From Garafolo:
Giants S Will Hill is facing another suspension for a violation of the NFL's drug policy, sources have told @FOXSports1. He will appeal.
Congratulations, you just went from late roster cut to rotational player. So Brown and Rolle start, Demps and Taylor compete for number 3. This sucks, Hill had the potential to be our best safety since I honestly can't even recall.
Seriously. How some of these brain lacking players can disrespect their fellow players, coaches and fans with sure immature antics is beyond me. The little boy can only think of going out to play. JERK!
they have 4 safeties they think they can count on already Â
To cheer on Ha Ha Dix just to say "Come on dix, put your helmet on someone"..."Hey Dix, stiffen up out there"..."Dix, don't go soft when you make a tackle....Dix, lay some wood...Dix is really emerging...we can start a female fan club "Chicks for Dix", sell t-shirts, the whole shmear.
Guy had the opportunity to become a top safety in the league for a great organization that gave him multiple chances to succeed. Just pisses it away with no remorse. Cant even go a full year being clean.
I was one of his biggest fans before this last incident, but I am all for the Giants cutting bait with this guy. Cant teach stupid.
"According to the league's drug policy, that testing only happens between April 20 and Aug. 9, though players signed or acquired after Aug. 9 can be tested later than that if they haven't been already."
He had to have known this and still chose to test fate. Link - ( New Window )
"But how do players continue to smoke weed if the NFL tests for it? That's easy: For players who have not previously tested positive or been arrested on drug-related charges, the league's random testing for what it calls "substances of abuse" only takes place for approximately four months out of the year, all of it during the offseason."
To cheer on Ha Ha Dix just to say "Come on dix, put your helmet on someone"..."Hey Dix, stiffen up out there"..."Dix, don't go soft when you make a tackle....Dix, lay some wood...Dix is really emerging...we can start a female fan club "Chicks for Dix", sell t-shirts, the whole shmear.
In training camp, you can match him up with Michael Cox and get that anticipated- Dix drills Cox in the hole.
Weed wont give a player
Advantage...less if anything.
Its almost legal .
Shouldn't be banned.
Meanwhile guys are taking
Growth hormones they cant
Trace.
he was one of the defense's best players and really help made safety a strength. there is still suitable depth with Brown and Demps but this is a big loss.
players can go wild from the end of their season until 4/20.
If this is Will Hill's 2nd "Stage 2" second failure to comply then he is facing a 6 game suspension. First failure to comply is 4 games which he got last year. Link - ( New Window )
Weed wont give a player
Advantage...less if anything.
Its almost legal .
Shouldn't be banned.
Meanwhile guys are taking
Growth hormones they cant
Trace.
There is no defense. Whether it gives him an advantage or not is completely irrelevant. It's a rule and he knows the consequences of breaking those rules. He had already been suspended twice and was on a short leash and clearly doesn't give a shit about anyone but himself (and even that can be questioned now that he has jeopardized his career). This guy is one of the dumbest people on the planet and there is no reasonable 'defense.'
Congratulations, you just went from late roster cut to rotational player. So Brown and Rolle start, Demps and Taylor compete for number 3. This sucks, Hill had the potential to be our best safety since I honestly can't even recall.
Cooper Taylor was going to be cut? Ummm, no he wasn't.
It's amazing how clueless some of you really are when it comes to football and the Giants.
EARLY in this draft. I think Pryor and Clinton Dix are legit possibilities at 12 overall.
Reese is very high on Taylor. Remember Demps is on the roster too. More needs than Safety right now.
Agreed. I don't think this puts safety in the mix at #12. We're still pretty solid there, with Rolle, Brown, Demps, and Taylor. But we need to get rid of Hill. We took a chance. It didn't work out. Time to abandon the project. It's disruptive at this point. Cohesion and chemistry are of primary importance to any sports team, but especially one like the Giants with a new OC and so many new players. Hill is threatening that fragile teamwork, and should therefore be cut. The Giants have already been more than patient with him.
the pot policy is a joke but that aside this is one huge loss Â
but (and this is no defense of Hill) the league really needs to update its policy regarding weed, particularly if it can be helpful for players dealing with physical pain or anxiety. I suppose Hill would still be in the league's good graces if he had a script for oxy and popped 8 pills per day?
just don't understand how someone blows the multiple opportunities he has been given. If he could stay out of trouble, he could have potentially made millions. Now, not so much. Some team will pick him up after we drop him and he'll play well until he gets suspended again.
and how it helps him cope with stress. It's easy to jump on the guy because we're all frustrated and tantalized by his talent, but it may not be as simple as some guy who just likes to get high with his buddies and eat potato chips. Link - ( New Window )
Dixon had tons of talent, but he nearly threw it away in his rookie season. He was late and missed practice and over slept. He got fined twice and was suspended a game. His father was an ex-Marine who got up early and he took it on himself to call and make sure that Dixon got up and went to work.
There was an article about it and the following line applies to Hill
Quote:
Father, and in this case, mother, know best. So every morning, depending on what time Ron Dixon has to be at Giants Stadium, he gets a wakeup call from his parents.
“As big a fine as he had to pay the last time, I said, ‘For a dime a day, let’s call him up,’ ” Diana Dixon told The Post from the family home in Florida. “There are so many young men who would love to have the opportunity he does that we didn’t want to see him mess it up.”
Will Hill is messing up his opportunity. The Giants are not going to wait on a guy who misses 25-40% of the season on suspensions, and it's been made clear he's on a short leash. It's a shame because this guy has legit Pro Bowl talent back at safety. But at some point you need to cut the cord and move on. http://nypost.com/2000/12/29/dixon-heeds-wake-up-call-parents-get-giant-going/ - ( New Window )
I'm gonna wait and see what actually happens here but if he fucked up again that's a huge blow to this defense. He completely changed what we were able to do on the field.
most pot heads would give up weed to be able to play in the NFL. The money, fame, being an athlete. All temporary, about 10 years. Then you can retire a millionaire and resume your pot head ways for the rest of your life. BUT NOOOOOOOO!!!
but when I think of million dollar talent 10 cent head.. Ron Dixon always comes to mind. Even though Dixon was just late because he was playing video games...
Glad to see Ron turned out to have a successful career away from football though.
That said- Will Hill has even more talent, and even less of a brain
Rolle and Brown are free agents in 2015. Taylor is an unknown and Demps is a known marginal player.
I know nothing about the players available, but I wouldn't complain about spending #12 on a Safety if the Giants are convinced that he can be a high-level starter for 4 or 5 years.
I mean, I'm assuming it's weed yet again. He simply can't be trusted. You just dread clicking on BBI one random morning and seeing he was involved in some stupidity that's going to cost him games. The end of his rope is in sights. The Giants aren't paying him to sit on the bench.
is upheld, how much time does he miss? 4 games or the full season?
Yeah, Hill needs a strong mentor/veteran who is willing to take him under his wing and keep him on the straight and narrow. plenty of time to partake in fun when your playing career is over.
LMAO, as I said when he was signed knuckleheads don't change Â
is upheld, how much time does he miss? 4 games or the full season?
Yeah, Hill needs a strong mentor/veteran who is willing to take him under his wing and keep him on the straight and narrow. plenty of time to partake in fun when your playing career is over.
There comes a point where a knucklehead is a knucklehead. The Giants have one of the better "life-coach" systems in place with Jesse Armstead and Charles Way. And Antrel Rolle is to be considered a veteran leader. In the end, Will Hill is still making the choice.
Not sure how you choose weed over millions of dollars...
With that being said, enough with the weed testing. Really, who gives a shit about people smoking pot? I can see testing for steroids and growth hormone or even more illicit drugs but pot is now legal in a few states and will be in more soon. It doesn't give players any advantage and as long as you aren't smoking trash bags of the stuff it really isn't that bad for you. Perhaps even changing the rules to only ban it's use during the season. Let guys enjoy their offseason.
as far as i know, the NFL's policy on alcohol is that you can drink however much you want if you're over 21, but if you have a history of alcohol ABUSE, then you enter into the league's substance abuse program and you must stay sober until you're out of the program.
so, if the league's policy on weed mirrored that of alcohol, Hill would still be in trouble because he was already in the substance abuse program at this point.
that would actually be a step in the right direction for the league, but still not far enough in my opinion. weed has medicinal properties that can actually help players avoid opiate addiction and deal with chronic pain stemming from playing injuries, whereas alcohol doesn't and can do more damage.
evidently he uses it to manage stress, as he's had a fucked up life... marijuana has been approved for medical use in 21 states, including NJ. wonder if this the league would've been more forgiving if he had a script..
still beyond disappointing, esp if he only had to keep it clean for 4 months.. just switch to booze for that period..
and how it helps him cope with stress. It's easy to jump on the guy because we're all frustrated and tantalized by his talent, but it may not be as simple as some guy who just likes to get high with his buddies and eat potato chips. Link - ( New Window )
I mean, everyone copes with stress. Your stress coping method can't be something that gets you suspended from your job.
bound now?
