Meaningless Game - But More BS from the Officials

pass interference calls were very lopsided in the Pats favor. Call a game tight or call it loose, but call it down the middle.

shitty calls.

if the league has told refs to throw more flags or look for certain things, but the amount of penalties called has been absurd. Ron Winter's crew has been terrible with the amount of BS calls made.

I also wonder what is up with PI this year. In three different games, I've seen DB's get called for PI when looking back for the ball and making plays, with the Webster one being an example.

In the Seattle-GB game last week, a Seattle DB looked back for the ball and made an INT and he was called for PI for "cutting off the WR" een though it didn't look like he did. A Carolina Panther was called for the same type penalty.

One can only hope this was just a preseason thing, but those PI calls worry me because they have such a negative impact on the game.

Both of those calls had me incensed, preseason or not. The back angle shot of Webster made it even more obvious - he wasn't grabbing the receiver with his back hand, he was deliberately holding it in the air so he WOULDN'T get flagged. And the PI they didn't call late in the game was blindingly obvious.

There is no way that could be considered clear enough evidence to overturn.

call the blatant ones, let everything else go.

I've seen, over the course of the preseason, all sorts of terrible ticky-tack calls for defensive PI.

There was one PI called in favor of the Giants a couple weeks ago were I still kinda just shook my head because its like "if that's PI, then you may as well let the receiver catch the ball."
I guess I was jsut envisioning how PO'd I'd be if it was called on a Giants corner.

INT??

about the Pick by Prince that was overturned that gave them a TD.

The one angle clear as hell that his hand was in. There was green between his hand and the sideline. The worst part is if it wasn't clear than the call on the field should've stand, which was a pick.

they didn't look at Carr's "fumble" longer.

Seemed like his arm was moving forward to me. no mention of it and no contesting by the Giants so I guess it was me.

Ball was knocked loose before his arm started moving forward

but I think the Carr fumble was a good call. And they look at turnovers in the booth.

I was wondering why TC didn't challenge it and figured he just wanted to move onto evaluating something else.

... there was a ton of focus on whether or not the knee hit before the hand, which was said to be out of bounds. But did any of you see a closer view? From all the angles I saw, there was no way to tell - and in the angles we saw, it looked like the hand was in.

So ... fuck if I know?

I thought was mandatory. It seemed that Carr's fumble might have been a forward pass. I was surprised that the officials didn't review it, or I missed the review.

It at least had a chance of being a forward pass, considering how far ahead the ball travelled.

Baffling.

The booth looks at it, and they buzz down to the official if they think there is something that needs to be looked at. Obviously they thought the play was clean, it was probably a good call.

we got a shitty PI call in our favor against Barden last week, the officials huddled-up and reversed the call.

WTF?

they decided Prince's hand touched the sideline, there is no way you could tell that.

more incensed when they actually overturn a call when there isn't sufficient evidence because I've seen calls overturned that simply become the opinion of the guy under the hood. If it isn't conclusive, you stick with what's called on the field, but even then, a Bill Leavy can rear his ugly head and just make a unilateral decision based on fucking nothing.

I think if they are going to have this much replay in the pro game, they should just adopt the college system. I think the college system works better. Much better actually.

agree

If there's any doubt, the call on the field is supposed to stand, but that's not what we saw last night.

the radio broadcast team reported Coughlin assumed it was an automatic review and lit into the refs when the next play started without one. Presumably he would have thrown a flag otherwise.

all turnovers are reviewed in the booth. They only buzz down if they see something that needs to be looked at further, that play apparently did not. I thought it was a fumble too, so I don't see a problem with that particular decision.

and quickly decided that the ball was already out, the empty hand rule, they aren't going to buzz down

on the Webster call is that the official who threw the flag couldn't have seen any infraction from his angle without x-ray vision. He threw the flag because he "thought" he saw something not because he actually DID see something.

at some point, replay has morphed from indisputable evidence to whatever the opinion is of the official looking at the replay. That's why the first few years of replay less than 10% of calls were overturned where last year almost 20% were overturned.

