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Banks and Papa on Postgame Show - Eli

Gary JC : 10/6/2013 8:05 pm
They basically said that a QB like Eli comes around every ten years. They said go ask the Raiders, Bucs, Jags, Vikes and Bills if they would take Manning. Banks basically said the light shines on the skill positions but when you don't have a solid OL and blocking TE, then this is what you'll get. Banks went on to say Manning has already proved himself, ie, a two time SB MVP. I'm just summing up what they said about Manning. They mentioned the invisible DEs and the LB position as well.
I guess some people need  
wonderback : 10/6/2013 8:07 pm : link
to be reminded of this. I don't know why. No one could play behind this offensive line. No one!!!
Basic common sense...  
GloryDayz : 10/6/2013 8:08 pm : link
often forgotten with the frustration of a season like this
Heard it  
JoefromPa : 10/6/2013 8:08 pm : link
and couldn't agree more............Giants need to retool quickly to take advantage of a franchise quarterback's prime years.
duh  
baadbill : 10/6/2013 8:08 pm : link
.
All true.  
CT Charlie : 10/6/2013 8:09 pm : link
But he had a bad day vs. a beatable team.
exactly  
eli4life : 10/6/2013 8:09 pm : link
Put Joe Montana in there and same thing would happen. Nobody would do well running for their life playing duck and chuck
...  
Gary JC : 10/6/2013 8:10 pm : link
I agree 100% with what they said.
Every 10 years?  
jeff57 : 10/6/2013 8:12 pm : link
Really? Really?
Every 10 years  
armsteadeatslittlekids : 10/6/2013 8:15 pm : link
I'm pretty sure they meant for a team, not the league. They're right.
His biggest problem  
oldutican : 10/6/2013 8:15 pm : link
is an inability to make something out of nothing (except for the Tyree miracle.) He is so unathletic he can only take the sack and make risky throws when under duress.
Jeff  
Gary JC : 10/6/2013 8:16 pm : link
What they meant is that a team has a shot to get a franchise QB every ten years. They didn't mean they one doesn't exist every year, just that every team can't grab one. They said a team needs to go through the Fitzpatricks and the Weedens before they have a shot at one.
Hes no Teddy Bridgewater  
j_rud : 10/6/2013 8:17 pm : link
.
i think they meant ten years for your franchise  
oipolloi : 10/6/2013 8:17 pm : link
in other words, you would be searching for a starting QB for ten years like the Giants did after Simms retired.
...  
Gary JC : 10/6/2013 8:20 pm : link
Yup! And Eli is no Tony Romo, either! Ba-zinga!
no way  
louied7535 : 10/6/2013 8:21 pm : link
around it eli stunk today as did the rest of the organization. eli is not above blame, he makes terrible reads just like the wideouts. this team is a complete fucking joke right now and as much as I love this team, something has to be done
I don't follow CFB  
chris r : 10/6/2013 8:22 pm : link
Is Bridgewater considered to be a Luck type QB prospect?
Only an idiot wouldn't recognize his ability  
B in ALB : 10/6/2013 8:23 pm : link
to avoid sacks, press the pocket and collect himself to make a throw. His footwork and movement between the tackles is excellent. Does he force the ball sometimes to try and make a play? Of course.

But he can't run like Bob or Wilson or Kaepernick so he's unathletic? Is that even a word?

I really wish some people on BBI would stop bullshitting the rest of us and just go root for another team.
I think Eli is the best Giants QB  
spike : 10/6/2013 8:23 pm : link
for at least 30 years
I get their points  
downinfront : 10/6/2013 8:23 pm : link
but at what point do we start questioning whether Eli can still play at a high enough level. Players get worse sometimes, even when you don't expect it. It can be due to age, work ethic, injuries etc.
Luck played higher level competition  
lalalalala : 10/6/2013 8:23 pm : link

