Looking back What do you think of Kerry Collins?

... In the fourth quarter. Of the 2003 game Westbrook won with a punt return. Unfortunately, the fumble counted. That was also the day N.D.Kalu snapped Richie Seubert's leg in half. Good times.

Collins was pretty bad that year, but he hung tough for a long time behind an offensive line that made the 2013 unit look good by comparison. The comeback against Dallas on Monday night was pretty remarkable, considering the circumstances. Can't blame Collins for the bizarre way they blew the lead. With a few breaks in games like that one - and especially the playoff meltdown in San Francisco - he might be remembered more positively.

that was Tommy fuckin Maddox blaspheming the QB position against the damned Eagles.

Loved his performance in torching the arrogant Vikings on that field of painted mud, and to this day hate how Fassel had such an incompetent game plan against the Ravens. There was a way to at least have a shot in that game - make it all about field position. Win the toss, kick off and let the defense bury Dilfer. Get the ball on the short field, chip the edge rushers, work the screen game and if they stop you pin em deep on the punt and do it again. Turn it into a grind out slugfest and maybe, just maybe, win 12-9. Field position had to be priority numbers 1 through 3, followed by putting Dilfer through the ground. Instead we just got run the fuck over. And the penalty on Hammer was BULLSHIT!

In comment 11627600 SanFranGiantsFan said:

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After Maddox, Brown, Kanell, & Graham, Collins was like Unitas. If you had a good OL protecting him, he was lethal.

This.

also agree with those who said he had limited pocket awareness, and wasn't good at reading defenses. He was flawed in that regard, but had a strong arm, and threw a gorgeous deep ball.

that of the bad group of post Simms QB's, most at least had a redeeming moment. Dave Brown trucked Deion Sanders, for that alone he has my gratitude. Kent Graham knocked off the 14-0 Broncos. Even Danny Kanell had a nice OT win over Detroit. Tommy Maddox though, that piece of trash inspired the one and only "We want Cherry" chant at Giants Stadium for the 3rd string never-was Mike Cherry, he was that damned horrific. Really high on the list of most loathed players to have ever worn the uniform.

Had one of the best deep throwing arms in the league. When he had time to setup, he would drop the long ball right in stride. Very pretty. However when he was forced from the pocket he was just awful.Ugh. Not the brightest guy either.

Good enough to make you think you could win with him, but not good enough to actually ever win.

Always made big mistakes at crucial moments. A lot of his "numbers" were put up in garbage time, especially with the Raiders.

In comment 11627845 WeatherMan said:

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that was Tommy fuckin Maddox blaspheming the QB position against the damned Eagles. Loved his performance in torching the arrogant Vikings on that field of painted mud, and to this day hate how Fassel had such an incompetent game plan against the Ravens. There was a way to at least have a shot in that game - make it all about field position. Win the toss, kick off and let the defense bury Dilfer. Get the ball on the short field, chip the edge rushers, work the screen game and if they stop you pin em deep on the punt and do it again. Turn it into a grind out slugfest and maybe, just maybe, win 12-9. Field position had to be priority numbers 1 through 3, followed by putting Dilfer through the ground. Instead we just got run the fuck over. And the penalty on Hammer was BULLSHIT!

One potential problem with that plan was that the kicking units both sucked ass in 2000. I don't think relying on Brad Maynard would have got the team very far.

then I think about Eli in the NFCCG at San Francisco...

Thank God for Eli and his pair of BIG BLUE BALLS!

soaking it up like a sponge and running it like a well oiled machine....Kerry? duh...uh...huh?

man could be throw a loaf of bread into a hungry families basket of groceries.

Bit=but, be=he

super bowl loss to Baltimore. I thought Collins was a good QB, not great, who at times looked great. Unfortunately at times he looked like crap too. Could make some pretty throws to his left down the sideline with deadly accuracy. The important thing about Collins is he made the Giants a better team.

How about giving us some data re your background with Kerry Collins?
How do we know whether or not to believe your stories?
Did he whip your ass at some time?

Always remember him fondly.

I was in the Keep Kerry and draft Sean Taylor camp...obviously, we all know why I am not employed by the New York Football Giants.

who was it that always called him "Lurch"?