Most of us love the guy, but for his own good, if he chooses, I hope its 8 or 16.
He has NO excuse,and NO defense;he had to have had things spelled out to him both times by the league office, and JR had to have drilled hope that point as well; Those rules are the rules until the rules change.
It'll either slap some sense into him, or he gets busted for dealing in the next year or two.
On a Giants football note, do you think the Giants were hedging bets On The Thrill with their signings this offseason, or, maybe even knew something? This could F'up the draft priorities for them(any good unsigned S still out there?).
I certainly hope Mr Thurmond is paying a whole lot of attention.
is upheld, how much time does he miss? 4 games or the full season?
Yeah, Hill needs a strong mentor/veteran who is willing to take him under his wing and keep him on the straight and narrow. plenty of time to partake in fun when your playing career is over.
if it holds up it could be a whole season. he's going to appeal it and I suppose it could be cut, not sure of those rules.I also read where this could be related to a Dec arrest. if thats the case then they knew about this going into FA.
Will hill is more than likely gone, and rolle, Stevie, and demps are free agents next year
I need to watch more videos but I just watched Clinton-Dix against Auburn and I want no parts of that. One thing I LOVE about Will Hill is he is very decisive and rarely pulls up when closing in for the tackle. It was only one game, but what jumped out to me was how hesitant Clinton-Dix looked at times again the run.
He's so talented though, this fucking sucks. He showed All Pro potential last year and was arguably the best player on the defense. Our "elite" secondary looks a lot weaker now.
Just really disappointing news. Can't believe Hill is this stupid.
and how it helps him cope with stress. It's easy to jump on the guy because we're all frustrated and tantalized by his talent, but it may not be as simple as some guy who just likes to get high with his buddies and eat potato chips. Link - ( New Window )
I mean, everyone copes with stress. Your stress coping method can't be something that gets you suspended from your job.
Sure it can. Find a new coping method or find a new job. Pretty simple.
Besides JPP when he's healthy, Hill's talent jumps off the screen. I was really looking forward to a full season of him playing defense with Rolle & Stevie in the 3.
I hope that it's just a misunderstanding somehow, but jeez louis...
He had the makings of a top 5 player at his position for years to come and just like that he will no longer be a Giant. Damn it this will definitely add another need to our draft where we already have several desperate areas of concern.
Weed wont give a player
Advantage...less if anything.
Its almost legal .
Shouldn't be banned.
Meanwhile guys are taking
Growth hormones they cant
Trace.
Maybe it will be legal at some point but it isn't now. He is well aware of that and was well aware before he signed with the team. It was totally within his power to stop and he didn't. People have come back from much worse than an addiction to weed.
No sympathy for this guy whatsoever. Hope he gets his crap together but there's no defense for this, his third suspension.
Weed wont give a player
Advantage...less if anything.
Its almost legal .
Shouldn't be banned.
Meanwhile guys are taking
Growth hormones they cant
Trace.
Not every rule is in place to protect a level playing field for the athletes. Some rules are in place because the NFL (or any employer)wants it's employees to represent their company a certain way. That's their right as an employer. If you take the money, you're accepting their terms of employment.
is really, really awful. If the top tackles are off the board I would not mind Clinton-Dix at all. Rolle isn't getting any younger, who knows with Stevie Brown what you're going to get.
And of course, I can almost guarantee someone else will eventually take a shot on him, he'll finally get it together and become a stud, all-pro safety. Because, well.. why wouldn't that happen?
Giants are livid with Hill over this and will most likly part ways; regardless of appeal outcome. NY Daily News - ( New Window )
Per Hill, last time he spoke with Mara, Tisch, Reese, Coughlin, Fewell, Rolle and Tuck. Assuring each that this was behind him. I don't know how you show up at the facility without feeling a great deal of shame.
Make a few million in the next 5 years or so then spend the rest of your life toking up. Idiot. I can't fathom walking away from that opportunity for some damn pot.
Safety just became one of the team's largest needs Â
you imagine how pissed we'd be if Hill was a first or even second round pick instead of a UDFA? This is why a guy like Hageman shouldn't even be considered on day one or two. Hageman's problems are the result of a terrible childhood, and are not self inflicted like Hill's, but the result will be the same if his anger gets him suspended.
So everybody still wanting Rolle to be a cap casualty? Â
Cooper Taylor.. yay. Hill is about 50x the player Taylor is. What a massive fucking downgrade. Worst possible news. This sucks.
Yes because Taylor has played enough for that assessment, give the guy a chance he has potential.
Taylor is not nearly as talented as Hill. Never was. If you're waiting for Taylor to ever flash the ability Hill did last year (and even before that), I wouldn't hold my breath because you'll be waiting forever. Hill looked like a player from the moment he took the field. Taylor has yet to show much of anything.
RE: So everybody still wanting Rolle to be a cap casualty? Â
It is one of the most ridiculous rampant chatter on this site. Hey let's cut Rolle, he is our most dependable defender, pro bowler, leader and doesn't miss games. Yeah let's cut him so we throw money at a couple potential FA busts. Apparently 31 is now ancient in the NFL.
not Clinton-Dix but actually haha at Will Hill, in a decidedly gallows manner that is. What a trainwreck.
I knew a guy who a few years ago had an absolute dream job lined up with the Feds. 6 figures, crazy benefits, job security. He was all but hired, and just had to pass a drug test. However he loved weed more than anything and would not stop smoking it. So finally a day before the drug test he starts freaking out, chugs one of those stupid drinks. He fails hard of course and loses the opportunity.
He then emails the org over and over pleading "give me another chance" and "the test malfunctioned" etc etc. They're like "dude, you need to stop contacting us now" which is apparently what the Giants will soon tell this fucking bonehead.
great football instincts, very good tackler. As talented as he is, so long Will Hill. Move to Colorado where you can completely burn yourself out. Disgusted!
Kid couldn't even go ONE FULL YEAR without getting suspended. I've seen players in the past that had serious drug problems and ultimately were kicked out of the league, but even in those cases, they would have at least one or two years of trying to at least "appear" clean in an attempt to earn a couple paychecks. This guy just DGAF.
but yet is being jumped but yet we have sympathy for others with drug problems..Just because he's an athlete and he has talent??
Seems a little hypocritical to me..
not at all hypocritical. playing in the NFL is a privilege, not a right. if he has a legitimate substance abuse problem then that sucks for him, but that doesn't make him any less of an idiot for blowing his playing career and potentially millions of dollars over weed. he's still making a choice to light up, and it's certainly an easier choice than for people who have addictions to other things like heroin.
And the Giants have gone to very admirable lengths to help him, even paying for his attendance at rehab, and supporting him through the process with patience and understanding. But, where exactly is the line where it's fair to criticise if not now?
@RVacchianoNYDN
From what I'm told, Will Hill is NOT facing a year-long suspension, so it would then be in the 6-8-game range, depending on the specifics.
In comment 11631791 arcarsenal said:
Taylor has potential and was hurt last year to early to judge him is all I'm saying. Obviously Hill is much more proven at this point but hill wasn't even drafted and was cut by the redskins he wasn't an instant star either.
Quote:
Cooper Taylor.. yay. Hill is about 50x the player Taylor is. What a massive fucking downgrade. Worst possible news. This sucks.
Yes because Taylor has played enough for that assessment, give the guy a chance he has potential.
