TC not buying JPP's weight gain as "muscle."

to note JPP's extra weight in camp
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amazing how unproductive he was in the second half of the season.

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once you have been weight training for a significant period of time.

Which means most of his weight gain was in all likelihood attributable to fat.

Hopefully he leaned out this offseason and can return to dominant form.

I was gonna say I remember JonC talking about it.

Coughlin's translation on this quote: Don't let it fucking happen again.

that the coaches wanted him to get bigger. Hopefully, he has pearned his lesson and will show up in shape and ready to kick ass.

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that I'm referring to 10+lbs of muscle. Not going to happen.

Small increases are absolutely possible, but muscle gain is a science of diminishing returns the longer you've been at it.

It's gonna make Cruz look fun.

are lucky to add 2-3 pounds of muscle per year. JPP is still young, so might be able to add more. But even at his age, no way could he add even five pounds of muscle in the short span of a single off season

If he has another mediocre season...

don't let him sniff free agency.

was necesary given his reps at DT? Maybe with Jenkins and Joseph and maybe some draft picks they can leave JPP at End and have him play at 275.

Tuck going inside so much probably hasn't helped his health much either--he's a big guy but not built like a tackle.

a big factor in the Giants mediocre season last year. He was certainly getting more attention, mostly because he was the only guy teams really feared last year. Tuck is/was a shell of his former self.

The Giants need someone opposite JPP who can be a disruptive force and garner attention. Can Tuck be that guy again?

Meaning this past one was mediocre?

I think that's more a product of people's expectations being downright batshit crazy heading into the season.

I was 2 rows behind the Giants bench. I was surprised how thick JPP looked. At the time, I mentioned it to the surrounding Giants fans that it will take awhile for JPP to get into shape. That night in Jax, JPP's backside would rival Boothe's. It was disappointing.

The difference between our defense in 2011 and 2012.

But he regressed significantly from 2011, which is not what you want to see from a young potential star. I don't see any way that he wasn't a disappointment.

dude has a powerful lower body. But he shouldn't have what looks like a beer belly.

He used to be much much much quicker off the snap in college, he needs to regain that quickness and I'm glad that the Giants have told him to lose significant weight.

was a difference watching him last season VS watching the youtube highlight video of him during his 16.5 sack season. He looked slender and displayed great quickness during that year. He looked bigger last season. To be fair though, teams adjusted to him and they adjusted to the pass rush in general. So there were other components to it. However, just by watching that video, you can tell there was a difference.

He was still our best defender, and teams probably accounted for him alot more...It was just as much on the one armed Tuck and one trick Osi for not expoiting their advantages.

First camp practice I watched, JPP was FAT. Big old SB winning gut. And, he wasn't the only one.

The conditioning was a disappointment.

Beyond that, I don't know if the lack of explosiveness off the snap is 1) who he is as a pass rusher, 2) due to the weight gain, 3) due to coaching, etc.

His run-defending efforts were still the best of the best.

I think people set themselves up for disappointment thinking "well he had 16 sacks, imagine how many he'll have once he learns the sport!". LT was invoked. It got crazy.

by both the GM and the Head Coach. He had better report in shape and be ready to go.

I remember some people saying he came to camp bigger thinking he was just bulking up or filling out. That didn't really make sense to me since his game was quick twitchy, speed, and elite athleticism.

I hope JPP doesn't go lazy on us.

JPP got comfortable, end of story. He wasn't in peak form and deserves to be called out for it. This kid needs to be an all world force if the 2013 Giants are going to make any noise.

his best game might've been the asswhooping he put on Tyron Smith in Week 1.

He isn't fond of the weight room at all

if he signs for less then we can celebrate!

I thought it was Fewells' fault that JPP didn't play well last season..

being monitored closely this off-season, or will be told "if you don't knock some pounds off you will be playing for Jacksonville;your call".
As I mentioned in other threads, re: KP, about JR and TC putting together a team thats ALL IN on the Giants,I have the feeling that management is putting players on a short leash.

in 2011 as well by opposing teams, the results were just better.

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now could mean that JPP is still fat. Could be a warning shot in his direction.

motivate players.

Most players won't motivate themselves.........

"Whether you like it or not, learn to love it."

Not even sure he or Reese have even seen JPP yet..

I'll bet he was doubled less in '11 than '12. His results may have been better. But team defense was pretty lousy in both years, save the playoffs.

