•First off, the Giants' official cap number as of today is
$3,312,849.
•I was close; I had the Giants
$3,461,340 under the cap, which was close, but no cigar.
•This number will change once Justin Pugh signs by about slightly less than a cool million bucks on the minus side.
•In addition, I've got it this information all listed here on my blog as well:
New York Giants Cap Central
•I'm trying to use the tweetuh for it now, so if you're so inclined you can follow me there too:
@NYGCapCentral
•Joel Corry threw me a shout out on his twitter account after he and I corresponded some:
Source:
@corryjoel
•I'm thankful to him on two counts:
1-for suggesting that I put it out on twitter, and 2-suggesting to Giants fans that they follow that Cap twitter account.
•Joel is one of the go-to people regarding the salary cap; if you want to learn about it, follow him.
•Without further ado, here goes with the fun gang--specially made for my fellow BBIers.
•First in order of most cap space to least cap space:
Source:
Top 51 League Cap Report
*****
Now, here are the figures listed in alphabetical order for convenience's sake:
Source:
Top 51 League Cap Report
*****
A couple of observations about the league as a whole and the NFC East clubs:
•The Raiders are in cap hell this year, but will be getting out of it soon.
•They're taking their medicine this year, to get healthy next year, and going forward in the future.
•The Giants are going to need to make a move or two to get fully under the cap by the time the regular season begins.
•Since the Top 51 rules apply, everything is fine now, but this won't last.
•This is just speculation on my part, but it makes TOO MUCH sense to cut Chris Snee the day after June 1st and gain
$7,875,000 in cap room ($4,750,000 in cap savings sans dead money, and then another $3,125,000 in cap credits due to the leftover dead money amount of $6,250,000 being spread out over two years).
•I'd cut Snee, and sign the still available--and pretty damned good--Brandon Moore to play his position for a 2 year deal with a cap hit in 2013 and 2014 of around $1.5 to $1.75 M, unless of course Snee would be amenable to agreeing to that deal himself after being released after June 1st.
•This move would give the Giants the room they need under the cap to not only give Victor Cruz the contract that he wants, but give the Giants the room that they need to operate under the cap for the rest o f the offseason, going past the Top 51 rule and into the regular season without having to restructure deals for any more of their players to create added room, like Antrel Rolle, Justin Tuck, or Steve Weatherford, off the top of my head of viable restructuring candidates.
•The Eagles continue their pattern of being way over the cap, which figures with the owner in charge their and Howie Roseman (more of a money guy than a personnel guy) running the show there.
•Dallas renegotiated a SHIT LOAD of contracts to get the point where they are now, ranked 13th in the entire league in cap room, being
$7,695,234 under it.
•The Cowflops are playing a fast and DANGEROUS fame, which will eventually come back to haunt them.
•They're playing (by they're I mean J.J. of course)
"kick the can" with a lot of contracts on their team, and are basically a house of cards right now.
•As far as the Redksins are concerned, they're actually blessed to be where they are since the cap has saved the from their own stupidity in a sense.
•They can't go out and make their typical big splashes in free agency, simply because they don;t have the room.
•That'll change in a couple of years when RG3's rookie deal is up (provided of course they haven't run him ragged with whatever is left of his injured knee).
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Check out this article by Joel Corry on offset language. It'll be an issue going forward for teams. I touched on it in my blog previously, and referred to an article by Mike Garafolo on it. Click
HERE for it.
This and split salaries are something that fans who follow the salary cap might want to become more familiar with. Joel did a great job on this write-up. It's worth a read.
Enjoy the holiday weekend.
The Offset Battle with Early First Round Picks - by Joel Corry from nationalfootballpost.com - MAY 24, 2013, 05:30 AM EST - (
New Window )
Source:
http://www.overthecap.com/cap.php?Name=Chris%20Snee&Position=G&Team=Giants
I would agree that they will likely do something after June 1, and that was the plan that they all agreed to many months ago. This was also part of the Cruz plan, using the Snee savings to partially pay for that deal.
I also feel that if they do not sign Cruz then they will carryover the money into next year, so they have extra money for the franchise tag.
Thanks again for all the info. You are an excellent addition to this site.
If they do release Snee, I would not sign Moore. There is a reason that he is still available despite the fact that his contract demands are not excessive.
They could have already agreed to the terms of a new, more cap friendly deal after releasing him on June 2nd. The intention of a such move for either party would not be to part ways, but to gain the cap room that the Giants need, and then have Snee sign a new already agreed upon deal the next day with reduced terms commensurate with his skill set.
