"Mock drafts that point Martin to the Giants aren't earth-shattering, or surprising, at this point. The pick makes so much sense, it's sort of eerie. The Giants still have an acknowledged need on the offensive line, they have a well-known and admitted love for offensive linemen with versatility and having been burned by some risky picks in recent years they might be inclined to play it safe early in this draft. Martin fits all of those criteria."
Giants pick at #12. I was hoping they could grab a guy that would be a game changer rather than a versatile, solid Oline prospect at #12. Seems like we just got one with our 1st pick last year.
am not a Peter King hater but the "risky picks" thing is silly. Last year was safe Pugh, Wilson was the last pick in the first round, risky? I guess. But Prince was expected to go higher than he did and wasn't a risk, JPP was a risk but one that paid off aka not one you would regret. If you are talking 2nd round too... Hankins wasn't especially risky, nor was Randle (expected to go higher), Austin was, Joseph wasn't.
Likely, one of these. According to my sources. Who I can't name for the obvious reason they don't exist. Also, my fake sources cover other teams. But it's best we know now. Or we don't. But whatever happens, please remember, I wanted to say it, first.
I will not be accountable for any of this. But I will delete if Headhunter will give me his password.
was a gamble and it burned them. Otherwise they have taken guys when they were expected to go (or later). Wilson hasn't worked out thus far but he wasn't viewed as especially "risky".
It's not so much that we need an OT to win games. We need an OT
Likely, one of these. According to my sources. Who I can't name for the obvious reason they don't exist. Also, my fake sources cover other teams. But it's best we know now. Or we don't. But whatever happens, please remember, I wanted to say it, first.
I will not be accountable for any of this. But I will delete if Headhunter will give me his password.
You are probably not even Vibe4giants, or are you and its more misdirection?
but I think King has been as good as anyone out there over the last 10 years that I have read or heard at nailing the Giants pick within the last week of the draft
He can play T or G, depending on how well Beatty comes back. He can replace Snee if Beatty looks good or play T if he doesn't. Snee can back up at G and C. Its a solid pick, and the kind that stabilizes playoff teams.
was Pugh predictable? I sure wasn't predicting him last year. I think Mayock was the only one that had us taking him. Nobody else even had him as a first rounder, iirc.
Wilson? Well there were a few who had us taking him right before the draft, but mostly not. Certainly it wasn't a predictable pick.
JPP was one of a number at his position, but predictable? Not really.
Prince? Nobody had him predicted as the Giants pick, iirc. Most mocks had him gone before us.
I'd say that the Giants have rarely taken the "predictable" pick. I agree with King - Martin makes so much sense that taking him is highly predictable at this point, unless of course we don't.
Odds are against us picking Martin, even while odds are higher for us picking him than anyone else, in my estimation.
Exactly. It's easy to look back in hindsight and think the Giants' recent 1st-round picks were sensible, non-shocking picks. But in the days leading up to all those recent drafts, none of those guys were the predictable picks for the Giants.
than 20. There are 5-6 guys at the top who will be gone and a relatively small group that will be in play for the Giants. Martin is obviously in that group.
I wonder , if the Giants have target cap allocations. Granted, you have two quality OL for 5 years, but could they afford to keep both of them when their 2nd contract needs to get done? Re-signing both might put stress on the cap and an overly high allocation to OL.
RE: It's not so much that we need an OT to win games. We need an OT
He was high on their board, not a real position of need at the time for a 1st round pick and they expected him to be long gone. Truly BPA selection. Turns out to be one of Reese best decisions with what happened to Thomas and Webster. I'm never going to knock the BPA approach.
he is as solid as he's supposed to be, Giants will have to pay a ton to keep him...I really dont see the value in drafting a Guard to early. Much rather lock in a cost prohibitive position in FA to a 4-5 year deal thanks to owning the #12 pick.
Id be all over ODB or Donald at #12.
Players like those do not ever hit the FA Market or cost a ton to woo and sign.
he is as solid as he's supposed to be, Giants will have to pay a ton to keep him...I really dont see the value in drafting a Guard to early. Much rather lock in a cost prohibitive position in FA to a 4-5 year deal thanks to owning the #12 pick.
