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What is needed to reasonably "fix" the Giants?

George from PA : 12/9/2013 5:17 am
#1.Resolve what is wrong with Eli. He is not comfortable in the pocket, his passes are off, usually towards double coverage and that swagger of a 4th qtr come back is gone.

- His mechanics are usually a big reason. He always seems to do better with a seasoned "father figure" QB coach and needs more time, with easier receptions.

- We have said it all year, a major upgrade to the OL.

Pugh was a great pick-up. Diehl/Brewer must be replaced. Beatty on notice. I think Baas gets another year due to his cap.

- A 2-way TE and a big WR target seem to be needed. I still am very confused by Nicks downturn. I can understand he lost a step but that was never his strength. His vice grip hands? How do you lose that??? Myers is Reese' biggest mistake!

- Easier plays/better plays called....higher percentage and simpler read/options. I assume most of the plays are set up in camp while expectation where high on our passing game. 3 deep options on a 3rd and 5? Gilbride and Coughlin biggest mistake!


#2. More presser on opposing QB's with better coverage.

In general, the defense played better than I expected. We stopped the run...which was our Achilles last year, but we regressed on the pass defense.

- A top flight corner opposite Prince to replace Webster.

- What to do with Tuck? I assume it would have been his side to be the problem but the JPP/Kiwi side was a big zero. Not knowing if JPP can return to form but Kiwi needs to be replaced.....could it be Moore?

-As always, a stud Lb'er!

#3. Special teams needs less turnover....most of them end up starting and it is always seems to be a different person that makes the mistake.


I feel it starts with the OL...with a TE, WR, and corner. DE?

Reese needs to polish his image this off-season....which has tarnished this year.


you left off  
newmike2 : 12/9/2013 5:35 am : link
firing the coordinators after TC resigns.
There are so many things that have to change  
silverfox : 12/9/2013 5:56 am : link
But it starts with Eli. He's a terrible QB simply put no matter whatever he's done in the past. Even rookies like buffalo's make him look silly at this point. No mobility, currently shell shocked , bad mechanics , and horrible decision making not to mention can't even throw a screen pass. He's not worth a third string salary at this point. Hell some third stringers came off the bench on other teams this year that look better.

The coaches and front office have not done their jobs. What happens to all of you when you don't do your job ?

The list goes on ,,, and I have better things to do with my time..
silverfox  
Tuckrule : 12/9/2013 6:42 am : link
when you have absolutely no offensive line and a shit running game for half a season how do you expect a qb to thrive. I have actually been surprised at how often he moves within the pocket to avoid sacks. Peyton, brady, brees wouldnt do much better. The only qbs in the league who would do better than eli with this current team is a scrambling qb with some nice legs like a wilson or newton.
Eli is due about $33MM over the next two years.  
Big Blue Blogger : 12/9/2013 6:44 am : link
If he's serious about a third championship, he needs to do the right thing and take a massive salary cut. Save face by calling it a restructure, guaranteeing some salary or adding meaningless years, whatever. The #1 lesson of 2013 is that Eli Manning, for all of his past post-season magic, is not good enough to carry a team behind a garbage offensive line. Maybe in 2011, for six games; but not now, and not behind a line this bad. Instead of buying his linemen cars or Rolexes, he needs to buy himself some linemen, and maybe a receiver or two.

Of course, it won't happen - the Mannings don't do business that way. Just don't expect a dramatically different results from the same QB-heavy cap distribution. We can bitch forever about short-term disappointments like Myers or Murphy, who will be gone next year anyway, and Will Beatty may have been a mistake (jury's out on that one). The key challenge is freeing big chunks of cap space and using it well. Chris Snee is a start, as are others, but Eli is the 500-pound gorilla.
tuckrule: Rodgers did it for years.  
Big Blue Blogger : 12/9/2013 6:45 am : link
He hasn't been as durable as Eli, but he has been magnificent behind awful lines, with a terrible running game.
New Coaching  
ZogZerg : 12/9/2013 6:47 am : link
.
First  
Arcanum : 12/9/2013 6:51 am : link
Unless there's better protection for Eli, his play will continue this way. Second, Eli needs a new system. This system, his predictable, and complicated as fuck to run. Guys are just out there clueless, running routes. The crazy thing is, is that, this system has been failing years. I've seen this destruction coming years ago. The Giants stuck with this system about 3 years to long.
Too  
AcidTest : 12/9/2013 6:58 am : link
much I fear to do in one season. As someone said, this is probably a two year rebuilding process. Eli is the key.
An OL is needed  
JohnB : 12/9/2013 7:30 am : link
If the OL can't protect Eli or open up running lanes then the offense is dead. Once the offense is dead, then the defense isn't good enough to carry the load.