In the end, Snee is an aging player who is not as teflon as some people may think he is just because he's TC's son-in-law. TC is not the GM here. Jerry Reese is. Neither Snee, nor any other Guard in the league is worth 11 million bucks in cap room. Such a move would not be out of the ordinary.
I don't see him being cut this year. If he hasn't rebounded from his surgery to have a Snee-like year, I think he's gone in '14
But I think Optimus figured out what is going to happen. Giants are waiting for June 1, so that cutting/resigning Snee will produce the maximum cap benefit.
Right now, Snee is dead in the sights of Kevin Abrams and the rest of the Giants' cap people. An aging, injury prone player who is making more money than he should with respect to his position, and who is ranked only 2nd to Eli Manning in cap value on the team is "marked for Cap Death" so to speak (pardon my Steven Segalese).
This kind of move would take him off the Giants' most wanted to take a paycut/restructure/or get cut list for next year. It would benefit Snee too since he'd be better off here in all likelihood, then any other situation throughout the league. Bottom line is this: Snee's not worth his cap number at this point in time to the Giants, or any other team in the league at this time, or going forward in the near future.
The Giants need to make room for when the Top 51 Rule ends in a little over 3 months (approx. another 2 to 2.5 million bucks), and if they're serious about singing Cruz, another 3.5 to 4 million bucks. That's $5.5 to 6.5 million worth of cap dollars they need to clear, if you count those two situations going forward. The Giants are reported to be at the "2 yard line" with respect to the new Cruz deal. You can be damned sure that Cruz's money ain't gonna come out of thin air, I can promise you that. Moves will have to accompany such a transaction.
Also, before we worry too much about Coughlin's family taking a monetary hit, don't forget that all that prorated bonus figure is already in Snee's bank account (and the IRS's, and his agent's).
A question, though Optimus: how can Snee's prorated bonus go down next year?
Then I can see a cut in salary, but cutting him? Can't see it. Not so certain we can classify him as injury prone. His poor performance this past year can be directly linked to his season long hip problem which presumably(hopefully) will be a non-issue once he's ready to play full time. The previous year, he was never the same after his concussion.
Nope, an outright cut would surprise the hell out of me
Read the article below:
"The Cowboys and Paycut Options for Doug Free" - by Jason Fitzgerlad from overthecap.com | May 8, 2013 - ( New Window )
If the Giants were counting on a Snee move to give them cap flexibility, they wouldn't be letting him participate in OTAs and allowing the chance of an injury to take that opportunity away. If they were planning to release Chris, they'd have done it already.
However, there are 5 players who word got out who do count as "pre-June 1st cuts." They are as follows, to go along with the dates they were released, and the teams they signed with:
The only reason I can think of to cut Snee is to give Cruz the long term deal. But I dont think a deal hasnt been reached because the Giants cant create the cap space, they probably set a value and dont want to go over that number.
If the Giants need a couple of extra million in cap space before the season starts as Optimus pointed out, they can create that by a minor restructure for any of the players available long term (typical convert salary to signing bonus type restructure).
They're gonna need another $5.5 to 6.5 million bucks in cap room before the season starts. I've done the math, and explained it several times. There's nothing minor about that. Either an Eli extension is on the horizon (Eli, Cruz, and TC share the same agent in tom Condon), or there's going to have to be some major fat trimmed.
Other players to look to who fit that categorization are Antrel Rolle and Justin Tuck (Steve Weatherford may also be a possibility for a restructure too). Personally, I'd rather avoid all that, and get the cap dollars that I need, if I'm the Giants, from Snee's contract.
My only problem is that I'm not sure the Giants should pay Cruz more than the $8M they've already offered Cruz, even if new money becomes available. But regardless of whether any new money is used for Cruz, they should still cut and resign Snee as you said. No way he's worth $11M.
I'm looking at players with bloated cap numbers first, like Snee and Rolle, who have cap numbers of 11 million and 9.25 million dollars respectively. Rolle is healty, and is a leader on defense, and his time will eventually come, but Snee's cap hit at this point is just obscene at this point in time.
I suggested that outside of the box line of thinking (which is not really "outside of the box" thinking at all for actual NFL cap analysts) to see as to how the Giants could create that room. Believe me, I've pondered over many different ways to get the necessary cap money that the Giants need, and this scenario is the one that makes the most sense to me.
I should have clarified better... my point was in reponse to the nepotism remarks. I dont think that has anything to do with it.
I fully agree that Snee's play the last couple of seasons doesnt justify his cap number, but under the circumstances, Giants would be better off, IMO, keeping him under the same deal this year to benefit from cap saving next year UNLESS they come to an agreement to a long term deal with Cruz. If a long term deal with Cruz doesnt happen, then I wouldnt cut Snee.