Id be all over ODB or Donald at #12.
Players like those do not ever hit the FA Market or cost a ton to woo and sign.
really convinced that everyone absolutely knew for certain who the Giants would pick in round 1, every year? Seriously?
A stopped watch is right twice a day. Just because you guessed right doesn't mean you knew anything. And that includes the media.
Wilson was brought to our attn seconds before the pick and even that whole supposed piece of inside info is questionable to me. For weeks everyone said no way does NY take a rb. Then they take one and everyone just knew that pick was coming. No. Just Pugh? lol...NO. No one saw that coming. JPP? No. Prince? No.
No one knows anything. No one knew anything. That's reality.
We may know the type of player the Giants like in round 1. The evidence over the past 10 years is pretty cut n dried. That's where the know it ends.
IMO Kenny Phillips is the only 1st rounder in the Reese era
but my problem is this, there will be olineman in the 2nd and 3rd rounds that would be nice pickups and if we pass on playmakers or even trading up for a playmaker I think we miss an opportunity to get a special player.
Zach Martin has pushed from 3rd round to possible top ten in 6 months. Would we have drafted Snee this high. If they draft Martin this high that should mean they would like him to play OT. Otherwise why not trade up for Jake Matthews.
0 or 1, Martin should be there, OK with pick.
2 One of the better OTs should be there or TE. This is where Reese earns his money.
3 Everyone above plus maybe Evans should be available. Best case for Giants.
This is based on running draft simulator about 200 times with the various draft boards.
really convinced that everyone absolutely knew for certain who the Giants would pick in round 1, every year? Seriously?
A stopped watch is right twice a day. Just because you guessed right doesn't mean you knew anything. And that includes the media.
Wilson was brought to our attn seconds before the pick and even that whole supposed piece of inside info is questionable to me. For weeks everyone said no way does NY take a rb. Then they take one and everyone just knew that pick was coming. No. Just Pugh? lol...NO. No one saw that coming. JPP? No. Prince? No.
No one knows anything. No one knew anything. That's reality.
We may know the type of player the Giants like in round 1. The evidence over the past 10 years is pretty cut n dried. That's where the know it ends.
Thats the ideal pick for me, a flexible OL. You give Beatty the chance to start and have a legit backup plan. If Beatty can start plug this guy in at G.
Fix the OL and everything else will fall into place
OL is a game changer, especially when it sucks. We still have a glaring need for a solid successful G, and a ? at T. IF T/G are a hole this season, prepare for another top draft pick next year.
And, yeah, the 'won't be able to afford him next contract' thing is silly. First, lets find that successful OL, then lets enjoy several years of him, then worry about affording him.
1. Jerry not mentioning DT or Donald
2. Giant's having a big need at DT
3. When asked Jerry said we have upgraded DL and we have some young guys that have to step up.
Sounds to me like DT and Donald could be the pick. Jerry avoiding discussion could be gamesmanship or wishful thinking on my part.
but my problem is this, there will be olineman in the 2nd and 3rd rounds that would be nice pickups and if we pass on playmakers or even trading up for a playmaker I think we miss an opportunity to get a special player.
Zach Martin has pushed from 3rd round to possible top ten in 6 months. Would we have drafted Snee this high. If they draft Martin this high that should mean they would like him to play OT. Otherwise why not trade up for Jake Matthews.
I have NEVER seen ANYONE talk about Martin in the third round.. the lowest I have seen is people talking about him going to Miami.. NOT ONCE did I even see anyone saying even end of the first early second.. and definitely not third round..
Yeah, I've never seen Martin projected anywhere but RD1...
Also, the whole notion of "getting pushed up/down" needs to be taken with a grain of salt... Most draft experts spend the majority of the offseason playing catch up with their evaluations and cannibalizing what other experts are "hearing"... Even Mike Mayock, who I like a great deal, has done a fair bit of it this year with guys like Bridgewater and Donald... The reality is that they probably were never there to begin with...
