Raanan NJ.com: NYG prefer Martin to Lewan; cooled on Ebron

Please tell that they are all over Donald like white on rice if he is there at 12

I would much rather have Martin in round 1 and Niklas in round 2 rather than Ebron in the first and an OL in the 2nd.

would have been a perfect smokescreen for teams like the Jets/Cardinals/Packers to want to trade up before the Giants, wished they had pulled this card

recent slide making him a remote possibility at #12, I wonder what would Reese's preference be between Matthews and Martin...with the obvious consensus screaming for the kid with the bloodlines

I have fallen off the Ebron bandwagon. The more I watch of him the more I don't like.

With respect to Martin and Lewan, I think if people truly watch both players they will come away more impressed with Martin. Lewan has the measureables and reputation but I do not think his play backs up his reputation as a nasty player. Martin is.

but I don't know how you have Mike Evans and Odell Beckham on that list without Brandin Cooks.

In comment 11643563 CromartiesKid21 said:

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would have been a perfect smokescreen for teams like the Jets/Cardinals/Packers to want to trade up before the Giants, wished they had pulled this card

But indicating we are cooling on Ebron could make teams like Buffalo or Detroit go in a different direction thinking that the Giants won't be taking a TE and if we do like Ebron (who I personally am not a fan of) he is there at #12

.

...the pick will be Zach or HaHa. I can't envision a scenerio where both would be gone in the top 11. Mathews is unlikely to fall. So 1 or 3 on that list...HaHa would surprise me.

Remember, there is no upside, whatsoever, of letting other teams know what you generally think about a position or a player prior to the Draft.

I've said for some time that 12 was too high. I see him going in the bottom third of the 1st and timing couldn't be worse for him because Austin Sefarian Jenkins, who I'd rather have at TE is on the way back up as he gets healthier from his surgery. Word is that he ran a 4.56 40 at a Jets private workout yesterday at 271 pounds. He also has better hands and clearly a better blocker with the ability to be the best in this class.

In comment 11643575 Jimmy Googs said:

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Remember, there is no upside, whatsoever, of letting other teams know what you generally think about a position or a player prior to the Draft.

Exactly. Unless there is a moron in the Giants organization, every piece of information leaked about the Giants "preferences" about prospects is intentionally leaked for a reason.

but I'd certainly be happy with Martin over Lewan.

it's all smoke.

people are guessing. it might be martin, it might be one of those ten, or it might not be any of them.

if the giants are honestly leaking info about who they "like", shame on them.

I've heard Martin's name for some time as a target, and it's likely Raanan's source is Mike G, which bodes well for the info.

While that is correct, I suspect the info is sourced not from NYG brass, fwiw.

but I wouldn't be surprised if that's an accurate list. I would think their experience with Shockey has to have some effect when considering a TE that high with diva qualities...especially one who has noted issues with dropping passes due to concentration lapses. I'm also not convinced they've given up on Robinson as the kid did have a decent training camp and Pope suggested he had finally seen the light, then he got injured.

on both counts. Still would prefer Donald to Martin, but would be quite happy with a Martin pick.

luck out on Nicklas in Round 2 and it's a good start

In comment 11643592 JonC said:

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I've heard Martin's name for some time as a target, and it's likely Raanan's source is Mike G, which bodes well for the info.

the Giants are not sharing any information about who they want in their drafts with Mike Garafolo. Are you kidding me?

it's smoke...and the Giants have been loose-lipped on the players they like for well over a decade. It got better after Accorsi left, but the press still gets wind of who they like (everyone knew they liked Shockey and Nicks for example).

In comment 11643592 JonC said:

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I've heard Martin's name for some time as a target, and it's likely Raanan's source is Mike G, which bodes well for the info.

But that was the whole point of my thread last week that was dissed.

Totally reasonable to think Giants are interested in Martin among many interests. So you package up a bunch of names of interest that shock NO ONE with some other names of non-interest and release it somehow to the media. Who cares, as the overall list doesn't help anybody...

go from, "he'd be a very good pick, but not at 12" to "I suspect he's our pick at 12." Gotta love this board..:)

...of being clued into what the Giants draft preference is as we do.