They would still need to make another 2 to 2.5 million bucks in cap room though if they don't come to terms with Cruz (leaving Snee out of the equation at this point). That would likely involve restructures for Rolle, and maybe Tuck, or even Weatherford.
Its not about what Snee is or isnt worth at this point. Deal is already in the books... too late for that. At this point, its about the best way to deal with a bad situation.
If Giants and Cruz cant reach a deal, whether Snee deserves the money or not, I think the best course of action would be to keep Snee's deal as is in 2013, as opposed to cutting him and resigning him and increasing the dead money next year.
Weatherford's contract ends in 2017, so the $2-3m signing bonus can be spread out over the life of his contract with a little effect down the line. Punters can play well into their 30s, specially for a guy like him who takes great care of his body.
Good work, BTW, on your numbers. I went through my spreadsheet last night to update everything-- spent several hours while hubby was watching the Coca Cola 600. I'm off on my numbers by about $400k but I think I know where I have to look again to get closer. :)
P.S. Do you think Barden's deal involves a split?
The players generally don't care about their cap figure so long as they get a large chunk of cash up front and guarantees. So when reports day Cruz's deal may average $7M per year, that doesn't mean it will be $7M per cap year.
No, I don't think Barden has a split, the good thing about these one-year minimum's is that if the player is cut, the team only has to eat $65K (the signing bonus). I'm pretty sure with a qualifying offer (the correct term for these 1-year minimum deals), teams need to keep them straight forward.
Again, there are other factors that will affect the cap, so it's too early to forecast that the Giants are destined for cap hell once the season starts. This is why the cap is fluid -- and a PITA to track, as I am sure you no doubt have realized. ;)
I don't see Snee being cut....but I do see a definite pay cut.....
I think Baas has one more year here.....I think we will be grooming one of the OLmen we have on the roster to play center next year....cutting Baas next year, will net us 2.5M and create a huge cap savings in 2015...
After Manning and Snee, Rolle is the third highest cap hit on this team....Rolle is kind of in the same predicament as Webster......the Giants could demand a paycut from 7M to 4-5M.....there is no way Rolle would get 4-5M out there on the open market....
Next year Tuck could be a casualty, too...
It's a tough business to operate under the cap, and hard decisons have to be made....
I think the teams that know how to manage their cap try to avoid dumping dead money into the next year's cap at all costs, especially if the cap figure isn't expected to rise much.
Again, if I have done my math correctly, the Giants have approximately 5% of this year's cap tied up in dead money. I don't know what the league average is, but that dead money, when broken back down into actual dollars, could have easily covered a few more veterans, I suppose.
I projected the 53-man roster before the draft; I'm gonna have to go do it again now that the draft is over. Out of curiosity, Who do you think doesn't make it or is vulnerable?
http://optimus2g.blogspot.com/2013/05/the-giants-and-walking-dead-money.html
I'm thinking that the reason I was off by the amount that I was off by--$148,491--is mostly because of a discrepancy in that department.
For example, a player might get a signing bonus of $2,560,896 yet in the media, it's reported as $2.5M. So I end up missing that $60,896 and if you miss a few thousand here and there, it adds up to where your numbers don't balance with what the NFLPA reports.
There could also be LTBE incentives factored into a guy's cap figure that on certain sites are listed as part of bonuses. If those LTBEs aren't collected, then they become cap credits at the end of the year.
Teams can restructure deals but I'm pretty sure that they can only re-negotiate, be it for a raise or a reduction, once per 12-month period. Restructure, as you know, means moving money around whereas renegotiate means changing the terms and dollar amounts of the deal.
I'll check on this as perhaps I'm wrong abut the 12-month rule, but I know I had this discussion with him before, though I can't remember if he said it pertained to new money or just changing toe overall dollar value of the deal.
Regarding who makes it and who doesn't, all I can tell you is to look at the numbers at each position on the roster. You see more than 4 safeties being kept? How many DTs stay? Who makes it as the third RB, Da'Rel Scott, Ryan Torain, or Michael Cox? Then pay attention to the preseason camp reports and games and the picture will become clearer.
Also ask yourself who might be candidates for inactive PUP (not to be confused with active PUP) or season-ending IR, and if those guys have splits in effect for this year if they don't make the 53-man roster. These are all factors that can influence the salary cap.
I understand you want to get a leg up on things but there are going to be at least 10 roster spots where anything can happen and while we're not talking huge dollars, it could affect the reserves moving forward.
BTW, if you want to contact me offline to discuss the cap stuff, feel free. I don't' want to take anything away from what you've done, which as I said is very impressive and better than most efforts I've seen.
Thanks.