Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

NYP: Mara says Super Bowl 'distant memory,' ...

Eric from BBI : Admin : 7/29/2013 8:57 pm
FYI.
Mara says Super Bowl 'distant memory,' bothered Giants missed playoffs 3 out of 4 seasons - ( New Window )
He is right  
bluesince56 : 7/29/2013 9:07 pm : link
Last years failure to defend their crown was horrible. This 6-2 start and the failure to make the playoffs needs to stop. Still love the two Superbowls in five years but maybe it could have been three? 2008 and 2012 were very disappointing.
Not making the playoffs is incredibly frustrating...  
arcarsenal : 7/29/2013 9:17 pm : link
Just because this team has won the Super Bowl 2 of the last 3 times they've gotten in. All you want is that chance with this group.

I think this year is going to be a golden opportunity to win the division. The Eagles and Cowboys are switching systems and re-tooling. I think the division is going to be competitive as always but I think it's going to be between NYG and WSH. Those 2 games in December between us and them are probably going to be massive and decide things one way or another.

The window is still wide open right now. If we're going to get a 3rd one in the Eli era, it has to happen soon.
...  
Giantology : 7/29/2013 9:19 pm : link
Coughlin on the hot seat  
Geomon : 7/29/2013 9:22 pm : link
Confirmed
Hopefully, the media puts him on the hot seat  
Dave in Hoboken : 7/29/2013 9:24 pm : link
sometime in August. Really go after him hard. We all know what happens when they do that.
The clock thing...  
Six Feet Under : 7/29/2013 9:27 pm : link
Has taken some critism, but I like what the leadership of this team is saying

1. This team will not be allowed to rest upon or take credit for past teams success.

2. Every day counts...you can not wait till your backs are against the wall to establish your identity....you have to play to your potential all the time

Eli and Coughlin will drive this home all camp. When Reese, Mara, Coughlin, and Eli are on the same page, they are just about the best in the league as a team

...so I like what they are doing
shoot im still pissed the 2010 giants didnt make the playoffs  
Neverend : 7/29/2013 9:30 pm : link
easy superbowl berth imo, even without nicks in the wildcard round (playing game of hypotheticals, maybe seubert doesn't get injured because giants rest starters w17? who knows)

I still don't know how far the 2012 giants would have gone. Havent given much thought about it.
Meh.  
NyquistX3 : 7/29/2013 9:30 pm : link
There are 31 other teams filled with the best players, coaches and executives in the country. Winning two Super Bowls in six seasons is an incredible level of success. Missing the playoffs in the other seasons is very frustrating, but so is losing in the playoffs. The end result is the same in both scenarios (no championship).

It's a great mentality to have, though.
I'm usually firmly in the "talk is cheap" camp,  
Exit 172 : 7/29/2013 9:30 pm : link
but there's something about this "NFC champs get the Giants' locker room" that seems to really be getting under the Giants' skin whenever it's mentioned to them.

Hopefully, that sense of "protecting" their locker room lingers into November and December.
arc -  
Exit 172 : 7/29/2013 9:36 pm : link
I understand your overall point, but I don't believe another Eli-lead championship "has to" happen soon. Elway won his only two in his final two seasons. We have no idea how the Giants will look in Eli's twilight years. He might even pull a Strahan/Bettis/Elway and leave the game a champion.
I don't look back on '05 and '06  
bceagle05 : 7/29/2013 9:42 pm : link
with any great fondness because we made the playoffs and lost in the first round, so the 'three out of four years out of the playoffs' theme rings a little hollow for me as a fan. Any team except the Saints, Packers and Ravens would trade their last four seasons for ours.

But if it motivates the players and coaches, it works for me.
That's true...  
arcarsenal : 7/29/2013 9:43 pm : link
It's just hard to keep a competitive team together long-term and have it be seamless. I worry that towards the end of Eli's career, we're going to be forced to re-tool a little bit.. but there's really no way of knowing.