Taylor is not nearly as talented as Hill. Never was. If you're waiting for Taylor to ever flash the ability Hill did last year (and even before that), I wouldn't hold my breath because you'll be waiting forever. Hill looked like a player from the moment he took the field. Taylor has yet to show much of anything.
in my opinion, no. some addictions are almost impossible to beat and some just require maturity and/or prioritization. if he is addicted to weed, this one falls in the latter category.
We don't have to turn this into a Cooper Taylor bashing thread Â
Who is bashing Taylor? I just think Hill is a far superior talent. I'd be willing to bet my handle here that Taylor never plays at the level Hill did last year. He's just not that player.
Who is bashing Taylor? I just think Hill is a far superior talent. I'd be willing to bet my handle here that Taylor never plays at the level Hill did last year. He's just not that player.
but we don't know what he was suspended for and it could be something that is on the banned list that maybe he has a prescription for like adderall. Why don't we all relax until the facts come out. If it is marijuana again then, yes, he is almost 100% done if not 100%.
but we don't know what he was suspended for and it could be something that is on the banned list that maybe he has a prescription for like adderall. Why don't we all relax until the facts come out. If it is marijuana again then, yes, he is almost 100% done if not 100%.
Yeah, that was basically the first thing I said. This isn't looking good but I'm going to wait for the details before I start calling him a scumbag pot head or a loser or whatever else people are calling him. If he did fuck up, it's a major shame and bad on his part. And it looks like he did. But we gotta find out what happened here still.
but we don't know what he was suspended for and it could be something that is on the banned list that maybe he has a prescription for like adderall. Why don't we all relax until the facts come out. If it is marijuana again then, yes, he is almost 100% done if not 100%.
You won't really get a whole lot more details. He used the Adderall cover up once already.
Hill may as well have taken a match to several million ... Â
between this, going into the last year of Rolle's contract and Brown coming off a major injury.
I think that's an overreaction/panic move. We don't know how the Giants felt about Hill prior to this announcement, and it's possible that they were looking at Safeties in this draft anyway, but I don't see them forcing a premium pick just because they might lose Hill, not when they have other, more pressing needs. I think it's more likely that they look for a kid with some CB/S/ST versatility in the middle rounds.
And, as I've said repeatedly, the 2015 UFA Safety market will be very good. The Giants might plan on doing for Safeties next year what they did for CBs this year...shop around.
Assuming the Giants suddenly go safety in rd 1 or 2 is really simple Â
the Giants aren't going to rush to judgement on this. They will gather all the facts regarding what he tested positive for (if it really was adderral, maybe he had a prescription) before they cut ties with one of their most talented players.
It would also be very unlike the Giants to throw a troubled guy to the streets. This is a situation where Mara may step in and want to help him on a personal basis (his talent certainly doesn't hurt). Mara stepped in when Coughlin wanted to cut Cruz (obviously a different situation, but he did say this talent isn't going anywhere). We all know him and his father put up with LT as well.
The last thing is if the decision has been made to cut him, it will be done quickly. The Giants don't allow questions like this to hover over them. If it doesn't happen soon, it may show they know more then we do (like last summer, they had all intentions to keep him).
Safety just jumped up to 3rd or 4th on the draft list Â
Will Hill has a lifestyle that has afforded an NFL career. The lifestyle includes recreational drug use. It is not abuse or the NFL career would not have been realized. His lifestyle is well known and has come under scrutiny multiple times in the past. Through it all he has continued to live his life and succeed in the NFL.
So his life lesson to date is that everything will be alright, not that he has to change his lifestyle. If the Giants have a problem with it, he will move on. And still do well.
he doesn't cost you anything and doesn't count against the roster. make the decision mid season when his suspension ends. If you need a safety, activate him, and then decide next offseason whether to bring him back again.
Will Hill has a lifestyle that has afforded an NFL career. The lifestyle includes recreational drug use. It is not abuse or the NFL career would not have been realized. His lifestyle is well known and has come under scrutiny multiple times in the past. Through it all he has continued to live his life and succeed in the NFL.
So his life lesson to date is that everything will be alright, not that he has to change his lifestyle. If the Giants have a problem with it, he will move on. And still do well.
Here's the caveat: He can be suspended for a full season very soon. And after that, he could probably be booted out of the league. So, if this continues, something will inevitably change. It isn't going to be all right, and he won't continue to do well.
Guy is an All-Pro talent and he does something very stupid. He was arguably our best defender last year. If he's gone, it is a HUGE loss. Quentin Demps/Cooper Taylor/Stevie Brown is no Will Hill, not even close. F--K!!!
is that failing drug tests leads to loss of income. It's already cost him some serious ka-ching (both in actual suspension loss of pay and in coulda got drafted and made more money). It's likely to lead to either being out of the NFL or getting significantly fewer dollars in a future contract.
What sort of upside down logic is it that anyone can paint a portrait of a young fellow grinning because he got a couple dollars out of an organization, saying "the jokes on them", while a truck full of unrealized money is passing him by, and claiming that it's not substance abuse?
Will Hill has a lifestyle that has afforded an NFL career. The lifestyle includes recreational drug use. It is not abuse or the NFL career would not have been realized.
had a massive impact on the defense's performance last year, but getting Hill back into the mix was perhaps equally important. We have seen what he can do.
People can use cliches like "Million dollar talent, 10 cent brain all the want." Let's soak up as much of that talent as possible until the league tells us we can't anymore.
Again, the problem with that is you're setting a terrible precedent. No one wants to see Hill stay here more than I do.. but if the Giants just say "alright, so it's x amt. of games, he can come back after he serves it" they're basically telling their players that their roster spot really isn't in jeopardy no matter how many times they fuck up off the field as long as they're good on it.
" Let's soak up as much of that talent as possible until the league tells us we can't anymore."
that works in the short term - hence my don't cut him now, use him the second half of the season.
Problem is that you can't rely on him. We relied on him for this season, and now he's likely to miss half of it. Do you want to rely on him for next season?
Again, the problem with that is you're setting a terrible precedent. No one wants to see Hill stay here more than I do.. but if the Giants just say "alright, so it's x amt. of games, he can come back after he serves it" they're basically telling their players that their roster spot really isn't in jeopardy no matter how many times they fuck up off the field as long as they're good on it.
I don't agree. Will Hill is tremendously talented, more so than 90% of the players on the roster. If a lesser player decides to indulge in prohibited activity he will learn very quickly that the Giants aren't as forgiving as he once thought.
So the message is "as long as you're good at football, you can go ahead and break the rules as often as you want. Your roster spot will always be here after suspension" ?
How can you rely on a player who is serving suspensions every single season?
this policy is a joke in the year 2014. The only reason I can think of weed being dealt this harshly with is because of marketing reason. Some suburban bible thumping housewife in Bumfuck, Kansas won't approve. It's probably a PR issue. The league needs to get out of the fucking middle ages. Joke of a league.
So the message is "as long as you're good at football, you can go ahead and break the rules as often as you want. Your roster spot will always be here after suspension" ?
How can you rely on a player who is serving suspensions every single season?
I'm not worried about any messages right now. I'm worried about the 2014 season and losing one of our best players possibly for the entirety of it. As other posters alluded to, A) It might be a year and B) If he fucks up another time, by rule, he might be out of the league (I don't know the exact specifics so excuse me on that, but there is a limit to the amount of times this can happen).
My point being the Giants' message isn't important to me. Hill is done if it happens again. If anyone is going to have his serves between now and that (hopefully non-existent) point, I want it to be us.
Everyone said he was "done if it happens again" the last time. This is the 3rd time now. I'd love for the Giants to give him another shot but to me, it sets a shitty example and more importantly, I'm fairly certain they won't anyway. When you keep betraying the trust of the team that is giving you the opportunity of your life, they're not going to turn the other cheek forever. I (unfortunately) think we've probably seen the last of Hill as a Giant.
this policy is a joke in the year 2014. The only reason I can think of weed being dealt this harshly with is because of marketing reason. Some suburban bible thumping housewife in Bumfuck, Kansas won't approve. It's probably a PR issue. The league needs to get out of the fucking middle ages. Joke of a league.
yeah sure and it has nothing to do with protecting the owners' investments? Where do you draw the line? Lets say weed is ok. Then what about if a guy tokes up before taking the field? Do you want that shit on your team? What if he is high and doing an interview on TV making a total ass out of himself? You are damn right it is marketing. The league IS marketing. That is how they make their money. Where did you think the dollars came from? without that, there would be no league.