Fix the offense and then everything will start coming together on both sides of the ball.
One easy fix and one hard fix.  
chiefmps : 12/9/2013 7:38 am : link
One, keep on losing the rest of the games this season, got to look forward for a top ten draft pick.
Two, salary cap, got to cut away the dead fat and rework Eli contract. Mite want to look into a new coaching staff, out with the old in with the new.
There is no way,  
Doomster : 12/9/2013 7:42 am : link
this is fixed in one season....

There are too many holes in the dike.....

The offensive and defensive schemes are failures...

The offense looked listless in preseason, and remained that way most of the year.....

Defense? How many times must we see, a zone defense, inside the 10 yard line, where no one knows their assignment, and receivers are wide open?

I mean, this is TOTAL failure.....front office, coaches, players.....the moves ownership makes in the off season, will really show how serious they are about turning this team around......words just will not cut it....
Doomster  
JoefromPa : 12/9/2013 8:10 am : link
your point about goal line defense is spot on. Incredible that from the 5 a receiver can get 5 yards behind a defender

As to the fix.........rebuild the interior of the offensive line, replace Fewell.

In today's NFL it doesn't take much to go from 1st to last and vice versa
George,  
Simms11 : 12/9/2013 9:27 am : link
agree with everything you said…..it's unfortunate, but this team needs a total overhaul IMO. There are some players that will form the foundation, but there's a clearcut need for upgrades at almost every position! On O - TE, WR and interior oline, and on D - DE, OLB and CB. Additionally there's a need for a KR and PR. Lastly, I think Eli needs a safetry valve coming out of the backfield on third down - a Dave Megget, Darren Sproles type. Could David Wilson play that role? possibly.
A lot of changes  
ij_reilly : 12/9/2013 9:30 am : link
New coordinators.

All positions except QB and safety.

Good news: all feasible in today's NFL, especially with the reasonable cap space the Giants will have.
RE: Eli is due about $33MM over the next two years.  
mrvax : 12/9/2013 9:32 am : link
In comment 11383980 Big Blue Blogger said:
Quote:
If he's serious about a third championship, he needs to do the right thing and take a massive salary cut. Save face by calling it a restructure, guaranteeing some salary or adding meaningless years, whatever. The #1 lesson of 2013 is that Eli Manning, for all of his past post-season magic, is not good enough to carry a team behind a garbage offensive line. Maybe in 2011, for six games; but not now, and not behind a line this bad. Instead of buying his linemen cars or Rolexes, he needs to buy himself some linemen, and maybe a receiver or two.

Of course, it won't happen - the Mannings don't do business that way. Just don't expect a dramatically different results from the same QB-heavy cap distribution. We can bitch forever about short-term disappointments like Myers or Murphy, who will be gone next year anyway, and Will Beatty may have been a mistake (jury's out on that one). The key challenge is freeing big chunks of cap space and using it well. Chris Snee is a start, as are others, but Eli is the 500-pound gorilla.


I agree 100%. Can Reese ask Eli to sit down and at least consider a pay cut? There's no way I make a substantial offer to Nicks either based on his play this year. Have to avoid these huge contracts. Reese's hands were tied with Beatty mistake or not. There was no choice.
Regime-change is needed.  
Klaatu : 12/9/2013 9:32 am : link
Start with a new GM. Blow the whole fucking thing up.
My Reasonable "Fix"  
JoeyBigBlue : 12/9/2013 9:32 am : link
Eli has a track a record of excellent QB play and is still isn't old (33 next season) I think he needs to work with his coach Cutcliffe, on refining his mechanics in the offseason. He will be OK.


Jerry Reese and the Giants Front Office need to have a real strong offseason. I would consider the following things.

- Fire OC Kevin Gilbride, ST Coach Tom Quinn, and QB Coach Sean Ryan.

- Rebuild the O-Line specifically the Interior O-Line.. Release David Baas, Release Chris Snee, and Say Good bye to David Diehl. Sign a 2 veteran Guards draft a young Center (2nd round pick) or Draft a OT in first Round and move Pugh to guard.

- Say Good bye to Hakeem Nicks. Promote Randle to starter. Sign veteran 3rd receiver

- Re-sign Justin Tuck to reasonable 2 to 3 year contract.

