but besides what is going on in King's Landing, the show is really dragging this season. All of these little plots about the people coming at the Lannisters is getting tedious. How much do I need to watch about Stannis and Daerys and the Wildings and Arya and the Hound. In particular, the Daerys stuff is really annoying, I get it, she goes from town to town building an army, (I have not read the books), so I ask myself when the heck is she going to actually use the army. She has been marching for two and a half seasons already. Let's go. The stuff in King's Landing, though, is first rate.
RE: I love the show and have watched every episode
but besides what is going on in King's Landing, the show is really dragging this season. All of these little plots about the people coming at the Lannisters is getting tedious. How much do I need to watch about Stannis and Daerys and the Wildings and Arya and the Hound. In particular, the Daerys stuff is really annoying, I get it, she goes from town to town building an army, (I have not read the books), so I ask myself when the heck is she going to actually use the army. She has been marching for two and a half seasons already. Let's go. The stuff in King's Landing, though, is first rate.
if you look at a map of the fictional universe, Danaerys is still pretty far from where she intends to go, I think. Meereen was the third major slave city that she conquered near Slaver's Bay, so if she's done she could theoretically start heading west over water, but she'd need a ton of ships to do that. if she wants to continue traveling over land, it looks like a pretty long trip.
the point is, they can't just teleport her and her army to westeros, nor can they ignore her storyline. I agree that the conquering slave cities thing is a little stale, but I think things will heat up soon.
I have a question for the book readers, in the books
The Hound & Arya storyline. They are both great characters and their relationship is so incredibly odd. They don't really like eachother but they need eachother and have developed a mutual respect. The Hound is such a great character that I could watch an entire episode simply about him.
I don't mind the Danaerys stuff as much as others, but it is not as compelling as the rest of the show. I do like Jorah, Greyworm & her other Captains or w/e you want to call them though, so I enjoy that. I do find myself asking how Jorah knows everything about every single new culture they encounter. It's a lot of information that he is always passing on to his Khaleesi.
RE: I have a question for the book readers, in the books
There's a lot of background about those individuals and also about their houses. House Stark goes back thousands of years and the book talks about some of the most important ones.
House Targaryen is also explained pretty fully - from Aegon the Conqueror and his dragons through the Mad King and some characters in between (Baelor the Blessed, Maegor the Cruel, etc.).
House Lannister is also interesting, in particular Tywin's back story. It talks about how House Lannister was founded by a guy named Lann the Clever a long time ago.
There's also a lot about Robert's rebellion, how the alliance came together, specific battles that were fought, etc.
but man are Stannis scenes annoying. I'm also confused about his stance - didn't the Red Witch acknowledge in last year's season finale that the Whitewalkers are coming and that the Iron Throne wasn't even important anymore? That "the true war lies to the north"? Now all of a sudden he's interested in the throne again?
keep in mind that this is a 7 book series of probably 7,000+ pages. The show condenses and accelerates the story as much as possible, but some parts are going to drag.
If they had the ability financially, 13 episode seasons would definitely be better, but that's not an option apparently.
I fully expect things to pick up, and once certain arcs play out, it will improve the perception of the earlier episodes. It happens in each season, in fact.
There's a ton of information on the backstory in the book...
But a lot of it is vague or veiled - never explicitly stated as "X did Y and caused Z". This leads to a lot of fan theories and speculation as to whether or not the way GRRM described a tree in the book may have some deeper meaning.
You do get a much better appreciation for the players in the game and why things are the way they are (and what will likely happen next) with reading the book, but they are doing a pretty good job keeping it together in the series.
RE: There's a ton of information on the backstory in the book...
But a lot of it is vague or veiled - never explicitly stated as "X did Y and caused Z". This leads to a lot of fan theories and speculation as to whether or not the way GRRM described a tree in the book may have some deeper meaning.
You do get a much better appreciation for the players in the game and why things are the way they are (and what will likely happen next) with reading the book, but they are doing a pretty good job keeping it together in the series.
I love that about the books. Adds a tertiary element of still not knowing definitively what happened in the past and what drives the actions of certain characters. GRRM has mastered that aspect of writing.
but man are Stannis scenes annoying. I'm also confused about his stance - didn't the Red Witch acknowledge in last year's season finale that the Whitewalkers are coming and that the Iron Throne wasn't even important anymore? That "the true war lies to the north"? Now all of a sudden he's interested in the throne again?
great point, she definitely said that at the end of last season. however, that was before Joffrey died, which Stannis apparently perceives as another opportunity to assert his claim. i would expect Melissandre to try to dissuade him from focusing on King's Landing given her realization from last season, but we'll see.
after being involved in slave trade (a big no-no). He has spent years in Essos before Game of Thrones begins. this accounts for some of his knowledge.
I know his story, so I do understand why they have him explain the different cultures and such. But it's like no matter where they go he knows every single meaning of every single gesture made. I'm nit-picking & it doesn't bother me THAT much, but I find it hard to believe one guy could know so much about the many, many different cultures across the land.
culture-wise. He's had to adapt and learn how to survive. He knows everything about Westeros due to his history there and is extremely intelligent, IMO. Not far fetched to have a guy like him pick up on things so easily even in other "countries".
great point, she definitely said that at the end of last season. however, that was before Joffrey died, which Stannis apparently perceives as another opportunity to assert his claim. i would expect Melissandre to try to dissuade him from focusing on King's Landing given her realization from last season, but we'll see.
