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Good, Bad and Ugly

PeterS : 11/18/2013 11:47 am
Good: "Green Zone" success and 4th down conversions. Good game for Brandon Myers. Terrific INT/TD by JPP. Shorter passing game is a good move. Weatherford had an awesome day.

Bad: Penalties, miscue by Louis Murphy. O-line took a step back from last week.

Ugly: We allowed a practice squad QB to pass for over 300 yards. Forgettable day for all the CB's.
I wouldn't  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 11/18/2013 11:49 am : link
say "bad" for OL. It was mixed. They had one really bad series after the game got to 20-13, but that was partially a scheme issue. The Packers timed a blitz up the middle and Brown couldn't get around Manning to pick it up.

Green Bay has a very big and physical front seven.
good observations  
marc in easton : 11/18/2013 11:49 am : link
Next time post about something this whole board didn't notice. Go beyond the obvious. Have a good day!
I thought the CBs played well  
Go Terps : 11/18/2013 11:50 am : link
Give credit where it's due...the guy made a couple great throws even when the coverage was good. Aaron Rodgers isn't making better throws than the ones he had to Nelson and Quarless.

marc  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 11/18/2013 11:50 am : link
was that really necessary?
Amukamara  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 11/18/2013 11:51 am : link
was a stud in run defense.
When your primary  
dep026 : 11/18/2013 11:52 am : link
goal is to stop the run, you are going to give up big pass plays. Price got beat once, McBride got beat once, and TT lost Jordy a few times.

None resulted in TDs. Secondary was fine yesterday.
Ditto Prince.  
MOOPS : 11/18/2013 11:54 am : link
Also Hill looks like a stud in the making.
We gotta bring Beason back.
i also feel will hill is a budding star  
fame56 : 11/18/2013 11:57 am : link
but i'm very worried about his addiction issues....

its very hard for a 20 something guy with lots of money to stay off of pot that he likes so much

i just hope he realizes that his professional football career is way more important..he can stay clean a day at a time for the next 10 years or so and do whatever he wants when he retires
they only had 3 penalties. TC cited it as one of the things  
Victor in CT : 11/18/2013 11:58 am : link
he was pleased about at the post game presser.
We need Linval  
lester : 11/18/2013 11:59 am : link
back too..
Eric - I Agree About Amukamara  
Trainmaster : 11/18/2013 11:59 am : link
He was really, really solid, especially against Lacy.

It seems Reese is at his best when he drafts for outright solid value (e.g. Amukamara, Randle) and whiffs too often when he takes a flyer in rounds 1-3 (rarely round 1) on a guy who was injured, had issues or requires adapting to a new position (e.g. Austin, Sintim).

Obviously there are exceptions, but the Amukamara and Randle picks are turning out to be very solid ones. The Randle pick will allow us to not overpay to keep Nicks. In hindsight, resigning Cruz will be much more important than resigning Nicks.
RE: i also feel will hill is a budding star  
Cam in MO : 11/18/2013 12:00 pm : link
In comment 11344242 fame56 said:
Quote:
but i'm very worried about his addiction issues....

its very hard for a 20 something guy with lots of money to stay off of pot that he likes so much

i just hope he realizes that his professional football career is way more important..he can stay clean a day at a time for the next 10 years or so and do whatever he wants when he retires



Meh, I'm more hopeful that he learns how to not get caught. Pretty sure that's more likely than him quitting for the next 10 years.


Want to add at least one "good" to your list...  
M.S. : 11/18/2013 12:02 pm : link
...despite 4 sacks and some heavy pressure besides, Eli just looked more fluid, mobile, agile and CONFIDENT throwing the ball yesterday! I've seen past games where maybe there was less pressure but more jittery-ness out of our QB.

But not yesterday! He played well, managed the game well, made some key passes and helped lead our team to victory.
marc in easton  
GiantWarrior : 11/18/2013 12:02 pm : link
Ha! Dick!
I agree with Terps and Eric  
johnnyb : 11/18/2013 12:04 pm : link
Prince and Will Hill were stellar in run support. Penalties always suck, but we did not committ many. I counted three, but I could be wrong.

