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One Thing Eli Needs to Do Better This Year...

Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/30/2013 5:39 pm
is get rid of the ball quicker. I don't know if this has been discussed on the site, but it seems to me he's holding onto the ball longer than usual. Obviously, with the blocking of the line, TEs, and backs, that's not ideal.

There were plays against KC where I thought the line did a reasonable (not great, but reasonable) job in pass protection, and I was yelling "throw it, throw it."

He's got to dump it off or throw it away.
receivers have to get open quicker  
Peter from CT : 9/30/2013 5:43 pm : link
for him to throw quicker. Without seeing a coaches tape, its pretty hard to know if he's holding it, or there is nowhere to throw it.

I think it comes back to the existing offense. Its time for it to evolve to quicker and shorter options.
for some reason  
chiefgiant40 : 9/30/2013 5:44 pm : link
they have no intermediate passing game. Is it route combination, lack of getting open quickly, no tight end, eli wanting to go down field?
If there's one thing I find very odd about Eli  
AnotherGiantsFan : 9/30/2013 5:45 pm : link
It's how bad he is at throwing screens. Has zero touch on the ball, and rarely puts in an ideal place for the RB.
If there's one thing I find very odd about Eli  
AnotherGiantsFan : 9/30/2013 5:45 pm : link
It's how bad he is at throwing screens. Has zero touch on the ball, and rarely puts in an ideal place for the RB.
I guess that's two things I find odd  
AnotherGiantsFan : 9/30/2013 5:45 pm : link
.
If  
PaulN : 9/30/2013 5:45 pm : link
He is being asked to not turn it over, or keep them down, and has to wait while our long passing game try's to get open, yet people are busting through anyway, while we have receivers still running wrong route's and dropping passes, it can begin to get a little frustrating. I do not place blame on Eli, I already know what he can do when he gets the proper support.
Eli is caught  
gmen9892 : 9/30/2013 5:45 pm : link
in what seems like a no-win situation. He knows he has to stop turning the ball over, so he is not forcing throws, but that is part of what makes him a great qb. Not being scared and being a gun slinger.

The other part of the problem is, he has no trust whatsoever in this o-line, so he seems to bring the ball down early a couple times a game now (havent seen him do this this many times in previous 5 years or so). It is a residual effect because of the poor offensive line that speeds up his internal clock in the pocket.
I don't think he's confident in dumping it off  
Gap92 : 9/30/2013 5:46 pm : link
As there seems to be no one to dump it off to. I don't think he has faith in the hands of the RBs and I have no idea where Brandon Myers goes after the snap when he's not whiffing on a block.

But a check down/dump off option would be very nice at this point.
Must be the grip strength,  
OlyWAJintsFan : 9/30/2013 5:47 pm : link
tough getting the ball out of his hands.

But seriously, routes and reads are taking too long to develop.
Listen to Eli on with Francensa from today  
BlueHurricane : 9/30/2013 5:48 pm : link
When it is uploaded to the fans site. He gave some answers that offered some insight into the offenses struggles. Answers that were more forthcoming that the usual vanilla stuff.
I knew before I opened this thread  
bradshaw44 : 9/30/2013 5:49 pm : link
That was what you were going to say. And I totally agree. I was doing the same thing. He seems to be very uncomfortable in the pocket right now and you can tell he's starting to hear footsteps. Not good
Others Have Stated This  
Trainmaster : 9/30/2013 5:54 pm : link
but Eli is a different QB in the 2 minute offense. He seems so much more confident and comfortable and, dare I say, more "Peyton like".

I completely agree he often holds the ball too long. Maybe he knows getting a long completion is the only real chance we have to score (yesterday as a case in point).
Maybe some of this is attributable to the fact that...  
M.S. : 9/30/2013 5:55 pm : link
...the Giants never developed/created a sophisticated short passing game! Why does Denver always have a receiver open for a sure 5 yards, which takes Eli's older brother about 3 seconds to complete?
eric  
japanhead : 9/30/2013 6:01 pm : link
seems really reluctant to fault the offensive system for the historically bad level of ineptitude we've been seeing. he's just been mentioning individual players all day long.. eric from bbi = bill barilko?
Yeah, the strip-sack  
BlackLight : 9/30/2013 6:05 pm : link
was definitely him holding the ball too long.
Eric  
dep026 : 9/30/2013 6:07 pm : link
I disagree.