I interpreted her saying that as the reason Stannis needed to take The Iron Throne. So I don't think she was trying to dissuade him from the current war, but motivate him to win the war so he could win the bigger war with the Whitewalkers beyond the wall. I could be wrong, obviously, but that is how I took it.
I urge you to check out the GoT map thread. It puts the show into perspective without spoiling anything.
I agree. Looking at the maps was a great help in understanding the locations of the numerous plots in the show in relation to one another. It also definitely gave me a deeper appreciation for the Khaleesi storyline.
solidifies what i said above about Danaerys - she's still very far from Westeros at this point - both by land and by sea - so unless she's hopping on the back of one of her dragons and flying there, I don't think she'll be invading King's Landing any time soon.
Everything in Game of Thrones has historical analogs
Drowned God = Norse Gods (Odin, Loki etc)
Old Gods = animism
New Gods (the 7) = paganism
The Lord of Light = Christianity
Lannisters = House Lancaster in England's War of the Roses (vs the Starks aka House of York)
The Martells/Dorne = Moorish Spain
The Night's Watch = Holy Orders, like the Templars, Teutonic Order etc
Greyjoys = Vikings
Free Cities (Braavos, Myr, Penthos etc) = Italian City States
Dothraki = An amalagation of all horseback steppe tribes (Mongols, Turks, Huns etc)
Old Valyria = Rome, hence the superior technology (Valyrian Steel) which can no longer be duplicated - those that survived 'the doom of Valyria' (probably volcano a la Pompeii) were a few steps ahead of the rest (the Targaryeans, the city of Volantis)
great point, she definitely said that at the end of last season. however, that was before Joffrey died, which Stannis apparently perceives as another opportunity to assert his claim. i would expect Melissandre to try to dissuade him from focusing on King's Landing given her realization from last season, but we'll see.
I interpreted her saying that as the reason Stannis needed to take The Iron Throne. So I don't think she was trying to dissuade him from the current war, but motivate him to win the war so he could win the bigger war with the Whitewalkers beyond the wall. I could be wrong, obviously, but that is how I took it.
I disagree. According to some recap sites, the exact quote from that scene was, "This war of the five kings means nothing... The true war lies to the north. Death marches on the wall: only you can stop him."
I disagree. According to some recap sites, the exact quote from that scene was, "This war of the five kings means nothing... The true war lies to the north. Death marches on the wall: only you can stop him."
But look at that last line. She is essentially saying "Only Stannis can stop them." How is he going to stop them in the role he is in now? He can't even gather an army to help him fight the war of the 5 kings. I believe she meant, and Stannis feels, that he needs to take the Iron Throne first in order to gain enough power to stop the Whitewalkers et al beyond the wall. Only a King can unify the kingdoms to fight the war beyond the wall.
That is how I interpret those statements and the fact that he is still concentrating on taking the Iron throne rather than the enemy beyond the wall, further cements me in my opinion.
Again, it's just my opinion, but I wanted to explain my thinking. When she said it I didn't think that she meant for him to stop trying to take the Iron Throne, I thought she was stating the importance of him overtaking the Iron Throne. Essentially saying that he needs to become King in order to save the kingdoms from the death that marches on the wall.
But look at that last line. She is essentially saying "Only Stannis can stop them." How is he going to stop them in the role he is in now? He can't even gather an army to help him fight the war of the 5 kings. I believe she meant, and Stannis feels, that he needs to take the Iron Throne first in order to gain enough power to stop the Whitewalkers et al beyond the wall. Only a King can unify the kingdoms to fight the war beyond the wall.
That is how I interpret those statements and the fact that he is still concentrating on taking the Iron throne rather than the enemy beyond the wall, further cements me in my opinion.
Again, it's just my opinion, but I wanted to explain my thinking. When she said it I didn't think that she meant for him to stop trying to take the Iron Throne, I thought she was stating the importance of him overtaking the Iron Throne. Essentially saying that he needs to become King in order to save the kingdoms from the death that marches on the wall.
You're probably right. It helps that the writing has been top-notch so far - I doubt they (or George RR Martin) would drop the ball on something so significant.
if you look at a map of the fictional universe, Danaerys is still pretty far from where she intends to go, I think. Meereen was the third major slave city that she conquered near Slaver's Bay, so if she's done she could theoretically start heading west over water, but she'd need a ton of ships to do that. if she wants to continue traveling over land, it looks like a pretty long trip.
the point is, they can't just teleport her and her army to westeros, nor can they ignore her storyline. I agree that the conquering slave cities thing is a little stale, but I think things will heat up soon.
I don't mind the Danaerys stuff as much as others, but it is not as compelling as the rest of the show. I do like Jorah, Greyworm & her other Captains or w/e you want to call them though, so I enjoy that. I do find myself asking how Jorah knows everything about every single new culture they encounter. It's a lot of information that he is always passing on to his Khaleesi.