The reason 'everyone around the league' knows the Giants are extremely high on Zack Martin is a simple one, he's a Justin Pugh clone, we don't need to be Sherlock Holmes to see that. The question you have to ask when analyzing that is...if Eric Fisher was available in last years draft would Pugh still have been the pick? Because in this class Fisher translates into Lewan.

As far as Ranaan making a 'Giants' value board based on what he hears from inside the war room??? is he claiming someone inside the organization is feeding him legit info? Anyone buy that for a second? Just say the truth, it's who he thinks the Giants covet. Every poster on BBI can write up their version and it's as valid as his.

you (Eric) knew about David Wilson half an hour before the pick, and some of the guys we've missed out on management has more or less confirmed that they liked.

In comment 11643594 JonC said:

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While that is correct, I suspect the info is sourced not from NYG brass, fwiw.

Then it really has no basis...

Martin. Solid prospect who offers us versatility.

They liked Pugh last year and Martin is supposed to be better than Pugh.. plus Martin is solid. 50 plus starts on the OL bodes well for durability.

You're talking about NYG brass ... the info likely didn't come from them, think about whom would have access to this info and might share with a beat writer they trust to an extent.

believed to be the pick by many especially after he made that visit to the Giants right before the draft. Garafolo picked that one I believe.

In comment 11643613 raever said:

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...of being clued into what the Giants draft preference is as we do. The reason 'everyone around the league' knows the Giants are extremely high on Zack Martin is a simple one, he's a Justin Pugh clone, we don't need to be Sherlock Holmes to see that. The question you have to ask when analyzing that is...if Eric Fisher was available in last years draft would Pugh still have been the pick? Because in this class Fisher translates into Lewan. Everything I've read suggests that Martin is a considerably better than Pugh, and that's not a knock on Justin. Similar height, sure. As far as Ranaan making a 'Giants' value board based on what he hears from inside the war room??? is he claiming someone inside the organization is feeding him legit info? Anyone buy that for a second? Just say the truth, it's who he thinks the Giants covet. Every poster on BBI can write up their version and it's as valid as his.

it isn't perfect, and these situations are always fluid.

too much Diva in him.. I dont see him as the next Vernon Davis or Jimmy Graham.... I see him being called SHEbron a lot in NY..

I can a stud wr.....dt or ol.....but safety would be odd....is haha that good?

Matthew would be great...Martin would be ok....but prefer Donald

....in quite some time. Is The Rug back as a consultant or something? WTF!!

Martin is not even close to being a Pugh clone. He's more talented and plays nastier. Most pro personnel people are comparing him to Logan Mankins.

In comment 11643619 JonC said:

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You're talking about NYG brass ... the info likely didn't come from them, think about whom would have access to this info and might share with a beat writer they trust to an extent.

Jon - none of us know if it came from them or not, or if the brass told one of their insiders to do a little talking and the Raanan ran with that and added a few other names that he "heard on the street" for which I can surmise might as well be BBI or the NFLN.

The list shocks nobody and helps no one other than Raanan sell papers...

Like to get him in 2...
IMO ...Barr is the best
Guy if there at 1 or Donald.
Barr has LT potential...
He could be what kiwi was
Supposed to be

In comment 11643608 Eric from BBI said:

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it's smoke...and the Giants have been loose-lipped on the players they like for well over a decade. It got better after Accorsi left, but the press still gets wind of who they like (everyone knew they liked Shockey and Nicks for example).

Eric I am curious why do you think that is? Are these beat writers guessing or do you think they have sources within the Giants org.?

Moore and Jpp..unstoppable

need help on the OL. Even though we had other issues, the OL basically ruined our season last year and didn't give us a chance compete.

