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The case for not selecting a WR at 12....

kmed : 3/28/2014 1:38 pm
Last year there were 23 WR's that had 1000 yards or more. Of those 23 WR's, they were drafted in the following rounds:

Rd 1-7 players
Rd 2-7 players
Rd 3-4 players
Rd 4-2 players
Rd 5-0
Rd 6-2 players
Rd 7-1 player

The first rounders:

Calvin(2), Demarious Thomas(22), AJ Green(4), Andre Johnson(3), Dez(24), Kendell Wright(20), Malcolm Floyd(13)


So by my count, only 1 player that was drafted in the middle of the first was a top 23(in yardage) player last year. Seems to me, if you miss the high end talent at WR that usually goes within the top 5 picks, you are better off either waiting until the end of the first or the second round.

.  
arcarsenal : 3/28/2014 1:39 pm : link
Each year is its own case.

Unless Watkins miraculously falls to us, I would be fine with passing on WR at 12 though. I'd rather address a more pressing need and find a WR a few rds later.
I think an easier case to make is that  
illmatic : 3/28/2014 1:40 pm : link
there aren't really any players worthy of the selection at 12 (not a huge Evans fan, sorry) unless they want to trade up and grab Watkins. But I think they can definitely find a good WR in rounds 2-4. The only problem is the Giants don't need another "good" WR. They need a potentially great WR. They don't need another Randle in my opinion.
There is also a case FOR selecting one at 12  
NYGmen58 : 3/28/2014 1:40 pm : link
MIKE EVANS

Would be the ideal X the Giants need and he will be a star in the NFL.

I realize O-line may be a greater need still but a player with Evans, abilities, measurable, and production doesn't come around too often.
If Evans or Watkins aren't there  
A Aron Balakey : 3/28/2014 1:41 pm : link
at 12 then obviously you wait to draft a WR especially with the amount if depth at the position this year. There will be some really good receiving talent probably falling all the way to the third round this year.
i would be happy with  
NewYorkGiants : 3/28/2014 1:42 pm : link
any of
Sammy Watkins
Mike Evans
Marqise Lee

I know its unlikely but I would love to trade up for Watkins

He just seems like a lock to be a dominant wideout for years to come i just think of him being as good or better than
Dez/Julio/AJ green
.  
arcarsenal : 3/28/2014 1:44 pm : link
I love Watkins and think he's clearly one of the best players in the draft.. but as good or better than AJ and Dez (+ Julio) is setting the bar really high. I think he'll be really good. I don't know if he'll be THAT good.
that same analysis would likely work  
Peter from CT : 3/28/2014 1:45 pm : link
for any position on the field
The case for not selecting a WR  
steve in ky : 3/28/2014 1:47 pm : link
would be that they have someone rated higher on their board who plays a different position and is still available.
I'd prefer the Giants don't take a WR  
pjcas18 : 3/28/2014 1:47 pm : link
at 12, but I feel like you can make a case against every position.
ARC  
NewYorkGiants : 3/28/2014 1:49 pm : link
to me he just has it all

Good Size 6'1 210
runs a 4.3/4.4
is fantastic at highpointing the ball
great vision
great body control
very fluid with his moves
absolute home run hitter any time he touches the ball he has a chance to take it all the way


i know the bar of julio aj green and dez is high but i believe without a doubt in my mind he is the total package and will be as good as them
Seems as though none of the 2nd tier WR's  
kmed : 3/28/2014 1:50 pm : link
in the draft had a good season last year. Either they were a top 5 pick or back of the first round and 2nd round.
Evans would be fine if there  
LauderdaleMatty : 3/28/2014 1:52 pm : link
Still weren't huge questions on the OL and no NFL level TEs on the roster. The rules favor WRs so much you do need to grab one too early as you can get very similar production out of guys taken 2-3 rounds later.

Sure you can miss on players but the OL is a mess and that had t changes with two middle of the road guys signed.

Fantasy football mindset rules people these days.

