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Sy'56 Full Analysis and What I would have Done Different

Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 12:20 pm
**DISCLAIMER**

It’s upsetting that I have to do this before I get in to the fun stuff…but some of you get really offended by someone offering their opinion. Every year I make picks for NYG in real time and compare them years down the road. I will offer my analysis on both the NYG draft and mine. It’s a fun thing to do and even more fun to compare a few years down the road. Now before some of you go nuts…this is NOT, II repeat NOT a criticism of NYG in the slightest. I simply disagree here and there but overall, NYG brought in a solid group of players that I think will improve this team. There is NO right or wrong at this point, so please keep that in mind.



ROUND 1

Odell Beckham – WR/LSU

With such a strong WR class that went a few rounds deep, NYG had to bring at least one of these guys in that could make an impact right away. Their current group is starving for another elite-level talent to pair with Cruz while we are waiting to see what the likes of Jernigan and Randle actually have to offer. Beckham was a first rounder on every board, with a good amount of teams likely having him in the top 20 overall. Beckham brings an NFL ready skill set. He catches the ball correctly, runs great routes, and does the little things right. Talent wise he may be the second or third best WR in the class. He has elite after-the-catch ability with top tier quickness and explosion and solid top end speed. I think Beckham can play the outside receiver in the NFL because what most fail to notice about him, he is about as physical and competitive as it gets. That really stood out to me when scouting his 2013 tape in comparison with his 2012 tape. He is very strong, tough, hard nosed 200 pounds. When a receiver with this much talent plays as hard as Beckham does with a chip on his shoulder every week, I think you can depend on him to make a steady contribution to the offense. Overall this was a great way to start off the draft for NYG.

Who I would have Picked:

Aaron Donald – DT/Pittsburgh

I’ve been all about Donald for months now and he was there for NYG at #12 overall. I wasn’t sure if he would be, but going in I knew I wouldn’t hesitate to take him if he was there. He was a top 5 player on my overall board and I felt the NYG defense really needed a guy that could demand consistent attention inside. Everyone knows about Donald’s lack of ideal size and I did lower his grade because of it. But his movement ability in tight spaces as well as in the open field are attributes you can go 4-5 years without seeing from a DT. Donald is a rare prospect and I think his impact on the league is going to be very big. In this scheme, Donald can play the role of the Tampa 2 3 technique very well, consistently beating OL off the snap and knifing his way through the pocket. If the Giants DEs could do their job with Donald penetrating, NYG could consistently start off every passing play with a major advantage.




ROUND 2

Weston Richburg – C/Colorado State

Prior to the draft I made a list of OL that I thought NYG would target, and Richburg was on it. He fits the mold of their plan to get a little more athletic at the center position and he is a really hard worker on the field. I love Richburg’s footwork, as it may be the best of any interior OL in the draft. What jumps out at me is how active he is every play of every game. He’s always looking to get his hands on someone and alter their plans. I like that a lot, as I believe quality OL play always starts with consistent effort. He struggles to maintain a position against bigger defensive tackles which worries me a bit. Centers don’t need to be massive, nor do they need to win the strong man competition. They are rarely blocking a defender by themselves and are often the helper to guards. With that said, I’ve seen numerous OLs around the league ruined by a player in the middle that gets pushed in to the backfield. I have several notes on Richburg from different games where he was being ridden 2-3 yards back when he was blocking a DT by himself. That could end up being a major issue for him early on in his career. Richburg did not finish as a 2nd rounder on my board. I thought he was more of a 3rd rounder but I can’t get upset about the actual value of the pick. Richburg has a legit shot at being a day one starter if he can beat out Walton.

Who I would have Picked:

Troy Niklas – TE/Notre Dame

I’ve seen a few times that NYG was not thrilled with the 2014 tight end class. I can see what they mean but there were a handful of guys better than any one of their current TEs. Watching Niklas being taken soon after NYG took Richburg was a tough blow for me, as I really like what this kid is right now and what I think he’ll be in a few years. Niklas is a former linebacker and defensive that, in just two seasons, evolved in to a balanced-approach TE with enormous upside. I don’t think he will ever be a Rob Gronkowski-level player, but I think he can make a similar impact when it comes to style of play. He is a massive body that still has room to grow but blends that size in with an actual skill set. He can make a lot of tough catches with his hands in traffic. Very good body control for a player his size and when it comes to what NYG likes to do with their TEs, I don’t see anyone on this roster that would be on Niklas’ level. At the very worst I could see him being a top tier blocking TE. His floor is very high, his ceiling could be a top 5 TE in the league within a few years. I would have loved to have seen him in blue.