Not a drug user but I'd say that weed is much more like alcohol than any other drug. You run the same risk of players drinking before a game as you do them smoking before a game-which is very little IMO.
That being said, if someone came up to you and said 'you can't drink alcohol to qualify for this super high paying job,' would you really have a problem stopping? It is just so dumb that this guy can't do this. Without knowing the facts, of course.
but if S Brown can regain his form from the previous year and drag down more INTs, it will be a big help. Hill was a very good tackler and I think that's something we'll miss more than anything, as that is just not Brown's game. I just hope Q Demps can help us pick up the slack there and that the young Taylor starts to show some cover and tackling skills.
You really dont know what pot smoking is like, do you? From what you wrote, you sound like you could have been in "Reefer Madness"
Not sure why you don't get it. Are you saying there is no chance that a player would maybe blow a bone in his car before walking into the locker room? Especially if weed was not on the list of banned substances? Are you saying that weed would not impair a player's ability at all? Do you want the guys you are rooting for to be high in the meeting room during the week? I am not saying everyone. 2 or 3 players. That is not something to be concerned about?
Let me position it this way. You have to take a piss test and sometimes a blood test for MANY jobs out there. The only reason why ALL employer's don't do it is costs. Now, when you consider how much money these guys make....
Not a drug user but I'd say that weed is much more like alcohol than any other drug. You run the same risk of players drinking before a game as you do them smoking before a game-which is very little IMO.
That being said, if someone came up to you and said 'you can't drink alcohol to qualify for this super high paying job,' would you really have a problem stopping? It is just so dumb that this guy can't do this. Without knowing the facts, of course.
The difference is that alcohol is legal.
I would never consider smoking pot and playing football Â
The excuse for Adderall may have cut him some slack in 2012. But, if he failed for that again, it is 100% on him. At this point, he is a 3rd time offender for the combination of two league drug policies. That exhibits a pattern of problematic and addictive behavior. It is absolutely best to cut ties now, even if we lose one of our best defenders.
Its a rules and respect for your teammates and authority issue. Everyone knows the rules, and now its the 3rd time he violated them. From my experience, if they don't get it after time one (maybe in extreme cases time #2) they are not going to change. Its time to cut it lose before he goes onto #4,5, etc.
If he's not on the field then I don't care how good he can play. It doesn't matter.
one where he speaks about the roster back in the early 80's. There were a lot of guys who he cut loose because he did not put up with that kind of shit. Of course, there is LT but from what I understand, the meeting room was like a chemistry class before Parcells got there
Diaper party and the host wanted everyone to bring diapers for his newborn and the attendees would bring the grass? He was just in the room while everyone was handing out diapers and smoking bowls. That'd be ok right?
Will Hill has a lifestyle that has afforded an NFL career. The lifestyle includes recreational drug use. It is not abuse or the NFL career would not have been realized.
Lawrence Taylor didn't abuse drugs?
Quite frankly, I wouldn't approve of Taylor's abuse if it happened today all the same.
When you start ignoring your own player's negative vices, yet you crack on other team's players, it's being a tad bit hypocritical, no?
sorry, but there is no excuse for this. NONE. Anyone trying to justify his behavior is just plain clueless. He has been provided every opportunity and support system available to help deal with his issues and continues to fail. Don't need a guy like that on the Giants.
LT was once in a generation, WH is a good player. Big difference. I don't condone treating players differently, but if you were going to pick one LT would be it.
In comment 11632433 EricJ (formerly Tyleraimee) said:
Quote:
In comment 11632332 Headhunter said:
Quote:
You really dont know what pot smoking is like, do you? From what you wrote, you sound like you could have been in "Reefer Madness"
Not sure why you don't get it. Are you saying there is no chance that a player would maybe blow a bone in his car before walking into the locker room? Especially if weed was not on the list of banned substances? Are you saying that weed would not impair a player's ability at all? Do you want the guys you are rooting for to be high in the meeting room during the week? I am not saying everyone. 2 or 3 players. That is not something to be concerned about?
Let me position it this way. You have to take a piss test and sometimes a blood test for MANY jobs out there. The only reason why ALL employer's don't do it is costs. Now, when you consider how much money these guys make....
Pot is the opposite of a PED. If they use it at inopportune times then it will affect their performance on the field. Probably won't mess up their lives but it will not help their professional football careers.
Having said that, it could be used as an actual pain management technique in the offseason, if it were legal. These ain't steroids or testosterone or growth hormones. Doesn't make Hill less stupid however.
This individual should have been cut long ago. Think about how many chances he has had. Remember, those chances go all the way back to his college days. He was a burden and a risk. He could not give a shit about his team or the fans. Now hopefully, he will get a huge suspension and no one signs him. Ever. I am embarrassed for this great organization that they let him hang on this long.
This individual should have been cut long ago. Think about how many chances he has had. Remember, those chances go all the way back to his college days. He was a burden and a risk. He could not give a shit about his team or the fans. Now hopefully, he will get a huge suspension and no one signs him. Ever. I am embarrassed for this great organization that they let him hang on this long.
Holy spin control Batman! This isn't good news in any way, shape, or form. Hill was one of, if not the best, performer on the D last year. So they lose an impact player, creating yet another hole that will need to be filled. But that's a good thing. Right on.
There's not a single positive thing about this, including your played out platitudes about "this great organization". The Giants moral superiority only exists in the minds of some of their fans.
As for Will Hill...You stupid, stupid, stupid, STUPID sonofabitch...You were *right there*...keep your nose clean and not only are you a fan favorite in the biggest sports market in the GD world, but you're probably going to the Pro Bowl or at least have a true breakout season in a contract year. Just find another way to chill and you cash in as a FA, either here or somewhere else. But that's out the window now. He's not even gonna be able to afford the sour anymore. #regs
He's a stupid selfish cocksucker whose addiction just hurt our defense.....unless he somehow wins an appeal on some bogus technicality. Put the fucking pipe down for a few years there will be plenty of opportunities to blaze up when your career is over. What an idiot.
Will Hill has a lifestyle that has afforded an NFL career. The lifestyle includes recreational drug use. It is not abuse or the NFL career would not have been realized.
Lawrence Taylor didn't abuse drugs?
Quite frankly, I wouldn't approve of Taylor's abuse if it happened today all the same.
When you start ignoring your own player's negative vices, yet you crack on other team's players, it's being a tad bit hypocritical, no?
You say that you wouldn't approve of LT's abuse, but you don't say if you would have kicked him off the team, which takes this to a whole different level.
Consider that probably a majority of Hill's teammates probably smoke dope, that it's probably less dangerous than alcohol, and that it's on its way to becoming legal in this country. Legal for health care in some states and more than just health care in other states.
If you want to say that he should have stopped smoking it when it was endangering his family and his career, I can't argue with that. But if you haven't found out yet how hard it is to kick bad habits yet, someday you probably will.
You got smokers hacking their brains out and they try to stop and they can't and they try again and they still can't. Just read a bio of Karen Carpenter. This girl had everything in the world going her away and she starved herself to death. She had the best treatment, understood (finally) what she was doing to herself and swore to her family she would stop taking laxatives and diuretics. But she couldn't keep those promises and she killed herself.
The guy has an incredible amount of talent. He's also been busted too many times and he was also behind on child support payments. Enough crap. Cut the guy and move on.. SAD....
issue, perhaps coupled with a bit of depression and post traumatic stress. hey, just throw some benzodiazepines like Valium, Ativan and Xanax at him and he'll be far better off than if he were to just keep smoking weed.. /sarcasm..
Same. I had been under the assumption that a suspension was forthcoming anyway. I thought i had read that around the end of the season maybe a little before, thought it had to do with his arrest, I remember reading about the pot smell in the car and speculation that he was going to be tested thereafter and expected to fail.Not a big suprise to me and was under the assumption that it was kind of common knowledge, based on widespread speculation after his last arrest. I guess the actual facts aren't coming out till now, or it may be a whole separate instance, I dunno, but I thought he was gonna get suspended not based on a lack of faith in the guy but just that I thought this was already out there.
As for Hill himself, I don't know what to say.Such a shame, and I take no joy in the guy fucking his own life up or the fact we now have yet another hole to fill.
