NFT: Cavs now willing to include Wiggins in trade

up Wigging for this deal to happen.

Well, this should do it. Love will be on Cleveland and Lebron will have what he wanted...the easiest road to a finals appearance.

what an asshole, going home to play on a very good team. Selfish prick definitely should have made things as difficult as possible so people can kill him down the road for only winning two titles

I want to see Lebron mentor Wiggins to see what he could turn into. They would be fun to watch together too. Plus I'd like to see if Lebron can get it done surrounded by good young players with lots of potential rather than teaming up with fellow all stars. I know you want the easiest path to a championship but yeah. That's fun for Cleveland fans, not so much for everyone else.

Sees through all the feelgood, goin' home bullshit.

The easiest path to a championship or the hardest path to a championship. Staying on Miami which just lost in the FINALS to finish what you started(not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4..) wasn't an option. When things get tough, Lebron will just run to the next easiest path.

In comment 11771319 armsteadeatslittlekids said:

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Sees through all the feelgood, goin' home bullshit.

I have been saying this from the beginning. He chose Cleveland cause they had a ton of young talent to go with some great trading assests. And nothing will change my mind as the days go on. And again... there's absolutely nothing wrong with LeBron choosing this option. If he feels that's his best way to win, then he should do what he wants. I have no problem with him signing with cleveland.

But this coming home angle is just a minor subplot to the whole story.

because he's earned that right, but it's lame, for sure. He's running away from a challenge that he started just 4 years ago because he knows it's not going to be easy.

Lebron goes to miami on a discount, to win. Villainized.

Lebron goes "home" for maximum dollars, signs a 2-year opt out deal hedging on the new TV deal to get an insane, likely never before seen payday, inherits a roster that could be set to win for the next 5 years, and goes to a team where he and his cabal of childhood friends can basically make the franchise their personal plaything.

Canonized.

he always planned on going back to Cleveland at some point and what better time to do it than now. I would agree with you if he ran somewhere else. Not Cleveland.

There has been talk of him going back to Cleveland for over 2 years now. Not just speculation and people throwing around bullshit. LeBron always planned on going back it was just a matter of when. No better time than now, where he is actually in his prime and can deliver those fans a title instead of coming back when he's 37 and cant bring a title.

by grown ass men to assign motives to every action the guy makes is bizarre. Especially fans of other teams who act like jilted lovers. I hope he defies the laws of physics and wins 100 rings just to shove it up everyone's ass.

energy though?

and radar furiously pounding the keyboard with sweat pouring down your face as you scream "I hate Lebron" at the screen. I'm totally close, right?

who cares what that dude does.

I never hated Lebron for going to Miami. That's where he chose to go to create his legacy. Cleveland effed up by putting crappy players around Lebron. He chose to go to Miami for a variety of reasons. I hated him because he didn't come to the Knicks, but that's just being a fan. If you aren't with me, I hate you. Just like I hate Derrick Rose. Just like a hated Jordan. Just like a hated Reggie Miller and Alonzo Mourning and everyone else that beat the Knicks.

This is different. He chose to go to Miami and I think he's running from the challenge by going back to Cleveland and using the "going home" crap to fool the slower fans.

That being said, it's just being a fan. I don't get too worked up over this stuff other than repeating myself a few times on a message board, but I'd probably be talking about painting my house or training my dog if I wasn't so whats the difference?

for staying in Miami and not running to Houston. I'll never root for another team, but I'd love to see Miami take out Cleveland. That would be epic.

I mean Wiggins may turn out to be a real good player, but he's still got a lot of filling in to do, and some development (probably a few seasons worth). Was Lebron going to expend a couple of his prime seasons waiting for that and having to mentor as well?

Lebron was never going to wait. With Irving, Lebron, Love, Cavs become an instant Finals contender and a heck of a good shot of bringing Cleveland a title sometime in the next few years.

Key is Cleveland will have to make sure it fills out enough of a quality bench.

he doesn't go back to Cleveland if he's not from there. The best free agent they ever signed was Larry Hughes.

In comment 11771372 Chris in Philly said:

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and radar furiously pounding the keyboard with sweat pouring down your face as you scream "I hate Lebron" at the screen. I'm totally close, right?

Ummm... I have always said and still think this was his best decision. All I said I think it has to do more with winning than coming home.

I don't even know why you say I hate LeBron when I have given him more props outside a few posters.

Miami panicked and gave him a MAX deal. He only stayed in Miami because he got more guaranteed money on the max deal by staying in Miami. He got his two rings.

And rumor has it his wifey wanted no part of leaving Miami to go to Houston.

