"Pitt Panther football sideline reporter Gregg Giannotti talks about DT Aaron Donald and the NFL Draft"
show has been a daily treat thats gotten better and better, but todays cast is a very good discussion about our potential first round pick. check it out.
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Everyone has to be on the same page on defense. You just can't freelance or you are going to leave a huge hole.
Now that said, if Donald is another John Randle, then it is very tempting to team him with Johnathan Hankins.
I wouldn't call this a boom-or-bust type of pick but it certainly is a bit risky. There are not a lot of 285 pound all-star defensive tackles.
I think people also need to realize that there was NO ONE but him on the Pitt DL.. teams schemed to stop him. and couldnt...
but that being said... I think the Giants are going OL or WR in round one..
The last time they did that that I can remember...they really got burned...Greg Mark from Miami.
Can this dude take care of business when his page isn't called? Can he deliver when it is?
His size doesn't answer those questions for me, his play would..
He does all the things that a defensive lineman should do. He can penetrate. He can hold his position at the point of attack. He can shed blockers when he wants to. I have seen him hold the point of attack and toss the blocker aside like a ragdoll.
Those who say he relies on his quick first step have not watched him closely. They don't know that he wins his battles every single time, no matter how big his opponents are.
The only times he can be stopped is when there are two linemen on him, and even then he regularly can hold his point and separate from his blockers when he needs to. He really doesn't get pushed back.
The thing about Donald is that he seems to intuitively understand how to use his strength and leverage to win battles at the line of scrimmage. This isn't a kid who has just been coached well. Read what's written about him then watch his snaps - he has exceptional technique of all the moves. This isn't because he's been coached so well. Heck, if it were that easy to coach a kid there would be plenty who could do what he does.
It's because he is a playmaker from the inside of the defensive line. He knows how to make plays, and has the body to do it.
I think this kid absolutely kills the pistol/read option offense. He's too close to the mesh point for QB's to delay handoffs and read the defensive end. He'll penetrate too quickly and blow those kinds of plays up.
Don't believe me. Watch his video yourself and tell me where you see him getting beat, or not being able to handle his man, or being too small for his position.
The idea that his size will hurt him is speculation - no one's got any documentation to back that up.
I rarely hope the Giants draft this guy or that and simply assume they know 10x more then me....but I want this guy. He jumps off the screen at you.
He has dominated everywhere including the senior bowl. Can he play DE too. He already has great rechnique and hands....I think he dominates
N Suh came in at 307lbs benched less the Donald at the combine and ran a 5.05 forty...not much difference between 6'4' 307 and 6 5/8 285...when the smaller player happens to be much stronger, quicker, faster...secondly nothing in his tape justifies the speculation on this board regarding size...he was the only player on the Pitt defense...despite the attention and consistent double and triple teams...he still beat people consistently
The last time they did that that I can remember...they really got burned...Greg Mark from Miami.
RE: What makes people think he could not maintain gap control? He is very strong, has very good hands, and gets off blocks. He can play the run and it's a passing league, so, I see his quickness and motor as an asset. You get tackles for losses and disrupt the passing game by penetrating. And, he is strong enough and has good enough leverage where he will not get pushed around like a lot of people seem to think. And, with his fast feet, great hands, and motor - he does not seem to struggle getting off blocks.
Look at his production and that is despite being double teamed a lot. Hankins and Donald might very well give the Giants two DTs who have to be double teamed. I keep watching his game tapes against quality OLines (e.g., Notre Dame) and he is a force to be reckoned with.
You bring in Hankins in better shape this year and team him with Donald - you have the core a special DT tandem, IMO.
Of course, Giants' FO may not have the same thoughts re: Donald. And, Donald may not be there.
Interesting perspective Eric. Here's what Sy said in his comments linked below:
Sy'56 : 9:35 am : link : reply
Simply because he can fit in to any defensive scheme. Thats not the case for some DTs and DEs.
Posted this morning. - ( New Window )
Some smaller guys profile as impact players ala Geno Atkins and John Randle...most don't.
I don't believe in remote thrower picks. It's a childish practice based on thinking you know more than NFL evaluators. The Giants are the pros and once we select a guy I'm all about his success for our team. Donald has a fantastic college resume. That said I'd prefer to focus on the more traditional Giants impact positions of WR/OT/DE for the #12 pick. There will be worthy candidates available.