it's hard to tell. I like Bridgewater alot but the Big East/AAC is the elephant in the room. BUT, he did beat Florida in the Sugar Bowl.
dont  
louied7535 : 10/6/2013 8:24 pm : link
take that the wrong way, I want eli as our qb, but results speak for themselves, what 12 picks and none are his fault, give me a break. the line is the biggest problem this team has, then the d line or de's I should say
good pocket awareness and nimbleness is not the same as  
chris r : 10/6/2013 8:24 pm : link
athleticism. Brady, Payton and Brees all have the same characteristics and no one calls them athletic.
Give Eli an Offensive Line and a system that is more user-friendly.  
Optimus-NY : 10/6/2013 8:30 pm : link
This is more for the WRs who misread what Eli does, than Eli. The Zampese/Norv Turner type of offense would be my favorite to see Eli run: a much less complex offense that is also a plug-and-play system that still incorporates the long ball.
To be fair, it'll be more of note when Banks and Papa don't say things  
Riggies : 10/6/2013 8:31 pm : link
like this.

Even when they're critical of Manning, they're careful to couch it because of who they're employed by (or at least who backs the stations that employ them). The day that stops is probably the day actual worthwhile speculation about Eli's future here should begin.
Agree 100%  
Boy Cord : 10/6/2013 8:31 pm : link
This project that lies ahead of the Giants has one key ingredient in place, and that's Eli. Like someone above me said, get him an OL and TEs that can block. This is on Reese. It's time for him to admit that there is no one formula for success when building a roster, and that he needs to be open to change. He has created some gaping holes on this roster and they need to be addressed this offseason. Eli is not one of them. Although, he was brutal today!!
Papa's comments today about the team...  
EricJ (formerly Tyleraimee) : 10/6/2013 8:35 pm : link
seemed to have a little less sugar coating than I am used to. He flat out said this is a BAD team. Pointed directly at a few of the obvious areas of weakness and made no effort to make any excuses for them (ie injuries).

Oddly enough, I think Bob Papa's job with the Giants is more secure than just about anyone elses'.
Well, Papa can't exactly call them a good team.  
Riggies : 10/6/2013 8:41 pm : link
The areas I heard him going on about are frankly areas that are going to have to be turned over significantly this offseason -- they're "safe" targets to hang. Eli Manning, outside of certain specific criticisms, is not.

Quote:
Give Eli an Offensive Line and a system that is more user-friendly.
Optimus-NY : 8:30 pm : link
This is more for the WRs who misread what Eli does, than Eli. The Zampese/Norv Turner type of offense would be my favorite to see Eli run: a much less complex offense that is also a plug-and-play system that still incorporates the long ball.


Exactly why he'll be a perfect for the Browns, Norv's current team, in a trade. ;)
so if you put a good qb  
SBlue46 : 10/6/2013 8:41 pm : link
On a bad team....you fire coach
Papa has been tough on Eli plenty of times in the past.  
Ace718 : 10/6/2013 8:42 pm : link
.
Eli  
Sammo284 : 10/6/2013 8:48 pm : link
doesn't deserve to escape unscathed. His decision making is horrible and regardless of the putrid play around him, QBs are supposed to still play the savior.

Elite QBs don't play as crappy as this and make boneheaded or sloppy panicky throws that Eli has now done with nonstop propensity dating back to last season.

I'm not saying we should dump, but Eli needs to be honest and take a real hard look this offseason at what kind of QB he is going forward and system he wants to play in. I'm a believer a guy like Eli at this stage of his career and age would absolutely thrive in a WCO style offense that a guy like Reid or Gruden runs.

I'm not sure Eli is a fit anymore for the boom or bust vertical offense that Coughlin loves, especially since the system has shown serious vulnerabilities when a running game is nonexistent and an OL that needs to typically hold longer for big plays, can't even push the line of scrimmage.
Eli is not playing well  
HomerJones45 : 10/6/2013 8:49 pm : link
that doesn't mean you get rid of Eli but you also have to acknowledge the bad throws, the ducking while he is throwing, the happy feet and the fact that he is taking up a major proportion of the cap while not playing well.