He can play T or G, depending on how well Beatty comes back. He can replace Snee if Beatty looks good or play T if he doesn't. Snee can back up at G and C. Its a solid pick, and the kind that stabilizes playoff teams.
Ho-hum pick.
Almost every year?
Likely, one of these. According to my sources. Who I can't name for the obvious reason they don't exist. Also, my fake sources cover other teams. But it's best we know now. Or we don't. But whatever happens, please remember, I wanted to say it, first.
I will not be accountable for any of this. But I will delete if Headhunter will give me his password.
JPP was sort of predictable. At least a lot of people were predicting that they would take him.
Their first rounders have all been guys taken where they were expected to go, which sounds oddly like 'best player available'.
Likely, one of these. According to my sources. Who I can't name for the obvious reason they don't exist. Also, my fake sources cover other teams. But it's best we know now. Or we don't. But whatever happens, please remember, I wanted to say it, first.
I will not be accountable for any of this. But I will delete if Headhunter will give me his password.
You are probably not even Vibe4giants, or are you and its more misdirection?
Wilson? Well there were a few who had us taking him right before the draft, but mostly not. Certainly it wasn't a predictable pick.
JPP was one of a number at his position, but predictable? Not really.
Prince? Nobody had him predicted as the Giants pick, iirc. Most mocks had him gone before us.
I'd say that the Giants have rarely taken the "predictable" pick. I agree with King - Martin makes so much sense that taking him is highly predictable at this point, unless of course we don't.
Odds are against us picking Martin, even while odds are higher for us picking him than anyone else, in my estimation.
Eli, not the manner but everyone knew he was the guy they were after
Ross, Nicks, Allen and Joseph; not the player but everyone knew the position those years.
I'm sure I am missing a couple.
Fun bit of trivia related to this:
The Giants have played the Patriots in the super bowl twice in the past 7 years.
Only 2 First-round offensive linemen were involved.
In the 2013 super bowl, only 1 First-round offensive lineman was involved.
I wonder , if the Giants have target cap allocations. Granted, you have two quality OL for 5 years, but could they afford to keep both of them when their 2nd contract needs to get done? Re-signing both might put stress on the cap and an overly high allocation to OL.
It's either rocket science or Brian surgery.. you have to choose.
Id be all over ODB or Donald at #12.
Players like those do not ever hit the FA Market or cost a ton to woo and sign.
Id be all over ODB or Donald at #12.
Players like those do not ever hit the FA Market or cost a ton to woo and sign.
Did we not just lose Linval Joseph to FA?
A stopped watch is right twice a day. Just because you guessed right doesn't mean you knew anything. And that includes the media.
Wilson was brought to our attn seconds before the pick and even that whole supposed piece of inside info is questionable to me. For weeks everyone said no way does NY take a rb. Then they take one and everyone just knew that pick was coming. No. Just Pugh? lol...NO. No one saw that coming. JPP? No. Prince? No.
No one knows anything. No one knew anything. That's reality.
We may know the type of player the Giants like in round 1. The evidence over the past 10 years is pretty cut n dried. That's where the know it ends.
Right on, brother.
Zach Martin has pushed from 3rd round to possible top ten in 6 months. Would we have drafted Snee this high. If they draft Martin this high that should mean they would like him to play OT. Otherwise why not trade up for Jake Matthews.
More realistic is Jerry bangs his fist on the draft war room table 3 times,smacks Ross in the back of the head,and calls in the pick.
2 One of the better OTs should be there or TE. This is where Reese earns his money.
3 Everyone above plus maybe Evans should be available. Best case for Giants.
This is based on running draft simulator about 200 times with the various draft boards.
A stopped watch is right twice a day. Just because you guessed right doesn't mean you knew anything. And that includes the media.
Wilson was brought to our attn seconds before the pick and even that whole supposed piece of inside info is questionable to me. For weeks everyone said no way does NY take a rb. Then they take one and everyone just knew that pick was coming. No. Just Pugh? lol...NO. No one saw that coming. JPP? No. Prince? No.
No one knows anything. No one knew anything. That's reality.
We may know the type of player the Giants like in round 1. The evidence over the past 10 years is pretty cut n dried. That's where the know it ends.