At the end of the day you have to be able to live up to your terms of employ, perform, and represent. He can't represent while suspended, and he certainly isn't doing the other 2.My guess is the Giants will wait till after the draft to cut ties, unless they want to make an example, i hear they are pissed, and while they are usually thoughtful in their moves a knee jerk reaction at this poitn wouldn't suprise me. You know, you fuck up once you talk to the guy. You fuck up twice then you brings your freinds and the rest of the village and talk to the guy. You do it again and you turn your back and wipe the dust from your feet and walk away. I fear that's where the Giants are with Hill right now, I'm not even sure they can keep him if they want to, whilst rebuilding the team with so many new faces and trying to establish their culture and order on all these guys. What kind of example does it set to keep him? Is that even a good thing?
Still you hate to turn your back on a guy who you know may c9me back to bite you in the ass. He will be suspended, it will end, he will play again for someone and probably at a very high level.It's really just a kick in the balls for all concerned.Ugghh.
Will Hill has a lifestyle that has afforded an NFL career. The lifestyle includes recreational drug use. It is not abuse or the NFL career would not have been realized.
Lawrence Taylor didn't abuse drugs?
Lawrence Taylor is a convicted Rapist. He's about one step ahead of hobo.Way to pick an example to make a half-baked point to begin with.
But it doesn't matter if he misses 8 games. The defense and the coordinator is the same as last year. He knows his role. It would be stupid not to keep him around and add him to the mix for the final stretch of the schedule and hopefully a playoff run. Besides, he'd also be insurance against injuries at the position.
At this point you get whatever games you can out of him until his contract expires in 2015 and you let him walk.
Everyone said he was "done if it happens again" the last time. This is the 3rd time now. I'd love for the Giants to give him another shot but to me, it sets a shitty example and more importantly, I'm fairly certain they won't anyway. When you keep betraying the trust of the team that is giving you the opportunity of your life, they're not going to turn the other cheek forever. I (unfortunately) think we've probably seen the last of Hill as a Giant.
I agree, but what a bitter pill if he gets off suspension goes elsewhere stays clean and does what he does on the field. Just aggravating. And stupid. Bottom line, like you said, how can you trust him and can the team afford the message it sends by keeping him with all the new players?
...that the NYG put something in writing the last time this happened that it would be the last time. Not sure their patience with Mr Hill will last any further. Shame if true...he is a good player.
On Mad Dog today, they even speculated that he would most likely be released.
he is a very good player who is playing at close to a Pro Bowl level at this stage of his career. To cut him would be a huge loss, and it's why i think the Giants need to keep him.
Until I hear tne official announcement that Hill is gone, I'm not going to make assumptions about what the Giants are thinking or feeling about Hill.
How do we know both of his priors were weed? We assume Sherman was on roids/enhancers and pulled the adderal line to cover it up. How do we know it is not harder drugs like coke or something?
I don't smoke weed but I don't have a problem with it. But if the rules of your job say not to do it, don't do it. I get drug tested at my job and I make a fraction of will hills salary. No one is forcing will hill to play in the NFL.
I believe the guy is also accused of being a dead beat dad. Cut him if he fails the appeal.
No, the major issue isn't that it's pot. It's that he can't exert some discipline and self control and has now been busted three times. It's the inability to fall in line when you know full well you're on a short leash and your career may be on the line. That's far more concerning than smoking pot.
don't remember him out of position or missing tackles, seemed pretty disciplined to me
If that was all that mattered would he have gone undrafted? Youre not this dumb. Intent on arguing, but not dumb. For the record I don't want him cut, but it's really stupid and yes, undisciplined.
No, the major issue isn't that it's pot. It's that he can't exert some discipline and self control and has now been busted three times. It's the inability to fall in line when you know full well you're on a short leash and your career may be on the line. That's far more concerning than smoking pot.
just because i listed it first doesn't mean it's necessarily the most serious issue. but it's quite annoying you have to admit. it's not crack, it's not meth, it's marijuana. cmon....
He's easily one of our 3 best defensive players. I'm cautiously optimistic about Stevie Brown, I hope he can prove that his 8 picks the last year he played was no fluke. We need him to step up more than ever. I hope Cooper Taylor made serious strides this offseason.
discipline. I'm no doctor but it may be a deep seeded issue more than deciding to do something that is wrong. Maybe he just wants to get high, but I think it runs deeper. If it is a psychological problem and smoking pot is a by product, then they should get him help just like anyone else that is having problems.
discipline. I'm no doctor but it may be a deep seeded issue more than deciding to do something that is wrong. Maybe he just wants to get high, but I think it runs deeper. If it is a psychological problem and smoking pot is a by product, then they should get him help just like anyone else that is having problems.
This is what my thought is.. while Giants fans are upset because it causes issues for the team.. this guy might have some real issues that need therapy..
No, the major issue isn't that it's pot. It's that he can't exert some discipline and self control and has now been busted three times. It's the inability to fall in line when you know full well you're on a short leash and your career may be on the line. That's far more concerning than smoking pot.
just because i listed it first doesn't mean it's necessarily the most serious issue. but it's quite annoying you have to admit. it's not crack, it's not meth, it's marijuana. cmon....
Aaaand the fact that his word is for shit is irrelevant?
The Rangers won a huge playoff game tonight, it's April and not even remotely close to football season and yet this still put a massive damper on my day.
Such a big fan of Hill's talent.. as someone who is just about 30, I really can't recall a Giants safety with the athleticism and dynamic overall ability that Hill showed since I've been a fan. To step right in and be a factor like he was... it was awesome to watch. This just sucks big time. The idea of he and 'Trel together back there from the get going into next season was so exciting. Big time blow.
He's too good. Fuck it. I don't care what kind of message it sends. He's a moron clearly, but I'd rather him be our moron than let some other team get him and reap the benefits.
I don't see that in any of the online articles. In any event, I am pretty sure the Giants will cut him. He sounds like someone who may be at high risk for this happening yet again. Too bad.
him or not because of my selfishness as a Giant fan since Hill played so well last season.
But for Hill to put any "ANY TYPE of unusual substance" into his body at this stage of his troubled career is alarming in so many ways. At some point you just have to shake your head and move on without him.
Giant management has a decision that they wish they didn't have to make, but you know its really not a difficult one.
We don't need a player who needs PED but can't get away with it. (let's face it, PED is probably a way of life for a large segment of the NFL populace). What the hell good is a clean player if they don't have what it takes?
recreational is a who cares situation, except that the one who cares is the NFL.
that's why drafting a safety if he's the BPA may not be the worst idea in the world.
Reese is very high on Taylor. Remember Demps is on the roster too. More needs than Safety right now.
i'd be pretty surprised if they went safety in either of the first 2 rounds
well the Demps signing and the resigning of Brown look better and better...have to wonder if the Giants new when they signed Demps..
He's finished. What a shame
I was one of his biggest fans before this last incident, but I am all for the Giants cutting bait with this guy. Cant teach stupid.
He had to have known this and still chose to test fate.
Link - ( New Window )
I mean you're a millionaire living the life and playing sports for a living, grow up.
In training camp, you can match him up with Michael Cox and get that anticipated- Dix drills Cox in the hole.
Advantage...less if anything.
Its almost legal .
Shouldn't be banned.
Meanwhile guys are taking
Growth hormones they cant
Trace.
If this is Will Hill's 2nd "Stage 2" second failure to comply then he is facing a 6 game suspension. First failure to comply is 4 games which he got last year.
Link - ( New Window )
Advantage...less if anything.
Its almost legal .
Shouldn't be banned.
Meanwhile guys are taking
Growth hormones they cant
Trace.
There is no defense. Whether it gives him an advantage or not is completely irrelevant. It's a rule and he knows the consequences of breaking those rules. He had already been suspended twice and was on a short leash and clearly doesn't give a shit about anyone but himself (and even that can be questioned now that he has jeopardized his career). This guy is one of the dumbest people on the planet and there is no reasonable 'defense.'
Cooper Taylor was going to be cut? Ummm, no he wasn't.
It's amazing how clueless some of you really are when it comes to football and the Giants.
Quote:
EARLY in this draft. I think Pryor and Clinton Dix are legit possibilities at 12 overall.
Reese is very high on Taylor. Remember Demps is on the roster too. More needs than Safety right now.
