Every year I love reading BBI around this time as so many people have different opinions about each player...most of whom have never really seen these guys play (including some draft "experts"). Who knows who's right or who's wrong, but I certainly can't profess to know more than people who spend their time evaluating these players for living. Thousands of hours are put into evaluating hundreds of players..and it's still a crap shoot most of the time.
Anyway...a high school friend of mines father is a former employee of the Eagles. My buddy is a Giants fan (his dad grew up a Giants fan and later in life worked for Eagles) and each year I try and talk to him about the Giants draft and get some perspective from his dad..who is still connected to the Eagles in some capacity. I normally speak to him a few weeks after the draft, but this year it was last night. Here's some thoughts from his old man:
- Each year, teams think they found a few guys that are off the radar and can get them later in the draft for various reasons; Injury, small schools, overshadowed etc.. This year, one of those guys was Bromley. Said he there was a buzz about him in recent weeks and thought he would get drafted earlier that the so called draft experts projected. He's a "sleeper" and thought many teams wanted him. He said that he is the type of guy that no one talks about as so many teams are interested and they hope he slips. He said no one will work harder than him and Giants got a really good player. Said he was a sure 3rd round pick in his mind and also used the Chris Canty comparison as player type. Thought the Steelers or Bears would grab him in the 3rd which means that he didn't think it was a reach at all.
He loves Beckham and never thought they Eagles (or Giants) would get him as they were sure the niners would trade up to get him. Shocked they didn't. Thinks he's the 2nd best (and complete) WR drafted in the past few years and loves him.
Berhe is the type of player that fits the new NFL style. Five years ago, he would not have been drafted as early, but he's the type of player that teams want in todays NFL. Plays the run and pass well and also thought several teams liked him.
Williams is another guy that he liked and thought he fell because all RB's fell. Also said he's one of the hardest workers at the position and runs harder than any RB in the draft. Thought Giants might take him in the 3rd but not surprised he fell to the 4th.
Just to clarify..these are his opinions and his opinions alone; not the opinions of the Eagles organization.
Exactly!! And majority of those fans, don't know a damn thing about the guys that were drafted.
^^^^ this
(Thanks for the info ;)
I think he's going to steadily improve with each season. Especially under our conditioning program. He definitely can put on some more muscle.I see him at 315-320 pounds.
I donvt know about you guys but he reminded of Fred Robbins when we had him in 2004. I truly believe Bromley is going to be a solid pro for us.
Some of the most popular picks like Wheatley and Derek brown turned out to be duds. Of course some of the bashed picks like Cedric jones, dayne, Thomas Lewis, and Austin did in fact end up sucking...
that is the problem the owners have..
Based on one anonymous former Eagles employee's opinion?
We shall see, but there isn't any fan here who saw his workouts at the Senior Bowl, so for a guy who apparently came on late, their opinions don't mean much. Same with Bromleyt, who clearly was a late bloomer.
How good are they? I have no idea, but neither does anyone else.
I think he's going to steadily improve with each season. Especially under our conditioning program. He definitely can put on some more muscle.I see him at 315-320 pounds.
I donvt know about you guys but he reminded of Fred Robbins when we had him in 2004. I truly believe Bromley is going to be a solid pro for us.
From your lips to the football gods' ears. I'd love another Freddie Robbins, one of my faves from days gone by. Now, realistically, I don't expect that level of play, but if Bromley comes close, it'll be a great pick and an exceptionally solid player.
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becoming more and more apparent that the only people who didn't like the Giants draft are some of the fans.
Based on one anonymous former Eagles employee's opinion?
You really have no sense of proportion, do you?
I do like the players drafted and am excited about some of the UFDAs but I really wanted a TE with one of the picks 3-5
But a lot of others thought he was a reach. Whether this includes NFL GMs is not something we will ever know. And the fact that Reese knows more about these players doesn't mean that we shouldn't analyze and criticize his selections. That is especially true given his frankly marginal draft record the last few years, at least outside the first round. Otherwise, what's the point of this board? Not everyone who criticizes Reese is Rich in Houston calling for him to be fired.
Reese would get more benefit of the doubt on picks like this if he had a better draft record. But he doesn't. He isn't Seattle. He isn't playing with House money like their GM and scouts. Seattle just drafted Justin Britt, OT from Missouri at the end of the second, which is arguably a much bigger reach that Bromley in the third. Some Seattle fans are probably questioning that pick, but then remember that their GM drafted Richard Sherman, Earl Thomas, Russell Wilson, etc.
Let's see where we are in two to three years. Bromley is a rookie. No judgments should be made this season, and perhaps we'll be pleasantly surprised by his play. If that happens, then the label of "reach" will begin to fade, and Reese will get more benefit of the doubt from fans on his future picks. But that is something he and the scouts have to earn.