You can bitch about the line all you want but other qb's play behind bad lines. The Packers line isn't full of all-pros and neither is the Lions. But Stafford and Rodgers have to stand up behind them and complete the pass. You don't see them on pass to throw 35 int's or throw 3 picks in the 4th quarter when the team is down by 2 points.

So, it is silly to talk about replacing Eli but he is pressing and not playing well.
I agree  
SethFromAstoria : 10/6/2013 8:49 pm : link
With them 100%. This man has earned the benefit of the doubt that when his guys are playing at the level be needs them at, he's one of the best. He is the last person I blame on the team and the only person I believe wants to win as much as every player should.
Nobody  
AcidTest : 10/6/2013 8:50 pm : link
is ever going to confuse Eli with Colin Kaepernick or Michael Vick, but he has great pocket awareness, and moves very well within it.

Eli is certainly to blame for a lot of the INTs, but he does have a bad OL, no running game, and an offense that is so complicated he frequently isn't on the same page as his WRs. I tend to agree that he will flourish if these problems are fixed. I also think that is how the situation will be viewed by the FO.

But this doesn't completely explain or exonerate his bad play this year or last. We aren't trading him, even if we wanted to absorb the $7M cap hit. But a really rotten season might mean the Giants restructure his contract in a way to minimize any cap hit if he is released in 2015.
Coughlin has benefited more from having Eli than  
SHO'NUFF : 10/6/2013 8:54 pm : link
Eli has from Coughlin...2 championships aside, I'll go as far as to say Coughlin ruined Eli's career.
When  
BB2K5 : 10/6/2013 8:56 pm : link
you throw 50 times a game & run 15, you're gonna have INT's. Throw in a bad O-line & this is what you get..They have to run the ball more to take some of the pressure off Eli (weather it's working or not)
Blinders  
dcgiantsfan : 10/6/2013 8:59 pm : link
Why does it seem blasphemus to call out Eli? Nobody has forgotten the fact that he has two SB rings. But dayum when he makes negative back breaking plays that a two-time SB MVP shouldnt make, he too needs to be held accountable.
if you can't run, throw more  
SHO'NUFF : 10/6/2013 9:04 pm : link
is my solution...but make them quick and short...that will open up the run...we did it to near perfection on 2 second half scoring drives...then we went away from it with a stupid shotgun handoff.
cant blame the OL  
Rflairr : 10/6/2013 9:36 pm : link
today
Eli does not need to be replaced  
Marty866b : 10/6/2013 9:40 pm : link
That's just crazy but if anyone thinks he's playing well is not being honest.He's part of the problem and not good enough to be the solution to it.
Sho'nuff  
EricJ (formerly Tyleraimee) : 10/6/2013 9:56 pm : link
I dont think Eli's career is ruined. You blame Coughlin but Reese is the one who left Eli with nobody to protect him. If you want to blame Coughlin for something then blame him for hiring a guy to be Eli's QB coach when the guy clearly was not qualified for that position.
No OL  
beatrixkiddo : 10/6/2013 10:13 pm : link
No Running game, No TE's. we are very one dimesnional, though a huge portion of that is on our inept coaching strategy. We don't wven utilize throwing screens to the RB's or any short- medium pass game. Its all
boom or bust, can't live and die by that strategy every week.