ROUND 3

Jay Bromley – DT/Syracuse

In terms of where I had hid him graded in relation to where NYG took him, Bromley was the worst pick of the draft for the team. By no means do I think he is a bad player or that he can’t contribute here. I simply had several DTs ahead of him that offer the same thing with a little extra. When talking about his potential, Bromley can play the penetrating role from the inside of this defensive line very well. He has decent get off and he plays with active hands and light feet, a very good combination for a DT to have. Bromley made his way in to the backfield plenty in the games I saw, so that I like. The thing I am concerned about is his ability to anchor a position and take on blocks. He isn’t a guy that plays low, and he won’t be a guy that pushes NFL offensive linemen backwards. I could see him either being a liability for the defense or a guy that can only pay on passing downs. He reminds me a ton of Jay Alford from Penn State a few years back that had a decent, but short showing with NYG. I briefly spoke about the need for more presence inside at DT for this team, a very overlooked weakness of this team. Bromley isn’t a guy that is going to solve that issue from what I see. Little bit of a one trick pony. Despite not liking this pick in the slightest, I can see why NYG likes him. He has the NFL body for what you want at DT and he made his way through the line a lot. We’ll see how he handles NFL strength, power, and size though.

Who I would have picked:

Travis Swanson – C/Arkansas

In my draft for NYG, I went two picks without taking an OL. It wasn’t the most ideal scenario but I am glad this worked out to get Swanson in round 3. Swanson was my top graded center and he’s been there since the 2013 season. He offers the combination of size, athletic ability, and quick decision making that I want. When it comes to what NYG is looking for at center, he fits the bill. He moves just as well as Richburg, but he plays with more presence and he excelled in the SEC against much tougher competition. I’ve seen a few people mention Richburg’s OK game tape against Alabama (it was nothing spectacular), go check out Swanson’s. He plays the game with similar quickness but more power. He is a guy that can reach the second level quickly, but also handle a DT by himself. Could he have been a day one starter? I think so. I’ve noted some lower body strength issues that can take some young guys a year to acquire before being put in to NFL trenches, but I still think he had the power presence to play right away. Friday was a rough one for me, as the Niklas/Swanson combination would have been much preferred over the Richburg/Bromley one.




ROUND 4

Andre Williams – RB/Boston College

This seemed like a pretty typical NYG pick and it was one that I really liked for this team. Williams is about as tough as it gets between the tackles. One thing I have always looked for out of college backs has been the ability to break tackles. Williams earned a top grade there and surprised a lot of us throughout 2013 as he showed there was some burst to his game once he reached the open field. Williams can handle a full load as he proved in college, but I don’t see him ever being the number one option. I think he will be a quality number two guy that can get a lot of the short yardage and/or dirty work done. He’s a guy that does his damage slowly, but surely. NYG needs a RB like that to pair with Jennings for the next few years. One thing I really don’t like about Williams, and the main reason why I had him drafted behind the 4th round, is that he is extremely limited. He isn’t a pass catcher at all. Yes he can work on it and improve, but there isn’t that natural feel that you want to see. It doesn’t kill his potential but I hate to see backs that can’t get in to space and simply catch the ball with consistency. In terms of where he currently stands on the NYG roster, he’ll likely compete with Cox for the spot behind Hillis but I wouldn’t be surprised to see him being the #2 option by season’s end. Good pick here that will help NYG pretty quickly as long as he can learn the playbook and block, two things I am confident he will do.

