Giants concerned Eli is in "decline"?

In comment 11617564 bceagle05 said:

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of Eli shoving another Lombardi Trophy right up his critics' asses.

Yup, yup.

That's why there will be wholesale changes on the OL along with a new RB and almost surely more help in the draft on the way.

Most of last year's debacle was attributable to the OL but they've sucked since the SF PO game and who knows, maybe E is shell shocked beyond full recovery.

We'll see.

and Phillip Rivers was all done the year before.

What a lazy article.

Our OL sucked last year. Absolutely sucked.

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The new offense, if it bears any resemblance to the one in which McAdoo worked in Green Bay, is likely to rely on quick decision-making (a Manning strength) and short-range accuracy. The old reliance on downfield timing and the ability of his receivers to read coverages exactly as he does from play to play could dwindle, and with it the interception total.

Specifically I am not at all confident that "quick decision-making" (sic) was ever Eli's strong point. Balls, unflappability, and a burning will to win have always been his strongest points IMO, along with the ability to make every throw on the field and of course to play his best in the biggest games and even the bigget moments with thoise games.

But quick decision making? I suspect that McAdoo was brought here specifically to improve Eli's game in that exact regard. It's the biggest and most obvious difference IMO between Eli and Peyton.

He's played a lot of games and taken some hits. I think he might be entering a decline as well.

He's a tough customer but he is not athletically gifted and requires as we saw last year a lot of support around him. I also would not extend him unless he takes a lower salary as he won't be worth what he's been making moving forward. He's been paid for his SB runs.

The end is coming sooner than people think. I think we have a 3 to 4 yr window again with Eli but to think he will get another 6 or 7 yrs here as a highly paid QB is questionable at best. His velocity has clearly dropped the last two years on his throws and as gutsy as he is he can't continue to make the kind of mistakes he made last year even if you want to blame everyone else for contributing to his poor play.

Pretty sure this isn't about 2015/2016. The future is now. Another losing season in 2014 and both Coughlin and Eli could be gone.

mis-read your post.

In comment 11617846 Sammo284 said:

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He's a tough customer but he is not athletically gifted and requires as we saw last year a lot of support around him. The end is coming sooner than people think. I think we have a 3 to 4 yr window again with Eli but to think he will get another 6 or 7 yrs here as a highly paid QB is questionable at best.

This is exactly right. What I want to add though is Eli's knowledge of the position and his football IQ are extremely high. Mentally he is far superior to some of the other QBs who run circles around him athletically. It is a trade off. Last year, I think it really was his head that screwed up his game. I dont think he trusted he O line either. So, he was making quick decisions, the wrong decisions, bailing out on plays, etc... for self preservation purposes.

and foremost a competitor who will do anything to win. His support last year was terrible. The Ol, TEs, RBs and Nicks were very poor. So he tried to win anyway he could. Forcing passes into coverage. making desperation throws off his back foot etc. Support him and he will win for us again. Poor drafting and FA aquisitions were the root cause of our decline not ELI.

I'll be a little concerned.

For me it depends on what would happen. If Eli has all the time in the world and messes up than, I agree. If we fail to surround him with talent, meaning it's a 2-3 offensively rebuild, then I can see the franchise saying they may want to change the page on him.

This is why I want us to go offensive big time in this draft. I want Ross and Reese to have a sense of extreme urgency to get this done all in 1 year.

In comment 11617517 GiantsFan84 said:

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there have been many people on this site who have said not to extend eli this offseason and see how he plays this season first. this is not an anti-giants article by graziano

Graziano and the fans who believe that are not putting enough emphasis on the go-awful, league-worst line that Eli has in front of him, and the piss poor support he received at WR and TE. I see no indication of Eli being in decline. This isn't a prove-it year.