All I know is that right now, there's no reason why this team can't do it again. This year is going to be another big opportunity.
there have been several seasons they SHOULD have done more  
mattlawson : 7/29/2013 10:06 pm : link
and were in position to do more

2008
2010
2012

if you follow the bell curve this makes we should finish 8-8 and our DC gets fired.
We didn't make the playoffs  
Doomster : 7/29/2013 10:10 pm : link
with 9 and 10 win seasons......we lucked out qualifying with a 9 win season, because we won the division....

One year the Pats had 11 wins, and didn't make the playoffs....

We have to beat the teams we are suppose to beat, instead of losing to them.......

Under Coughlin, we have only had two seasons where we have won a playoff game......the other seven seasons we haven't won any.....in three of those seasons, they lost their only game.....in the other 4 seasons, they did not qualify.....unfortunately, this has happened 3 out of the last 4 years.....

Winning 2 SB's, certainly has made up for it.....it's just hard to stomach this team not making the playoffs.....



Anyone still think Reese was out of bounds and going rogue?  
Mason : 7/29/2013 11:39 pm : link
Called it. :)
This is a good thing, though.  
Dave in Hoboken : 7/29/2013 11:42 pm : link
There are sports teams out there who haven't won a championship in decades and hang their hat on that last championship won. That must be embarrassing as fuck.
Just a random observation  
NINEster : 7/30/2013 12:14 am : link
from an outsider...

Past performance does not guarantee future results. I would even go on to say that it most likely inhibits future results.

Giants' fans have been given two consecutive super bowl championships in the high seed wildcard manner and are lead to believe they every failure to make playoffs is a missed super bowl trophy.

Further compounding this is a perfect 5-0 record in NFC championship games.

It's like the entitlement 49er fans felt about never losing super bowls until it actually happened.

Shouldn't beat yourself up on this stuff. There's a reason for everything. If the Giants indeed repeated in '08, they'd be a totally different team than they are now, no guarantee of another super bowl appearance in '11. Nicks might not get drafted in '09, Cruz and JPP would most likely play for different teams.

Winning brings some level of complacency in every locker room across the league. Baltimore will be that less hungry this year, SF that much hungrier....and if the SB results were reversed, the motivation would also be reversed.

Looking back at the '80s, from 1984 to 1988, the super bowl champion lost in the playoffs the year before in heartbreaking fashion ('83 49ers against Redskins, '84 Bears against 49ers, '85 Giants vs. Bears, '86 Redskins vs. Giants, '87 49ers vs. Vikings). Every last bit of intensity was needed to become champion in those days, and that's with predictable dominant teams compared to today.

There are no real lost rings for those '80s NFC teams in my mind. You can swap years around, but same overall results most likely.

Had the 49ers went on to win it all in 2011, I'm convinced the 2012 team doesn't go back to the super bowl. And most likely the Giants make the playoffs and do some damage.



NINEster - good post  
Optimus-NY : 7/30/2013 4:35 am : link
.
...  
SanFranGiantsFan : 7/30/2013 6:03 am : link
I like this type of attitude. The division isn't bad @ all; not winning it would be a major disappointment.
Well put by JM.  
Victor in CT : 7/30/2013 8:19 am : link
Sets a high standard, but doesn't brag or make ridiculous predictions a la the folks in the green side of the building.
Think he is  
TMS : 7/30/2013 8:27 am : link
trying to get the players attention. They looked complacent and not hungry last year. Two SB rings can do that to some players. We need new blood, and some guys need a kick in the ass or be shown the door.
What bothers me somewhat  
yankfan : 7/30/2013 8:33 am : link
is the attitude some people have about non-conference games...."Oh, losing this one isn't all that important." or "We can afford a loss here." As we've been shown in the past, EVERY game is important.
NINEster  
Giantology : 7/30/2013 8:51 am : link
Quote:
Giants' fans have been given two consecutive super bowl championships in the high seed wildcard manner and are lead to believe they every failure to make playoffs is a missed super bowl trophy.


This is incorrect.