Who I would have picked:

Martavis Bryant – WR/Clemson

I had a pretty good idea heading in to the weekend that Bryant was going to be a target late day two, or early day three for me. To see him still there in the 4th round knowing I hadn’t brought in a WR yet was a perfect match of grade and need. Bryant has elite potential that popped up here and there in a Clemson offense that really made a point to spread the ball out after Watkins got his touches. When Bryant was given downfield opportunities, I thought he shined more often than not, showing a legit NFL-level skill set when it came to getting himself open and coming down with the ball. Bryant is a deep threat with outstanding length and leaping ability, a very tough combination for CBs to deal with. In addition, there is some hidden talent here once he gets the ball in his hands. He has that quick twitch and vision to get yards after the catch. As I said earlier, NYG really needed an outside receiver out of this deep class. They came away with Beckham, which was fine, but I think Bryant can make a similar impact on the offense. His route tree was limited however; so banking on immediate contribution out of him would have been risky. But in terms of where I see him in a year or two, I think we are looking at a legit #2 option for anyone’s offense.




ROUND 5

Nat Berhe – S/San Diego State

While you can’t be upset with who a team takes this late in the draft, I had a hard time looking at some of the names still available when NYG took Berhe. I really wanted another safety on this team if the value matched up and the need was greater than other positions. Berhe is a solid addition that wore a few hats for the SDSU defense. He is the high energy, relentless type that will get the most out of himself. If you have a bunch of players like that on a roster, you often will find an overachieving team. I like that approach and I understand it. But when I watch Berhe on tape, I can’t but help notice the amount of times he hurts his team as often as he helps. He gets really over-aggressive when pursuing the ball carrier and it leaves wide open cutback lanes and more missed tackles. I don’t ever want that out of a safety. As a cover man, he seems to always be playing catch up as well. When I see a safety that is constantly guessing and trying to recover, I get worried that he just doesn’t know how to read the action. He fits the scheme well because he can fill a few roles for the defensive backfield and Fewell can work well with guys like that. Personally, I had a list of safeties ahead of him on the grading sheet but once again, I look forward to watching how it plays out. He won’t be counted on early but with his style of play, he’ll be able to make special teams contributions early on.

Who I would have picked:

Cyril Richardson – G/Baylor

If you spoke with me last fall about Richardson, I would have told you he had a legit shot at being a first round pick. But after a horrid showing during the practice sessions at the Senior Bowl and a sub-par combine performance, he really took a slide down the totem pole. With that said, I would have been elated to see him at this point in the draft be taken by NYG. He has NFL-ready power and strength. The knock that I hear most is the lack of athletic ability and heavy feet. I would like to dispute that considering he didn’t test that poorly at the combine in the short area drills and he has a lot of success as a pulling guard. Richardson has never been and will never be a guy that dominates with movement and athleticism, I know that. But he can take over battles once he gets his hands locked inside on a defender and enough athletic ability to get there. At Baylor, he was forced to play at such a high rate with minimal rest, and I think it really took a toll on his game. At times his feet would get stagnant which forced him to try and win battles with just his hands. But I don’t think that is a capability issue, I simply believe he needs to be in an NFL-paced offense that will allow him to recover play to play. Richardson has dominance written all over him once he learns how to consistently play with his feet. I’ve had similar grades on bigger guards that some will downplay because of elite movement ability that have turned out great in the league. Richardson would be in the running for starter in 2015, with a possibility in 2014 as well. There are some people that think his future could reside at RT because of his length, but I think his best fit is inside.




ROUND 5 (comp)

Devon Kennard – LB/USC

Ever since the effort to sign O’Brien Schofield, I’ve been very curious to see just how aggressive NYG was going to be in bringing in a pass rushing OLB talent. I am assuming the defensive scheme has been tweaked a bit in order to get a role like this put in to certain pass rush packages. In addition, this was right around the time of the draft where I thought NYG could go after a LB. It’s a group that Reese has chosen to all but ignore until the later rounds and the bottom ring of free agency which is a strategy I have been very much against. Kennard is a big body with length and bulk, very well put together. He’s had his share of injuries but nothing that should be counted against him too much. Almost 6 years removed from a torn up knee, about 4 years removed from a thumb, 3 years removed from a torn up hip, and about 2 years removed from a torn pectoral. On the field USC has simply just tried to get him in to the game any way possible whether it was at DE, MLB, weak side LB and strong side LB. NYG must love the versatility and experience he has in different roles. A healthy 2013 was really important for Kennard, proving he was more than just an upside-guy. He works best when rushing downhill at the passer. He has the quickness and ability to bend in any direction to give himself the advantage over stiff linemen. His tape against UCLA and Notre Dame were big plusses for him. If NYG does in fact have this new kind of Joker-type role, he could compete for the spot right away. But when it comes to the classic 4-3 SAM, I don’t see him being the guy you want in there. He is slow to react when he isn’t rushing/blitzing downhill. It is my biggest negative I try to avoid when looking for 4-3 LBs. He has a hard time changing direction and playing against NFL-caliber speed. In coverage he looks like he has the tools but just never seems to click mentally. He’ll make the roster and do well on special teams but I am most interested in seeing if there actually is a Joker type role for this scheme in 2014.