We also can't afford a bust in the 1st round. Given that, I think Martin is a nice pick at 12. I'd rather ride with a young and physical OL with some questions marks at WR depth, rather than reach for a WR and have an OL injury or two at camp and be right back where we were last year.

can throw a name out there. they're fishing for reactions from the team brass, and if they get some, again, shame on the giants.

they may very well like martin a lot, and no I wouldn't be surprised if they chose him. that does not mean this source is now credible.

and being right about shockey and nicks might be a genuine leak, or it might be blind squirrels finding a nut. who knows. there is no "reveal" of draft boards after it's over to ever know for sure.

if Martin, Beckham Jr., Donald and Barr are all available at 12. Each represents a real need....OL, WR, top pass rusher...very interesting to see which direction they would go. The wild card would be Ha Ha given the Hill situation.

the BBI poll last night...
http://www.bigblueinteractive.com/ - ( New Window )

Suit yourself. I know where the info was likely sourced, of course, anyone with common sense would be able to surmise it could change over the next ten days, or never come to pass in the end.

But, I've heard the last four 1st round picks ahead of the draft and vetted all through Eric, for the record.

until watching some clips on him last night. His speed certainly jumps off the screen...esp at that size.

.

they feel he's a high end 4-3 DE.

If it was Barr, they probably see him as a DE.

in order to guide the perception of their draft picks. There are a bunch of people beating the drum for Lewan and Ebron and if a guy like Martin is taken, you could see a negative outpouring from the fan base. By leaking this info, people have time to adjust to the idea of these players being passed over in favor of Martin.

I can remember when Jeff Lageman was picked by the Jets, the fan base went nuts, yet Lageman was a pretty good player compared to guys the fans wanted.

When Luke Petitgout was picked, fans went nuts because they wanted Aaron Gibson or LJ Shelton, yet Petitgout was better than both.

The front office may not have leaked this info but if they did, I can understand why.

In comment 11643650 Wonderphil11 said:

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if Martin, Beckham Jr., Donald and Barr are all available at 12. Each represents a real need....OL, WR, top pass rusher...very interesting to see which direction they would go. The wild card would be Ha Ha given the Hill situation.

Beckham should be there, no? I think he's at best the 3rd WR, I'd be shocked if 3 WR's went before pick 12.

I think the safety that would tempt them is Pryor more than Dix, but agree safety might be in play now.

In comment 11643655 JonC said:

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Suit yourself. I know where the info was likely sourced, of course, anyone with common sense would be able to surmise it could change over the next ten days, or never come to pass in the end. But, I've heard the last four 1st round picks ahead of the draft and vetted all through Eric, for the record.

Jon - i am not doubting you so don't need to be defensive. Who is the likely source? And what does that mean "you heard" as in the Giants #1 choice if he is there or a guy on a longer list of preferreds?

Also, Eric is really plugged in and is told pre-draft who the Giants will pick if available? That's pretty cool.

Can you give me reasons as to why you think Ebron is a diva? Like some kind of example. Everybody uses that when talking bad about Ebron, but I have asked 3 times now for an example and I have not got one.

I think Martin may be the best OL available at 12 and I do like Martin over Lewin. I am also glad to hear they are not considering Ebron because in my mind he's not the complete TE and therefore not worth pick that high.

I just hope the Oline is addressed with the first pick because all the elite OL guys will be gone by round 2.

In comment 11643673 Eric from BBI said:

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If it was Barr, they probably see him as a DE.

Barr doesn't have the physicality to beat tackles as an end. Bitonio totally shut him out in their matchup. His best fit is as a 3-4 OLB.

but that's hardly high praise.

I like Martin and would be happy if we drafted him. I'd hope, however, that he ended up being closer to a Pro Bowler than a solid starter, given our draft position.

one peep about is barr. and of course that could mean we love him or hate him.

Barr's college coach Jim Mora Jr. (who knows a thing or 2 about pro DEs) said he would pick him #1 overall and reminded him of John Abraham, Demarcus Ware, Pat Swilling and Chris Doleman.

Quote:

Mora has already told a few coaches that Barr has the frame to bulk up and fill a similar role (as Abraham) at the next level. "I do think he could weigh 260 pounds and maintain his speed and quickness, to play defensive end for a 4-3 team. He was our right end in nickel. He didn't feel comfortable going down (with a hand in the ground) and just rushed from a two-point (stance). He'll get better at that." That's the scary part for teams that elect to pass on Barr early in the draft. With scouts frequently talking about how high a prospect's ceiling is, Barr might just have the highest of anybody on the defensive side of the ball.