It has become one of the detriments of replay that nobody seems to want to address.

If the replay clearly shows that the original call was correct, they would say "The ruling on the field is confirmed..." and if it's unclear and not enough to overturn, they'd say "The ruling on the field stands...."

the interception.

to fix the issue, we can only hope that the Giants have someone in their front office calling the NFL today and forcing them to review these terrible calls.

A game should not be decided by a host of bad officiating calls where you just hope they even out. It's freegin' crazy. A $9 billion dollar a year league and we get this shit??? WTH?

for the officials too. Everyone relax.

the overturn of the interception was the right call.

2 things.

First off, I think since it's preseason, ecah team has their own broadcast, so the replay officials would be looking at the views from the Patriots broadcast rather than the Giants broadcast. maybe it showed something different.

From what we saw, I thought it was clear that the left hand came down before the right knee. Then the question is whether the hand came down in bounds or not. The hand did end up touching the line, but I think the whole hand touched inbounds first, then slid out of bounds. I don't think, based on the replays we saw, that the call should have been overturned.

You're going to tell me that it was clear and incontrovertible that Prince's hand was out of bounds? Seriously?

yes, I am. 100% so/

I don't even think it was close. It was clear his fingers were in the white. Maybe you need to get a new HDTV b/c it was pretty obvious on mine.

It seems the referee takes forever now, the Prince interception being a good example. Broadcasts go to commercial and come back and they're still reviewing the play!?

PI on C WEb was BS. The overturn of Princes INT was BS. There was also non call of offensive pass interference vs TT. The guys pushes off of TT's hands and separates. Only preseason but having to drive over 4 hours to see that crap and deal with 77,000 Massholes was frustrating.

PI on C WEb was BS. The overturn of Princes INT was BS. There was also non call of offensive pass interference vs TT. The guys pushes off of TT's hands and separates. Only preseason but having to drive over 4 hours to see that crap and deal with 77,000 Massholes was frustrating.

and I was thinking that on those two calls. The Webster one especially. I did not think that was pass interference at all. He made a play on the ball and if he got there early, it was really really close. The overturning of the interception was baffling. And I'm glad Mayock didn't softball that one. He was very adamant about it being the wrong call.

have a fucked up TV then.

Greg - you think we can get returns on our pieces of shit?

Replay needs to have INDISPUTABLE evidence. The fact we are even arguing about that makes it unlikely it was indisputable.

gave a meaningless pre-season game to the home crowd.

catch by Dez Bryant that was called back and essentially gave us the win.

As a fan, I wanted Amukamara to keep that INT but looking at the replay I disagreed with Mike Mayock. It looked to me like Amukamara's fingers were touching the white line.

So at least I didn't pay for my piece of shit :)

Josh clearly sees things better than you, I, anyone else here and Mayock.

Jan - I thought the flag was because the ref THOUGHT Webster grabbed the receiver from behind with his right hand, but since he didn't actually see it he didn't know that Webster actually wasn't grabbing the receiver at all. Hence, the comment made earlier about the ref making a call on what he thought was happening rather than what he actually could see.

I even thing that was indisputable. I actually thought it was close live and was surprised they weren't reviewing immediately. Not sure how you can say he hand didn't touch the white but ok.

but more telling was the way they elected to review calls. They pulled everyone back from the 20 to look at Princes close call. So they were willing to review a call for the Giants that they initially didn't question...

But on Carr's fumble they didn't. Patriots ball, no looking back.

I thought two of the three calls against Kyle Wilson in the Jets game were horseshit, too.