By not going to another team that we have to play.
But, the more I think about it, the more I think it's going to be Martin.
I rarely hope the Giants draft this guy or that and simply assume they know 10x more then me....but I want this guy. He jumps off the screen at you.
He has dominated everywhere including the senior bowl. Can he play DE too. He already has great rechnique and hands....I think he dominates
Nicely said. He totally jumps off the screen at you and opposed to Clowney this kid lives and breathes football and is a non stop tremendous competitor. In fact Id be willing to bet this kid has a better overall cateer than Clowney.
In this draft it seems to me that the top talent goes by about 10-12, and those from 12-20 or so are pretty similar in talent. I happen to think that Donald is a top 10 talent but might drop to us if 3 QBs go early. Just one man's opinion.
if the Giants take a player like Donald in round one.. it pushes the offense down a round.. The Giants need to serious draft offense 1,2,3.. and the targets should be some order of TE, WR and OL..
if the Giants take a player like Donald in round one.. it pushes the offense down a round.. The Giants need to serious draft offense 1,2,3.. and the targets should be some order of TE, WR and OL..
ALOT of Good offense can still be had post round 1:
Rd. 1 Donald
Rd. 2 Jordan Matthews/Joel Bitinio/Kuandijo/Jackson/Yankey
Rd 3. Martavius Bryant/Allen Robinson/Trai Turner/Dakota Dozier/Juwan James/Jake Mewhort
Rd 4. Crocket Gilmore/Arthur Lynch
First, I feel that if the Giants drafted Aaron Donald, he would see time on the field at DT and DE in the same manner that Cullen Jenkins does.
Second, regarding NFL double-teams when he is at DT, Aaron is a three-technique type of DT so he will face a double-team less often than the one-technique or nose-guard DT. And yes, teams do switch up and double-team the three-technique DT in the run game but that usually leaves a DE one on one with a tight-end. Now most tight-ends in the league are better blockers than the ones the Giants had last year but that still should be an advantage for the team. Also I'm sure this something I'm sure he has already faced and is familiar with.
P.S. I'm not comfortable with giving opinions about the breakdown of gap responsibilities for three-technique DT's but I assume it will include a lot of line calls where there is only a one-gap role which Aaron should do well in
First, I feel that if the Giants drafted Aaron Donald, he would see time on the field at DT and DE in the same manner that Cullen Jenkins does.
Second, regarding NFL double-teams when he is at DT, Aaron is a three-technique type of DT so he will face a double-team less often than the one-technique or nose-guard DT. And yes, teams do switch up and double-team the three-technique DT in the run game but that usually leaves a DE one on one with a tight-end. Now most tight-ends in the league are better blockers than the ones the Giants had last year but that still should be an advantage for the team. Also I'm sure this something I'm sure he has already faced and is familiar with.
P.S. I'm not comfortable with giving opinions about the breakdown of gap responsibilities for three-technique DT's but I assume it will include a lot of line calls where there is only a one-gap role which Aaron should do well in
So are you a proponent for drafting Donald semi-pro?
Then follow up with a FB. If the center is good and take on our 1T I may even pull the LG assuming 3T is B gap shaded on the RG.
So there are to s of options.
Yes, but it is because I'm a proponent for best available player instead of OMG, the pick has to be best offensive lineman available or Eli is going to die, die, I tell you... Insert the usual matching need and value theory stuff
Then follow up with a FB. If the center is good and take on our 1T I may even pull the LG assuming 3T is B gap shaded on the RG.
So there are to s of options.
Those are good options and if those play calls are blocked well at the line of scrimmage then in addition to the DT's hopefully not getting flushed downfield, our solid against the run DE's and LB's have to do their jobs when the DT's are soaking up so much attention.
Someone on the play-side in the front seven has to defeat their block or the Defensive Coordinator is going to have to start cheating more DB's into the box. And I hope that someone is a DE more often than not
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So are you a proponent for drafting Donald semi-pro?
Yes, but it is because I'm a proponent for best available player instead of OMG, the pick has to be best offensive lineman available or Eli is going to die, die, I tell you... Insert the usual matching need and value theory stuff
Agreed. And we can always get an excellent OL (likely a plug and play type) at 43 in this draft if need be.