In comment 11627951 Blackbeard said:

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How about giving us some data re your background with Kerry Collins? How do we know whether or not to believe your stories? Did he whip your ass at some time?

background is simple, and mentioned before. We went to Penn State at the same time and didn't like each other. I don't care if you believe my stories. Unless you count the couple of times I had to kick him out of our house, we never got into an altercation.

In comment 11627639 jsboston said:

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it was nice having a real quarterback again. in comparison i only have one good memory each of brown and graham (brown trucking prime time and graham to toomer)

True, but Kent Graham did slay a dragon.Nobody thought he could be beat at the time.

In comment 11627734 Hades07 said:

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he has probably grown up since then. A lot of the players on that team were jerks, with a few noticeable exceptions. Most interactions I had with that team, players and coaches, left a sour taste in my mouth. One of my favorites was after throwing one of the players out a window for attempting to force himself on one of my friend's little sister, we got a visit and lecture from Joe about the importance of the football team to this school. What a load, he walked into somebody's room without an invite, in a part of the house that was roped off and sticks his penis in an 18 year old freshman's face and Joe is worried about the football team. Ask Joe why his football team was getting wasted at our house the Friday night before a game.

I guess the world finally found out about the great Saint Joe. How did Paterno keep such a phony fine reputation for so long, what a hypocrite.

It's always funny to see BBIers who say things like "he was terrible" or "he couldn't win". In the four years he was the beginning of the year starter for our team, the Giants went to the playoff twice and the Superbowl once. And, had the Giants defense not folded like a cheap card table in SF, it could easily have been twice to the Superbowl.

Let me also point out that KC did this at a time when talent at the offensive skill positions was pretty thin on the ground out in The Meadowlands. Tiki Barber, Amani Toomer, Shockey in '03, the oft-injured Ike Hilliard and then a whole lot of nobodies, busts and scrubs.

didn't have the O-Line or the receivers to beat that "All World" Raven defense.

Collins was an upgrade. Kind of an ingrate though. Giants resurrected his career, then when they brought in Eli and they wanted him to serve as a mentor - he responded with the "I ain't no f**king babysitter" comment. Maybe, but the Giants ain't no f**king Betty Ford center...

Flawed - absolutely. He did give us an expectation that we could win any game we played. The previous years gave us none of that

I still am of the belief that they were going to beat TB and go to the SB. That offense was just dialed in.

He just didn't want to take a pay cut, which is understandable, given the circumstances.

He was 31 years old, still in the prime age for a QB, and it made no sense for him to hang around (at a discount) and mentor Eli when it was clear there was no future as a starter for him in NY.

And, to be fair, there's no way that Kerry could have survived in Coughlin's complex, multiple read offense. He just didn't have the mental horsepower for it.

but did the best he could with what he had

should read:

'' stopped being an asshole and an alcoholic with the help of a stable situation and the decency, honesty and support of the giants organisation ''


which says very good things about the mara and tisch families and (good old jim fossil?)

blew the fucking doors off san fran in a playoff game

had hit the skids. Collins was also what the Giants needed as well at the time...somebody who could anchor down the QB position for a few years.

bad superbowl aside...

In comment 11627998 Gary from The East End said:

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It's always funny to see BBIers who say things like "he was terrible" or "he couldn't win". In the four years he was the beginning of the year starter for our team, the Giants went to the playoff twice and the Superbowl once. And, had the Giants defense not folded like a cheap card table in SF, it could easily have been twice to the Superbowl. Let me also point out that KC did this at a time when talent at the offensive skill positions was pretty thin on the ground out in The Meadowlands. Tiki Barber, Amani Toomer, Shockey in '03, the oft-injured Ike Hilliard and then a whole lot of nobodies, busts and scrubs.

Yes, yes and yes.

in the same way Dave Brown is overrated by some on BBI.

KC also had an undefeated season at PSU and pretty good success with his NFL teams.

underrated IMO

when Kerry took over. He was alot better than many give him credit for. Big time arm. He played in the NFL for 16 years....obviously Kerry had talent.

I always liked him and always was optimistic about our chances to win with him under center. Couldn't make the same statement about the QB's that preceded him.

After the mediocrity and weekly up-and-down disappointment and uncertainty of the Dave Brown/Kanell/Graham years, Kerry was a breath of fresh air. When given protection he could shred a defense and make it look easy. He helped take us to a Superbowl with his epic 41-0 destruction of the Vikings. Sure, he wasn't perfect...crumbled under pressure and I never liked his slack-jawed "Duh?" expression after throwing a stupid INT. But he had the accuracy and touch Brown never had, the and the arm strength Kanell never had.

