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New figures for Snee & Weatherford contract restructures...

Optimus-NY : 9/5/2013 7:26 pm
Here's what I wrote about them, with the details listed below.

The Giants gained $1,925,000 in needed cap room from restructuring Snee's & Weatherford's contracts yesterday - 9/5/2013 - ( New Window )
Thanks Optimus...  
rptl530 : 9/5/2013 7:32 pm : link
you remain the man.

I'm still working on your article but I still hope the day comes when the Giants can get on the right side of this cap situation. I hate all these restructures.
rpt - Take solace in the fact the Giants are going about things in an  
Optimus-NY : 9/5/2013 7:35 pm : link
intelligent and piecemeal fashion, unlike the Cowboys and Saints. The Giants are managing their cap situation the way that a team with a franchise QB and recent championship pedigree should. If they need more room, they'll dip back into the Snee and Weatherford salary cap well (mostly Snee though). They're doing it the right way.
rptl530 : 9/5/2013 7:41 pm : link
I'm not overly concerned about it but I'd like to get on the right side of this stuff. "Dipping back into the Snee pool" at his age doesn't appeal to me, especially with the albatross that is already David Baas.

NYG needs to hit interior OL hard and early next year, though I'm sure it won't happen.

That said, if they can afloat without needing to touch Eli (and I think that's the gameplan) I'm all aboard.
You know what the Giants' approach tells you?  
Optimus-NY : 9/5/2013 7:48 pm : link
They had no intention of touching Eli's deal if they could avoid doing so. They're not out of the woods yet, but they're pretty safe IMO.

Another poster asked what the advantage would be of waiting to benefit from Eli's extension this year. The answer is that when an extension is done, it is done with the first year being the year which teams can benefit most from the maximum amount of cleared out cap space since they are contracts are typically designed with that idea in mind.

The Giants will need the gained space from the Bank of Eli more next year then they possibly could have this year. Next year they to deal with the free agency of players like Nicks, Linval Joseph, and JPP coming up right after them.
rptl530 : 9/5/2013 7:53 pm : link
stay off Eli right now (like I said I'm sure that's the gameplan) and then deal with next year, next year.

I HATE dead money. It might not be Dallas or NO dead money but it still kills your cap and your ability to operate.
Yeah, the borrowing from the future  
Enoch : 9/5/2013 7:56 pm : link
is a little worrisome, but so long as it's kept fairly low (<5% of cap), I doubt that it would be a serious problem. The goal is to keep things going to maximize the championship opportunities during the years when you've got a franchise QB in his prime. (Knowing and accepting that bad luck with injuries, playoff matchups, scouting margin-of-error, etc., are unavoidably going to sink the majority of those 'opportunity years.')
2014 Snee 10 million plus  
Chip : 9/5/2013 8:21 pm : link
and dead money up to 3,250,000.
rolle and Snee will have to extend or be cut.
could free up alot of money either way. It will be interesting to see what happens next year. Either way the season begins tonight. Go Giants

I head an interview with Rolle on WFAN last year  
if_i_knew : 9/5/2013 8:45 pm : link
He said he will never restructure a contract
Enoch - Perfectly stated  
Optimus-NY : 9/5/2013 8:51 pm : link
That's it in a nutshell right there.

Depending on where a team is with respect to it's realistic range of expectations, they can operate as follows with respect to the cap:

1. A team that is rebuilding that doesn't have a franchise QB or other franchise type player: These teams should have no dead money, or be in the 1 or 2 year process of taking their cap medicine.

2. A team that has a franchise QB in his rookie contract that is one the way up.

3. A team with a franchise QB in his second or third contract who is in his prime.

4. A team with a franchise QB in his second or third contract, in his prime, who has won a championship.

5. A team with a franchise QB in his second or third contract, in his prime, who has won multiple championships.

Each of these categories is harder to manage than the one preceding it, with the 5th one being the most difficult to manage. The Giants are in this 5th category with Eli. They've done a pretty good job IMO. Personally, I believe that the Giants have themselves in a position to win a another Super Bowl in the next 3 to 4 years on account of their drafting skill. Each year past a QBs 2nd contract the draft becomes a more important part to managing the salary cap.

This is due to the importance of acquiring young players via the draft who can keep added cap costs down. Reese and Ross have to hit home runs in Eli's next 3 or 4 years in order for them to maintain sufficient cap health that will allow them to extend, and re-sign the players they need to in order to compete at the highest level.

Wait until the 49ers, Seattle, Redskins, and Colts have to deal with the contracts of Kaepernick, Wilson, RG3, and Luck. They'll have to transform how they deal with acquiring and paying players.
Optimus, my brother...  
pganut : 9/5/2013 8:56 pm : link
You have this stuff down. Always appreciated, always excellent. Thanks for your analyses and breakdowns. Gratitude.
if_i_knew - I'm glad you reiterated my point about Rolle not wanting  
Optimus-NY : 9/5/2013 9:07 pm : link
his contract played with. Sneakers also confirmed it as well in another thread. He's going to have to take a significant pay cut to remain here next year though an extension, a flat out renegotiation that reduces his cap number (like Diehl this year), or being cut. Same goes for Diehl. Giants will need their money next season.

