...so much has been written about our shit line backers and our do-nothing defensive ends, and our offensive line that can't run block and our #1 running back who can neither hold onto the ball nor pass block very well.
Fair enough!
But the Number One reason why this team finds itself in a hole is because our 2-time Super Bowl QB -- in his tenth season -- is throwing bad passes and way, way too many interceptions. IMO, the 2013 Season comes down to this: Either Eli Manning pulls his game together or we're looking at a Top 5 Draft Choice in 2014... maybe higher.
The Heart IS the Giants Problem
What good is having a very good qb(not elite), a good trio of receivers, a RB that can take it to the house, if you don't have the time to pass and you can't consistently open holes in the running game?
It makes you one dimensional....it makes defenses dare you to run by playing 7 back there....there are many plays and schemes that you can't run without a good OL......and because of this OL, we can't take advantage of our weapons....we've gone years without addressing this problem, and now it's biting us in the ass..
Sure it's a team game, and Eli doesn't run block nor rush the passer, nor run down on punt returns... but the game of football depends first and foremost on the play of the QB. And he has been very bad so far after two games. Eli's QB Rating is 75.9 (25th in the NFL.) His rating is lower than Jake Locker's, Cam Newton's, Chad Henne's, Ryan Tannehill's, and EJ Manuel's.
That's ugly.
A turn around for the Giants -- if there is going to be one in 2013 -- starts with Eli Manning. He needs to cut down on both his physical and mental mistakes.
I realize that he's the big whipping boy of the OL, but saying he's the problem with the lack of blocking when he's been inactive is ridiculous.
NY-Fan : 11:47 am
It plays with very little passion, plays very slow,
Yep. We play flat and unispired, and the D is complacent, except when it was getting continual stops in the first two games only to watch the O give the opportunities away.
In the first half of both games, the D has played very well and was hitting hard. The O has been making mistakes, not executing well and wasting scoring chances. Not much of that seems to be because of a lack of passion or slowness.
But maybe not as atrocious as his end of half INT against Denver! That was a very big let down that should not happen with a 10-year vet. He forced something there that looked like a third string rookie trying to make the team in his last exhibition game.
If we find a way to fix our OL woes, we will get back on track as a football team. Really, that solution is nothing more than better performance from Boothe, Baas and Snee. We are not going to sign anyone off the street to come in here and play, nor did it appear that Brewer or Mosley are solutions at this time. If they cannot raise the level of their game, this is going to be a long season.
Beatty and Pugh, in my view, have performed adequately, though far from spectacularly. It's the G-C-G that have really hurt us in this 0-2 start.
The physical errors are one thing, but the poor decisions are really hard to justify after all these years. That's not an OL issue. That's an Eli issue. And right now we are seeing the BAD Eli. I'm waiting for the GOOD Eli to play for 60 minutes.
We run an offensive passing scheme that is built upon WR option routes. The WRs read the defense and finish their routes based on what they see. In order for this to work, you need great WRs who run great routes and make great reads. We have that.
however, you also need for the QB to make the exact same read. When it's on, it's extremely hard to defend because it is designed to find the holes in the defense.
however, it is very high-risk because if either the WR or QB sees something differently, then the QB is going to throw to a spot where the WR won't be near. It won't be an interception due to an imprecise throw, but an interception because the QB throws to an area where there are defensive players and not wide receivers. This then makes the INT returns worse.
Unfortunately, because the risk comes from the QB and WR seeing the exact same thing and not due to inaccuracy, there is the greater opportunity for risk (INT, incomplete) because there are more variables.
More than that, this type of exploitative offense is designed to dominate the deep-ball game. It's why Eli attempts more deep passes than anyone else in the league.
Another thing that hamstrings us is that our offensive line is not great in pass protection, thus forcing Eli to read what his WRs are doing earlier than he would like because deep plays take longer to develop.
Even worse is that our offensive line is embarrassing at run-blocking. We are meant to use the run to open up the passing game and to keep defensive players shallow. But since no team fears our rushing attack, defenses can keep extra men back.
The problems with our offense are sourced in the offensive line and with Gilbride's system which is ineffective with our personnel and in today's NFL where starting positions are more of a carousel than seemingly ever before
However, As M.S. and others have said this is mainly on Eli. And I agree on the pass to Scott (to hard and inaccurate) and the end of the half pass against Denver. Just unacceptable for a QB of his experience and quality.
If Eli does not step up his game and cut out the INTs, the Giants are done.
As I have stated before, one of my pet peeves of Eli is first down int's....3 of the 7 int's came on first down.....
As everyone knows, there is the Jekyll/Hyde Eli.....you would think after 10 seasons, the thought process on when to throw and not to throw should be ingrained.....
The pass before the half vs Denver, was a rookie mistake, made by a veteran......it was first down, Nicks was covered....we were in fg range....we had timeouts.....where was the short pass option? Eli stared him down, he was covered, and he still threw it up for grabs....throw it away....2nd down.....go for the td if it is open, or hit a short pass to make the fg attempt easier...