Who I would have picked

Jordan Zumwalt – LB/UCLA

I was in the same frame of mind as NYG at this point in the draft. There was some solid LB talent still available at this point and there is definitely space for a rookie within the current group. I love Zumwalt’s approach to the game and I wish NYG had more guys that played with this kind of attitude and aggression. Zumwalt isn’t big but he plays as strong as any LB you will find when it comes to attacking the ball carrier and bringing him down. He isn’t a dirty player, but he’s close. He doesn’t play past the whistle, but he’ll play through it. He doesn’t try to injure guys, but he’ll try to hurt them. Zumwalt has some physical limitations, which is why he slid down towards the end of the draft, but he gets the most out of himself because of how hard he plays. He mostly played inside within UCLA’s 3-4 scheme and I think his fit here would be on the weak side and/or backing up Beason. He is quicker than he is fast but I love how he reacts to what the offense does after the snap. There is definitely a ceiling here but I think this kid is football player above all else that will make his presence known on special teams and eventually in a starting lineup.




ROUND 6

Bennett Jackson – CB/Notre Dame

When it comes to sheer value, this was my favorite pick NYG made. I’ve been talking him up for awhile now and I am really excited to see how he is used within the scheme. Jackson is relatively new to the defensive side of the ball and sometimes it shows, but the kid can flat out play. His physical style stood out to me every week and he knew how to use it to his advantage. While his footwork and ability to locate the ball downfield need plenty of work, I think he can add immediate value to special teams and the back end of the depth chart. For a few months now, I’ve been saying Jackson’s best fit may be at safety in the NFL. His movement ability is and physical nature is better suited for that spot of the defense but his performance at CB throughout college really adds important value to a backup. Seeing how valuable Rolle has been to this defense because of his CB/S versatility, I can’t help but think that may be the plan for Jackson in another year or two. In the mean time, we get to watch another young, aggressive player bring the toughness to this scheme that NYG really needs.

Who I would have picked:

Travis Carrie – CB/Ohio

Another big DB that I have been touting since the early fall here. Carrie went a couple rounds after I thought he would. Playing at a small school with average workout times and one serious injury to his name will do that to you. But Carrie is a year and a hald removed from the knee and moved really well in 2013. He is 6’0/206 with 4.4 speed and solid shuttle/3 cone times as well. He also has a 41 inch vertical, which would have been #2 overall among the DBs at the combine. Beyond that, Carrie is a smooth athlete that reacts well and gets his hands on a lot of balls. I love to see him in man coverage because he can win the matchup in so many ways. Whether it’s his physicality at the line, movement ability in short and long space, or knack to find the ball, he gets it done. Yet another guy here that I think can play a few spots but I think his best position will be CB. Top notch intangible kid that will make his name known.


__________________________________________________________________________

Well there you have it guys. Here is a condensed comparison of my draft against NYG draft.

NYG

1 – Odell Beckham – WR/LSU
2 – Weston Richburg – C/Colorado State
3 – Jay Bromley – DT/Syracuse
4 – Ande Williams – RB/Boston College
5 – Nat Berhe – S/San Diego State
5 – Devon Kennard – LB/USC
6 – Bennett Jackson – CB/Notre Dame


Sy’56 Draft

1 – Aaron Donald – DT/Pittsburgh
2 – Troy Niklas – TE/Notre Dame
3 – Travis Swanson – C/Arkansas
4 – Martavis Bryant – WR/Clemson
5 – Cyril Richardson – G/Baylor
5 – Jordan Zumwalt – LB/UCLA
6 – Travis Carrie – CB/Ohio


_________________________________________________________________________


Once again guys…this is NOT done to criticize anyone else. Drafts are never won or lost at this point….So I suggest you accept the views of others and attempt to respectfully disagree so that our discussions can be fun, rather than elementary back and forth petty fights.