Just winning a Superbowl, being a DPOY candidate in your first real year of playing, and getting a bunch of attention from NFL/fans is just a recipe for a player to get lazy in the offseason.

Now if he comes to camp overweight this offseason, I'll be worried.

Hope so. Not a good sign if he's still fat.

Keep in mind he hadn't played much Football and then basically in his first season as a starter he makes All Pro and wins a SB. Some players never achieve either. So I'm sure he didn't train nearly as hard and lost a bit of his hunger coming into this season. He needed to be humbled so this will probaby being a good thing for his career that he's been called out by Coughlin and they won't let that slide again. He's now playing for big money so I expect him to come back in much better shape. And what's with the obsession with weight? JPP has more than enough power at 275 to play DE, he should stay at that weight to maintain his quickness.

to 300lbs. I remember seeing him and he was huge and his play that year declined. The only difference was the coaches wanted him to bulk up so he could move inside. Once he lost the weight he was a terror both inside and out. I miss that Tuck.

I hope JPP heeds the message

was sucking wind and showing none of the hustle he did in 2011

a lot of his best plays were pure effort plays, that endless gas tank, those were gone last year

....22 during the '11 season and just turned 24 so he's still a pup by any standard.

There's certainly an air of immaturity to him so hopefully he figures it out soon and isn't the type (like Osi) who flounders without a mentor whooping his ass.

I bought that JPP jersey this year.

This is just like when I bought that Mo Vaughn t-shirt when he joined the Mets.

coach and the team's diet guy should be handling this. He should be on a certain meal plan, and the S&C coach should be working with him. Maybe this off season, things can shape up for JPP.

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JPP 295# - ( New Window )

JPP's bad season on Tuck! JPP saw Tuck moping and coasting so he did it to. Motivated Tuck= Hyped up JPP.

on that JPP thread. Sigh... still think JPP has legend potential but last year was a let down.

So it won't be a surprise when they bring it up should they engage JPP I'm new contract talks...

Adding weight - even if its muscle - is not the same as being in condition. One of the biggest factors is recovery time. How fast do you recover after sprinting thirty yards?

If you add muscle that is not transferable, that is to say not useful in the acts of your occupation, it can be detriment to performance and conditioning.

This is common in younger players. They think they are getting stronger but they are just getting bigger without benefit.

is not surronded by the best crowd

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Care to elaborate?

when the whole DL is clicking, teams can't concentrate on JPP......maybe he thought more weight would make him more of an enforcer....it didn't work out.....but NO ONE on the DL distinguished themselves last year.....Sacks? JPP 23rd...Osi 33rd....Joseph and Tuck 58th......Canty 74th.....Bernard 137th.....

This was the strength of this defense....pressure the QB.....with the present ensemble of linebackers, and a new direction in the defensive backfield(KP A.D.), and the present state of this DL, it could get worse before it gets better......we don't have cap space for difference makers in free agency.....when was the last time we drafted a stud defensive performer that produced in his first year?

The defensive philosophy seems to be, take a chance on projects and hope they work out....how has that worked out?

Didn't the Giants say he played at 290lbs in 2011. How much heavier was he. Everything I saw was he weighed 295

He was 275 lbs coming out of college

His dunk after the pick six at Flatscreen Stadium showed that the belly fat was keeping him more grounded:) There's no way JPP could have pulled off all of those backflips last year!

I hope he does get back to his rookie season form.

Curious what the drop off was in pressures from 2012 compared to 2011

when Tuck was sucking and Osi was hurt. Sure having the other DEs play better lifts his game up even more, but in 2011 he was a one man wrecking crew.

JPP didn't have a sack in the last SEVEN games of the season. That's pretty mediocre.

"fat and happy" ....

cant do those backflips with that extra weight!

overweight and perhaps not in prime condition. Does training camp, preseason, and practice not get him in football shape? People are talking about a lull he had in the 2nd half of the season. I'm pretty sure he is in darn good shape by then.

You have to remember, we had suboptimal play at defensive tackle. This allowed teams to run the ball against us AND which kept our defense on the field longer. Of course he's eventually going to look winded at the end of a 60 yard drive if that keeps happening. Also, when the defensive tackle play is poor, it's easier to scheme around him.

http://corner.bigblueinteractive.com/index.php?mode=2&thread=447931

firing a warning shot to JPP: Come into camp in shape this time. As to "Useless Muscle", you can be damn sure JPP's every workout is being run by the top trainers in the biz who are doing ONLY sports specific stuff.