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It depends on the opposing OL of the team we face. If its an I pro right I'd double both DTs and chip off to backer like we used to do when our OL wasnt a shit show.
Then follow up with a FB. If the center is good and take on our 1T I may even pull the LG assuming 3T is B gap shaded on the RG.
So there are to s of options.
Those are good options and if those play calls are blocked well at the line of scrimmage then in addition to the DT's hopefully not getting flushed downfield, our solid against the run DE's and LB's have to do their jobs when the DT's are soaking up so much attention.
Someone on the play-side in the front seven has to defeat their block or the Defensive Coordinator is going to have to start cheating more DB's into the box. And I hope that someone is a DE more often than not
Well that goes for anything in the trenches. You wanted drawn out well and then have your player execute those blocks.
That's how I would play Donald if I am in the meetings helping game plan was my point.
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In comment 11613942 AnishPatel said:
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It depends on the opposing OL of the team we face. If its an I pro right I'd double both DTs and chip off to backer like we used to do when our OL wasnt a shit show.
Then follow up with a FB. If the center is good and take on our 1T I may even pull the LG assuming 3T is B gap shaded on the RG.
So there are to s of options.
Those are good options and if those play calls are blocked well at the line of scrimmage then in addition to the DT's hopefully not getting flushed downfield, our solid against the run DE's and LB's have to do their jobs when the DT's are soaking up so much attention.
Someone on the play-side in the front seven has to defeat their block or the Defensive Coordinator is going to have to start cheating more DB's into the box. And I hope that someone is a DE more often than not
Well that goes for anything in the trenches. You wanted drawn out well and then have your player execute those blocks.
That's how I would play Donald if I am in the meetings helping game plan was my point.
If teams were forced to account for him like that. It would be a huge victory for the defense especially one that has other good players on the DL. it will also restrict flexibility/options of what the offense can do.
In Donald's case, he routinely beat double teams in college, and didn't give ground in the running game even with two guys working against him.
He has as fast a "get-off" (that first step AND the reflexes to move just as the ball is being snapped) as I've ever seen in a DT. Often he's by the two guys assigned to block him before they've even gotten out of their stances. I also can't remember a DT as quick as him who also had his strength.
I'm sold on his ability to be an impact player from day one. Indeed I'm wondering if he'll be there for us at 12, as I'm guessing that he'll rise rapidly as the draft approaches.
In Donald's case, he routinely beat double teams in college, and didn't give ground in the running game even with two guys working against him.
He has as fast a "get-off" (that first step AND the reflexes to move just as the ball is being snapped) as I've ever seen in a DT. Often he's by the two guys assigned to block him before they've even gotten out of their stances. I also can't remember a DT as quick as him who also had his strength.
I'm sold on his ability to be an impact player from day one. Indeed I'm wondering if he'll be there for us at 12, as I'm guessing that he'll rise rapidly as the draft approaches.
That's college playing for freaking the amazing powerhouse of Pitt. He did have a good Senior Bowl. So now scouts will have to project that to the NFL and see how he will do against NFL guards and tackles. I am not sold on that at all. I am still questioning his use at the NFL level. Is he a pass rushing specialist who will come in on 3rd down? Can he play on 1st and 2nd down and mix it up consistently at this level?
I can see them blocking him and he being a liability at this level in the running game.
Like I told GD, we have other important needs, mainly on offense. We need to show a sense of urgency because our offense needs to be a 1 year build. The coaches have a 1 year contract basically. Eli has a 2 year one. We need to do this shit now.
I'd go offense, but there are two guys I like. I do like Gilbert, and Mosley at LB the more I see videos on him. Now would I draft them if offensive personnel is available? No, but two guys I do like if all the other guys are gone.
Why would you pass on offense if a good player is there round 1? This year is unlike any year because of the close to expiring contracts of the coaching staff and a lot of the offensive personnel. The sense of urgency is the greatest this year. The way our draft classes have gone downhill, I want them to fix this offense and show a sense of urgency here.
You have a blue chip offensive prospect available. I am not passing on him just because we can get guys later. Ross has been fucking up our drafts since he got here. Do you trust that fool in drafting "very good offensive" players in the later rounds?