Was that a sreen pass I saw? About time, and well executed.

Murphy obviously cut the wrong way, which led to Eli's only interception. We won the turnover battle for a change.

I thought the run defense played well and Beason gave us another reason to cheer. he has been a big addition to our below-average LBs.

Need to keep it up for 'Boys next week. Keep it going!!
RE: When your primary  
GIANTSr01 : 11/18/2013 12:07 pm : link
In comment 11344225 dep026 said:
Quote:
goal is to stop the run, you are going to give up big pass plays. Price got beat once, McBride got beat once, and TT lost Jordy a few times.

None resulted in TDs. Secondary was fine yesterday.


That's my biggest worry against Dallas. For the first time in a month, the Giants will have to worry about the pass and run. One thing the backup QBs have allowed them to do is stack the box. That said, Murray is no McCoy or AP or even Lacy.

The other noticeable thing with Beason and Hill, is that the two of them actually get through on blitzes. No sacks yesterday for them, but at least a couple pressures from them (possibly a couple hits too).

How do you figure that the o-line regressed?  
MetsAreBack : 11/18/2013 12:07 pm : link

I didnt see the whole game - watched most of it on Red Zone as i didnt feel like streaming off the Internet and we were stuck watching the Dolphins in South Florida - but the drives they showed, Eli was for the most part getting a nice clean pocket... and it showed up in the results (270 yds passing)

As far as the running stats, sure they dipped a bit... a) Green Bay has a better run D than Oakland and b) last week it was well documented that most of Brown's yardage was after initial contact.
Also, wanna say that on any given Sunday...  
M.S. : 11/18/2013 12:08 pm : link
...Perry Fewell can throw 5 or 6 guys out there on the back 7 who can run like Hell and can tackle the daylights out of the other team!!!

Jon Beason, Jacquian Williams, Prince Amukamara,Terrell Thomas, Antrel Rolle, Will Hill... these guys can really get after it. When they tackle, the opposing guy usually stays tackled.


RE: Want to add at least one  
GIANTSr01 : 11/18/2013 12:09 pm : link
In comment 11344255 M.S. said:
Quote:
...despite 4 sacks and some heavy pressure besides, Eli just looked more fluid, mobile, agile and CONFIDENT throwing the ball yesterday! I've seen past games where maybe there was less pressure but more jittery-ness out of our QB.

But not yesterday! He played well, managed the game well, made some key passes and helped lead our team to victory.


Eli even looked good running the ball yesterday. Though one was called back on a hold by Pugh.
GIANTSr01...  
M.S. : 11/18/2013 12:10 pm : link
...McBride is gonna need help over the top against Dallas, or else there will be burn marks on the field.
RE: How do you figure that the o-line regressed?  
dep026 : 11/18/2013 12:10 pm : link
In comment 11344277 MetsAreBack said:
Quote:

I didnt see the whole game - watched most of it on Red Zone as i didnt feel like streaming off the Internet and we were stuck watching the Dolphins in South Florida - but the drives they showed, Eli was for the most part getting a nice clean pocket... and it showed up in the results (270 yds passing)

As far as the running stats, sure they dipped a bit... a) Green Bay has a better run D than Oakland and b) last week it was well documented that most of Brown's yardage was after initial contact.