Mora on AB - ( New Window )

one hears things...

Sometimes you think it must be smoke...and the Giants are playing around to mislead...but that doesn't seem to be the case at times.

But it usually does the bulk of fans no good because you are told, "This is what I know, but you can't say anything." So why say anything at all? I think people want to prove they are plugged in somehow.

Also, the draft is fluid. Prospects who were not supposed to be there are still there, and guys who were supposed to be there are gone.

Last year, well before the Giants picked, I was told, "they are going to draft a RB and it isn't the one you think it is...but you can't tell anyone until right before the pick."

many OL's get named a game MVP? How many are the team captain for two years in a row at a major program like Notre Dame? How many can play virtually any position on the OL?

high character. innate work ethic. freak athlete and frame. all the boxes are checked

the BBI reaction if it is one of the safeties? Sy'56 would be thrilled.

what you guys are saying about Barr, but

a) with all that speed, why couldn't he be a BIG Will LB?

b) in today's NFL, wouldn't a LB with his size/speed combo be ideal to blitz, play some DE on obvious passing downs and even try his hand at covering the Jason Witten's of the world? it seems we get caught up in positions and forget what Seattle reminded us all of, namely to play simple, get 11 fast/aggressive guys and be disruptive

is that a fair point or is this guy not a fit?

Vernon Davis wasn't a complete TE when the 49ers drafted him. He probably wasn't as good a football player as Ebron, but he was a better athlete. He was the 6th overall pick and I don't think anybody would say any different.

Shockey wasn't a complete TE, but prior to injuries he was definitely worth the 14th pick. We might not draft him, but people use terrible reasons to not like him. He isn't a great blocker and a diva. Most college TEs aren't good blockers coming out of college, because they aren't asked to do it much. Doesn't mean he can't be taught.

Because in a 4-3 defense, the LB spends more time dropping than coming forward.

Doesn't mean he can't do it but it would be a waste of talent.

while not quite as gifted, Jeremiah Attachou has some similar qualities

going down the projections to the 5th round range, Prince Shembo also has some similar traits

but on the other hand, we took sintim in the 2nd round and gave O'brien Schofield $8M for 2 years. the schofield interest may've tipped our hand we're in the tweener market again

(you can never have too many tweeners)

Quote:

Last year, well before the Giants picked, I was told, "they are going to draft a RB and it isn't the one you think it is...but you can't tell anyone until right before the pick."

I think you mean two years ago, right? Not last year when Pugh was the selection.

Just a really, really low risk that he's not a very solid player.

I'm not defensive at all, you're mistaken, but I can't say more. Martin is high on the list, and I've heard that from several directions. Pay attention to Phil in LA as well. As the draft draws close I hope to know the pick, Eric very often hears the same info as me at some point.

is the most logical OL choice for this team based on his versatility alone. He provides insurance at OT and OG while getting ready to take over for Snee or Beatty in the future.

I would not be disappointed with him as the pick at all.

and not GM's.

As for what was said....GOOD. Cannot fathom how dumb picking Ebron would be.

JOMO25
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9:41 am : link : reply

Because in a 4-3 defense, the LB spends more time dropping than coming forward.

Doesn't mean he can't do it but it would be a waste of talent.

-->> what if he were a traditional 4-3 WILL on downs 1-2 and on 3rd and long type situations, a guy like Jacquian Williams comes in for Barr and Barr moves to DE for Ayers. Just saying that a little bit of creativity allows this guy to be a disruptive force.

would play what position? LB or DE?

You're still wasting Barr's best skills on two downs.

Testing well doesn't mean he can actually play in space when live bullets are flying.

would have to be blind not to have had Martin as a strong possibility with the 1st pick a few months ago....just makes too much sense

Barr I think he would be wasted as a LB in our system, that relies on the front 4 for pass rushing. I don't mind a safety either in the first round especially since we don't know if Rolle will be back. Brown is on a 1 year deal, I believe, and Hill probably won't last here.