Another of my pet peeves with Eli is the short pass.....for some reason, which is hard to understand, he is not accurate with this pass......the receiver is not far away, yet the pass is hi/lo/has too much mustard/receiver has to change his route to catch it.....
I Joking set my third pet peeve as Eli can't slide....
But my fourth pet peeve has arisen again......can you believe he threw another left handed pass downfield?
Time to get it together Eli....
I am really not happy with the routes our WRs are running. IMO, they are rounding off their routes and also seem to be running them at practice speed. Barely any separation.
To solely blame Eli is comical at best. That just tells me you really don't have a good understanding of the Giants and what they do particularly on offense.
You probably could list a dozen or more contributing factor for the 0-2 start and Yes Eli would be a part of that.
Just to give you an example...Eli's pick at the end of the half.
I'm sure you blame Eli for that one just like the other 6 that he has also thrown.
To me that's on Nicks. Nicks had an option on that route to run a post(which he did) or a flag route(where Eli threw the ball). I've seen many say Eli should've thrown the ball away. I've got no problem with Eli giving Nicks a chance to make a play on the ball. Hell what QB doesn't trust a Wr like Nicks?
What most fail to realize is that ball is long gone out of Eli's hands PRIOR to Nicks making his cut to the post. This is a product of the offensive system which is a bigger issue in my book.
Do you realize why Eli threw the ball to the flag? Maybe it was because Eli saw the safety crashing hard from this inside to help on the coverage. Do you think Nicks was suppose to run the option route towards more coverage? Nicks F'd his one up big time!
So before we throw Eli under the bus for this 0-2 start I think we need to look at the whole picture. There is much blame to go around, but hopefully this team gets their act together and turns this around. Season is still early with a lot yet to be decided.
You provide a very insightful description of that Denver INT before the half, but there is no getting around that Eli threw a high risk ball there at a critical juncture of the game. There's a very good reason why the INT stat is listed under the QB's name, and not the WR's. It is the former who decides when and where to launch the ball, not the receiver.
Eli has been a lousy on-field manager of the game so far. He is simply throwing passes that are inexcusable for a 2-time Super Bowl MVP champion playing in his 10th season.
Inexcusable.
So I agree with M.S. – yes, this Giants team is lacking in many areas, but the fact is – so have MANY other Coughlin/Manning teams. The difference so far has been Eli’s lack of 4th quarter response.
The responses here are ALL valid. They are ALL logical. But Eli’s career has not been about logic.
It has been about the ability to turn on the jets when the going gets tough.
And for 2 weeks at least, we haven’t seen it.
The best part of this post is that while fans like you shit all over Eli you rarely hear a coach or another player throw Eli under the bus for his Ints.
Think about it.....
(2) Be that as it may, I didn't think I was throwing Eli under the bus... more like pointing out what I feel have been some very bad throws and some very costly on-field decisions by the Giants QB;.
(3) You seem to be arguing that the bad Eli stats (after 2 games) are a product of a complex system and that either the WRs, OL and/or fluke plays are more to blame for Eli's performance than Eli himself.
(4) I definitely recognize the other parts to Eli's performance so far, but I also believe Eli's performance begins with Eli, not someone or something else.
JohnF : 9/18/2013 12:02 pm
we don't score. Our redzone offense is horrific, and it comes back to the Offensive Line not being able to block.
The rest of your post is spot on. The problem is that it's hard to fix. Unless Gilbride/Eli suddenly change their style of play (at least for some plays), nothing will change.
I can see Pugh and Brewer getting better as the season goes on. I'm not sure if Baas or Snee have much left to make the Oline respectable. No running game, no short passing game = loss.
A lot of these unforced errors (ironically some caused by Eli 'forcing') would not happen if we could establish some sort of consistency in running the football and reliably protect our QB in the obvious passing situations which ensue. Again, it all starts up front.
And like I said earlier the 2nd was a fluke off the DB's heel..
1. Draft for your need not best player available.
2. Our play calling is very predicable.
3. Reese is horrible.
4. Rolle and Thomas seem to be the only players on defense that are vocal.
5. By signing Jacobs we have at least he and Cruz as spark plugs.
6. Sign some that is a creative D.C.
I also put a fair amount of blame on the coordinators. KG has become too predictable & slow. PF is just clueless sometimes.
First half they gather intel... Second half they exploit it on both sides of the ball...
Darren Sharper said he loved playing Eli because he know there will be opportunities "to eat" which in DB speak means to get INTs... now he blames that on Eli and I dig that. In reality he's talking about our offensive strategy. what we are going to do from play to play, series to series appears to be well known in the league. When we win games (which is not THAT often 10-6 in 2007, 12-4 2008, 8-8 2009, 10-6 2010, 9-7 in 2011 and 2012) its not usually because of superior playcalling or strategy, but instead the sheer will of the players involved in the plays.
Its takes AMAZING highlight reel throws by Eli to beat coverages. Acrobatic ass catches by the WR and TE (which gets them crushed at the same time) or simply, slip ups by the secondary like when Cruz breezed past the Redskins secondary for a last second touchdown last season.
Theres a reason why 90% of Giants fans have agita instead of excitement during football season.