The combined savings of these two players if they are cut next year, a la Boley, Bradshaw, and Canty will be $14.25 million (7 for Snee, & 7.25 for Rolle). Add this to the amount for Eli's gained cap space in 2014 as the result of an extension, and you'll probably net another 10 million bucks, making it about 24 million extra dollars to use. The Giants have an estimated $105,804,494 in cap dollars presently on the books for next season as per (click this link HERE to see).

If you subtract about 24 million from that you'll roughly $82 million dollars on the books. Subtract that from a flat cap of 123 million this year and you get about 31 million dollars under the cap, not including the rollover money and increased cap base cap number that will be slightly higher than the 123 million dollars figure from this year and you'll get about 33 million dollars of cap room.
what's good pganut?  
Optimus-NY : 9/5/2013 9:11 pm : link
Email me for more Spartacus stuff ( I wrote an interesting piece on a Gods of the Arena epsiode. Check it out HERE.

they're keeping  
fkap : 9/5/2013 9:12 pm : link
their heads above water. That doesn't mean it's intelligent. You can excuse Eli's high contract because he's an established franchise QB. Snee, Rolle, and Baas are ridiculous. You can even factor Tuck into it. Baas was a bad pick up. The rest are old geezers who we really have no replacements for.

Part of managing the cap is good drafting, and we've had too many misses, so we have to keep expensive aging vets instead of replacing them with up and coming youth. What we're left with is a team that is above average, but not near the top of the pack.
pganut : 9/5/2013 9:14 pm : link
Your second paragraph underscores why it's important for Will Hill to get his shit straight and take advantage of the opportunity in front of him. The Giants also need him to do that in that scenario.
My post above  
pganut : 9/5/2013 9:15 pm : link
Was in response to Optimus' 9:07. I type too slow and fkap jumped in. Apologies for the confusion.
OL age  
dvb : 9/5/2013 9:24 pm : link
Pugh - 23
Brewer - 26
Beatty - 28
Boothe - 30
Snee - 31

I know some of the youth is starting due to injuries, but i think Pugh's in there for good. I agree that Baas wasn't a great signing, but i think the OL that we see Sun. night could be better, possibly a lot better, than the '12 version and it's quite a lot younger.
hey pganut  
Optimus-NY : 9/5/2013 9:32 pm : link
David Baas stands a fucking Roman!

He stands Roman? Than we shall send him home...  
pganut : 9/5/2013 9:45 pm : link
...on great rivers of blood flowing fast to the senate, drowning
haha pganut  
Optimus-NY : 9/5/2013 10:07 pm : link
On second thought, Baas looks more like a Gaul...
Doomster : 9/5/2013 10:48 pm : link
cutting Snee/Rolle would only net us around 9.25M, not 14M.....

Eli is a 20M man this year and the next extend him just 3 years at his present salary, if he only counts 10M against the cap next year with an extension, means he will [b][/b]average 22.5M in the following 4 while you will have an extra 10M to work with the next year, you will have 12M less to work with each of the next four years after that.....
Doomster - That's incorrect  
Optimus-NY : 9/5/2013 11:35 pm : link
The savings for Snee if he's cut next year would be $7,250,000. Click [url=]HERE[/url] to see.

The exact same would apply to Rolle. Click [url=]HERE[/url] to see.

Click on the Giants' cap page from below...

Giants' 2013 cap numbers and player contracts - - ( New Window )
Tuck and Webster $$$ will be off the books next year  
George from PA : 9/6/2013 5:51 am : link
if Snee and Pugh end up with a solid right side....I do not see Snee leaving.


one could argue Rolle is the MVP of the secondary and now captain....I think he stays as well.

Baas wasn't a great signing....but as our staring center during a Super Bowl run....I will not complain. Does he stay? depends on Boothe/Brewer current success. Cordle is not the answer
Doomster : 9/6/2013 8:06 am : link
What about the "dead" money? That leaves a "net" of around 9.25M......
Is Rolle  
Doomster : 9/6/2013 8:07 am : link
worth 9M against the cap?
stretch234 : 9/6/2013 8:40 am : link
The Snee deal was done in 2008. At the time he was one of the top G in the game. You can't bitch about now saying it was not smart

Rolle has earned his money. He is the only player at his position able to play S and slot corner

The Baas deal is the worst one

You have to pay players and hope they are still productive by the end of their contract
Doomster : 9/6/2013 8:49 am : link
Rolle has "earned" his money?

As for Snee, he restructured, that is why he is so high.....and he was worth the money he made, initially....but the last two seasons, no....I see a cut in pay, like Diehl, next much depends on how he plays this year....I don't see him completely cut from the team, unless his play falls off the edge of the earth...

Remember, you can cut Snee/Rolle, and create net cap space.....but now you have to replace them, and you have to pay those guys too.....and what if those guys don't perform? Such is the life of a GM.....
Doomster - You misunderstand  
Optimus-NY : 9/6/2013 12:28 pm : link
Doomster : 8:06 am
What about the "dead" money? That leaves a "net" of around 9.25M......

Jason has all this columns for a reason. Everything is taken into account already. Cap savings are Cap savings. Dead Money is Dead Money. No need for any kind of math to differentiate between the two in your example. Just look at the pictograph for Snee's salary again. Jason Fitzgerald knows his shit more than I do. He's got it right.

You'll see the impact of the dead money after you add up all the other cap numbers. Capiche? Hope that helps.
Chris Snee's updated contract information courtesy of  
Optimus-NY : 9/6/2013 12:31 pm : link
see below.

Chris Snee's updated contract information courtesy of - ( New Window )
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