In comment 11643729 Wonderphil11 said:

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would have to be blind not to have had Martin as a strong possibility with the 1st pick a few months ago....just makes too much sense

Exactly. You don't have to be a beat reporter or have connections to know that a guy like Martin would be in play.

while the upside of other players may get a lot of attention, there is just a lot of common sense that would go into a solid versatile O-lineman like Martin, in the biggest problem area that we have now and in the near future.

.

this also. Martin over Lewan makes sense and saying no to a TE @12 in this draft makes sense too.

But have to admit of all the picks probably on the Giants board...Martin is the lowest risk plug and play player...If we were to draft Marin...I see him as a 10-12 year plug and play player and immediate starter...he is probable the next "Snee"

This draft has been way over analyzed so I would expect for the media to have an idea, just like us of whom the Giants will probably end up with. I Would expect Martin but if Matthews did slip I wouldn't be shocked by a move up to 9 or 10. Both guys seem extremely safe and I would be happy with both.

"people want to prove they are plugged in somehow" too.

In comment 11643633 Emlen'sGremlins said:

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Martin is not even close to being a Pugh clone. He's more talented and plays nastier. Most pro personnel people are comparing him to Logan Mankins.

When I see the Pugh reference its not about talent or nastiness. Almost every review says he is more talented than Pugh. When they say clone they are referring to his ability to possibly play anywhere along the offensive line, the fact that he is a technician, the reality is that he doesnt have the prototypical size and measurables (shorter arms) and that he probably has a very low ceiling but a high floor. You could plug him in and he would be a ten year starter..

In comment 11643685 Big Rick in FL said:

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Can you give me reasons as to why you think Ebron is a diva? Like some kind of example. Everybody uses that when talking bad about Ebron, but I have asked 3 times now for an example and I have not got one.

Thats my assessment from seeing the interviews I have seen of him. He is a guy who likes the spotlight. Talks about himself a lot (not his team).. Continually talks about his ability and what a tough mismatch he is.. how there are very few people as athletically gifted as he is.. blah blah blah..

Im not saying thats a BAD thing.. confidence is great and every player should have it.. he just seems like the Diva type of player who wont mesh well in a Coughlin offense where as a TE he better be excited about doing the dirty work and the little things..

You really think the Giants personnel department gives a rats ass about what the fan base's reaction is to their picks?

will be good litmus test.

If they draft Ebron, then they've gotten better at misdirection since everyone early associated them with Ebron and now the scuttlebutt is in the obvious direction.

If they draft Martin, then they still aren't great at hiding their intentions.

opposite (not obvious) direction

the Giants had developed a preference for Martin over Lewan, Matthews, Ebron, etc., why on God's green Earth would they share that preference with a journalist?

all this junk from the media in the lead-up to the draft is just click bait. they know nothing about what the team's internal thought processes are. nothing. these articles carry the same weight as a BBI thread on the merits of picking Aaron Donald.

Thanks!! Don't see that as a diva at all. I haven't heard anything negative about him from teammates or coaches. Haven't heard anything about him talking bad to his QB or arguing with coaches.

Any interview I have seen with him he has seemed very intelligent. When asked about college everything he answered was we. "We got better as the season went on." "We lost to Miami, but we fought until the end" is stuff that I have read. When asked about his Pro Day or why teams should draft him he has stated that he looks better in person then tape or that he can beat people all over the field. That is what he should say IMO. He is trying to sell himself to teams. I appreciate your reply since nobody else has replied to me. Just don't see that as a diva at all.

If you have time or remember what interviews you have seen could you possibly link them? Maybe I'm missing something about him. It would be greatly appreciated. I just see people calling him a diva as they have nothing bad to say about him as a football player so they play the diva card. Thanks if you can link those interviews!

people throw the "diva" term around a little freely nowadays. when i think "diva" i'm thinking of terrell owens - a guy who is going to be a constant distraction from week to week. Ebron is certainly confident in his athleticism (and rightfully so, he's an athletic freak), but i don't see him as causing major distractions if he doesn't get as many looks as he would like. i don't see him throwing his hands up in frustration all the time like Shockey did, for example. i could be wrong on that, but i just don't see it.

what i do see is a mismatch nightmare at TE the likes of which we haven't had on this team in a long time. Eli needs a #1 WR AND a TE and it strikes me that we could potentially kill two birds with one stone by drafting Ebron. i see him as a Jimmy Graham type of receiver. now, that might not necessarily work for a Coughlin offense (block first, catch passes second), but i'm thinking Tom is going to have another of his epiphanies this year and will let McAdoo control most of the offensive scheming. if that's the case, i certainly hope we go into the season with a dynamic, pass catching TE. and there's nobody like that on the roster currently. not even close.