Every year we fail to make the playoffs is a missed OPPORTUNITY for another Super Bowl trophy. I think most NYG fans are well aware that simply making it to the big game does not guarantee a championship, especially after XXXV.
And  
Giantology : 7/30/2013 8:52 am : link
they certainly weren't consecutive, either.
Let's face it....  
Doomster : 7/30/2013 8:59 am : link
Teams go through cycles......winning cycles and losing cycles....we are in a winning cycle right now.....having players like Eli, JPP, Cruz, Nicks, Wilson, etc., help to keep us in that cycle.....but inevitably, it will swing the other way....called the law of averages.....but after what happened to us for almost 20 years, we could still be on this ride for awhile......
I understand why the team needs to publicly take that stance,  
Go Terps : 7/30/2013 9:12 am : link
but as a fan I don't feel the same way Mr. Mara does. I'm not sitting here thinking about the years we didn't make the playoffs, because when we've made it we've made it count. Our '09, '10, and '12 seasons could all have been 0-16 and I would still be happy with having won the two Super Bowls we've won.

Since Coughlin and Eli got here only the Steelers have won as many Super Bowls...and no one would argue that their Super Bowl victories were as memorable as ours (particularly XLII) were. As far as I'm concerned there isn't a team in the league that's had a better last 8 or 9 years.
In about 10, 15  
eclipz928 : 7/30/2013 12:03 pm : link
maybe 20 years from now, I'll look back at this era of Giants football very fondly and with strong, life-binding memories. As I stand currently, I have tremendous pride in this team and feel privileged to have experienced two amazing Super Bowl wins in recent years.

That being said, I find it extremely difficult to look past some of the missed opportunities that this team has had over the last 8 seasons, and I share in Mara and Reese's frustration. This team, with a very good QB who has yet to miss a single game, has been talented enough to accomplish even more than what they already have, yet have repeatedly fallen well short of their potential.

Losing to the Eagles in the first round in '06 and '08 still stings. Matt Dodge punting us out playoff contention (again, against the Eagles) in '10 is still maddening. Missing the playoffs outright last season after having a 3-game lead in the division is still hard for me to even grasp.

Again, I'm extremely grateful for the Giants success with winning championships, and over time that will be the lasting legacy I'll attribute to the Coughlin era - but the years in between and circumstances in which the Giants either missed the playoffs or got booted in the first round weren't just disappointing, they were horrific. To me, short of something crazy like Eli shooting himself in the leg, missing the playoffs again this season would not be acceptable.
As a fan, I feel blessed to have "won" two SBs in '08 and '12..  
Big Blue '56 : 7/30/2013 12:33 pm : link
What a remarkable achievement this has been. Beating out 31 other teams twice within a very short period of time to win it all is a wonderful feat. Losing the other years is always disappointing, but on balance, I'll take that accomplishment every 5-10 years over multiple playoff appearances sans the cigar..
Im with Mara  
blakjedi : 7/30/2013 12:40 pm : link
I been a lil bit angry with the Giants ever since the loss to Dallas opening day... The giants set both positive and negative records and its infuriating at times. I knew Resse wasnt bullshitting when it came to clock. Letting the team know that the championship drive starts TODAY and is a continuous effort is good thing.

There are no off weeks, off games or anything. For the next 186 days their sole and only goal is being the NFC representative in Superbowl 48
If your expectation is a Super Bowl victory every year  
Go Terps : 7/30/2013 12:44 pm : link
You are going to be disappointed. No team has won more than 6 of the 47 that have been played. The Giants have won 4, which ties them with Green Bay for fourth place in the league. 2 of those have come in the last 6 seasons...a better mark than any other team in the league over that time. If the Giants are missing opportunities, what is everyone else doing?

Any fan that is disappointed right now has a view that isn't aligned with reality.
I don't remotely expect a championship every year  
Greg from LI : 7/30/2013 12:52 pm : link
I do expect a playoff berth more often than once every 4-5 years.
I think John Mara wants more playoff games-- specifically  
Exit 172 : 7/30/2013 12:56 pm : link
home games -- for more revenue. So he's got a legit gripe there.
Greg  
Go Terps : 7/30/2013 1:01 pm : link
By that rationale, would you prefer 6 seasons of 6 playoff berths and 0 titles to 6 seasons of 3 playoff appearances and 2 titles?