Its about consistency. There were drives where Eli had all day. Then there were drives where the OL just looked like crap. I wouldnt say the OLine regressed yesterday, but its becoming stagnant.
the negatives on the OL  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 11/18/2013 12:11 pm : link
yesterday were the two first-half penalties (Giants only had three penalties all day however) and that one really bad series in pass protection (but again, part of that was on the scheme/back).
At this point the line is what it is  
MetsAreBack : 11/18/2013 12:13 pm : link
not very good and in need of overall (doesnt help when $11-12mm of your cap dollar investments in said o-line has been on IR all year either)

I just disagreed with the 'regression' comment because a) they werent particularly good against Oakland... since Brown did most of the work without their help, and b) for the most part, Eli had time to throw yesterday
I don't know why people are so focused on the yds thrown by Tolzien  
PatersonPlank : 11/18/2013 12:15 pm : link
for the following reasons:
- IMO that was likely the gameplan, stop the run and make the no-name guy try and beat you
- We turned him over 3 times, with no TD's
- We only gave up 13 pts, so it did work
Dont know  
gmen9892 : 11/18/2013 12:19 pm : link
What Webster's status is going to be for this weekend, but this would be a HUGE game for him to come back for. Dallas has so much WR depth.
PatersonPlank...  
M.S. : 11/18/2013 12:23 pm : link
...I agree with you, but I just gotta a feeling that Tony Romo is looking at game film and is salavating a little... especially with Trumaine McBride at starting CB. McBride will need some help, and hopefully Prince can limit the damage with all the one-on-one coverage he'll be asked to perform.
RE: GIANTSr01...  
GIANTSr01 : 11/18/2013 12:24 pm : link
In comment 11344290 M.S. said:
Quote:
...McBride is gonna need help over the top against Dallas, or else there will be burn marks on the field.


Agreed, though I'm more concerned with getting Prince help assuming he's going to be on Dez. Prince has been great this year, but you can't cover Dez 1-on-1. We're going to need big games from Rolle and Hill. And JW needs to have a strong game against Witten.
I wouldn't  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 11/18/2013 12:31 pm : link
count on Webster. He hasn't practiced much. He's going to be very rusty. Again, this isn't a video game.
I'm starting to  
phil in arizona : 11/18/2013 12:50 pm : link
like Jernigan.

I hope we can get Nicks back but I think we'd be OK with Cruz, Randle, and Jernigan next year.
Don't care about Tolzien's passing yards  
rsjem1979 : 11/18/2013 12:58 pm : link
They were behind all day, the Giants focused on (and succeeded in) shutting down Lacy, so naturally the QB is going to pile up some yardage.

But they wanted to put the game on his shoulders, and he rewarded them by throwing 3 INTs.

Sounds like they executed their gameplan pretty well if you ask me.
RE: Amukamara  
PeterS : 11/18/2013 12:58 pm : link
In comment 11344219 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
was a stud in run defense.
He did make two nice TFL's.
RE: I wouldn't  
Jimmy Googs : 11/18/2013 1:05 pm : link
In comment 11344375 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
count on Webster. He hasn't practiced much. He's going to be very rusty. Again, this isn't a video game.


Well he needs to start getting the rust off then.

I know he is probably doing his best with rehab, but we are one injury away in the secondary of having a BIG problem.

His presence, and a few increasing snaps each week, would be a welcome sight.
Eli's mojo may be back!  
GiantsUA : 11/18/2013 1:07 pm : link
or just about back, let's see what happens this week.
I'll add short yardage running  
pjcas18 : 11/18/2013 1:15 pm : link
game as a positive. Not sure if it was Conner, Jacobs, Brown, O-line, whatever, seemed like all the short yardage plays were picked up- smash mouth style.

Penalties?  
NJGiantFan84 : 11/18/2013 1:18 pm : link
Really? We had 3 and 2 of them were really early on. They did a very good job on that.

Thorzien can throw the ball nicely when he has time and receivers get open. Who cares how many yards he throws for if he has 0 TD passes? The defense has been outstanding. Yeah, Prince and McBride got beat deep a few times but often the passes were short passes to great receivers who got YAC. I wouldn't call anything defensively bad yesterday, especially since they made plays when they were needed most.

Cruz was outstanding. Nicks had some good catches and our Special Teams helped us win a game. Weatherford was great, Randle had an outstanding run. Jacobs contribution won't show on the stat sheet but he was tremendous in short yardage. Brown also made some plays.