In comment 11643821 Eric from BBI said:

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will be good litmus test. If they draft Ebron, then they've gotten better at misdirection since everyone early associated them with Ebron and now the scuttlebutt is in the obvious direction. If they draft Martin, then they still aren't great at hiding their intentions.

If they draft Martin, then maybe their intentions were fairly transparent anyway...

In comment 11643592 JonC said:

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I've heard Martin's name for some time as a target, and it's likely Raanan's source is Mike G, which bodes well for the info.

You guys are funny. You think I can bring another media member to my boss as a source? Not quite. Love Mike G though. He is a friend. Great guy.

Just wanted you all to know I check out this site often and I enjoy the conversation.

Ban Him!!!!

Not sure why you would use another media member as your source either

In comment 11643842 Big Rick in FL said:

Quote:

If you have time or remember what interviews you have seen could you possibly link them? Maybe I'm missing something about him. It would be greatly appreciated. I just see people calling him a diva as they have nothing bad to say about him as a football player so they play the diva card. Thanks if you can link those interviews!

cant go through every link and interview for the last six weeks.

In comment 11643867 JordanRaanan said:

Quote:

In comment 11643592 JonC said: Quote: I've heard Martin's name for some time as a target, and it's likely Raanan's source is Mike G, which bodes well for the info. Fair enough, Jordan. You guys are funny. You think I can bring another media member to my boss as a source? Not quite. Love Mike G though. He is a friend. Great guy. Just wanted you all to know I check out this site often and I enjoy the conversation.

No, the personnel department doesn't give a rat's ass about fan perception - and they shouldn't - but the public relations and market departments care deeply about fan perception.

That's an insane comparison.

Fair enough, Jordan.

In comment 11643867 JordanRaanan said:

Quote:

In comment 11643592 JonC said: Quote: I've heard Martin's name for some time as a target, and it's likely Raanan's source is Mike G, which bodes well for the info. You guys are funny. You think I can bring another media member to my boss as a source? Not quite. Love Mike G though. He is a friend. Great guy. Just wanted you all to know I check out this site often and I enjoy the conversation.

Jordan -- appreciated all your info during the free agency period. You were really on top of things. Stick around! Your insight is appreciated.

The organization recently allowed their squeaky clean defensive team captain to leave for Oakland while keeping a multiple offender knucklehead like Hill on the roster. Again, PR/Marketing are meaningless when it comes to personnel from an overall organizational perspective.

we haven't seen Ebron on an NFL field yet, so i think dismissing the comparison is a little premature, no? and i certainly didn't mean to suggest that Ebron can replicate Graham's production. i just meant that they're similar types of players. we don't have Drew Brees, after all.

the only apples to apples comparison that we have at the moment is that Jimmy Graham was drafted in the third round and Ebron is being projected to go in the top 20 picks or so.

In comment 11643867 JordanRaanan said:

Quote:

In comment 11643592 JonC said: Quote: I've heard Martin's name for some time as a target, and it's likely Raanan's source is Mike G, which bodes well for the info. You guys are funny. You think I can bring another media member to my boss as a source? Not quite. Love Mike G though. He is a friend. Great guy. Just wanted you all to know I check out this site often and I enjoy the conversation.

Ha! Good for you Jordan.

Giants are probably going QB anyway because that is the only position BBI is not focused on...

Yes I wasn't expecting every single interview. Just maybe the main 2 or 3 that stood out to you? I have read a ton of his interviews and haven't seen anything to call him a diva.