I'd understand any fan agitation if the 2 titles didn't happen...but they did. Would we really feel better about this era if we'd made the playoffs last year and lost in the NFCC or something? Ask the fans in Buffalo or Minnesota how great it is to make the playoffs.

2 titles in 6 years...that's the mark that matters. How many times we made the playoffs is irrelevant by comparison.
.  
arcarsenal : 7/30/2013 1:06 pm : link
I think fans would have zero complaints if the Giants had only missed the playoffs once or so in the last 4 years even if we only won a grand total of one or two more playoff games in that span.

Not saying it's fair or is even a huge deal but I think people would probably feel more fulfilled if we had been a playoff team in 2 of 2009, 10, 12.. even if we didn't really get anywhere in either year but still had the Super Bowls in 2008 and 2012.
I feel extremely fulfilled.  
Big Blue '56 : 7/30/2013 1:08 pm : link
But that's just me
arc  
Go Terps : 7/30/2013 1:11 pm : link
Maybe you're right, I don't know. That is a line of thinking I do not understand at all, in the least. I take no more pleasure in a playoff exit than I do in not making the playoffs at all.

If anything, all of my worst moments as a Giant fan are playoff losses. I don't look back on 2000, '89, or '08 and remember them fondly.
.  
arcarsenal : 7/30/2013 1:12 pm : link
As am I.. but I understand the rationale behind being frustrated about no playoffs in 3 of the last 4 years even with the one year being the Super Bowl.

I think given this teams propensity for making it count when they DO make it, it frustrates fans when they see a playoff berth just within reach but missed. Especially when in 2 of those years, we let it slip away to the point where we won divisional games in Week 17 but couldn't get in because we needed help and couldn't get it.
.  
arcarsenal : 7/30/2013 1:13 pm : link
Basically, I think people just want to know for sure that a Championship wasn't in the cards in a given year rather than have to wonder "what if". Know what I mean?
I do  
Go Terps : 7/30/2013 1:19 pm : link
I'm just not sure it's realistic to expect to make the playoffs that often. Other than 2008 this has never been a very strong regular season team...and neither of the title winners were great teams either.

The QB, though...
Sure..  
Big Blue '56 : 7/30/2013 1:19 pm : link
Perhaps, perhaps if we weren't 10-6(*11-5 Celek) in one of those playoff-less years I would be slightly bothered(in the overall), but even then, I seriously doubt it
.  
arcarsenal : 7/30/2013 1:30 pm : link
I think people look at teams like the Colts, who have made the playoffs 12 times in the last 14 years, the Eagles who made the playoffs 9 times in 11 years, the Steelers who made it 8 times in the last 12, the Ravens who have been there 6 of the last 7 (5 in a row), the Pats who have made it 10 of the last 12 years, etc.. and just assume the Giants should be able to do the same.

I get it. But you have to take the trade off and take the Championships without thinking twice. Can't always have your cake and eat it too.

And the Giants have been in the playoffs 5 times in the last 8 seasons.. which is far from bad. I think people just want this to be a perennial playoff team the way some other teams seem to be.
Some fans want the consistency the Colts showed under Peyton  
JonC : 7/30/2013 1:34 pm : link
and some fans want to see an NYG team consistently win 10-13 games each year.

It's the very hot or cold performances of the team they see as a blemish on the era.
the clock  
giantgiantfan : 7/30/2013 1:37 pm : link
thing is dumb. It's something Jerry Jones would do if the SB was being played in Dallas.
I suppose those fans would see those things  
JonC : 7/30/2013 1:42 pm : link
as validation of the two titles they've won most recently, but I don't see that as being remotely important, and don't agree with that perspective or mentality.