We need a "LIKE" button on this site
Fix the OL and everything else will fall into place
We need a big receiver. The qb tends to miss high and we've got him throwing to smurfs.
And, yeah, the 'won't be able to afford him next contract' thing is silly. First, lets find that successful OL, then lets enjoy several years of him, then worry about affording him.
2. Giant's having a big need at DT
3. When asked Jerry said we have upgraded DL and we have some young guys that have to step up.
Sounds to me like DT and Donald could be the pick. Jerry avoiding discussion could be gamesmanship or wishful thinking on my part.
Zach Martin has pushed from 3rd round to possible top ten in 6 months. Would we have drafted Snee this high. If they draft Martin this high that should mean they would like him to play OT. Otherwise why not trade up for Jake Matthews.
I have NEVER seen ANYONE talk about Martin in the third round.. the lowest I have seen is people talking about him going to Miami.. NOT ONCE did I even see anyone saying even end of the first early second.. and definitely not third round..
Also, the whole notion of "getting pushed up/down" needs to be taken with a grain of salt... Most draft experts spend the majority of the offseason playing catch up with their evaluations and cannibalizing what other experts are "hearing"... Even Mike Mayock, who I like a great deal, has done a fair bit of it this year with guys like Bridgewater and Donald... The reality is that they probably were never there to begin with...
Yep and I love them too. Won't lie the speculation is fun.
Just hope he's still around at 12.
(2.) St. Louis Rams - Jake Matthews, OT, Texas A&M
(3.) Jacksonville Jaguars - Jadeveon Clowney, DE, South Carolina
(4.) Cleveland Browns - Blake Bortles, QB, UCF
(5.) Oakland Raiders - Sammy Watkins, WR, Clemson
(6.) Atlanta Falcons - Anthony Barr, OLB/DE, UCLA
(7.) Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Khalil Mack, OLB, Buffalo
(8.) Minnesota Vikings - Teddy Bridgewater, QB, Louisville
(9.) Buffalo Bills - Greg Robinson, OT, Auburn
(10.) Detroit Lions - Justin Gilbert, CB, Oklahoma St.
(11.) Tennessee Titans - Taylor Lewan, OT, Michigan
(12.) New York Giants - C.J. Mosley, LB, Alabama
(13.) St. Louis Rams - Mike Evans, WR, Texas A&M
(14.) Chicago Bears - Timmy Jernigan, DT, Florida State
(15.) Pittsburgh Steelers -Louis Nix III, DT, Notre Dame
(16.) Baltimore Ravens - Eric Ebron, TE, North Carolina
(17.) Dallas Cowboys - Ha Ha Clinton-Dix, S, Alabama
(18.) New York Jets - Marqise Lee, WR, USC
(19.) Miami Dolphins - Cyrus Kouandjio, OT, Alabama
(20.) Arizona Cardinals - Zack Martin, OT, Notre Dame
(21.) Green Bay Packers - Calvin Pryor, S, Louisville
(22.) Philadelphia Eagles - Kelvin Benjamin, WR, Florida St.
(23.) Kansas City Chiefs - Stephon Tuitt, DE, Notre Dame
(24.) Cincinnati Bengals - Darqueze Dennard, CB, Michigan St.
(25.) San Diego Chargers - Bradley Roby, CB, Ohio St.
(26.) Cleveland Browns - Carlos Hyde, RB, Ohio St.
(27.) New Orleans Saints - Antonio Richardson, OT, Tennessee
(28.) Carolins Panthers - Brandin Cooks, WR, Oregon St.
(29.) New England Patriots - Jace Amaro, TE, Texas Tech
(30.) San Francisco 49ers - Odell Beckham Jr., LSU, WR
(31.) Denver Broncos - Scott Crichton, DE, Oregon St.
(32.) Seattle Seahawks - Allen Robinson, WR, Penn State
Mike evans is a huge risk and would not be a smart pick at 12. Martin is a sure day 1 starter and he and pugh can be book ends for 8+ years
Can you see the Cowboys letting him past them???
He might not get by the Rams.
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