Go Blue!
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Thats a pretty tits draft Sy  
robbieballs2003 : 5/12/2014 12:24 pm : link
.
once we made the Richburg pick  
Sneakers O'toole : 5/12/2014 12:27 pm : link
which I liked a lot, I was holding out hope that Niklas would fall to us in the third, but I kind of knew that was a pipe dream.
your draft  
Mr. Nickels : 5/12/2014 12:28 pm : link
would have been so much better
Thank you for your insight  
Ron Dixon's Alarm Clock : 5/12/2014 12:29 pm : link

How about you post your choices from previous drafts? It would be interesting to compare your selections vs the Giants on players that are now established
Great job Sy.  
Curtis in VA : 5/12/2014 12:34 pm : link
Devon Kennard sounds like pretty much every other run of the mill LB they've drafted over the years. Stiff hips and slow to react.
Sy'56  
robbieballs2003 : 5/12/2014 12:35 pm : link
I have a two part question. I know you were extremely high on Jordan Matthews. What do you think of him on the Eagles in Chip Kelly's offense? Also, they said he is going to be playing out of the slot which is unusual for a player his size with Maclin on the team too?

The only reason I would see him playing out of the slot is to get a bigger WR to help block with his inside/outside zones. It has to be nice to get a big body there to help block safeties/LBs. Also, they love to run Jet screens which means the slot would block the corner. Once again, if you can get that big body on a corner it would open up some big plays. How about in the passing game. What advantages do you see with him playing the slot?
Sy  
DanMetroMan : 5/12/2014 12:35 pm : link
I'm sure you touched on this but what was your take on Quarles?
Dixon  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 12:35 pm : link
I've posted them a few times...maybe I'll make another thread this week with the full list. Be on the look out for those.
The format doesn't serve you well.....  
WideRight : 5/12/2014 12:38 pm : link
The Giants picks are followed by your critique, and your picks are followed by your comments. So any forthcoming discussion will tend to be adversarial - attacking the Giants with you, or defending the Giants against you.
I've been looking forward to this  
sjnyfan : 5/12/2014 12:39 pm : link
Thanks as always Sy. Not only for this but the entire draft process. I did the same and mines was:

1. DT Aaron Donald
2. WR Cody Latimer
3. RB Tre Mason
4. CB Pierre Desir
5. OL Wesley Johnson
5. TE Jake Murphy
6. SS Jonathan Dowling
I was a big Donald fan, too  
BillT : 5/12/2014 12:40 pm : link
But you just cant complain about getting a guy with Beckham's talent at a position as important as WR. And it improves every other WR on the roster as well. Bryant's addition does neither and WR was a big need. I just find the whole TE fixation a head scratcher and taking one instead of a top OL...? Not saying that's not a good draft SY. It is. And thanks for all you bring to the board.
robbie  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 12:42 pm : link
I am really high on Matthews...unfortunate to see him land on a division rival roster much like Dez Bryant in 2010.

Matthews will see time in the slot, but I don't think that is where he will end up every down. He has the skill set to be moved around and I think Kelly is the guy that will do that.

Matthews was used in the screen game about as often as any WR I saw this year, thus I expect that is part of the reason. It gives him more space to work with. And yes, Kelly wants WRs that can block LBs, this Matthews could be more effective in that role from the inside. In addition, I think this is all about getting his best players on the field. Maclin and Cooper may have the outside spots locked down, thus Matthews may need to be in the slot by default.
I would have been ecstatic with that draft  
SHO'NUFF : 5/12/2014 12:43 pm : link
I wanted Donald...but the gap in talent after Beckham is huge when it came to available WRs in the 4th...the gap between Donald and other available DTs, not so much.
DanMetroMan  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 12:43 pm : link
Very surprised to see Quarles fall out of the draft, as are a lot of people. Wondering if there is something off the field we don't know about...which happens every year.

