ESPN's Dan Graziano reports the Giants have concerns Eli Manning is entering the decline stage of his career.
Manning turned 33 in January. Per Graziano, it's part of the reason the G-Men decided not to extend Eli's contract this offseason, which would have provided significant cap relief. The Giants are hoping Manning is "energized" by the arrival of OC Ben McAdoo, but there's no guarantee he can rebound from the regression he showed in 2013. The Giants lost Hakeem Nicks and failed to upgrade at wide receiver or tight end in free agency, so Manning will be working with mostly the same supporting cast as last year. Manning recently underwent ankle surgery, but is expected to be ready for training camp.
Source: ESPN.com Apr 12 - 2:38 PM
I can't argue with a coaching staff that sees him every day but I have a very hard time using 1 season to cause concern. Awful line, lazy/disinterested Nicks, no TE, no running game. He "sucks" this year and it would be safe to say he is in fact likely in decline.
Agreed. Which also applies to all the defensiveness on this thread, right? As this, too, is all 'speculation' definitely 'written by somebody on BBI.'
Really hope it's wrong, but I have no more idea than anyone else here. So, as ever, we'll see.
Eli will be the usual Eli if he has the pieces to help. Eli was able t win 2 SBs with Gilbride, but you could argue despite KG, or maybe its despite Eli, I dont know. Eli has shown greatness and absolute bone-headedness, and a whole lot of consistency, so I think he will benefit from not having to run the most complicated offensive scheme in the NFL.
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pure speculation at best. Sounds like it was written by somebody on BBI.
Agreed. Which also applies to all the defensiveness on this thread, right? As this, too, is all 'speculation' definitely 'written by somebody on BBI.'
Really hope it's wrong, but I have no more idea than anyone else here. So, as ever, we'll see.
Other than one post about the o-line in response to another poster, I haven't actually given my opinion on Eli one way or the other. I just commented on these "unnamed" sources and the wishy washiness of the two articles in this thread.
Riggies : 10:12 am : link : reply
to be successful or not terrible is proven untrue just by his own history.
It's partly why pushing all the blame on everyone else to excuse how terrible he played last season doesn't work and it slights the good that he accomplished prior to it (as well as making me wonder what the hell team you may have been watching).
Eli has to get back to the QB that makes his WRs and general supporting cast better than they are, and not be a guy who has to be propped up by a superior running game, superior WRS with large catch radii, and superior defense.
Tell me when, in his entire career, Aaron Rodgers had an RB to work with like Tiki or Jacobs or Bradshaw... Or even a single WR as good as Plax or Nicks was at their peaks.
If Graziano wants to quote Reese or Coughlin or Mara, then quote him. Or, while I don't like it, specifically state "a high source within the Giants told me..." But he doesn't say either thing. He's having a discussion with himself in his own mind guessing what the Giants are probably thinking. He's supposed to be a professional writer - he's supposedly being paid - yet he writes without citing sources or even telling us what information came from the Giants and what information is just in his head? Pure garbage and journalistic malpractice.
And - its premise is also pure garbage. I have posted several times since 2013 (and during 2013) that Manning might be having his best year, not his worst. Certainly there isn't a single person on BBI (and perhaps in the world) that can tell me what Manning's statistics would have looked like if he had an all-pro OL, RB, and WR in front of him. Maybe he would have had even more interceptions and fewer TDs, but I tend to doubt it.
But this idea that 2013 was Manning's worse year is pure shit talking. Total garbage. Someone looking at statistics and saying that you can compare quarterbacks to each other based purely on statistics while ignoring the quality of the other 52 players on the respective teams. Pure unadulterated garbage.
nassib is interesting in a WCO imo. he has the athleticism and can throw on the run
Are we talking about physical decline? A guy that's never missed a start in his career doesn't really seem to indicate that.
Are we talking mental decline? I find that doubtful.
Is it prudent to just take a step back, see the musical chairs on the line which led to a career high in sacks by the midway point of the year, no running game or backs to speak of, no tight end, and a stud reciever that dogged it all year may have led to a poor performance?
I personally think Eli is the same Eli we've always known, good, bad, or indifferent. I saw nothing this year that I haven't seen in previous years, albeit amplified by a crumbling offense.
I would think, at some level, for sure that question had to be asked.
plenty of potential reasons he could decline:
*age
*injury
*having children - decline started around same time
*lost hunger (2 rings, 2 Super Bowl MVPs)
*bank account is so big he doesn't feel like letting a bunch of roided up meatheads try to rip his head off (lost his "edge")
*lost passion after long career
it could be anything, or all of them
Nicks added no value and Cruz is far from a #1
the offensive complexity weighed on WR/TE position performance
TE was useless
RBs no consistency
Eli was horrific himself, and has been since the midway point of 2012. Its not about sacks, and late game blowout INTs that are irrelevant and hurt his stats. Its about accuracy, its about happy feet, its about forcing plays when the risk reward is beyond awful. forcing a 5 yard pass into traffic when the upside is just that.... 5 yards. its very immature and reckless throws... even after acknowledging the OL and everything above was terrible around him.
hopefully the new offense allows more balance and a more cerebral game from Eli, which is where i think he excels. Hopefully we see more cohesion with the WRs, and the new OL allow a solid pocket up the middle.
But if people just turn a blind eye to the last 25 games he has played... and arent concerned that this could be a decline... then you are just a blind faith homer. and how Peyton plays at 39 means NOTHING.... hes the fcking GOAT. (regular season)
I expect him to bounce back but i dont have total confidence. And you dont pay a guy 20+ mio and then also need a stud X, a good OL, a good TE, and everything else. 20+ mio QB means you can win with holes... which Eli HAS DONE in the past.