Agreed. I don't think this puts safety in the mix at #12. We're still pretty solid there, with Rolle, Brown, Demps, and Taylor. But we need to get rid of Hill. We took a chance. It didn't work out. Time to abandon the project. It's disruptive at this point. Cohesion and chemistry are of primary importance to any sports team, but especially one like the Giants with a new OC and so many new players. Hill is threatening that fragile teamwork, and should therefore be cut. The Giants have already been more than patient with him.
shit just doesn't make sense.
Link - ( New Window )
There was an article about it and the following line applies to Hill
“As big a fine as he had to pay the last time, I said, ‘For a dime a day, let’s call him up,’ ” Diana Dixon told The Post from the family home in Florida. “There are so many young men who would love to have the opportunity he does that we didn’t want to see him mess it up.”
Will Hill is messing up his opportunity. The Giants are not going to wait on a guy who misses 25-40% of the season on suspensions, and it's been made clear he's on a short leash. It's a shame because this guy has legit Pro Bowl talent back at safety. But at some point you need to cut the cord and move on.
http://nypost.com/2000/12/29/dixon-heeds-wake-up-call-parents-get-giant-going/ - ( New Window )
They're not mutually exclusive..
I'm gonna wait and see what actually happens here but if he fucked up again that's a huge blow to this defense. He completely changed what we were able to do on the field.
Fuck.
and weed is legal in some states now, (Seattle), Den, CA so you have to wonder if the league needs to change the policy at this point
What is scary, is look at the S's and CB's on this roster, that are signed AFTER this season.....
Wait, I mean HaHa!
Can you imagine holding a million dollars in one hand, and a joint in the other, and asking him "which one do you want?" And he takes the joint.
Glad to see Ron turned out to have a successful career away from football though.
That said- Will Hill has even more talent, and even less of a brain
I know nothing about the players available, but I wouldn't complain about spending #12 on a Safety if the Giants are convinced that he can be a high-level starter for 4 or 5 years.
Very good player, I'd still stash him on the suspended list, they don't pay him, and it gives them an option down the road.
Yeah, Hill needs a strong mentor/veteran who is willing to take him under his wing and keep him on the straight and narrow. plenty of time to partake in fun when your playing career is over.
I already factored in taking a safety in my mocks 5th round.
Yeah, Hill needs a strong mentor/veteran who is willing to take him under his wing and keep him on the straight and narrow. plenty of time to partake in fun when your playing career is over.
There comes a point where a knucklehead is a knucklehead. The Giants have one of the better "life-coach" systems in place with Jesse Armstead and Charles Way. And Antrel Rolle is to be considered a veteran leader. In the end, Will Hill is still making the choice.
Yeah the focus needs to be offensive heavy - though getting a DT would be ideal some time.
Now, though, Safety may be necessary due to Rolle, Demps, and Brown on short deals.
"Marijuana is not addictive." BBI
With that being said, enough with the weed testing. Really, who gives a shit about people smoking pot? I can see testing for steroids and growth hormone or even more illicit drugs but pot is now legal in a few states and will be in more soon. It doesn't give players any advantage and as long as you aren't smoking trash bags of the stuff it really isn't that bad for you. Perhaps even changing the rules to only ban it's use during the season. Let guys enjoy their offseason.
as far as i know, the NFL's policy on alcohol is that you can drink however much you want if you're over 21, but if you have a history of alcohol ABUSE, then you enter into the league's substance abuse program and you must stay sober until you're out of the program.
so, if the league's policy on weed mirrored that of alcohol, Hill would still be in trouble because he was already in the substance abuse program at this point.
that would actually be a step in the right direction for the league, but still not far enough in my opinion. weed has medicinal properties that can actually help players avoid opiate addiction and deal with chronic pain stemming from playing injuries, whereas alcohol doesn't and can do more damage.
still beyond disappointing, esp if he only had to keep it clean for 4 months.. just switch to booze for that period..
I mean, everyone copes with stress. Your stress coping method can't be something that gets you suspended from your job.
Can't argue with that. And to be clear, I am not defending Hill. I agree with Davisian - Hill is a moron AND the league needs to modernize.
Most of us love the guy, but for his own good, if he chooses, I hope its 8 or 16.
He has NO excuse,and NO defense;he had to have had things spelled out to him both times by the league office, and JR had to have drilled hope that point as well; Those rules are the rules until the rules change.
It'll either slap some sense into him, or he gets busted for dealing in the next year or two.
On a Giants football note, do you think the Giants were hedging bets On The Thrill with their signings this offseason, or, maybe even knew something? This could F'up the draft priorities for them(any good unsigned S still out there?).
I certainly hope Mr Thurmond is paying a whole lot of attention.
Yeah, Hill needs a strong mentor/veteran who is willing to take him under his wing and keep him on the straight and narrow. plenty of time to partake in fun when your playing career is over.
if it holds up it could be a whole season. he's going to appeal it and I suppose it could be cut, not sure of those rules.I also read where this could be related to a Dec arrest. if thats the case then they knew about this going into FA.
Uh, yeah, I'd say that's pretty bad.
Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/giants/hill-giants-drug-suspension-looms-blog-entry-1.1764559#ixzz2zcnqMCeW
http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/giants/hill-giants-drug-suspension-looms-blog-entry-1.1764559 - ( New Window )
Will hill is more than likely gone, and rolle, Stevie, and demps are free agents next year
Yes, depending on where he is in the drug program, which is somewhat guarded information.
Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/giants/hill-giants-drug-suspension-looms-blog-entry-1.1764559#ixzz2zcnqMCeW http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/giants/hill-giants-drug-suspension-looms-blog-entry-1.1764559 - ( New Window )
He should be done. Nobody is equating weed to something much more serious, but it never ends with Hill, and apparently never will.
Will hill is more than likely gone, and rolle, Stevie, and demps are free agents next year
I need to watch more videos but I just watched Clinton-Dix against Auburn and I want no parts of that. One thing I LOVE about Will Hill is he is very decisive and rarely pulls up when closing in for the tackle. It was only one game, but what jumped out to me was how hesitant Clinton-Dix looked at times again the run.
NY Daily News - ( New Window )
He's so talented though, this fucking sucks. He showed All Pro potential last year and was arguably the best player on the defense. Our "elite" secondary looks a lot weaker now.
Just really disappointing news. Can't believe Hill is this stupid.
Quote:
and how it helps him cope with stress. It's easy to jump on the guy because we're all frustrated and tantalized by his talent, but it may not be as simple as some guy who just likes to get high with his buddies and eat potato chips. Link - ( New Window )
I mean, everyone copes with stress. Your stress coping method can't be something that gets you suspended from your job.
Sure it can. Find a new coping method or find a new job. Pretty simple.
I hope that it's just a misunderstanding somehow, but jeez louis...
Advantage...less if anything.
Its almost legal .
Shouldn't be banned.
Meanwhile guys are taking
Growth hormones they cant
Trace.
100% correct
No sympathy for this guy whatsoever. Hope he gets his crap together but there's no defense for this, his third suspension.
It's about responsibility and loyalty. Two things Will Hill has shown very little of over his football career.
Advantage...less if anything.
Its almost legal .
Shouldn't be banned.
Meanwhile guys are taking
Growth hormones they cant
Trace.
Not every rule is in place to protect a level playing field for the athletes. Some rules are in place because the NFL (or any employer)wants it's employees to represent their company a certain way. That's their right as an employer. If you take the money, you're accepting their terms of employment.
Per Hill, last time he spoke with Mara, Tisch, Reese, Coughlin, Fewell, Rolle and Tuck. Assuring each that this was behind him. I don't know how you show up at the facility without feeling a great deal of shame.
Yes because Taylor has played enough for that assessment, give the guy a chance he has potential.
ugh.
Quote:
Cooper Taylor.. yay. Hill is about 50x the player Taylor is. What a massive fucking downgrade. Worst possible news. This sucks.
Yes because Taylor has played enough for that assessment, give the guy a chance he has potential.
Taylor is not nearly as talented as Hill. Never was. If you're waiting for Taylor to ever flash the ability Hill did last year (and even before that), I wouldn't hold my breath because you'll be waiting forever. Hill looked like a player from the moment he took the field. Taylor has yet to show much of anything.