You
can just see it in the way this team ays that they don't believe in their coaches and their strategy, this is it for
them. Bring on the Cowher! I cant wait for top 5 draft picks, hopefully trade downs ensue and this team
can build for the rest if eli's time here rather quickly.
I blame Reese for neglecting the OL ...  
Boy Cord : 10/6/2013 10:31 pm : link
... and TC for most likely influencing some of the decisions with his misguided loyalty. I also want to see Eli in a new offensive system. Something that doesn't take an advanced degree to absorb.
Eli is like the rest of us  
newmike2 : 10/6/2013 10:45 pm : link
he has no confidence in his line and his team is playing like they have no confidence in the coaches. If they lost but played well and executed well, that's one thing but they have a game plan that goes bust when one guy turns towards the sideline instead of inside and it seems to happen all the time.
It's so damn frustrating to see the entire game hinge on one guy making the minor adjustment at the same time his QB is instead of running a simple route like Ruben Randle and the slant.
Personally, I think there is something wrong with ELi.  
idinkido : 10/6/2013 11:32 pm : link
Yes, he has been put into many bad situations but he has made a lot of bonehead plays, too. Eli takes a lot of physical punishment.
Eli can move in the pocket,  
oldutican : 10/6/2013 11:36 pm : link
but he is so slow that he rarely escapes it to make a play. Many of his bad decisions come when he is trying to get away. You don't need to be Vick to be able to run for a first down when there is plenty of room to run, or get away from a big d-lineman and make a play.
I've rewatched...  
Ryan : 10/7/2013 12:46 am : link
...up through the 1st INT (about 10 min left in 4th) and my DVR cut off shortly thereafter but Banks/Papa are absolutely right. Eli was incredibly sharp to this point and aside from some good bottling of McCoy, the only reason it was really a game. He was making a killing hitting those slants, made several nice throws on the run and was on the money on 5 of 6 deep shots (1 caught, 2 Randle drops, 1 Cruz probably should have had for a TD, 1 Cruz DPI, 1 to Cruz that was well covered).

After seeing it over and over I don't blame Eli for trying to get the ball out on the 1st INT and it looks like he was already cocking to throw when he was hit in the head. We cleared out with 4 verticals and Jacobs released underneath and out and could have gotten a big gain but the corner blitz was perfectly disguised and the protection didn't slide (maybe Jacobs should have seen and not released - not sure). Beatty got beat by Cole outside which gave the DB a clean corner and Boothe just stood there looking around. Even if he had doubled down on Cordile's man he clears a better lane and Eli can probably get the throw off. All ELi has to do is get it out beyond Kendricks who was in no man's land and either Jacobs catches it or it falls harmlessly incomplete. But like everything with this fucking team every bounce lands on worst case scenario.

The last two drives end on INT's that are firmly on his WRs while the pass protection breaks down and the defense once again opens the 2nd half flood gates. So, I don't get the venom. I really think some people sit on BBI/nfl.com and don't actually watch the game.
Eli  
jpat54 : 10/7/2013 12:55 am : link
He should be in his prime yrs.But with no OL,no RB's no TE,He's at the mercy of the opposing defense.I just hope he doesn't get maimed.On defense same problem,no talent.Which is all Reese's fault not T.C.We have arugbally(sp)the best receiver in the league.Deffinately one of the top 4,A great QB,But you can't win with 2 VG skilled,players with no help.
Like you?  
HomerJones45 : 10/7/2013 12:57 am : link
he was not "incredibly sharp". He had some good stretches and some bad stretches. He was pretty bad in the latter half of the firs quarter and the second quarter. He missed Cruz badly on a 3rd and short out that would have been a first down. He missed Nicks badly on a slant where Nicks had his man beat for a first down. A goodly number of throws were high.

He looked much, much better in the 3rd quarter which is probably what you remember.
You have no idea....  
Ryan : 10/7/2013 1:08 am : link
...what you're talking about.

Cruz stumbled coming out of a jerk route on the 3rd and 3 and couldn't get to the ball. Nicks let up coming out of his break on the slant looking for the ball at that point for some reason - the throw was in same place as all the other ones he completed - it's a timing route.

Missed a bunch of throws high? When? Not to this point in the game. At all. The only times we went short were when we went to the hurry up which we completed a bunch up until Jacobs fumbled it away. Coupled with Randle's 2nd drop of a perfectly thrown deep ball and you have the main culprits of the 2nd quarter dry spell.

Just shut your mouth.
I don't understand why people forget  
bradshaw44 : 10/7/2013 1:12 am : link
With a good enough OL Eli is the one that through the pass to Mario. Kid is amazing. Just get him an OL. He's proved he can do it. B
Eli is playing poorly because he  
chops : 10/7/2013 10:53 am : link
is trying to win without help.

It's like asking a fish to climb a tree.
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