- Say Good bye to Corey Webster. Draft a Corner High (1st round). This team needs a No. 1 corner in the Worst way to pair with Amukamara

- Re-sign Jon Beason to reasonable 2 to 3 year contract.

- Sign veteran strongside linebacker.

- Target RB, Guards, Linebacker, and WR late in draft Rounds (3-7)




Also think  
JoeyBigBlue : 12/9/2013 9:33 am : link
Giants should fire Marc Ross. His late round drafting has really hampered this organization.
Maybe it's time for Coughlin and Reese to make Sophie's Choice.  
Big Blue Blogger : 12/9/2013 10:47 am : link
Let them keep one guy from each of the lists below, or resign. Based strictly on recent results, every one of these guys has arguably earned a pink slip.

For Coughlin (coordinators):
Gilbride #1
Fewell
Quinn

For Coughlin (position coaches & other):
Gilbride #2
Ryan
Flaherty
Pope
Nunn
Herrmann
Giunta
Palmieri

For Reese:
Ross
Sternfeld
Abrams
Chris Mara belongs on this list - maybe Coughlin too - but I suspect John M. would have to make those calls himself.
after watching yesterday's game  
bc4life : 12/9/2013 11:16 am : link
in addition to the obvious upgrades (O-Line) - you gotta wonder, in a copy cat league, is that San Diego offense something we should try to copy.
Lots of things  
Patrick77 : 12/9/2013 11:50 am : link
Fire Couglin
Fire Gilbride

Let the new head coach decide all other coaching positions.
Cut/move or don't resign the following:

Nicks
Tuck
Webster
Kiwanuka
Diehl
Baas
Snee
Myers


Then hopefully in free agency they can find 2 interior OL, keep Boothe and sign a #3 WR. They need to draft an interior player and a WR as well IMO. A veteran TE or even 2 need to be brought in so Pascoe can be a utility player who is inactive every week. Drafting a TE would be adviseable but not necessary. They can get quality blocking and pass catching at the TE position from plenty of FAs. Brown, Hillis, Conner, Jacobs, and Wilson should all come to camp. A cheap veteran RB may be useful as well depending on the cap situation.

On defense I think defensive tackle and the backfield look good, everyone they can bring back except Webster should be brought back. Beason needs to be resigned, another linebacker brought in would be nice as well as another draft pick. It shouldn't be too hard to find the same or better production as Tuck and Kiwanuka with free agents as well. On defense they have talent and at times it shows well, what they haven't had all year is a pass rush. Moore, a healtyh JPP, and some free agents should help. Another DE should be drafted.

This roster is not terrible, but it is missing starters at 2-3 offensive line positions, 1 wide receiver, 1 tight end, 1 defensive end, and 1 linebacker spot in 2014. If a new coaching staff is given those items they would be successful. Coughlin and company, even with more talent would be hindered by the complexity of their schemes and inability to get young guys involved. They also have shown they can't will this team to play a turnover-free or mistake-free style of play.
My list is not that long...  
nyblue56 : 12/9/2013 12:02 pm : link
but we should be doing the following:

1) Change the offensive system. They can do something similar (same concept) but get simply reads and less adjustments or allow Eli to give the receivers the new route prior to the snap (similar to what Peyton does). If he knows where there are going, he play with more confidence and play faster, with more accuracy.
2) Draft and bring FA that are actual good OL. when your QB can't step up he is playing with one hand behind his back. The deep passes will flutter, the short passes will sail, he will start drifting back even when there is no pressure while throwing.
3) SIGN JOHN BEASON;retain the DTs that we have on the roster; Keep tuck (hope JPP can make a come back; I think that is a good gamble; get moore ready. Draft or Bring in a quality corner.
Change  
AnishPatel : 12/9/2013 12:06 pm : link
the offensive system. Change the offensive system.. Change the offensive system. Add more talented players to the offense. Change the offensive system. Change the offensive system.
Too much to fix in one season.  
Red Dog : 12/9/2013 12:12 pm : link
And if they don't start this off-season with a new draft head and new drafting philosophy, a near-complete overhaul of the coaching staff, and a lot of new players, it will quickly get to be too much to fix in two seasons.

Buffalo got to the point that it is too much to fix in three or four seasons. I'd hate to see the GIANTS reach that point, but that is exactly where they are headed.
Doomster and Klaatu  
Percy : 12/9/2013 1:33 pm : link
Agree. Nothing more need be said.
Change the offensive system.. Change the offensive system.  
Mondo : 12/9/2013 2:22 pm : link
Change the offensive system.. Change the offensive system.
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