Here's a quote and then a link. "All of this means that the NFL draft’s mechanism for sorting players is largely an efficient system, in the sense that none of its individual actors have the ability to “beat the market” in the long run. Some do see short-term deviations from the mean, but those prove unsustainable over larger samples. The implication is that much of what each team gets from its draft picks — the very entryway to the league for almost every NFL player — is determined by pure chance."
Can't beat the draft - ( New Window )
Bromley will surprise folks I think. He's much like last years 3rd round pick (D Moore) in that he needs to bulk up a little and become more polished. He'll be learning from a couple great players too - C Jenkins and Patterson.
I do like the players drafted and am excited about some of the UFDAs but I really wanted a TE with one of the picks 3-5
Thats what most fans think. They think that we adressed the seocndary HEAVILY.. when in reality we didnt.. we replaced three players we lost with three more players.. the net gain of players was ZERO.. the difference is that hope we gained BETTER players..
The Safety issue became a problem with the Will Hill suspension.. If the suspension is upheld.. at the least he is getting six games.. if not a year.. and the Giants might wind up releasing him..
Demps. Rolle. Brown. Taylor. Hill? Sounds like plenty of depth in secondary
Robinson. Donnell. Davis. Haven't proved anything at TE as threats
I just feel taking a chance on a TE instead of Berhe or Jackson or even Kennard would've been a better option. Otherwise I was happy with the draft
Putting the onus on Reese is foolhardy. Ross should get most of the blame. For Reese, if any blame should be placed on him, it's for hanging onto Ross to long.
When Reese was Director of Player Personnel. Reese coordinated the Giants’ college scouting, was in charge of the team’s draft preparation and ran the draft room as the players were selected. He also did a lot if his own scouting. That's when we were more successful in the War Room. It set us up for 2008.
I wish their was a way Reese could take on more of that responsibility. That's when he was at his best. In 20 years, I'll remember him more for that, then what he had provided us at GM.
Beyond first rounders, but I expected you to understand that. Guess you did not. There you go.
Hey Acid...I didn't mean to mislead, but he was not in a position to make these types of decisions, he just worked for the Eagles and was well informed.
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nice information, but it's really just speculation on the part of this person. He doesn't know whether the Steelers, Bears, or anyone else would have taken Bromley in round three. What's more valuable is his analysis, since he used to be in a position to make these types of decisions.
Hey Acid...I didn't mean to mislead, but he was not in a position to make these types of decisions, he just worked for the Eagles and was well informed.
OK. Thanks. As I said, nuggets like this are always appreciated.
That would make him an even bigger fool
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becoming more and more apparent that the only people who didn't like the Giants draft are some of the fans.
Based on one anonymous former Eagles employee's opinion?
Radar, you aren't dumb. Stop acting like you are.
Demps. Rolle. Brown. Taylor. Hill? Sounds like plenty of depth in secondary
Robinson. Donnell. Davis. Haven't proved anything at TE as threats
I just feel taking a chance on a TE instead of Berhe or Jackson or even Kennard would've been a better option. Otherwise I was happy with the draft
and you have heard this now many times.. They lke to create competition..
and how many times did you think we had great depth on the secondary.. and at the end of the season you are trying to get guys off the street...
Had Boss proven anything?? Had Ballard proven anything.. Had Bennett proven anything before signing with the Giants.. you dont take a chance at a position if you have higher rated players there.. The Giants have done that.. and it hasnt worked out.. You can get a TE.. we have gotten them in FA.. We have gotten them as UDFA's... and we have gotten them as late round draft picks.. you can get a TE...
The reality is that the TE needs to block. McAdoo was a TE coach for six years.. he knows how to coach up TE's... really not worried about TE..
Also you need players for special teams.. and if one of these guys pushes Charles James or Hosley off the roster.. SO WHAT ??? you just got better..
Ebron gone before their pick in round 1
Seferian Jenkins gone before their pick on round 2,, should they have passed on the best center in the draft who can also play guard knowing how badly the interior of the OL played last year.... and draft Amaro or maybe Troy Niklas who still hasnt run a 40.. has limited speed and average hands who is getting over a double hernia surgery??
Id much rather fix the OL in round 2..
CJF was gone at the beginning or round 3...
Should they have passed on one of the most productive college backs in all of football in round 4 to take Arthur Lynch who is mostly a blocker ??
Now I was hoping for Lynch in round 5 but it didnt break that way...
so unless you were going to miss out on a OL in round two.. you really didnt have much chance to get one of the better rated TE's in the draft..
They did bring a TE in as a UDFA.. and they might still address the position later or with June 1 cuts..
the TE for the Giants simply isnt a feature role.. Its a necessary one.. but it isnt a feature one.. even people crying Green Bay features a TE we need a TE..
Does Green Bay feature a TE?? no.. not really..
Finley best year ever was 2011
2011
16 games
55 receptions
767 yards
8 TD's
13.9 avg per catch
And thats with Aaron Rodgers throwing the ball at record numbers..
The Giants are probably looking at 35-40 catches.. 500-600 yards and 5TD's...