I'm only 25% through book 4 but they touch on it from time to time but don't go into great detail. An anecdote pops up from time to time
House Targaryen is also explained pretty fully - from Aegon the Conqueror and his dragons through the Mad King and some characters in between (Baelor the Blessed, Maegor the Cruel, etc.).
House Lannister is also interesting, in particular Tywin's back story. It talks about how House Lannister was founded by a guy named Lann the Clever a long time ago.
There's also a lot about Robert's rebellion, how the alliance came together, specific battles that were fought, etc.
If they had the ability financially, 13 episode seasons would definitely be better, but that's not an option apparently.
I fully expect things to pick up, and once certain arcs play out, it will improve the perception of the earlier episodes. It happens in each season, in fact.
You do get a much better appreciation for the players in the game and why things are the way they are (and what will likely happen next) with reading the book, but they are doing a pretty good job keeping it together in the series.
You do get a much better appreciation for the players in the game and why things are the way they are (and what will likely happen next) with reading the book, but they are doing a pretty good job keeping it together in the series.
I love that about the books. Adds a tertiary element of still not knowing definitively what happened in the past and what drives the actions of certain characters. GRRM has mastered that aspect of writing.
great point, she definitely said that at the end of last season. however, that was before Joffrey died, which Stannis apparently perceives as another opportunity to assert his claim. i would expect Melissandre to try to dissuade him from focusing on King's Landing given her realization from last season, but we'll see.
I know his story, so I do understand why they have him explain the different cultures and such. But it's like no matter where they go he knows every single meaning of every single gesture made. I'm nit-picking & it doesn't bother me THAT much, but I find it hard to believe one guy could know so much about the many, many different cultures across the land.
I interpreted her saying that as the reason Stannis needed to take The Iron Throne. So I don't think she was trying to dissuade him from the current war, but motivate him to win the war so he could win the bigger war with the Whitewalkers beyond the wall. I could be wrong, obviously, but that is how I took it.
I agree. Looking at the maps was a great help in understanding the locations of the numerous plots in the show in relation to one another. It also definitely gave me a deeper appreciation for the Khaleesi storyline.
Drowned God = Norse Gods (Odin, Loki etc)
Old Gods = animism
New Gods (the 7) = paganism
The Lord of Light = Christianity
Lannisters = House Lancaster in England's War of the Roses (vs the Starks aka House of York)
The Martells/Dorne = Moorish Spain
The Night's Watch = Holy Orders, like the Templars, Teutonic Order etc
Greyjoys = Vikings
Free Cities (Braavos, Myr, Penthos etc) = Italian City States
Dothraki = An amalagation of all horseback steppe tribes (Mongols, Turks, Huns etc)
Old Valyria = Rome, hence the superior technology (Valyrian Steel) which can no longer be duplicated - those that survived 'the doom of Valyria' (probably volcano a la Pompeii) were a few steps ahead of the rest (the Targaryeans, the city of Volantis)
Slaver's Bay (all the cities Dany is conquering) - Look at this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_slave_trade
Also most of the story line comes from historical events - assassinations, betrayals etc.
Quote:
great point, she definitely said that at the end of last season. however, that was before Joffrey died, which Stannis apparently perceives as another opportunity to assert his claim. i would expect Melissandre to try to dissuade him from focusing on King's Landing given her realization from last season, but we'll see.
I interpreted her saying that as the reason Stannis needed to take The Iron Throne. So I don't think she was trying to dissuade him from the current war, but motivate him to win the war so he could win the bigger war with the Whitewalkers beyond the wall. I could be wrong, obviously, but that is how I took it.
I disagree. According to some recap sites, the exact quote from that scene was, "This war of the five kings means nothing... The true war lies to the north. Death marches on the wall: only you can stop him."
But look at that last line. She is essentially saying "Only Stannis can stop them." How is he going to stop them in the role he is in now? He can't even gather an army to help him fight the war of the 5 kings. I believe she meant, and Stannis feels, that he needs to take the Iron Throne first in order to gain enough power to stop the Whitewalkers et al beyond the wall. Only a King can unify the kingdoms to fight the war beyond the wall.
That is how I interpret those statements and the fact that he is still concentrating on taking the Iron throne rather than the enemy beyond the wall, further cements me in my opinion.
Again, it's just my opinion, but I wanted to explain my thinking. When she said it I didn't think that she meant for him to stop trying to take the Iron Throne, I thought she was stating the importance of him overtaking the Iron Throne. Essentially saying that he needs to become King in order to save the kingdoms from the death that marches on the wall.
That is how I interpret those statements and the fact that he is still concentrating on taking the Iron throne rather than the enemy beyond the wall, further cements me in my opinion.
Again, it's just my opinion, but I wanted to explain my thinking. When she said it I didn't think that she meant for him to stop trying to take the Iron Throne, I thought she was stating the importance of him overtaking the Iron Throne. Essentially saying that he needs to become King in order to save the kingdoms from the death that marches on the wall.
You're probably right. It helps that the writing has been top-notch so far - I doubt they (or George RR Martin) would drop the ball on something so significant.