Two plays from this week are reasons why. He got rid of the ball quick when he had to scramble: Intentional grounding. A few series later, INT.

Overhead replays are ideal to see why Eli is in a lose-lose. The receivers are not out of their breaks by the time Eli has to throw the ball. People complain that he is taking a sack, however, the WRs arent looking for the ball and are still in their route.

What Gilbride needs to do is stop with the PA on 2nd/3rd and long. And run shorter patterns.
Eric  
Jeffrey : 9/30/2013 6:18 pm : link
Totally agree. He is trying to make the big play and this is an attribute of the good and bad Eli. However, with a porous line that is also inexperienced, he simply has to be smarter. I also cannot understand why the 2 minute drill is not a bigger part of the gameplan. It is not an original thought and yet it disappears for most of the game even though it is one of the few proven schemes this year. Call it West Coast or whatever but short, quick passes, mixed in with some misdiurection runs and an occasional deep ball would seem to open things up more and also help out the line.
It's not on Eli  
Brandon Walsh : 9/30/2013 6:25 pm : link
When the majority of the routes have the receivers running 15-20 yards downfield which obviously need time to develop.

Look at the difference at the end of the 1st half in the two minute drill when the routes where shortened up, the ball came out.

I know our offense is predicated on downfield passing game but this is not 2011, the coaches need to implement more of a short passing game with Eli in shotgun so he has time and can scan the field.

I don't expect much to change though, we will just continue to hear about "lack of execution" instead of realizing something schemtically also has to give.
When the Giants are looking to throw a bomb every other  
ZogZerg : 9/30/2013 6:29 pm : link
play it's hard to get rid of the ball quicker.

Eli needs to stop being so careless with the ball. He's a turnover machine.
I just hope Eli is still standing  
SanFranGiantsFan : 9/30/2013 6:31 pm : link
by Week 17. What a tough SOB.
I think we need to move to our  
Amtoft : 9/30/2013 6:35 pm : link
two minute offense. Let Eli have control of calling plays quickly and moving the ball. When a team is is going full gun at you, the other team is more on their heals.
been thinking the same thing  
SamdaGiantsFan : 9/30/2013 6:44 pm : link
and i don't know whether or not to blame Gilbride or Eli, but its got to be on Eli at this point. His 'internal clock' on getting rid of the ball seems to be a bit off
I feel like Eric is screwing with us.  
drkenneth : 9/30/2013 6:48 pm : link
....
Where is Eli supposed to go with the ball?  
drkenneth : 9/30/2013 6:50 pm : link
Do you think he likes holding it so long?

This team has a lot of re-occurring habits. That's on coaching. Do you think he loves throwing it 30 yards on 3rd and 3 also?
Opposing teams  
RB^2 : 9/30/2013 7:00 pm : link
seem to be getting pressure on the QB rushing only four guys. That could be making it harder for Eli to find guys downfield.
He hardly as time to throw it away let alone find  
matt in syracuse : 9/30/2013 7:18 pm : link
a receiver...he should be removed for the season so he doesn't suffer a career ending injury.
Eric, I agree  
Matt M. : 9/30/2013 7:21 pm : link
But there were a number of plays where I thought that and then replays there actually was not a back or receiver to dump it off too. How do we have so many plays where all 4 or potential receivers are at least 10 yards downfield?
When teams can overplay the pass...squeeze the routes and dare  
BSIMatt : 9/30/2013 7:34 pm : link
You to run it...and then you can't run it...makes it harder to find open receivers.
nicks  
whobetta : 9/30/2013 7:37 pm : link
runs routes like he's 50... no separation EVER

guys have to be open
Throwing quicker is not part of Eli's game, for whatever reason  
jintsfan : 9/30/2013 7:42 pm : link
the Jints are always looking to go deep and just refuse to mix in a short passing game. Combine that with wr's who can't get separation and there is no way Eli can throw quicker.
do tell...  
SHO'NUFF : 9/30/2013 8:21 pm : link
Quote:
Listen to Eli on with Francensa from today
BlueHurricane : 5:48 pm : link
When it is uploaded to the fans site. He gave some answers that offered some insight into the offenses struggles. Answers that were more forthcoming that the usual vanilla stuff.