They should be able to find someone to do that.. they have done it consistently in all honesty.. Boss did it.. Then Ballard did it.. Then Bennett did it..
so basically they had a 5th rounder.. an undrafted FA and a Dallas underachiever in a contract year produce results..
No doubt the Giants need a TE.. They either need one of the guys on their roster to step up.. or they need to start looking elsewhere.. The draft just didnt work in their favor..
I know this because Joey in VA knows this. And he works out.
I do see some positives, FWIW, so I can see why we might have targeted him on day 3 perhaps or as an UDFA: he has size, a high motor and is fairly good at keeping his feet. Those qualities can be had in DTs normally available in the later rounds/FA. What he lacks, in my view, is what sets the grunts apart from the greats.
Regards,
Football Guy n VA
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Neither did Hankins.
Beyond first rounders, but I expected you to understand that. Guess you did not. There you go.
Wasn't aware that Hankins was a 1st rd pick.
Ok sounds good.. now exactly how do you MAKE the draft work for you..
That kind of logic is how the team wound up with players like Cedric Jones and Thomas Lewis.. the player we wanted wasnt there so we MADE a pick at a position of need.. even though the player didnt warrant the pick..
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In comment 11671772 arcarsenal said:
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Neither did Hankins.
Beyond first rounders, but I expected you to understand that. Guess you did not. There you go.
Wasn't aware that Hankins was a 1st rd pick.
Kiss the ring, you fuck,
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In comment 11671894 mdc1 said:
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In comment 11671772 arcarsenal said:
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Neither did Hankins.
Beyond first rounders, but I expected you to understand that. Guess you did not. There you go.
Wasn't aware that Hankins was a 1st rd pick.
Kiss the ring, you fuck,
Modus, wrong poster
This draft is about Eli Manning and will be judged on the degree to which it assisted Manning in his attempt to regain his pre-2013 form. Everyone knows that Manning had an awful bottom third season and that the team can do no better next season than struggle life and death to make the playoffs if Eli does not make it back to the top third of quarterbacks.
No one is exactly sure of why Manning fell apart last season, but it does not seem to be due to a hidden injury. The premise of his breaking down under the constant pressure of opposing defenses pummeling him because his line could not protect him is plausible and is the only one over which the team has control this offseason.
The Giants made quite a few moves to shore up the line during free-agency. They signed Geoff Schwartz, a Chiefs UFA at guard. Most agree that this was a very good signing, and he will step in at left guard as an immediate upgrade. The Chiefs were sorry to lose him.
There were more questions about the signing of center JD Walton from the Broncos. A 3rd round draft choice of Denver in 2010, he started all 32 regular season games for the Broncos in 2010 and 2011. But bad luck caught up with him in 2012. After starting the first four games he had a serious ankle injury that required surgery. He missed the rest of 2012, and then needed additional surgery in June, 2013 causing him to miss that entire season on PUP. The Broncos had had enough and waived him. The Redskins claimed him but did not play him in the last two games of the season. So the Giants pretty well know what they are getting: solid player who has had serious ankle problems that have kept him from playing in a game since the 4th game of 2012.
To bolster offensive tackle the Giants signed another player with question marks: Charles Brown. Brown was drafted in the 2nd round by the Saints in 2010. He mostly sat out his rookie season but became the starter for the Saints in 2011. He then had the misfortune of being placed on IR after five games starting in 2011 and three games in 2012. These were lost years when he should have been learning how to play. He started the first 14 games of 2013 at left tackle, but felt the wrath of coach Sean Payton in a game against the Rams:
'I saw enough,' Saints Coach Sean Payton said. 'I saw enough, period. It was enough penalties, pressures, sacks. It was enough. At some point you can’t just keep watching it. Feelings get hurt, it is tough.'
For fans of Pro Football Focus, the news is not good. He received the lowest rating of any player on the Saints' offense for 2013 and was ranked 66th of 76 offensive tackles. His pass blocking was his worst fault.
So that's how the team addressed the offensive line in free agency. A solid starter and two question marks, with Brown being the bigger question mark. More to come was expected in the draft.
As it turned out the Giants only drafted one offensive lineman, but at least Weston Richburg appears to be a good one. He was a four year starter at Colorado State. Gil Brandt, the respected former player personnel VP of the Cowboys from 1960-1988, gave him a quick evaluation on Sirius. Undersized, very quick, and should be the Giants' center for the next 10 or 11 years.
But what of offensive tackle? As of now, the Giants seem to be rolling the dice with Beatty. With all the new people on the line, the cohesion that is so important to line play will not be there, which makes it even more important to put the best people out there.
And Snee and his ankle and other injuries and his age make him, well, less than even money to make it through the season with skills close to what they were in his prime.
So I rate this draft lower than most because it failed to sufficiently provide for the protection of Eli, and if the team has another season like 2013 and misses the playoffs for the third season in a row the Reese/Coughlin era will be over.
One last thought. Jerry Reese may yet pull a rabbit out of his drawers and pick up a Kawika Mitchell or Michael Boley.