Section 2 Dead Ball
Article 1: Dead Ball Declared.
An official shall declare the ball dead and the dow
n ended:
(a) when a runner is contacted by a defensive player a
nd touches the ground with any part of his body
other than his hands or feet. The ball is dead the in
stant the runner touches the ground. A runner
touching the ground with his hands or feet while in
the grasp of an opponent may continue to
advance; o
official rules - ( New Window )

and then slid out of bounds. Kind of like the drag of a foot. It was a bad overturn.

the local affiliate? I didn't see any replay of the interception on the local broadcast that showed Prince's hand close up that would have cleared it up. All the replays I saw were at a distance that made it appear to me to be very close and certainly debateable either way - not indisputable visual evidence by any stretch.

let's look at it this way...the law of averages....the calls that go against us now, reverse in the future....

The Prince PI...that was PI....in slow mo, you can see him make contact to the back before the ball gets there....

The overturn of the Prince INT, since it was called an int on the field, there has to be indisputable evidence to overturn....when his hand initially hit, it looked in bounds, and then slid out of bounds....the question was, did his other leg come down after his hand went out of bounds or did it come down before his hand went out of bounds....I did not see any indisputable evidence to overturn this....

As for Webster, in slow mo you could make the call he pulled on the right shoulder with his right hand and released....at regular speed it would be hard to determine, especially from the ref's angle....

They were bang bang plays that could have gone either way...

Since it doesn't count towards the regular season, it's much ado about nothing...

The moment the finger touched out of bounds the play is dead.

equals two feet.

You are citing a rule out of context.

In the field of play, a player can touch the ground with his hand and not be considered tackled, as long as his knee or some other part of his body hasn't touched down.

That's not what we are talking about here. For a pass to be considered complete, the receive must get two feet down. In this case, a hand is equivalent to a foot. If a player gets one foot and one hand in bounds, the pass is complete (or intercepted in this scenario). Also, once the hand goes out of bounds, the play ends. I still think the hand came down in bounds, then slid out of bounds.

thats corrects

hand first hits the ground from one angle. It was too close to
overturn.

On those was/not was PI calls, I thought I was the only one 'questioning'(i.e., a few undeleted expletives).

A hand is equal to a foot?

since when?

ding ding ding!

Yea his fingers hit in bounds before sliding out but the ball was still moving in his hands. He didn't have true possession until his fingers were already on the white and before his knee touched down.

the game was a "pick 'em". jump to your own conclusions. there was also an awful blown neutral zone infraction call that ended up being an offsides.

.

....

Yea, it was not an interception. What I don't understand is how the play is changed after the the next play was already run.

20 for the touchback.

hit the turf 1st before his fingers touched out of bounds. The fact there was np PI at the end of that game was pathetic.

Quote:

fj Rob_MTL : 11:19 am A hand is equal to a foot? since when?

Are you serious? In the context of catching a pass before going out of bounds, yes, one foot and one hand touching in bounds is sufficient.

Even in the rule you cited, it talks about any part of the body other than the hand or foot.

are all equivalent to 2 feet. Actually, I think you're considered down if any part of your body other than feet or hands touch the ground. I thought his forearm came down in bounds before his fingers touched out of bounds - but not really a good camera angle to confirm.

...he had help ...he was off balance and the WR put his hands on him ...efectivly taking him out of the play... should have been Offense PI IMO

However, I don't think there's ever been a scenario or a physical possibility for just a single hand to come down inbounds during a catch without either two feet or another part of the body also touching down inbounds.

....I can't even imagine what that would look like.

but some of you are complaining about good calls. Carr clearly lost the ball before his hand moved forward, and there was no PI on the long TD TT gave up. He slipped on his own.

The Webster call was ticky-tack but that's today's NFL. If you run through the receiver it's called and he did get there slightly before the ball did. Given that, there was clearly PI on the Giant's last drive that was blatant and should have been called.

Prince may or may not have been in bounds, but in that case the call made on the field needs to stand. The fact that there is so much disagreement (including from the national broadcast team) indicates it was not indisputable which is the standard.

anyone find the video of Princes INT online?

Thread but agree we are in for it. Officials are not calling in our favor at all

but did anyone notice the Pats ran the "pick" play over and over and didn't get called for it once.

There was an offensive PI.

testing the officiating to see how much he can get away with. He's always looking for an edge.