In fact where are these good offensive players he showed he can draft? Beatty? Beckum? Barden? Brown?Jernigan or Brewer?
We are still waiting on Wilson, RR, Hosley and freaking AR to contribute. That whole damn 2012 draft I am waiting on.
You make it sound like it's that freaking easy, like you're shopping for clothes. We will go to mall, get some shirts and shoes, swing back and get some pants and belts, and we are all set. That easy? Again, based on what? Our amazing freaking drafts we have produced? We will pass on offensive talent and get some later. As if that shit as worked last bunch of years.
Again, no thanks, with Eli have 2 years on his contract and the coaching staff 1 year basically, can we actually show a sense of urgency even if that means going out of our way to staff offensive talent?
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Like I told GD, we have other important needs, mainly on offense. We need to show a sense of urgency because our offense needs to be a 1 year build. The coaches have a 1 year contract basically. Eli has a 2 year one. We need to do this shit now.
Where we differ Anish is I think in this draft if we dedicate rounds 2-4 to offense we will still be in good shape while adding a special once-in-a-decade talent in Donald in round 1.
It seems like you are almost hellbent on adding an offensive guy regardless if he is pure BPA or not in round 1.
I think this year is different as such because of the post you commented on prior regarding our offense and the contracts for everyone. We are on the cusp of major change that could result in not re-signing Eli and changing of all our coaches if we fuck up this year.
Moreover, I want a balance of value and need. DT is not a big time need. We can find a perfect marriage offensively this year. Factor in adding to the offense now since Eli only has 2 years left and coaching staff 1, we need to hit and find success NOW. There is no 2 or 3 year plan.
Blitz! That's our damn issue. We just rely on the front 4. Well, team has changed now. We need to supplement our pass rush by blitzing. If pass rush is a concern then add pressure from other areas.
Maybe the team knows this and that's one of the reasons we went balls out to upgrade the secondary even more. At least the back end of the defense is solid. So maybe we do blitz knowing that the secondary is solid.
I think this year is different as such because of the post you commented on prior regarding our offense and the contracts for everyone. We are on the cusp of major change that could result in not re-signing Eli and changing of all our coaches if we fuck up this year.
Moreover, I want a balance of value and need. DT is not a big time need. We can find a perfect marriage offensively this year. Factor in adding to the offense now since Eli only has 2 years left and coaching staff 1, we need to hit and find success NOW. There is no 2 or 3 year plan.
I think you detailed the urgency extremely well.
And I was originally in total agreement with you. I wanted one of the top 3-4 OTs, Marquise Lee (who I love more than any WR than Watkins), Ebron, or Evans. But the more I watched Donald, the more I couldn't deny just how much this kid blows up anyone he faces. The 'wow' factor is more consistent with him than almost any prospect in this entire draft from a position which is EXTREMELY hard to dominate at.
So it comes down to that he is likely to be on another tier grade-wise than anyone else when it comes our turn to pick. I can't give that type of value up to go for a higher need position especially when I think I can still get 3 good offensive players in round 2-4 (in this loaded draft).
Blitz! That's our damn issue. We just rely on the front 4. Well, team has changed now. We need to supplement our pass rush by blitzing. If pass rush is a concern then add pressure from other areas.
Maybe the team knows this and that's one of the reasons we went balls out to upgrade the secondary even more. At least the back end of the defense is solid. So maybe we do blitz knowing that the secondary is solid.
Anish,
Fewell when he doesn't try to get too cute is a decent but not great DC. However, when it comes to blitz design,timing, and disguise, he is possibly the worst schemer in the entire NFL.
That's why the driving force for our team in the offense. That's the side of the ball that's broken. That's the side of the ball where our HOF, franchise QB is on. Our succeeding or failure will be tied into that side of the ball.
That's the side that needs lots of help. I hope our 1st rounder is an offensive upgrade. This team needs to be successful now. It's a 1 year plan.
That's why the driving force for our team in the offense. That's the side of the ball that's broken. That's the side of the ball where our HOF, franchise QB is on. Our succeeding or failure will be tied into that side of the ball.
That's the side that needs lots of help. I hope our 1st rounder is an offensive upgrade. This team needs to be successful now. It's a 1 year plan.
Guess what? If i didn't have Donald rated so high I'd be in total agreement with you.