RE: Evans would be fine if there  
NYGmen58 : 3/28/2014 1:58 pm : link
In comment 11592591 LauderdaleMatty said:
Quote:
Still weren't huge questions on the OL and no NFL level TEs on the roster. The rules favor WRs so much you do need to grab one too early as you can get very similar production out of guys taken 2-3 rounds later.

Sure you can miss on players but the OL is a mess and that had t changes with two middle of the road guys signed.

Fantasy football mindset rules people these days.


What does fantasy football have anything to do with this?
RE: ARC  
arcarsenal : 3/28/2014 1:59 pm : link
In comment 11592582 NewYorkGiants said:
Quote:
to me he just has it all

Good Size 6'1 210
runs a 4.3/4.4
is fantastic at highpointing the ball
great vision
great body control
very fluid with his moves
absolute home run hitter any time he touches the ball he has a chance to take it all the way


i know the bar of julio aj green and dez is high but i believe without a doubt in my mind he is the total package and will be as good as them


His size is solid but all those other guys are bigger than he is. Julio and AJ are both 3" taller and Julio is built like a brick. Dez is not a LOT bigger but he is stronger. These guys can get to passes that I'm not 100% sure Watkins will at the pro level. He's a gamebreaking talent, no doubt.. and I've been a proponent of his for a while now.. but I do think guys like AJ have a catch radius that Watkins just doesn't have. He can make up for it in other ways.. it's just a very high bar to set.
RE: Seems as though none of the 2nd tier WR's  
Curtis in VA : 3/28/2014 1:59 pm : link
In comment 11592585 kmed said:
Quote:
in the draft had a good season last year. Either they were a top 5 pick or back of the first round and 2nd round.


But they weren't drafted in the back of the first round and 2nd round because it was safer to draft them there. That is just where they fell according to the teams who picked players before them. It doesn't really mean picking a WR in the top 10 will be any less or more productive. Players are picked way ahead or way behind where they are slotted for a variety of reasons.
Add to that that this draft  
chris r : 3/28/2014 1:59 pm : link
Is very deep at WR and it becomes crazy to take a WR not named Watkins at 12.
RE: RE: Evans would be fine if there  
LauderdaleMatty : 3/28/2014 2:09 pm : link
In comment 11592603 NYGmen58 said:
[quote] In comment 11592591 LauderdaleMatty said:


Quote:


Still weren't huge questions on the OL and no NFL level TEs on the roster. The rules favor WRs so much you do need to grab one too early as you can get very similar production out of guys taken 2-3 rounds later.

Sure you can miss on players but the OL is a mess and that had t changes with two middle of the road guys signed.

Fantasy football mindset rules people these days.




What does fantasy football have anything to do with this? [/

Well which group on this team needs more help? OL or WR. Randle was a high pick who has shown promise yet we have a lot of people saying the offense needs Evans as a weapon. As FF has grown I popularity it's my opinion that the mindset of more and more fans is that they will ignore manynog the most basic aspects of football and
Be mesmerized by stats and big plays. Hence the clamor for a WR or TE. Just can't believe people think Evans can be a huge help if Eli is once agai running for his life. It's a thought process offensive skill players before linemen early and often

I think it's a function of people amazed by states even when a team doesn't win much. I'll call it the Matt Stafford syndrome. How many big games has the team w the hands down best WR in the NFL won the last 4 years? Doesn't mean you pass up a Megatron in the draft but it also means without a solid line u don't usually win.
....  
vibe4giants : 3/28/2014 2:10 pm : link
Quote:
Yay
kmed : 3/23/2014 8:27 pm : link : reply
another 40+ days of this!

RE: i would be happy with  
X : 3/28/2014 2:19 pm : link
In comment 11592554 NewYorkGiants said:
Quote:
any of
Sammy Watkins
Mike Evans
Marqise Lee

I know its unlikely but I would love to trade up for Watkins

He just seems like a lock to be a dominant wideout for years to come i just think of him being as good or better than
Dez/Julio/AJ green


We have too many holes to fill to move up and this is a deep draft so we need all our picks.
LauderdaleMarty,  
Curtis in VA : 3/28/2014 2:20 pm : link
I don't think Eli will be running for his life this year if they don't pick an offensive lineman at #12. Sure, they could use some help at G and C. But how often do you have the chance to pick a guy like Mike Evans if he's there? Not to mention, Guards are a dime a dozen as free agents. You don't need a top end player at that position. See Kevin Boothe. Just a guy that can get it done. And what Center would you draft at 12?