Certainly not anywhere near the 5 - 7 I have read people mentioning bandied about the past year.

this info was leaked last year as well.....i know its not a subject well-rec'd here but i know for a fact there were more than a few players (nicks was one of them) that was not cool w/eli's play

we giants fans like to make excuses for him but he has been abysmal since hurricane sandy hit. when he's pulling in 20m to play like crap and everything is about him him him, while everyone else is busting their butt and playing well for vet min it creates problems! this is a grown mans game and there r a lot of new players who werent here when eli was playing well (fair or unfair)

with Eli's deal set to expire, it's going to be very interesting as to how they decide to move forward. If these types of reports become more frequent, then it's clear the stage is being set for a potential exit soon than late.

*Eli is not Peyton

*Coughlin didnt exactly get a vote of confidence either - they are making him change the offensive system and if he didn't agree to, he was gone.

is that the Giants may have their pick of Bortles, Bridgewater and Manziel.

i happen to love bridgewater and if we needed a QB id be all over it

i also cant help but feel reese is into the "new breed" of spread football, which would explain the interest in kevin sumlin (and makes u wonder if they'd want touchdown johnny)

pure speculation at best. Sounds like it was written by somebody on BBI.

And that "scout's take" posted in this thread? Talk about a smear job...

Again.

In comment 11617715 Goin Deep said:

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Like your posts that seem well thought out and insiteful but can you please extend your line sentenses (script), its very hard reading. Thanks.

I can't be the only one that caught this gem, right?

He covers the Packers, an may be the best pro football beat writer in the nation, certainly one of the top 5. Since Garafolo left the NYG beat, our local reporters are hacks compared to McGinn.

You shouldn't dismiss his reportage as a smear job, unless you chose to wear blinders.

No way McGinn fabricated that, though maybe he sought it out to confirm his own opinion...

that for our HOF QB this is a "show me" yr

I agree, they should make a priority of getting him more help, and assume they will.

Not the guy reporting it.

I miss Ohm

but the discussion is a valid one. It isn't just Eli though, everyone is on notice. If this team has another subpar year it very well could be a full blown house cleaning starting from the top.

about any professional "scout" that would call any professional player, especially one of Eli's caliber, "embarrassing" and "pathetic".

Put your name to comments like that if you feel so strongly about it.

Wouldn't McGinn want to protect himself from looking foolish if he didn't think the smear job had merit? OK just wants to make waves, rock the boat?

That's more Ralph V's MO than McGinn's, I believe.

Even if it comes off as somewhat unprofessional.

Could be more telling than we thought.

Those scout's quotes are under the section of his game preview called "McGinn's View," at the end of the article.

not the guy reporting it.

McGinn assembles quotes from 3 different "personnel people" - 2 scouts and one untitled "personnel man."

McGinn is making what he thinks is a very serious assessment: he sees Eli's decline last year as unprecedented and "bizarre."

You brushing it off as a "smear job" says more about you than about McGinn, Britt.

And OK I've made my point (about McGinn) and it's fine to totally disagree, I get that.

?

Big picture, just look at Eli's contract and what an extension would cost if his agent pushes hard for market rate.

Would you sign him for 5/100 right now? No way. He needs to put a big 2014 in the books to even consider the ballpark.

QBs who need significantly greater support in terms of talent/quantity around them, don't deserve to make Zeus-like salaries, and can't expect to win consistently. I think Eli kind of falls into that gray area. We've seen his greatness, but we have also seen how ugly some of his weaknesses/limitations can be.

Also, I"m sick to death of the comparisons to Peyton in any kind of argument (whether it be stats, age, health, championships). Just because guys like Warren Moon, Favre, Elway played into their late 30s doesn't mean all other QBs can do it. Most flame out in pretty ugly fashion. People are equating that just because Eli won a couple SBs, that now he is therefore some legend and deserves to play as long as he wants, and will be able to. Faulty logic at it's best.

Denver's OL wasn't great at all last season. Brady has gone deep in the playoffs with porous OL. Rodgers won a SB with one of the worst OL I had seen of any playoff team in the last 15-20 yrs. Seattle just won a SB with a marginal OL.

I'm really getting tired at the continuous excuses on the rest of the offensive players. Giants sooner or later will have to make a Simms-esque decision with Eli. Extending him too much could be less of a mistake than letting a divorce happen a year too soon.