He doesn't look like he's in prime condition. Does anyone have a shot of what he looked like when he started to slump, months later?

....at the beginning of this offseason to work with JPP. I understand there's probably nobody better to learn from than a future Hall of Famer at your position, but what does this say about our veterans on the D-Line and our position coach?

my thoughts exactly. what cud strahan teach that tuck hasnt

I was expecting a little worse than what is in those pics.

Subways coupons than Tuck.

when he ran hard, he jiggled. I am not exaggerating for effect

his head wasn't in the game last year either

needs to commit to the game, and realize that he can't just get by on athletic ability like he could in college.

should include the requirement to do the same number of backflips he did as a rookie.

As I said, it's not the weight. It's the conditioning.

There is nothing contradictory about a guy getting naturally bigger and guys not understanding muscle versus fitness.

Sorry it went over you head.

Unfortunately, many trainers just are not very good. Every NFL player is not working with an Olympic trainer. And, of course, there are many different theories on muscle and fitness.

Something like this happened to Tiki. He thought he needed to get stronger to play in the NFL. Instead he got bigger and lost quickness. He eventually dropped back down and became an pro bowl player.

You said it's natural for a young man to get bigger. Implicit in that is that they are expected to fill out. You then said, nothing to see here. Obviously there was as the man you have despised from the get-go, said he was overweight..So you were wrong and JPP's play last year disproves your let's move on, nothing to see declaration..

Not my head it flew over

It never seemed to make a difference. He just really struggled. Especially in the 2nd half and down the stretch when he had supposedly lost the weight that was a concern to begin with.

I was at camp, JPP was easily 300 lbs. That's ~20 lbs or more gained over the end of the prior season.

Look, for those defending him, just stop.

He is a young man, but he is also a professional athlete that needs to mature, and part of the process is learning how to eat, not get fat, and improve year after year. JPP didn't do those things as a whole in '12.

factors that have nothing to do with his conditioning, like having really shitty defensive tackle play next to him. I'm sure his conditioning was fine by the time he started slumping.

I had that same thought as you did..If you have to get a Strahan to teach him, it says alot about Osi and Tuck..

This is way I cringe every time i hear "we need to get younger"..Younger means inexperience..and it means growing pains..

it certainly wasn't only JPP. Most of the team failed to show up to play last season.

But the players around him didn't open his mouth, stuff it with food, and force him to sit around and pack the extra lbs on him during the offseason.

I read on BBI that JPP was the best defensive player in the league and that there is no player in the NFL as valuable as him. He couldn't have had a disappointing season or poor body transformation.

he shouldn't show up to camp in decent shape. There's no excuse to not be in shape but I think blaming his diminished stats on that is retarded considering he was most likely in better condition when he started "slumping".

for a young player. I think he'll do the right thing. It's very important that he has a great 2013 to "leverage" (I hate the phoney bastids using this word) his play making ability for his next contract.

wait gain with JPP. It was lack of hustle and drive... the kind he had tons of in 2011

JPP faced alot of schemes designed to slow him down, especially after teams realized how diminished Tuck and Osi were, no doubt about it. I think fans here have over-estimated the double teams he faced, as an excuse, but there was plenty of chipping and going low with blocks, etc.

it was all the above.

If you're overweight and have played a certain way at a lower weight, the things that were second nature to you get bogged down. With that comes frustration perhaps

They all have to be able to fit into a pair of skinny jeans, along with a v-neck t-shirt by May 10th.

Any man caught with a 20 ounce soda will have to take dancing lessons from Perry Fewell.

determination and heart to an extent.

A 15 lb gain spread out over a 6' 6" body isn't the same as if it occurred with a standard height and body framed person... certainly could have contributed as JonC said but I suspect that was far from the issues with JPP wouldn't have led to the dramatic drop off in production and hussle.

In otherwords if he hadnt put those 15 pounds on I still think he would have had close to the same average/below average year. Reese hit it on the head with that quote. I also think as a young guy learning from the veterans around him, he was taking negative cues from Tuck and maybe a little of osi who had one foot out of the door all season.

question is why did he come in over weight? It ties into his whole mind set as a player on and off the field. Hopefully he wakes up this season.

He was horrible last season; a total & complete disappointment. He better get his ass in gear.

From the beginning of the season he looked heavier and not muscular. Longer hair. Just looked like he was in post super-bowl hangover. Then they said back issues. Well if he was heavier that would be the case.

He needs to slim down and come with more intensity. He definitely was a disappointment.