I just havent seen him play as he has the last 25 games since he was a rookie. which is quite scary and cause for concern
I would think, at some level, for sure that question had to be asked.
Lou, why would that question have had to have been asked? I could make the case that Manning had his best personal performance in 2013 - that he did more in 2013 than any of the other 31 QB could have done had they been the Giants QB - and there isn't anyone in the world who could dispute that.
Why? Well that's obvious, right? It doesn't take a brain surgeon to know that if you have the worst OL in football, zero ability to run the ball, your #1 WR missing; your #3 WR unable to make the right reads on the fly ... that you can't measure the performance of your QB under such circumstances. It's just ridiculous to even try.
So, I question the premise that Eli had a bad season. Maybe he did - but that assessment certainly can't be based upon the statistics or decisions he made while under seige. Maybe a QB coach can see something but I know one thing - nobody in the media - or on BBI - can tell me Manning had a bad season - because they would have zero basis to reach any such conclusion.
plenty of potential reasons he could decline:
*age
*injury
*having children - decline started around same time
*lost hunger (2 rings, 2 Super Bowl MVPs)
*bank account is so big he doesn't feel like letting a bunch of roided up meatheads try to rip his head off (lost his "edge")
*lost passion after long career
it could be anything, or all of them
This list tells me that you know virtually nothing about the guy who has been under center for this team for the past decade.
No, but it's enough (IMO) to cloud any opportunity to make a definitive assessment of his play from this past season.
So as always, I'll wait and see, and hope for improvements to all those areas to get a better idea of where he's at when he steps back on the field in September.
People change.
THEN EVERYBODY CAN CHANGE! - ( New Window )
Some people in some ways. Generally not about toughness though. At least not in my experience.
But, the point is, you have zero reason to say such a thing. None whatsoever. Talk to me about the QB when there is a solid 52 other players and its the QB who is holding the team back. Until then - and until proven otherwise - for me Eli is what he's always been (however you want to grade him historically). But there is zero evidence that he changed in any way over the past year or so - certainly not like the evidence we KNOW exists in the OL, running game, TE, and WR etc.
And the only things on there that could possibly have merit are the biggest 'no shit' factors one could come up with.
Eli could be declining hard or just like the team last year, every single problem we could have possibly had, we did, and this translated to Eli's play as well and he joined in the awful.
Is there reason for concern? Of course.
But fuck if I'm not gonna hope for/expect anything other than Eli returning to 2011 form and bringing us home SB #3.
But in a season like we just had, where you're failing to get proper protection so often and you're taking so many hits.. it piles up eventually. You probably get a little tired of taking that kind of beating.
I have no concerns about Eli if we can actually pass protect. He doesn't need an all pro line to be a good QB... he didn't exactly have that in 2011.. but he does need better than what he had in 2013. I think just about any QB would.
And I would be sorely disappointed in the franchise if there was even a hint of truth to such a suggestion.
Giants do sometimes prod their players through the media. It is usually last resort but they will use it as a channel of motivation.
I think area junc was on to something. I also think the old complicated offense was burning Eli out. It is not a fun offense to run and with the OL in shambles and everything having to be so precise for it to function well it really wore done our Qb.
Hence the big change in offensive philosophy which TC is hoping will 'reenergize' Eli.
I think the new offense will do just that.
plenty of potential reasons he could decline:
*age
*injury
*having children - decline started around same time
*lost hunger (2 rings, 2 Super Bowl MVPs)
*bank account is so big he doesn't feel like letting a bunch of roided up meatheads try to rip his head off (lost his "edge")
*lost passion after long career
it could be anything, or all of them
Eli ranked among the worst qb's in the NFL last year. You guys can afford to be cheery optimists that all is well, but the FO is doing its job in hedging its bets.
If the complexity of the offense posed a problem of any kind for the team, it wasn't Manning that had the difficulties.
Eli ranked among the worst qb's in the NFL last year. You guys can afford to be cheery optimists that all is well, but the FO is doing its job in hedging its bets.
Home. Fair enough. But that argument only works if you can answer the following for me.
1. Who were the top ranked QB last year? #
2. What would each of those 10 QB have been ranked had they taken every snap for the Giants last year?
If you can't answer the above - or even give me a "general ranking" - then your post makes zero sense and is totally baseless.
1. Who were the ten top ranked quarterbacks last year?
2. What would each of those 10 QB have been ranked ...
He sucked last year, even the most optimistic Giant fan has to admit that. That said, I struggle in trying to find a lot of QB's in this league who could have really thrived in a similar situation.
Put Peyton behind the line the Giants just threw out there in 2013 in an offense where he's got to run 5-10 step drops from snaps under center. Something tells me he wouldn't have been playing at MetLife this past February.
If the complexity of the offense posed a problem of any kind for the team, it wasn't Manning that had the difficulties.
When you run an offense like that its not fun and it can wear you down especially when everything is malfunctioning around you.
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may have been complex but I've never heard any broadcaster or anyone else ever suggest that the complexity posed any problem for Eli Manning. Indeed, all I've heard since he's been in the league is that one of his strengths is that he's so cerebral.
If the complexity of the offense posed a problem of any kind for the team, it wasn't Manning that had the difficulties.
When you run an offense like that its not fun and it can wear you down especially when everything is malfunctioning around you.
I agree 100 % ... Eli's problem last year was having the best part of his game taken away from him ...
He has vision and a smartness knowing what he has before the ball is even hiked ...
Last year ... he was in a fog ... not knowing if pressure would come from the left ... or from the middle ... or if the back would pick up a blitz ... or if Nicks would finish a route ... or if Randle made the right read ...
When he has the confidence in his teammates doing their jobs and making the right reads ... he has total confidence and understanding as to what will work on every play ...