Greg - Who compared him to Graham?

I offered one potential explanation as to why the Giants would spread information/disinformation to beat reporters. It's neither an exhaustive explanation nor is it based on anything I know other than an attempt to explain how and why Ranaan could have gotten this information other than a non-sanctioned leak.

As to the merits of personnel, there was nothing in my post that opined on recent personnel decisions. Take what I wrote for what it is.

If both are there at 12, Martin would be a fine pick, able to play anywhere on the OL and do it right away, less likely than Lewan to thrive at LT (even though he seems able to do well even there), but a potential all-pro at G. So would Lewan, who may be less ready, and seems never to have played at G, but has greater physical gifts than Martin and projects as a way better OT. (I discount his "personal" problems/issues.) Given the immediate needs and continuing uncertainty about the Giants' OL, my guess is that Martin's the choice. Plug and play (and surely that's what we're looking for right now), rookie notwithstanding.

has not yet been written about Hill..The final story on Justin Tuck just about has..Tuck had a few meaningless big games against the Skins..I'm glad that he bought himself some more money. The Giants know what JT has left and were not going to ante up more than the minimum to retain him..In fact, they never made an offer of ANY kind, iirc..

Hill is 7 years younger than Tuck with a far more healthy body. His brain? Not so healthy..The Giants try not to knee-jerk personel decisions if they can possibly help it..

Hill may have played his last snap for us, for all we know..His talent and upside, far greater than JT's at this point, may be worth being patient for, imv

Thanks for joining the conversation.

How do you go about verifying information like this? The public perception of sports journalism is something in between Columbia/Pulitzer journalism and pure speculative rumor-mongering. How do you find the balance?

you have your OTs set for a decade. Draft Travis Swanson or Marcus Martin in the third or fourth and you've got your Center and the most important parts of the OL are solidified.

well, only if you re-sign them in four years. They didn't re-sign Cofield or Joseph and we thought our DTs would be set.

In comment 11643592 JonC said:

Quote:

I've heard Martin's name for some time as a target, and it's likely Raanan's source is Mike G, which bodes well for the info.

Lol, based on what?

Martin being the pick. I just hope its after we trade down 3-5 slots.

In comment 11643867 JordanRaanan said:

Quote:

In comment 11643592 JonC said: Quote: I've heard Martin's name for some time as a target, and it's likely Raanan's source is Mike G, which bodes well for the info. You guys are funny. You think I can bring another media member to my boss as a source? Not quite. Love Mike G though. He is a friend. Great guy. Just wanted you all to know I check out this site often and I enjoy the conversation.

Keep up the great work Jordan. You've been pretty spot on this off-season and the insight and the original content is appreciated

his pick but he is human. Its always nicer to hear cheers than boos. I suspect that when its cheers, at that moment he can care if he wants too. If its a negative reaction from the crowd he can look at TC and chuckle.

I want Martin over Lewan.

In comment 11644026 Eric from BBI said:

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well, only if you re-sign them in four years. They didn't re-sign Cofield or Joseph and we thought our DTs would be set.

Assuming that the picks pan out, I think the organization would put a premium on keeping the OL together given the importance continuity plays in the success of an OL.

he probably immediately fills that joker de/lb position we like to use

no safety in round 1. If you want a safety take on day 3 of draft. Lewan im indifferent

are out.


They have us taking Aaron Donald and Odell Beckham respectively

from what I've read (and it isn't close to everything out there), he may not be able to handle LT...so do you move Pugh over or put Martin at G? if the latter, the 12th pick for a guard?

Questions at LT - whether Beatty will be back healthy
questions at RG - Whether Snee will be able to play

Martin gives you a guy who can play both spots, adds competition to camp, and will take over one of the spots or another one. Lots of flexibility and all the intangibles.

I think the only way they don't pick Martin is if they can get the WR from Texas A&M. But, he'll be long gone.

Hopefully the dolphins don't trade in front of us to grab him.

or Kouandjio.

IMO Pugh can play either.

They're the best 2 players in my opinion.Donald is a risk,but is probably worth it.