Miami will be respectable the next season or two with Deng, Wade still at a so-so level, and Bosh, but they aren't going to win anything and in a few seasons will be a bad team with old declining players on bad deals and some cap problems.

and they win a title this year, does Lebron even leave? I'd highly doubt it.

was a tactical one mixed with some friendship. Wade was the straw stirring that whole Heat Dream team together.

Lebron is no dummy though moving forward. He can see how Bosh no longer plays the same way inside and how Wade is declining fast.

People think Lebron is taking the easy way out are looking at it on paper.

Lebron is now expected to win a championship in Cleveland. He's going back to a pressure packed environment with expectations.

He could have stayed in Miami for another 4 or 5 years and then gone and chased a ring as an aging vet on a close to Finals team.

People think superstars can do it alone. Even the big ones have had a running mate or a balanced supporting cast. They can't win championships on their star power alone. Cleveland surrounded him with a terrible cast the last few seasons he was there before. He saw it and ran at a better opportunity. He handled it terribly in terms of PR and arrogance, but anybody who couldn't see the tea leaves there the 1st time is kidding themselves.

Can you contradict yourself any more in 2 sentences?

doesn't leave if they win a title, but it would only have been delaying his return to Cleveland. He was always going to go back. if they won this year I think he would have opted in instead of opting out to go for 4 in a row, you're not leaving with the chance at doing something Jordan or Kobe didnt do.

Going back to Cleveland isnt something that just popped into his head 3 weeks ago when he looked up at their roster. A roster by the way that won what, 33 games in a pathetic eastern conference? Stick LeBron on any team in the east and they are probably the favorites. The idea that its some loaded juggernaut that he's walking into is BS.

No matter who he plays for whether it's the heat, Cavs, or even the kings. That's the label all the best players in sports get. I don't think going back to Cleveland adds any oressure. LeBron expects to win and be the best and works his assistant off to be the best.

There is no extra pressure for Lebron now. I'll even go further and say that the other players will feel more pressure than lebron.

In comment 11771392 MookGiants said:

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he doesn't go back to Cleveland if he's not from there. The best free agent they ever signed was Larry Hughes.

No Mook. He doesn't go back to Cleveland if they have a roster like they had when he left. Going home is a nice story (although he left them high and dry 4 years ago and did it in such a manner that people destroyed him for it). But we need to stop with this "Oh it's so nice he went back home to finish what he started when he was drafted!" nonsense. He went back there because they have a team loaded with young talent. If not for that he NEVER goes back there. He reups with the Heat.

does he go back?

would he go back in the prime of his career to be surrounded by shit? The idea that anyone would ever do that is bullshit. The timing was going to have to be right for him to go back in his prime, but he was always going to go back at some point. The timing just fit for it right now.

The best free agent Cleveland ever signed before LeBron was Larry Hughes. They aren't even anywhere near his radar if he wasn't from Akron. They could have the best team ever and he wouldnt consider it, no one ever considers going there as a big time player.

Ran from another challenge for the easy road. He made a decision to leave in 2010 for whatever reasons he had with the goal of winning like 6 championships in Miami and as soon as that got harder, he bolted. I think it says a lot about his character.

that easy road is "home".

who are ripping him and saying oh he only went back because of the talent there would be the same ones ripping his career if he stayed in Miami and only won 2 titles saying how he's overrated and all this other shit to minimize his career. No matter what he does, he can't win.

that its an easy road is BS. They'll be the title favorites because they have LeBron. Kyrie Irving is so good yet they have been terrible every single year he's been there. Wiggins hasn't played a single NBA game and likely will need a couple years to truly develop. If they keep him Wiggins will help LeBron down the line not so much this year.

Pick any of the top 10 teams in the east last year and put LeBron on them and they are instantly favorites to come out of the east, that's how good he is.

He wouldn't have gone back to shit because it makes no sense. He would've stayed in Miami. You're right about the timing being right, though, because Cleveland has just had 3 of 4 first overall picks. The irony is the reason they had them is largely because he left, which opens up a host of NBA conspiracy theories about their role in orchestrating this. I don't believe they did, but I've heard that angle by some of the NBA haters out there.

wanted the easy road just go sign with Chicago and take their 17 million dollars.

They just gave Irving a max deal, obviously they think he's a star and ascending(he is). They have a shit ton of assets to bring in another star or two as well. It's an easy road, no question.

In comment 11771372 Chris in Philly said:

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and radar furiously pounding the keyboard with sweat pouring down your face as you scream "I hate Lebron" at the screen. I'm totally close, right?