He'll compete for a Mike Patterson type role and I would day there is a 50/50 shot of him making the team. Not sure he handles the power game as well as NYG wants but he can be a difference maker. Great value UDFA.
Just to be clear  
chris r : 5/12/2014 12:44 pm : link
each pick is not what you would have done had the giants done what they done in the previous rounds, right? Like you wouldn't have taken M Bryant after the Giants took Beckham in round 1?
Correct Chris r  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 12:46 pm : link
Completely separate from start to finish
Thanks  
DanMetroMan : 5/12/2014 12:47 pm : link
Sy. I couldn't find a single source online that had Quarles any worse than a "mid-round" guy and I saw him as high as 2-3 which is why I was surprised.
The thing is, Dan...  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 12:53 pm : link
There is a lot more to it than what a guy's grade is compared to where he was drafted. There are scheme fits, current depth charts, current needs for a specific type of DT within a depth chart...etc

Goes that go undrafted are not necessarily graded lower than the guys that were drafted.
Guys*  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 12:55 pm : link
.
Many thanks for this Sy  
4thand17 : 5/12/2014 12:59 pm : link
and all your stuff the last few months - always a good read and a valuable frame of reference for a casual draft observer.

Quick question: I realize we as fans focus too much on specific positions when viewing the draft, but it seems the most likely combo in rounds 1 and 2 were WR-OL, in either order. So given the choice now, would you prefer Martin and then Matthews, Lee, etc;, or Beckham-Richburg?
my main concern with Sy draft  
fkap : 5/12/2014 12:59 pm : link
is the WR. Giants absolutely need a WR, yet he picked a project. (picking projects is one of the many reasons the Giants are in their current situation). I couldn't intelligently do the same 'what Ida done' scenario, but I don't like how Sy handled the WR situation.
I  
AcidTest : 5/12/2014 1:03 pm : link
like your draft better. A lot more in fact.
thanks Sy. I personally would have gone for Martin at 12  
Victor in CT : 5/12/2014 1:05 pm : link
and Richburg or another OL in Rd2. I could have lived with Amaro or Latimer in Rd2 if they had gone OL in Rd1. I didn't like the idea of a WR in Rd 1, so though I was not a proponent of Donald, I am a proponent of fortifying the trenches, so I could have lived with it.

Just have to hope it works out now.
I didn't hate our draft but I like yours a lot better  
The_Taxman : 5/12/2014 1:06 pm : link
It actually filled holes with players that had higher floors and ceilings while never reaching. I felt Richburg, Bromley, and Berhe were reaches. I definitely would rather have Donald, Niklas, and Swanson over Beckham, Richburg, and Bromley. Loved the Zumwalt pick in the 5th as well. I see Kennard as another typical Giants LB. Stiff special teamer/backup in the mold of Herzlich, Paysinger, Kehl, etc. There were LBs available there that were faster and more dynamic.
Can you share a few older drafts  
Lenny in Indy : 5/12/2014 1:08 pm : link
so we can see how you/Giants compare after a few years in the league?
Your mock is good Sy  
ANGPASS : 5/12/2014 1:10 pm : link
I really like the andre williams pick
I really like martavious bryant, but he needs more work than odell
I thought they should have grabbed Nix instead of bromely
Berhe is apparently a will hill clone. he looks just like Hill on tape. think he makes the team over cooper taylor
The drafted the LB to replace the scofield signing/non signing

I wish we could of grabbed donald too. i was expecting zack martin. but i think they can't replace nicks with a 4th rounder, and they addressed the oline through FA and linval with hankins. I think the first 5 picks are beasts and will have a future here. I am happy about the draft.

also, the TE position seemed weak this year. the giants were not high on anyone. i think we all wanted niklas and other because we have such a gap. who knows about these TEs. If they didn't draft one, macadoo must of not been crazy about them. they pick the center becasue macadoo was high on him for his offense.
That is amazing...  
Amtoft : 5/12/2014 1:13 pm : link
You picked in "real time" and right after you picked the players seem to come right off the board. I mean 1st pick one pick later Donald... 2nd pick 9 picks later Niklas... 3rd pick 2 picks later Swanson... 4th pick 5 picks later Bryant... 5A 1 pick later Cyril... 5B 18 picks later Zumwalt... 6 26 picks after Zumwalt boom Carie gone. Man in real time that is a super amazing thing that happened there.
Sy56  
Aloha Alan : 5/12/2014 1:15 pm : link
Your draft picks were great versus what we picked. Yes our brain trust had different ideas, but they should put you in charge of scouting!!!

Personally I would have liked Donald and Niklas in rounds 1 and 2 which would have made both our defense and offense that much stronger in the trenches.