I know everyone is going crazy for Zach Martin,but he's a little overrated in my opinion.I'm also picky when it comes to taking offensive lineman.If I'm going to take one with the 12th overall pick,over guys like Gilbert,Mosley,and Donald,than he's gotta be very good.

In comment 11644121 Mike in St. Louis said:

Quote:

from what I've read (and it isn't close to everything out there), he may not be able to handle LT...so do you move Pugh over or put Martin at G? if the latter, the 12th pick for a guard?

Martin can probably handle LT better than Pugh. If Beatty's not ready, I'd play Martin there. Otherwise I'd play him at LG and move Schwartz to RG.

Martin is a solid player but he is not a special OT or OG by any means. He is a top 18-24 talent in this draft since he will never be able to play LT at the NFL level. Martin would also be making the switch to OG a position he would have to learn can we have a player picked at #12 sitting on the bench for most of the year. In this draft at pick #12 if it's an OL he must have to ability to one day move to LT. That's the problem we have with Pugh today he could play OG, OC or RT but he is also not an NFL LT.

Lewan may have some issues but he would play RT from day one and depending on Beatty could play LT next year if not sooner as needed.

.

In comment 11644359 Dragon said:

Quote:

Martin is a solid player but he is not a special OT or OG by any means. He is a top 18-24 talent in this draft since he will never be able to play LT at the NFL level. Martin would also be making the switch to OG a position he would have to learn can we have a player picked at #12 sitting on the bench for most of the year. In this draft at pick #12 if it's an OL he must have to ability to one day move to LT. That's the problem we have with Pugh today he could play OG, OC or RT but he is also not an NFL LT. Lewan may have some issues but he would play RT from day one and depending on Beatty could play LT next year if not sooner as needed.

How can you definitively say that Martin cannot play LT? I know some speculation is that teams might want to play him elsewhere, but I don't see where that is conclusive. And I fail to see anything in the tape I watch of him that leads me to the conclusion that he cannot do the job of a LT in the NFL.

If Diehl could do the job on a line that was one of the NFL's best for quite some time, I think Martin could do at least as well.

Please provide your reasoning - specifically - about what aspect of his play isn't good enough to play LT.

Thanks!

I want a special player. Not a "safe plug and play". Teams drafting in the late 20s take those kinds of players. We were one loss away from picking in the top 10. We should get a top 10 talent.

was LOVE Evans, br really happy to build the lines , thats were we lost games in the last 2 years the LOS

is a special talent. People like to focus on physical attributes but a guy who can develop almost flawless technique while in college is both rare and special.

be fine with Martin at #12. Originally, I thought #12 was too high for Martin, but he is just so solid and good. He has the lowest bust factor of anybody likely to be available at #12, and that is exactly what we need after so many projects.

The only guy I have a problem with on that list is Evans, especially at #4... Like some others here I have some doubts how his game will translate to the NFL; I don't see the quickness and don't see the RAC ability.

Especially interesting and different from other Giants' draft speculation out there is Dix at 3 and Mosley at 8.

Martin #1 must make Phil in LA happy, but Lewan is still on the list at #7!

Don't see him dropping very far at all.

Martin is gone will they take Lewan? I would be surprised if they didn't.

if Lewan is gone as expected.

In comment 11643914 Big Rick in FL said:

Quote:

Yes I wasn't expecting every single interview. Just maybe the main 2 or 3 that stood out to you? I have read a ton of his interviews and haven't seen anything to call him a diva. Greg - Who compared him to Graham?

Rick no offense.. but when I look on the net Im not cataloging where I looked.. when I looked and what site I looked at.. and since im looking at interviews and comments over several devices (phone, tablet... home and work computers).. I cant remember every site.. for every interview.. for EVERY player..

Just look around and see what you can see and form your own opinion..

There have been questions following him around during the scouting process ... does he have the right attitude and focus, will he be professional in his approach, does he play full speed and carry out his duties consistently, does he have the proper work ethic or is he immature, etc. Those types of questions, mixed with info from those who know him and those who seek drama, will lead to diva labels, etc.

You'd have to be biased to choose to quickly dismiss it. Luckily, it's not a job that falls to us.