I was also on Team Draft Robert Gallery And Keep Collins that year. Good thing I was wrong.

reminded me of Craig Morton

Howitzer for an arm, could make all the throws including that perfect deep ball, and could get absolutely white hot at times.

Unfortunately, he frequently struggled to read defenses and once he got hit or felt bodies at his feet, his eye level quickly dropped as did his performance and confidence levels.

Given Fassel's known lack of preparation as a head coach, I do think Collins suffered from it to an extent we'll probably not know for sure.

I don't recall many people around here, even 20 years ago, overrating Dave Brown. He was a punching bag on a weekly basis in the early BBI days. The only props he got was knocking over Deion on a QB scramble. The sad thing is that Brown's best games as a Giant were mostly in losses when the defense folded late in the 4th quarter and spoiled it. There was an early game in '97 against the Testaverde Ravens that we pretty much had won until the D folded like a cheap suitcase in the 4th quarter and cost us the game. Brown was good that day. I was furious.

I always wondered how much Bill Romanowsky breaking Kerry's jaw early in his career played into his fear of getting hit

Agreed.

He didn't become Ryan leaf

and his early NFL years, Collins admitted as much. However, it is almost universally claimed that he really turned his life around after quitting drinking. So much for second chances.

As far as QBing goes, sure, he wasn't going to solve Beal's conjecture, and he did have trouble when pressured, but he was immeasurably better than the guys who played the position before him. Great arm, good accuracy - he made the Giants relevant again. I have very positive memories of Collins. His performance in the NFC Championship game is my favorite Giants Stadium moment.

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In comment 11628189 jnoble said:

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I don't recall many people around here, even 20 years ago, overrating Dave Brown. He was a punching bag on a weekly basis in the early BBI days. The only props he got was knocking over Deion on a QB scramble. The sad thing is that Brown's best games as a Giant were mostly in losses when the defense folded late in the 4th quarter and spoiled it. There was an early game in '97 against the Testaverde Ravens that we pretty much had won until the D folded like a cheap suitcase in the 4th quarter and cost us the game. Brown was good that day. I was furious.

People overrated Dave Brown? How is that even possible? Worst GY decision ever as a GM, and he had plenty in the 90s. Picking Strahan was an aberration.

Dave Brown may be a nice person but he was in my opinion the worst Giants' QB ever.

seemed to have trouble sustaining the high level of play. Certainly no bum as some seem to think.

He took the Giants to the Super Bowl and had a great arm. Great points about what we had, or lack of, prior to Collins.

of BBI interviews with Kerry...
Q&A: Quarterback Kerry Collins - ( New Window )

...
Q&A: Quarterback Kerry Collins - ( New Window )

the '03 playoff debacle in San Fran was on NFL network this afternoon. I always watch it - kinda like how you have to take a look at a car crash.

Never ceases to amaze me what a perfect storm of screw-ups were made in that game. That horrific missed call on the pass interference at the end was just the icing on the cake.

And I had forgotten that f-ing Ron Winter was the ref for that game. I'd have hated him even more over the years if I had remembered that.

But the mention of Collins with Fassel as coach brings to mind two decisions made by Fassel that cost the Giants when Collins was behind center. If Fassel had given Strahan a series or two off in the 2nd half of the 2003 playoff game against the 49ers, I think the Giants win the game because Strahan would have had the ability to chase down Garcia. I remember Strahan repeatedly motioning to the sidelines, begging to be taken out of the game because he could barely breathe.

The second poor decision was the 2000 Super Bowl. If Fassel had played Garrett after the Ravens knocked Collins out of the game, I think we win it. For the remainder of that game Collins had happy feet and repeatedly missed open receivers because he was throwing the ball way too soon. The Giants offense was better than the Ravens defense in my opinion, but it needed a quarterback who could stand in the pocket and wait for the play to develop.

In comment 11628101 Some Fan said:

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in the same way Dave Brown is overrated by some on BBI. KC also had an undefeated season at PSU and pretty good success with his NFL teams.

Who the hell overrates Dave Brown LOL

He did the best he could with what he had to work with. He was looking to resurrect his career after Carolina and he succeeded. He came to the Giants with a lot to prove and he did while also overcoming his own demons.