Phenomenal job Sy!!!
If I am going to use  
NewBlue : 5/12/2014 1:18 pm : link
A painter or a portfolio manager I want to see a history of referrals...satisfied customers? good track record?
Be it Sy or Kiper or Great Blue North or anyone, show me some past performance so I can determine who has a good track record.



So amazing also  
Amtoft : 5/12/2014 1:21 pm : link
that you kept passing on your highest rated interior OL in Yankey in what you deemed clearly a need... Amazing how that was able to work out for you. It isn't like you waited to make the picks after the draft or anything.
SY, awesome stuff, any chance you could do this  
ligmen : 5/12/2014 1:22 pm : link
for all the undrafted guys we signed?
If I had to critique your shadow draft  
Mike in NY : 5/12/2014 1:27 pm : link
1) Not really a fan of Travis Swanson in Round 3. I would have held out for someone like Wesley Johnson or Gabe Ikard in the 5th or 6th Round. Watching Swanson get beat by the same players Richburg stymied at the Senior Bowl followed by his low bench score knowing what I had seen of Richburg in the regular season (the same struggles you noted 1 on 1 versus DT's) I do not think Swanson profiles as anything more than a decent back-up

2) Martavis Bryant has a lot of upside, but he is definitely less likely to contribute this year than Odell Beckham Jr. The Giants need somebody to take the pressure off of Cruz in the base offense and I am not convinced we had that on our roster and I am not convinced as a rookie Bryant can fill that role. Odell Beckham Jr. was my second ranked WR in this draft and I personally did not think the difference in DT's (I probably wold have taken DaQuan Jones over Bromley) made up for the difference in WR's

3) I do not like that you did not address RB. Although we signed Jennings, all of our back-ups have significant red flags and there were a number of intriguing RB's that got pushed down because RB as a whole fell

4) The more I watch of Berhe I like him as he looks a lot like what the Giants and their fans like out of Will Hill without the off the field issues. Hopefully he can develop like Will Hill did, but I think he is a player that looks better in pads than he does gym shorts

5) For reasons stated previously I am not a fan of Richardson for the Giants

6) Agreed on Zumwalt/Kennard. They were two LB's that I liked similarly so I cannot fault the Giants for going with one over the other with that pick

7) Carrie/Jackson are also both similar players in my rankings so that is another where you can say just flip a coin IMO although I would have also considered someone like Laurent Duvernay-Tardif or redshirt someone like James Hurst with that pick because they both have the potential to play OT
Sy  
gidiefor : Mod : 5/12/2014 1:28 pm : link
One thing that the Giants did this year, they appear to have evolved their drafting philosophy. Every pick they made was for someone who not only demonstrated good production on the College level, but who also demonstrated leadership ability and who had no "personality issues." I found their draft consistent with the way they generally draft except for that additional criteria. I don't feel that you addressed that modification in philosophy in your analysis.

Also their round 3 pick showed dramatic growth in his last year of college play and you have appeared to discount that as well - with many reports coming in of not only other teams who would have liked to have him but very favorable reports from those that know him.

I for one like the Giants draft very much. I am impressed with Donald - but don't think size wise that he fits the Giants mold. I also think Beckham is a phenomenal pick.

You draft, to me, doesn't resonate therefore.
Sy  
Lowell.. : 5/12/2014 1:33 pm : link
i wish you ran the draft for the NYG.
Amtoft  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 1:44 pm : link
I discussed Yankey during the draft a few times with people here. Yankey and Richardson were G1 and G1A for me...but I thought Richardson was the better scheme fit for guard. Yankey is some position versatility to him and could play RT, thus his grade finished slightly higher. But when it comes strictly to G play, I like Richardson more and I've been vocal about that.
Sy...you fail to take into account  
SHO'NUFF : 5/12/2014 1:45 pm : link
the ripples you caused by your actions...a disruption in the timeline...an alternate universe....who is to say that the Rams don't pick Niklas since Donald is off the board? if this happens, your whole draft is ruined. =)

p.s. good shit, Sy!
Sy  
pa_giant_fan : 5/12/2014 1:45 pm : link
glad you don't draft for the Giants
Sy  
lawguy9801 : 5/12/2014 1:47 pm : link
Thanks as always for the write-up. I really enjoy your contributions.