I hate to equate to another sport, but since I am a Devils fan, I'll draw parallels to what the Devils have gone through with Brodeur (been rather ugly this year and even last by allowing a former legend to continue to holding capital that his play can't match) and even what the Knicks dealth with on Ewing (really ugly and team initiated) The end eventually comes and no matter how it happens or who initiates it, it is never pretty (not everyone gets a Strahan or Elway like sendoff).

The money issue, and ROI of re-signing him at anything close to what he's already making (and earned by previous accomplishments.)

This FO is not very 'emotional' about money decisions; nor should they be.

In comment 11617903 area junc said:

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this info was leaked last year as well.....i know its not a subject well-rec'd here but i know for a fact there were more than a few players (nicks was one of them) that was not cool w/eli's play

Your "info" isn't well rec'ed because you're consistently exposed as a lying sack of shit every single time you pretend to be an insider, from your Rolando McClain drumming to your claims about offers the Giants made to Linval Joseph to your insinuations about Ahmad Bradshaw being in drugs.

At least have the smarts to realize why everyone killed your alleged insider tidbits about the team having locker room blowouts over Eli and not pretend it's just about people not wanting to hear bad things about him.

And it's horrible play contributed to Eli's awful season. But let's be honest, am I the only person who saw horribly inaccurate passes from Eli even when he wasn't under pressure? Eli continuously throws behind his receivers and overthrows them too depending upon the route. He's never been a consistently accurate QB but rather one who with a great supporting cast can make magic happen in the brightest of spotlights.

Mark me down as one of those with high hopes that we see something from Nassib this year that offers a glimmer of hope for him to be the starter one day. If the torch can be passed to him when Eli's current contract is up, than Reese will really have something to build around without be strangled by Eli's big salary.

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Denver's OL wasn't great at all last season. Brady has gone deep in the playoffs with porous OL. Rodgers won a SB with one of the worst OL I had seen of any playoff team in the last 15-20 yrs. Seattle just won a SB with a marginal OL.

Their offenses rely on high percentage, 5-10 yard, three step drop and let it fly, type passes. Ours asks our QB to take 7 step drops and chuck it 20+ yards down the field.

Not an excuse, but two different animals when you're talking about pourous lines.

That you're taking crazy pills

he may have to take off his rose colored glasses and go back and actually watch last games.

he will improve upon last year and get re-extended one last time.

In comment 11617597 fkap said:

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because it wasn't a fiscally smart move? It only provides short term relief, and they haven't had the need for the extra room this year. extending 2 years of high salary is a lot of money to borrow from the future. But anyhow, only morons aren't concerned about when the inevitable decline sets in, especially coming off a bad year. That doesn't mean anyone is in panic mode (other than on BBI).

I think you nailed it. The reason his cap is high now is they kept extending him pushing everything to these two years. If they don't need to extend then don't.

to be successful or not terrible is proven untrue just by his own history.

It's partly why pushing all the blame on everyone else to excuse how terrible he played last season doesn't work and it slights the good that he accomplished prior to it (as well as making me wonder what the hell team you may have been watching).

to see Eli bounce back in this new system. Besides aiming for more wins, I hope this system can pad the shit out of Elis stats. I would love to see more4-5 TD games.

In comment 11617971 Riggies said:

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In comment 11617903 area junc said: Quote: this info was leaked last year as well.....i know its not a subject well-rec'd here but i know for a fact there were more than a few players (nicks was one of them) that was not cool w/eli's play Your "info" isn't well rec'ed because you're consistently exposed as a lying sack of shit every single time you pretend to be an insider, from your Rolando McClain drumming to your claims about offers the Giants made to Linval Joseph to your insinuations about Ahmad Bradshaw being in drugs. At least have the smarts to realize why everyone killed your alleged insider tidbits about the team having locker room blowouts over Eli and not pretend it's just about people not wanting to hear bad things about him.

BRA-VO! Post of the week. Thomas thinks that Nicks didn't care for Eli's play? Is he kidding?

why we may have our pick of those three quarterbacks down at #12. I'd much rather roll the dice on Eli.