please elaborate.
the receivers are not helping him......  
Simms11 : 9/30/2013 8:23 pm : link
not much separation and they're dropping balls right in their hands, as well. Eli doesn't appear to want to force things right now, as he's avoiding more turnovers too.
Eric  
Marty866b : 9/30/2013 8:26 pm : link
Good point but the Giants have NO short passing game. There are no timing patterns that his brother excels at. All we do is throw it deep most of the time. We don't utilize our backs as receivers out of the backfield nor have we been utilizing the tight end.Also, no crossing routes underneath the linebackers. These are the types of things to help the qb. Gilbride and or Coughlin seemingly do not like those types of plays. It would have been interesting to see a Wes Welker work in our offense.
tough when  
Mr. Nickels : 9/30/2013 8:32 pm : link
he has to wait for cruz to run all the way down the entire field
one would hope  
hitdog42 : 9/30/2013 8:35 pm : link
after 10 years and 2 SB MVPs... that a $20mio QB would be able to speak up and either 1) check into some more quick hitters (like he had in the past to nicks but for some reason hasnt this year) or 2) pointed out to the staff that its impossible to run these 5 step drops and play action passes when you cant run and teams are in the backfield in 1.5 seconds. He is not blameless for the current scheme.
We all love to blame KG and TC... well the QB certainly doesnt appear to be blaming anything but execution either... week in and week out. At some point, when the ship is sinking... oh shucks doesnt work any more and you need to speak up.
Maybe i am wrong but i have no doubt that if Eli suggested that they spread the field and run more 1 back sets and pick up the tempo... that they may just do that a bit more.
It's difficult to throw more quickly  
GiantTuff1 : 9/30/2013 8:46 pm : link
while running an option route based offense especially when people want you to stop throwing interceptions

That is the epitome of being between a rock and a hard place.

He has to wait that extra bit longer to make sure receivers are for sure breaking where he thinks they are, so as not to have our typical QB-WR miscommunication.

I feel for him, and it's certainly a reason to be somewhat gun shy.

Now, on screens and stuff, I agree he should look for check downs more often, but the Giants should just implement more of it into the offense. At the same time it's tough to know how much of that is available considering how many guys we need to keep in to block now.

And on a side note the Giants need to get Darrell Scott off the field on every down and let's use David Wilson as a pass catching weapon. Screen him against teams to death. Put him in space and let's see what we have and build his confidence both he and Eli's confidence.

At this rate, David Wilson is one of the few guys who can have a massive upside impact, if we elect to use him... which I think is crazy and an indictment of this coaching staff that we haven't, considering we were 0-3, and now 0-4.
Today in  
St. Jimmy : 9/30/2013 8:49 pm : link
Philly they were discussing how the Eagles defense is petrified of getting beat deep so all they do is back off and let underneath routes and get nickle and dimed all day. That's not good because the Giants will probably do nothing but pass deep and play right into the Eagles' defense.
That is their game plan  
cheeseburger : 9/30/2013 10:02 pm : link
because they can't do anything else. TE can't get open and RB's need to stay in and block (we saw what happens when they do go out for passes anyway ) Most of our passes are double moves and reads so they take time to develop.
I know what you're saying...  
arcarsenal : 9/30/2013 10:09 pm : link
But I don't think he really can. I think a lot of the routes being run are long developing routes. At the points where you're thinking he should throw the ball, a lot of times, the receivers haven't made breaks yet. And to me, that's the problem. We need to run some stuff that develops quicker so that Eli can get the ball out of his hands faster. Especially with how the blocking is right now.