The 6-2 starts resulting in 8-8 and missing the playoffs is definitely frustrating, but pro football truly is the game of inches. How many times each season do we make note of a play that turned a season 180 degrees.
Saying that this team is frustrating  
eclipz928 : 7/30/2013 2:28 pm : link
is an understatement. Again, this is what its about right here:

Record Through First 8 Games

2004: 5-3 (5-2 start)
2005: 6-2
2006: 6-2
2007: 6-2
2008: 7-1
2009: 5-3 (5-0 start)
2010: 6-2
2011: 6-2
2012: 6-2

This team under Coughlin has been, remarkably, able to begin 9 consecutive seasons with a record of 5-2 or better. 9 fantastic starts by all standards . . . yet only 5 of them were able to propel this team to a playoff appearance, and only 2 of those resulted in a progression past the first round.

I'm amazed that there still exists Giants fans who aren't completely driven insane by this. There's no other team in the NFL, past or present, that has seen anywhere near close to a game-by-game or season-by-season trajectory that resembles what the Giants have been like this past decade.
eclipz  
Go Terps : 7/30/2013 2:30 pm : link
If there weren't two titles to show for it I'm sure it would be bother me more. But since there are, it doesn't.
Inconsistency  
Sneakers O'toole : 7/30/2013 2:36 pm : link
it really depends on how you look at it.

In the Coughin/Manning era, we've only been below .500 once. In their debut year in 2004 when they went 6-10. Since that year, the Giants have never dropped below .500 and have won world championships twice. That is a history most people would sign up for.

It's a matter of perspective. I have no problem with what Mara has to say, because his job is to set goals. Within the organization, the goal should be win the Superbowl, year in and year out.

But from our fan perspective, we have it very good in this era. Like, really good. Our down years aren't really down, they're just average.
Wish I was a fan of the Colts  
bignygfan : 7/30/2013 4:28 pm : link
when Peyton was there.

They made the playoffs every year, must have been great.
Is that a joke  
Go Terps : 7/30/2013 4:34 pm : link
?
2010 and 2008  
Neverend : 7/30/2013 4:56 pm : link
are the ones that sting the most. in 2008 the eagles were probably the only team in the entire NFL playoff field that the giants didn't match up well with (altho they did beat the steelers without holmes, not a guarantee they win the superbowl even without plax). in 2010 they accomplished so much in that regular season and for that to not be worthy for a playoff berth is incredibly frustrating, forget watching teams like seattle in there.

it is what it is, im more than happy. But still get frustrated just thinking about those seasons. If the 2011 giants didn't make the playoffs, I would probably be thinking it wasn't much of a lost opportunity, the defense just became a group of massive underachievers with a terrible running game to boot. of course that's assuming the giants won a superbowl in either 08 or 10.
Mr. Mara,  
oldog : 7/30/2013 5:23 pm : link
how quickly you forget, but don't worry, the senior years can be like that. A few notes, Coughlin (Yes, TOM), could also be memory challenged, so keep an eye on him, don't worry about Eli, he's still good for 10 more. We are a little worried about your defensive coordinator, renewal cannot always be ruled out. So stay on top and bring back that old time feeling.
Eclipz  
BigBlue4eva : 11:39 am : link
Its very nice to see that this team is able to get off to such a great start every year. I think that statistic speaks most to the abundance of talent Mr. Accorsi and Mr. Reese have acquired during their tenure. They undoubtedly understand how to assemble a football team, as proven by the two recent titles.

However, what is much more revealing about those nine seasons, is what transpired AFTER those terrific starts. I believe the comments made by both men were directed solely at the head coach. Careful analysis of those periods is where I believe Coach Coughlin's true abilities as a coach reside. This unfortunate trend is at the root of Mr Mara's and Mr Reese's recent comments. There are way too many, and some downright pathetic, losses at crucial times, with tremendous playoff implications on the line. They have had second half failures almost every one of those nine seasons...including their Super Bowl Runs.

In my opinion, the two Super Bowl victories were not achieved BECAUSE of Tom Coughlin....they were achieved DESPITE Tom Coughlin. Great coaches motivate their team in the second half of the season. The stretch run for the postseason. Coughlin's grade there is a big fat F. I'm sure the Giants ownership understands this, and I believe they felt it was necessary to communicate it.
Back to the Corner