Look, this team is what it is. Mediocre. But if we play like we did yesterday, there are only a few teams we couldn't play with. And if Eli comes on to be the Elite QB we know he can be, this team could make a run at the post season.

There was far more good yesterday than bad and ugly relative to what it was in the first 9 games.
Good Bad and Ugly  
Jimmy Googs : 11/18/2013 1:21 pm : link
Good - four targets and three big catches from one of BBI's favorite whipping boys - Brandon Myers. Not huge production but enough to really help keep drives moving.

Bad - Offensive line didn't have a bad day, but did have a VERY BAD 4TH QTR allowing several sacks and not creating any running lanes when needed to finish off the game. Momentum was changing because they couldn't win their battles.

Ugly - Louis Murphy. Key mistakes on route running and also special teams is not endearing him to anyone. Feel to make it up to your teammates next week IF you get a chance.
The good: JPP Int, Andre Brown's running, Cruz's receptions  
NbgBlue : 11/18/2013 1:31 pm : link
The Bad: O-line still giving up sacks, Murphy's route running
The Ugly: Deep ball to Bear Pascoe, Eli's scramble and hook-slide
RE: I thought the CBs played well  
Simms11 : 11/18/2013 2:01 pm : link
In comment 11344217 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Give credit where it's due...the guy made a couple great throws even when the coverage was good. Aaron Rodgers isn't making better throws than the ones he had to Nelson and Quarless.


Actually our zone scheme needs work as their receivers were finding far too many holes and the 3rd String QB was getting them the ball on the money.
Giant pass defense clearly gave up some yards BUT  
Jimmy Googs : 11/18/2013 2:20 pm : link
some of those longer plays by Green Bay were great individual efforts by their QB and Receivers. A couple of those catches were using just fingertips on only half of the ball.

You can always play tighter coverage, but I chalk a few of those catches up to "sometimes the other team just makes a play".

PR by Randall was a +  
TXRabbit : 11/18/2013 3:09 pm : link
Defense against the run continues to be a +
Weatherford not sucking anymore was a +
No pick-6's for Eli was a +
I was actually excited about our running game. It was fun to watch some smash-mouth
The two long passes  
johnnyb : 11/18/2013 4:14 pm : link
completed by Green bay were perfectly thrown balls. defense was avtually pretty good from where I was sitting. Sometimes you have to tip your cap to the QB- he layed the ball in beatifully and there was nothing McBride could do. I thought, overall, the defense played a good game.
I stand corrected re: the CB's  
PeterS : 11/18/2013 4:27 pm : link
it wasn't all on them. That first long pass was a tremendous catch by Jordy Nelson.
Although it was one of Eli's better games this season...  
Big Blue Blogger : 11/18/2013 4:53 pm : link
...it was not a performance worthy of a $20MM franchise QB. He badly missed an easy TD to Cruz, and even the TD he did hit to Randle was slightly underthrown. The deep throw to Pascoe was an ugly play all around, but I think the idea there is to throw it to Bear only if he's WIDE open. He had a step, which had narrowed to a half-step by the time the ball sailed over his head. Of Brown's two early drops, I thought the second was thrown too high and too hard - probably because Eli felt pressure.

As for the interception: not Eli's fault, obviously - awful play by Murphy, nice catch by Williams - but still a poor risk-reward throw since Murphy was going to need about six yards after the catch for the play to serve any useful purpose. Eli Manning (of all people) should be painfully familiar with the downside of green-zone passes to the flat.
OL/Andre Brown  
Bill in UT : 11/18/2013 6:02 pm : link
Watching last weeks game, it seemed like AB was ripping off 5-6-7 yards every carry. But at the end of the day he averaged under 4 yards per carry. Yesterday, not so many 5 yard plus runs, and again, less than 4 yards per carry. So the perception may be a little larger than the actual numbers. I just checked- he's averaging 3.8 for 48 carries. Da'Rel Scott was averaging 3.7 for 20 carries, lol. Then Jacobs and Wilson at 3.3. As a team, 3.2 yards per carry
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