It is one of the most ridiculous rampant chatter on this site. Hey let's cut Rolle, he is our most dependable defender, pro bowler, leader and doesn't miss games. Yeah let's cut him so we throw money at a couple potential FA busts. Apparently 31 is now ancient in the NFL.
I knew a guy who a few years ago had an absolute dream job lined up with the Feds. 6 figures, crazy benefits, job security. He was all but hired, and just had to pass a drug test. However he loved weed more than anything and would not stop smoking it. So finally a day before the drug test he starts freaking out, chugs one of those stupid drinks. He fails hard of course and loses the opportunity.
He then emails the org over and over pleading "give me another chance" and "the test malfunctioned" etc etc. They're like "dude, you need to stop contacting us now" which is apparently what the Giants will soon tell this fucking bonehead.
Seems a little hypocritical to me..
Seems a little hypocritical to me..
not at all hypocritical. playing in the NFL is a privilege, not a right. if he has a legitimate substance abuse problem then that sucks for him, but that doesn't make him any less of an idiot for blowing his playing career and potentially millions of dollars over weed. he's still making a choice to light up, and it's certainly an easier choice than for people who have addictions to other things like heroin.
Seems a little hypocritical to me..
How many strikes before it's okay to call a player out on the carpet? 5?
Fucking dummy.
Yeah, definitely no big loss. Only one of the most talented players on the entire defense and a starting safety.
Stanley being Stanley..
And the Giants have gone to very admirable lengths to help him, even paying for his attendance at rehab, and supporting him through the process with patience and understanding. But, where exactly is the line where it's fair to criticise if not now?
From what I'm told, Will Hill is NOT facing a year-long suspension, so it would then be in the 6-8-game range, depending on the specifics.
Quote:
In comment 11631791 arcarsenal said:
Taylor has potential and was hurt last year to early to judge him is all I'm saying. Obviously Hill is much more proven at this point but hill wasn't even drafted and was cut by the redskins he wasn't an instant star either.
Quote:
Cooper Taylor.. yay. Hill is about 50x the player Taylor is. What a massive fucking downgrade. Worst possible news. This sucks.
Yes because Taylor has played enough for that assessment, give the guy a chance he has potential.
Taylor is not nearly as talented as Hill. Never was. If you're waiting for Taylor to ever flash the ability Hill did last year (and even before that), I wouldn't hold my breath because you'll be waiting forever. Hill looked like a player from the moment he took the field. Taylor has yet to show much of anything.
in my opinion, no. some addictions are almost impossible to beat and some just require maturity and/or prioritization. if he is addicted to weed, this one falls in the latter category.
Taylor hasn't had a chance to show anything. He's a rookie. His job was special teams last season, and he did okay.
Good riddance.
Wasn't calling you out.
Really should just be a fine. But, that's not the case.
it could be Adderall, which falls under the nfls PED policy
it could be Adderall, which falls under the nfls PED policy
Great minds think alike.
What a dumb ass he is.
Yeah, that was basically the first thing I said. This isn't looking good but I'm going to wait for the details before I start calling him a scumbag pot head or a loser or whatever else people are calling him. If he did fuck up, it's a major shame and bad on his part. And it looks like he did. But we gotta find out what happened here still.
You won't really get a whole lot more details. He used the Adderall cover up once already.
Problem solvd...move on.
I think that's an overreaction/panic move. We don't know how the Giants felt about Hill prior to this announcement, and it's possible that they were looking at Safeties in this draft anyway, but I don't see them forcing a premium pick just because they might lose Hill, not when they have other, more pressing needs. I think it's more likely that they look for a kid with some CB/S/ST versatility in the middle rounds.
And, as I've said repeatedly, the 2015 UFA Safety market will be very good. The Giants might plan on doing for Safeties next year what they did for CBs this year...shop around.
It would also be very unlike the Giants to throw a troubled guy to the streets. This is a situation where Mara may step in and want to help him on a personal basis (his talent certainly doesn't hurt). Mara stepped in when Coughlin wanted to cut Cruz (obviously a different situation, but he did say this talent isn't going anywhere). We all know him and his father put up with LT as well.
The last thing is if the decision has been made to cut him, it will be done quickly. The Giants don't allow questions like this to hover over them. If it doesn't happen soon, it may show they know more then we do (like last summer, they had all intentions to keep him).
But only a little.
So his life lesson to date is that everything will be alright, not that he has to change his lifestyle. If the Giants have a problem with it, he will move on. And still do well.
So his life lesson to date is that everything will be alright, not that he has to change his lifestyle. If the Giants have a problem with it, he will move on. And still do well.
Here's the caveat: He can be suspended for a full season very soon. And after that, he could probably be booted out of the league. So, if this continues, something will inevitably change. It isn't going to be all right, and he won't continue to do well.
Brock Vereen from Min?
Joyner from Fla St?
Southward from Wis?
3 guys to consider for the Giants. All 3 would add a lot of speed and versatility to DB unit.
What sort of upside down logic is it that anyone can paint a portrait of a young fellow grinning because he got a couple dollars out of an organization, saying "the jokes on them", while a truck full of unrealized money is passing him by, and claiming that it's not substance abuse?
huh? so you're saying it's impossible for an NFL player to have a drug addiction?
Lawrence Taylor didn't abuse drugs?
He's currently our most reliable defender (when he's actually on the field).
You don't cut bait with that with ease, no matter how shitty the situation is.
People can use cliches like "Million dollar talent, 10 cent brain all the want." Let's soak up as much of that talent as possible until the league tells us we can't anymore.
BUT maybe, just maybe this will bring Hill to his knees. I am still somehow hoping we keep him. He is so talented on the field.
that works in the short term - hence my don't cut him now, use him the second half of the season.
Problem is that you can't rely on him. We relied on him for this season, and now he's likely to miss half of it. Do you want to rely on him for next season?
IMO, they're in play now.
I don't agree. Will Hill is tremendously talented, more so than 90% of the players on the roster. If a lesser player decides to indulge in prohibited activity he will learn very quickly that the Giants aren't as forgiving as he once thought.
How can you rely on a player who is serving suspensions every single season?
No one is reliable.
How can you rely on a player who is serving suspensions every single season?
I'm not worried about any messages right now. I'm worried about the 2014 season and losing one of our best players possibly for the entirety of it. As other posters alluded to, A) It might be a year and B) If he fucks up another time, by rule, he might be out of the league (I don't know the exact specifics so excuse me on that, but there is a limit to the amount of times this can happen).
My point being the Giants' message isn't important to me. Hill is done if it happens again. If anyone is going to have his serves between now and that (hopefully non-existent) point, I want it to be us.
yeah sure and it has nothing to do with protecting the owners' investments? Where do you draw the line? Lets say weed is ok. Then what about if a guy tokes up before taking the field? Do you want that shit on your team? What if he is high and doing an interview on TV making a total ass out of himself? You are damn right it is marketing. The league IS marketing. That is how they make their money. Where did you think the dollars came from? without that, there would be no league.
That being said, if someone came up to you and said 'you can't drink alcohol to qualify for this super high paying job,' would you really have a problem stopping? It is just so dumb that this guy can't do this. Without knowing the facts, of course.
Obviously not counting on that miracle.
Not sure why you don't get it. Are you saying there is no chance that a player would maybe blow a bone in his car before walking into the locker room? Especially if weed was not on the list of banned substances? Are you saying that weed would not impair a player's ability at all? Do you want the guys you are rooting for to be high in the meeting room during the week? I am not saying everyone. 2 or 3 players. That is not something to be concerned about?
Let me position it this way. You have to take a piss test and sometimes a blood test for MANY jobs out there. The only reason why ALL employer's don't do it is costs. Now, when you consider how much money these guys make....
That being said, if someone came up to you and said 'you can't drink alcohol to qualify for this super high paying job,' would you really have a problem stopping? It is just so dumb that this guy can't do this. Without knowing the facts, of course.
The difference is that alcohol is legal.
If he's not on the field then I don't care how good he can play. It doesn't matter.
I just don't think Will Hill learns anything from these suspensions.
Yes, you want to send a message to the team but c'mon smoking weed isn't the end of the world.
Would the Cardinals cut Patrick Peterson? Would the Seahawks cut Richard Sherman? Half of the Seahawks have been suspended and they don't cut them.
