I am warming up to picking this kid if he is there at 12...very intelligent... 4.45 at his pro day...seems to love the game of football...He reminds me a bit of Antonio Pierce in terms of his football acumen...I think he will be a perennial pro bowler. Dominant defenses win Super Bowls gentlemen.
He is a tremendous pass rusher, especially considering he's only been playing defense for two years. But right now, that's it. He gets washed out of running plays, and is lost in space in coverage. That really isn't his fault. He's still learning. But that makes him a project, something we need to stay away from in the first four rounds IMO.
But Reese may well see otherwise. Barr has the type of freakish athleticism and length that may remind him of JPP, and has the frame to add another twenty pounds. Reese also likes to draft for the future. Kiwi is probably gone next year, and Moore is still an unknown himself. The Giants win by coming after teams with wave after wave of high quality pass rushers.
I still think Tennessee will take him at #11, because they play a 3-4, but I certainly wouldn't discount the possibility that the Giants will take him at #12 if the Titans pass.
The Giants have been looking for that type of player for yers and havent been able to find one.. a guy who can stay on the field as a SAM on running downs and then be utilized as an extra pass rusher on passing down..
That being said.. I dont think they take Barr..
He would need to do more than just bulk up. As JonC mentioned:
I just don't think Barr lasts that long. Teams love and need pass rushers and there are plenty of teams at picks 1-11 that run the 3-4 defense or would be willing to taylor their defense for Barr. Guys like Barr never last---Big school, big production, good measurable attributes and from all accounts he's a good kid. He goes top. 7-8 in my opinion. If he lasts to 12... He's a Giant.
That said, it would be a considerable risk because there will be a steeper-than-usual learning curve for him. He doesn't have a lot of experience in the typical 4-3 SAM role. He pretty much played a downhill role with a lot of pursuit. He will have to learn the stay at home, take on blocks and shed game. That takes some players a long time, others can learn it pretty quick.
Drafting him to be a full time LB is a mistake IMO. DE or nothing.
He would really need to be coached up to play in a defensive scheme/position that he's never done. So, he'd sit for a whole year and just play specials or Fewell would need to re-do the whole defense in the next 5 months.
Do we need another Moore this year?
2. Reese has shown a knack for players with upside who'd have likely been picked higher had they had more of a track record (whether it's a junior entry, a player who had an injury, or a new position).
3. They've deployed stand up rushers before and had agreed to terms with a similar sized rush LB just last month.
Nobody will know who the Giants pick will be until the first 11 play out, but there's no reason to believe Barr isn't in the range of on their board that will lead to serious consideration. If they believe he's a prospect on the level of the Von Miller or Demarcus Ware I think they'd be willing to take on the challenge of carving out a unique role.
The thing is I don't like Barr. And I am dutifully humbled realizing that Kirwan does. To me this guy is from the LaVarr Arrington-Mike Croel school of straight-line demolition derby antagonists, who don't really accomplish all that much on a football field. Buckeye Shanzier I place in this group as well, although his nominal starting point is inside the formation. But Pat is most likely correct. If the Giants draft him, they will conceptually have a plan in mind.
Take a guy who can step in, play a natural position and make an impact right off the bat.
He can easily play D end in our 4-3 system. Jason Taylor had similar size as Barr and Taylor is one of the best 4-3 D ends in the last 20 years. Everyone is worried that he cant play 4-3 end b/c he is too thin. BS this kid has unreal insticts to get behind the line of scrimage, and we would be stealing a futer pro bowler at the 12 pick. BPA no question is Barr at 12 unless Matthews somehow drops to 12.
This is only IMO
Hankins at NT
Jenkins and JPP at DE
Obviously, they a 4-3 for now. But if Giants don't make playoffs, Coughlin and Fewell are likely gone, so who knows what could happen.
And why, every season since the internet became popular, has someone wondered if and when the Giants could go back to the 3-4.
I mean Osi started for us for years, and he couldn't do any of that shit worth a dayum.
The problem is that Barr does look better right now as a 4-3 OLB than a 4-3 DE, and seems to be another "high ceiling" "low floor" player. We're supposed to be getting away from those types of players this year, given how many times we've been burned in the past.
How about Brad Van Pelt? Harry Carson? It's not the conversion factor alone, it's whether or not the guy is a player,1st and foremost.
Look, I would pass on Barr. He's a "project," despite his talents. But I wouldn't be surprised if the Giants took him. And I wouldn't be furious either.
But I think he'll be gone. As will Matthews, Donald, and Evans. Ebron could end up being the default pick, unless the Giants pull a semi stunner by selecting CK or Lee.
It's pretty simple as Phil made clear, I see the same player he does. But, fans and even NYG brass has often made the mistake of projecting/converting and failed.
this team needs guys who can step in and play now and there are many of them who will be available at a position of need in round 1.
If the Giants in the 80's played a 4-3D would you say sont draft LT. he wont fit in our scheme ,or do u not think he would have made an amazing DE in a 4-3 system.
I'm not trying to compare Barr to LT, but what I am saying is its the player not the system. A player is a player and will find ways to make plays
And this is why i dont think he is drafted..
Another one of those guys where too much is being made of the forty time.
Just because Simtim STB here doesn't mean Barr will.