of them who is good value at that point in the draft and fills a need ahead of someone who we know will be a back up and has to be coached up on pass protection.

I would never advocate a desperate win now approach but Glenn isn't that. He makes us better now and on an ongoing basis.
In Reese we trust.  
SuperRonJohnson : 4/27/2012 11:14 am : link
It's a great pick. We have a lot more to do today and Reese and company will do the same exceptional job again.
yeah, speed kills  
Dylan fan : 4/27/2012 11:17 am : link
Wilson is gonna be a holy terror on KORs. He blew by about 6 players & put a lot of distance between them & him rather quickly.
Wilson 90 yard KOR - ( New Window )
Reese was pretty clear  
JonC : 4/27/2012 11:17 am : link
that after the top 15, the grades were pretty even through 32 (and probably a bit beyond to around 40), nothing mystifying here.
NoGainDayne...  
FatMan in Charlotte : 4/27/2012 11:18 am : link
but your reasoning for wanting Glenn is one of his weaknesses:

Quote:
Our run blocking was bad last year, plain and simple. We lost our 2nd best run blocker to boot and it's not as if Glenn wasn't a good value at our spot, he was. A 4 year starter in the SEC and a guy that steps in and really helps us with a weakness.


He'd be fine as a pass blocker, perhaps, but the biggest knocks on him are based on his lack of push and ability to open space. Wouldn't that be a key for a run-blocker?
FMIC  
NoGainDayne : 4/27/2012 11:18 am : link
he got moved all over the line, hard to settle in, more likely was trying to mitigate mistakes as opposed to getting comfortable and excelling.

I said you aren't getting a road grader at the end of round 2, i'm not saying Cordy Glenn definitely is one. He very well could be at 6-6 345 and as I said we aren't getting someone with that potential at the end of round 2.
Garafolo  
Phil in LA : 4/27/2012 11:18 am : link
also said we were taking Adrian Branch, he's not getting the best intel this week.
NoGain  
Fred in Atlanta : 4/27/2012 11:20 am : link
We are probably not getting a home run hitting RB at the end of Round 2 either.
Here are the best RBs the NFL has to offer....  
djm : 4/27/2012 11:21 am : link
in no particular order:

McCoy
Jones Drew
Foster
Gore
Steven Jackson
Lynch
Turner
DeAngelo Williams
Forte
Peterson
Fred Jackson
Ben Tate
Rice
Mendenhall
Chris Johnson
McFadden
Charles
Ryan Matthews

I may have missed a couple but out of that list, ONE GUY, Arian Foster went undrafted. ONE. The rest? All drafted in rds 1-3. Most in Rds 1-2.

Please. Stop with this horse crap myth perpetuated the last few years around here that RBs are a dime a dozen and can be found in any round. It's nothing but 100% bullshit.

Oh, here is a list of TEs that were NOT drafted in rd 1.

Gronkowski
Bavaro
Hernandez
Graham
Daniels
Witten
Fred Davis
Gates
Finley

And many many more...

Here is a list of OLINEMEN that were NOT drafted in RD-1:

Chris Snee
Brad Benson
Jumbo Elliot
Doug Riesenberg
David Diehl
David Baas
Kareem McKenzie
Bart Oates
Billy Ard
Chris Godfrey
Shawn Ohara

Might as well wait to draft the TE and OL. After all, we can always find those guys later in the draft.


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