There's plenty of validity to taking a WR or even a DT over an offensive lineman.
RE: ....  
chris r : 3/28/2014 2:20 pm : link
In comment 11592641 vibe4giants said:
Quote:


Quote:


Yay
kmed : 3/23/2014 8:27 pm : link : reply
another 40+ days of this!



There's a really neat new forum feature to deal with this: it's called not opening threads on topics that bug you.
Look at you.  
vibe4giants : 3/28/2014 2:41 pm : link
Not getting things. (More BBI 101.)

I was having fun with kmed's reaction to a draft speculation thread a few days before starting his own. Thanks upping the fun quotient, as always.
There looks like  
spu : 3/28/2014 2:52 pm : link
there is going to be some really good WR's in round 3. I have been doing some reading on Paul Richardson and Done Moncrief and they both look like they could be real 3rd steals.

I don't think the Giants need to force the issue in the first round and might be better off waiting until the third or fourth rounds to add a WR.
In 2012...  
Ed A. : 3/28/2014 3:12 pm : link
the Giants were determined to improve a DL who was among the leagues worst against the run. Ergo, they beefed up the DL and had a major improvement. Now Joseph, Tuck, Rogers and Patterson is gone from that line, (although they may still re-sign Patterson). There are presently three players on that line, Hankins (in his second year), Jenkins (33 years old) and Kuhn (enough said). There doesn't appear to be a viable choice left on the free agent list. How in the world can you ignore this in the draft? Supposedly, it is not a deep draft in Defensive Lineman. I cannot believe the Giants will not go DL early in the draft and more than once.
i think you have a case not to select a WR in the 5th round  
George from PA : 3/28/2014 4:54 pm : link
:)
Still rather have Ebron  
eli4life : 3/28/2014 5:21 pm : link
1 We have shit at Te

2 te has evolved recently so everyone is still stuck on what the te position used to be (especially what the Giants used te for in the gillbride system)


3 we have shit at Te


4 we are switching to a West coast based system that utilizes a te like Ebron

5 we have shit at Te



Did I mention we have shit at te?
We can always go  
AnishPatel : 3/28/2014 5:32 pm : link
OL, TE, CB, DL.
RE: We can always go  
GmenDynasty : 3/28/2014 5:47 pm : link
In comment 11593040 AnishPatel said:
Quote:
OL, TE, CB, DL.


Anish could you handle :

Rd 1 DONALD

Rd 2 Juwan James/Kouandijo/Yankey/Bitonio/Gabe Jackson/Morgan Moses/Jake Mewhort/Antonio Richardson

Rd 3 Martavius Bryant/Devin Street/Moncrief (perhaps with a slight trade up if need be) or one of the TE's
Or they could draft Sammy Watkins lite -  
Jim in Forest Hills : 3/28/2014 5:59 pm : link
Brandin Cooks.
RE: RE: We can always go  
AnishPatel : 3/28/2014 6:09 pm : link
In comment 11593050 GmenDynasty said:
Quote:
In comment 11593040 AnishPatel said:


Quote:


OL, TE, CB, DL.



Anish could you handle :

Rd 1 DONALD

Rd 2 Juwan James/Kouandijo/Yankey/Bitonio/Gabe Jackson/Morgan Moses/Jake Mewhort/Antonio Richardson

Rd 3 Martavius Bryant/Devin Street/Moncrief (perhaps with a slight trade up if need be) or one of the TE's



I don't want Donald. I do like Gabe Jackson and Moncrief. That's picks are cool. There are a lot of combinations I like. I just have to wait and see how it unfolds.
I want an OT or Donald.  
wgenesis123 : 3/29/2014 6:06 am : link
Since The OT's will likely be gone make that Donald to put the D back in the Giants DEFENSE.
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