However, I know you've done this comparison in years past. Would you mind posting at least a couple of drafts' worth of comparisons?
do you have some prior year  
Blue Baller : 5/12/2014 1:47 pm : link
real time drafts to take a look at?

I'll throw a few in here....  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 1:48 pm : link
But I'll make a separate thread later in the week so you guys can grill me!
Fantastic Post -- Fun, too  
Percy : 5/12/2014 1:51 pm : link
Hugely appreciate this insightful, retrospective thread and all of those you've put up on the draft. Thanks!
Its a shame that we couldn't get the Giants to critique your draft  
Peter from CT : 5/12/2014 1:51 pm : link
in the way that you critique theirs. It would be really interesting to see what limitations that they saw on the players they didn't take.
RE: Its a shame that we couldn't get the Giants to critique your draft  
Mike in NY : 5/12/2014 1:55 pm : link
In comment 11673881 Peter from CT said:
Quote:
in the way that you critique theirs. It would be really interesting to see what limitations that they saw on the players they didn't take.


They can't because it would give clues to other teams what they look for specifically in players and if they want to go after a player when he is cut or as a Free Agent someone could use it as leverage
2013  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 1:58 pm : link
NYG

1 - Justin Pugh - OT/Syracuse
2 - Jonathan Hankins - DT/Ohio State
3 - Damontre Moore - DT/Texas A&M
4 - Ryan Nassib - QB/Syracuse
5 - Cooper Taylor - S/Richmond
7 - Eric Herman - G/Ohio
7 - Michael Cox - RB/UMASS


Sy'56

1 - Datone Jones - DE/UCLA
2 - Jamar Taylor - CB/Boise State
3 - Alvin Bailey - G/Arkansas
4 - Shamarko Thomas - S/Syracuse
5 - Devonte Holloman - LB/South Carolina
7 - Luke Marquardt - OT/Azusa Pacific
7 - Kevin Reddick - LB/North Carolina
Sy I have always appreciated your work  
Headhunter : 5/12/2014 1:58 pm : link
the conclusion I draw is that since there is not 1 pick that you deem the Giants making better than your alternative, you have to rate the draft at best as a D if not lower
we could  
Mr. Nickels : 5/12/2014 2:03 pm : link
have had Nix and Quarles but let's see what we got with Bromley
2012  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 2:08 pm : link
NYG

1 - David Wilson - RB/Virginia Tech
2 - Rueben Randle - WR/LSU
3 - Jayron Hosley - CB/Virginia Tech
4 - Adrien Robinson - TE/Cincinnati
5 - Garrett Mosley - OT/Auburn
6 - Sean McCants - OT/UAB
7 - Markus Kuhn - DT/NC State


Sy'56

1 - Courtney Upshaw - DE/Alabama
2 - Mohamed Sanu - WR/Rutgers
3 - Zerbie Sanders - OT/Florida State
4 - Mark Harris - CB/Florida State
5 - Cyrus Gray - RB/Texas A&M
6 - Travis Lewis - LB/Oklahoma
7 - Jerrell Harris - LB/Alabama
headhunter  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 2:09 pm : link
I disagree. More than one way to skin a cat here....there are several players they could have taken that I would have liked....but perhaps still wanted someone else. I'm not in to grading drafts a few days after because it doesn't make sense. I think its just discussion time rather than a full blown rating.
Not going to split hairs  
Headhunter : 5/12/2014 2:11 pm : link
I appreciate your work and look forward to it every year
2011  
Sy'56 : 5/12/2014 2:16 pm : link
NYG

1 - Prince Amukamara - CB/Nebraska
2 - Marvin Austin - DT/North Carolina
3 - Jerrel Jernigan - WR/Troy
4 - James Brewer - OT/Indiana
6 - Greg Jones - LB/Michigan State
6 - Tyler Sash - S/Iowa
7 - Da'Rell Scott - RB/Maryland


Sy'56

1 - Jimmy Williams - CB/Colorado
2 - Mason Foster - LB/Washington
3 - Delone Carter - RB/Syracuse
4 - Marcus Cannon - OT/TCU
6 - Bill Nagy - C/Wisconsin
6 - Eric Hagg - S/Nebraska
7 - Ian Williams - DT/Notre Dame

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