It's infuriating and frustrating but I'd try to ride this one out.
Unless he's addicted to heroin in which case cut him.
Along the same lines, can he claim he's a Rastafari?
He needs to get creative right about now.
Quote:
Will Hill has a lifestyle that has afforded an NFL career. The lifestyle includes recreational drug use. It is not abuse or the NFL career would not have been realized.
Lawrence Taylor didn't abuse drugs?
Quite frankly, I wouldn't approve of Taylor's abuse if it happened today all the same.
When you start ignoring your own player's negative vices, yet you crack on other team's players, it's being a tad bit hypocritical, no?
Quote:
You really dont know what pot smoking is like, do you? From what you wrote, you sound like you could have been in "Reefer Madness"
Not sure why you don't get it. Are you saying there is no chance that a player would maybe blow a bone in his car before walking into the locker room? Especially if weed was not on the list of banned substances? Are you saying that weed would not impair a player's ability at all? Do you want the guys you are rooting for to be high in the meeting room during the week? I am not saying everyone. 2 or 3 players. That is not something to be concerned about?
Let me position it this way. You have to take a piss test and sometimes a blood test for MANY jobs out there. The only reason why ALL employer's don't do it is costs. Now, when you consider how much money these guys make....
Having said that, it could be used as an actual pain management technique in the offseason, if it were legal. These ain't steroids or testosterone or growth hormones. Doesn't make Hill less stupid however.
Holy spin control Batman! This isn't good news in any way, shape, or form. Hill was one of, if not the best, performer on the D last year. So they lose an impact player, creating yet another hole that will need to be filled. But that's a good thing. Right on.
There's not a single positive thing about this, including your played out platitudes about "this great organization". The Giants moral superiority only exists in the minds of some of their fans.
As for Will Hill...You stupid, stupid, stupid, STUPID sonofabitch...You were *right there*...keep your nose clean and not only are you a fan favorite in the biggest sports market in the GD world, but you're probably going to the Pro Bowl or at least have a true breakout season in a contract year. Just find another way to chill and you cash in as a FA, either here or somewhere else. But that's out the window now. He's not even gonna be able to afford the sour anymore. #regs
Quote:
In comment 11632158 WideRight said:
Quote:
Will Hill has a lifestyle that has afforded an NFL career. The lifestyle includes recreational drug use. It is not abuse or the NFL career would not have been realized.
Lawrence Taylor didn't abuse drugs?
Quite frankly, I wouldn't approve of Taylor's abuse if it happened today all the same.
When you start ignoring your own player's negative vices, yet you crack on other team's players, it's being a tad bit hypocritical, no?
You say that you wouldn't approve of LT's abuse, but you don't say if you would have kicked him off the team, which takes this to a whole different level.
Consider that probably a majority of Hill's teammates probably smoke dope, that it's probably less dangerous than alcohol, and that it's on its way to becoming legal in this country. Legal for health care in some states and more than just health care in other states.
If you want to say that he should have stopped smoking it when it was endangering his family and his career, I can't argue with that. But if you haven't found out yet how hard it is to kick bad habits yet, someday you probably will.
You got smokers hacking their brains out and they try to stop and they can't and they try again and they still can't. Just read a bio of Karen Carpenter. This girl had everything in the world going her away and she starved herself to death. She had the best treatment, understood (finally) what she was doing to herself and swore to her family she would stop taking laxatives and diuretics. But she couldn't keep those promises and she killed herself.
...slip sliding awayay...
...ya know the nearer to your destination the nearer you're slip sliding away.
But only a little.
As for Hill himself, I don't know what to say.Such a shame, and I take no joy in the guy fucking his own life up or the fact we now have yet another hole to fill.
At the end of the day you have to be able to live up to your terms of employ, perform, and represent. He can't represent while suspended, and he certainly isn't doing the other 2.My guess is the Giants will wait till after the draft to cut ties, unless they want to make an example, i hear they are pissed, and while they are usually thoughtful in their moves a knee jerk reaction at this poitn wouldn't suprise me. You know, you fuck up once you talk to the guy. You fuck up twice then you brings your freinds and the rest of the village and talk to the guy. You do it again and you turn your back and wipe the dust from your feet and walk away. I fear that's where the Giants are with Hill right now, I'm not even sure they can keep him if they want to, whilst rebuilding the team with so many new faces and trying to establish their culture and order on all these guys. What kind of example does it set to keep him? Is that even a good thing?
Still you hate to turn your back on a guy who you know may c9me back to bite you in the ass. He will be suspended, it will end, he will play again for someone and probably at a very high level.It's really just a kick in the balls for all concerned.Ugghh.
Quote:
Will Hill has a lifestyle that has afforded an NFL career. The lifestyle includes recreational drug use. It is not abuse or the NFL career would not have been realized.
Lawrence Taylor didn't abuse drugs?
Lawrence Taylor is a convicted Rapist. He's about one step ahead of hobo.Way to pick an example to make a half-baked point to begin with.
But it doesn't matter if he misses 8 games. The defense and the coordinator is the same as last year. He knows his role. It would be stupid not to keep him around and add him to the mix for the final stretch of the schedule and hopefully a playoff run. Besides, he'd also be insurance against injuries at the position.
At this point you get whatever games you can out of him until his contract expires in 2015 and you let him walk.
I agree, but what a bitter pill if he gets off suspension goes elsewhere stays clean and does what he does on the field. Just aggravating. And stupid. Bottom line, like you said, how can you trust him and can the team afford the message it sends by keeping him with all the new players?
On Mad Dog today, they even speculated that he would most likely be released.
cause we going all the way
Until I hear tne official announcement that Hill is gone, I'm not going to make assumptions about what the Giants are thinking or feeling about Hill.
2). Great player with all the potential in the world throwing it away... He knew what he was signing up for.
3). The NFL not having a damn spine when it comes to this issue.
4). The anti-pot crowd here. You just sound fucking ridiculous.
I don't smoke weed but I don't have a problem with it. But if the rules of your job say not to do it, don't do it. I get drug tested at my job and I make a fraction of will hills salary. No one is forcing will hill to play in the NFL.
I believe the guy is also accused of being a dead beat dad. Cut him if he fails the appeal.
If that was all that mattered would he have gone undrafted? Youre not this dumb. Intent on arguing, but not dumb. For the record I don't want him cut, but it's really stupid and yes, undisciplined.
just because i listed it first doesn't mean it's necessarily the most serious issue. but it's quite annoying you have to admit. it's not crack, it's not meth, it's marijuana. cmon....
He's a great player, but he has hurt this team three years running now.
This is what my thought is.. while Giants fans are upset because it causes issues for the team.. this guy might have some real issues that need therapy..
2). Great player with all the potential in the world throwing it away... He knew what he was signing up for.
3). The NFL not having a damn spine when it comes to this issue.
4). The anti-pot crowd here. You just sound fucking ridiculous.
+1!
Quote:
No, the major issue isn't that it's pot. It's that he can't exert some discipline and self control and has now been busted three times. It's the inability to fall in line when you know full well you're on a short leash and your career may be on the line. That's far more concerning than smoking pot.
just because i listed it first doesn't mean it's necessarily the most serious issue. but it's quite annoying you have to admit. it's not crack, it's not meth, it's marijuana. cmon....
Such a big fan of Hill's talent.. as someone who is just about 30, I really can't recall a Giants safety with the athleticism and dynamic overall ability that Hill showed since I've been a fan. To step right in and be a factor like he was... it was awesome to watch. This just sucks big time. The idea of he and 'Trel together back there from the get going into next season was so exciting. Big time blow.
They sent him to spend time at a clinic. That excuse, combined with his pattern of behavior, doesn't fly.
He's going to get suspeneded again.
But for Hill to put any "ANY TYPE of unusual substance" into his body at this stage of his troubled career is alarming in so many ways. At some point you just have to shake your head and move on without him.
Giant management has a decision that they wish they didn't have to make, but you know its really not a difficult one.
He's not very good at concealing his PED.
He has 'recreational' drug problems.
We don't need a player who needs PED but can't get away with it. (let's face it, PED is probably a way of life for a large segment of the NFL populace). What the hell good is a clean player if they don't have what it takes?
recreational is a who cares situation, except that the one who cares is the NFL.