I don't think it was a coincidence that as soon as we went to the hurry up, we were able to move the chains a few times and get down the field.
I agree philosophically, but dump it off to whom? The WRs all seem  
Victor in CT : 10/1/2013 8:05 am : link
to be choosing, or are being told to choose, the longest part of the "route tree". That leaves Pascoe, Brandon "the Galloping Ghost" Myers, and either Jacobs (iron hands), Scott (that horse has been beaten to death) or Wilson, if he isn't cowering under the turf in pass pro. Not a lot of options there. TC has to get involved and make changes in the O like he did after the 52 pass attempts in gale force winds fiasco against the Redskins in 2007.
sadly, your all dreaming  
NYG007 : 10/1/2013 9:06 am : link
Kevin Gilbride will never adjust and run shorter patterns. He simply will not. He needs to be fired over it as well.

A TE who could get open would be a big help to this offense.  
old timer : 10/1/2013 10:02 am : link
we don't have one.
A TE who could get open would be a big help to this offense.  
old timer : 10/1/2013 10:03 am : link
we don't have one.
Two TEs who could get open would be even better  
old timer : 10/1/2013 10:05 am : link
.
I feel that one reason for our struggles on offense  
Kevin_in_Pgh : 10/1/2013 10:15 am : link
is that a lot of our plays develop slowly in general. Think of how many runs are delays, pitches, etc. It's Eli - but it's not just him.
Eric,  
Doomster : 10/1/2013 10:59 am : link
it's your site...it's been discussed for weeks...
A stud TE to be Eli's BFF  
NNJ Tom : 10/1/2013 11:01 am : link
has been the biggest unaddressed need this team has had since Boss left.

The clown from Oakland doesn't count. This has been The Reese's biggest failing.

This offense  
AnishPatel : 10/1/2013 11:07 am : link
isn't a dump off or dink and dunk style of offense. His eyes are always going to be down field . This offenses foundation is based on the home run ball and accordingly while check downs is probably logical, I still expect him to try get the ball upfield. Plus we don't know what some of the routes are. If the route is a 15 yard comeback route which goes near the sideline he probably is waiting for the WR to break and come back.

A new offense realistic or not can cure this but in this offense he will always look to go deep and hit that home run.
"I don't know if this has been discussed on the site"  
mattlawson : 10/2/2013 11:57 pm : link
surely you jest
Given that the Giants offense  
Aspano! : 10/3/2013 9:06 am : link
is supposedly based on option routes, i.e. the receivers change their route based on the coverage, could it be that opposing defenses have figured out how to defend it?

What I mean is, it has been established that the Giants' O-Line is shoddy at best, and that, given enough time, the defense can get to Eli. It's also no secret that the receivers are going to base their routes on how the defense is positioned. If they see a certain look, most likely the WRs will adjust their route to go longer.

I wonder if teams have used tape to see what looks make the Giant WRs adjust their routes deep, and then tried to disguise them as well. This way, they can force the WRs deep and possibly temporarily defend against the deep ball, allowing the DL more time to get to Eli. I would also think that doing something like that would yield similar offensive results to what we've seen, with increased pressure on Eli, the offense being stagnant for extended periods of time with the occasional long play mixed in.
This is a big problem  
bignygfan : 10/3/2013 10:38 am : link
I think Eli has no one to dump the ball off to, since D-Scott was a dud and our TEs are the worst in the NFL.

Jacobs did well on a designed dump-off, I suppose. Either way, those plays have to be blocked and we can't.
The strip-sack:  
BH28 : 10/3/2013 10:48 am : link
I was at the game in end zone seats beind and this is what I saw: he definitely stared down Cruz. Cruz was running an option route, about 10-15 yaards. Eli stared him down the entire time waiting for him to make his break. By that time it was too late.

Eli did that a few times in that game, stared down the primary receiver waiting for him to make his break based on the defense.

It's not gonna happen, but the only way the Giants can avoid this is calling shorter routes until the line blocks better.
Eric  
Matt M. : 10/3/2013 11:01 am : link
I agree with you, but contend a lot of the issue is the playcalling/design? There were at least 5 plays where I recall thinking that and then replays showed all 4-5 receivers who were out in patterns were all at least 15 yards downfield? How do you design and call so many plays where there is not even 1 outlet receiver/checkdown receiver?
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