LMAO

again, take that same Cavs roster and have LeBron born and raised in Atlanta, Georgia. Think Cleveland is ever an option?

No one would go anywhere to play with shit in the prime of their career. Somehow criticizing him for not doing that is quite funny.

It was a combination of home and roster. But without that being home, the roster never would have mattered.

Regardless of what their roster looked like I do think he would have gone back before his career was over. Not in the prime of his career like he is now, but he would have gone back.

He has the best of both worlds now, he can maximize his prime with good young players and go back home, and somehow people are criticizing him for that saying he took the easy road.

Who wouldn't take the easy road if it involved them going home to the place they want to be? That's something everyone would love. Home and the easiest road. How more perfect could it be for him? Why shouldn't he want that? Why should he willingly take the much tougher road and not go home?

road on a team that won 33 games last year in the Eastern Conference.

It's an easy road because LeBron is on the team. He can put any eastern conference team on his back to the nba finals at this point.

he carried a garbage team to the finals, but don't be dense for the sake of being dense. They are extremely talented, they have a ton of ascending young players and they just needed a star to take them to the next level. They also will use their many, many, many assets to add veteran talent around Lebron.

In comment 11771440 MookGiants said:

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wanted the easy road just go sign with Chicago and take their 17 million dollars.

I hate this argument. Going to a third team simply wasn't an option if this guy cares one iota about legacy. The best player on the planet going to a 3rd team in his prime to chase rings? Yeah, ok. He'd be labelled a mercenary and he knows that.

He had two options. Cleveland and Miami. Cleveland was far and away the better option, so he went there. It's simple. And I'm thrilled he decided to go there too. Upset that KLove is going there though.

In comment 11771356 Chris in Philly said:

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by grown ass men to assign motives to every action the guy makes is bizarre. Especially fans of other teams who act like jilted lovers. I hope he defies the laws of physics and wins 100 rings just to shove it up everyone's ass.

You seem to spend just about as much time defending him.

Cleveland gets 3 #1 picks after LeBron leaves, setting up the great feel good story of his return?

In comment 11771475 chris r said:

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Cleveland gets 3 #1 picks after LeBron leaves, setting up the great feel good story of his return?

Shut up

In comment 11771475 chris r said:

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Cleveland gets 3 #1 picks after LeBron leaves, setting up the great feel good story of his return?

No. The universe blows.

ruins everything.

If the Cavs can get Kevin Love it's really a no brainer. Love is something like 26 and the best PF in the league. That team will rock for a long time...

love cant stay healthy, cant play defense, and wiggins looks the part out there, and would relieve defensive duties for lebron at times.
i hope the cavs dont make this trade.
it would be refreshing to see lebron lead the team of young cavs... now back to mercenary style...

team basketball none better than the Spurs.

trade is a win/win situation. CLE gets an elite scroer entering his prime and becomes the Eastern conference favorites. MN gets the #1 pick in a good draft, a player whose upside is through the roof. They can at least sell their fans on the idea that they got a good return for Love.

In comment 11771451 MookGiants said:

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again, take that same Cavs roster and have LeBron born and raised in Atlanta, Georgia. Think Cleveland is ever an option? No one would go anywhere to play with shit in the prime of their career. Somehow criticizing him for not doing that is quite funny. It was a combination of home and roster. But without that being home, the roster never would have mattered. Regardless of what their roster looked like I do think he would have gone back before his career was over. Not in the prime of his career like he is now, but he would have gone back. He has the best of both worlds now, he can maximize his prime with good young players and go back home, and somehow people are criticizing him for that saying he took the easy road. Who wouldn't take the easy road if it involved them going home to the place they want to be? That's something everyone would love. Home and the easiest road. How more perfect could it be for him? Why shouldn't he want that? Why should he willingly take the much tougher road and not go home?

No I don't. I never denied that. MY argument is if Cleveland DIDN'T have the talent it has he NEVER goes there, home or not. He would've stayed with the Heat, which was the plan back in 2010, wasn't it? He's the one who said they were going to win more than 4, 5, 6, championships together. His plan wasn't 4 years and I'm out.

I don't begrudge him going back to Cleveland. It's awesome to play in front of your hometown, but let's stop with the prodigal son talk and all that nonsense. He chose them because their arrow is pointing up and Miami's is pointing down. Plain and simple.

In comment 11771490 hitdog42 said:

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love cant stay healthy, cant play defense, and wiggins looks the part out there, and would relieve defensive duties for lebron at times. i hope the cavs dont make this trade. it would be refreshing to see lebron lead the team of young cavs... now back to mercenary style...

He also happens to be the best rebounder on the planet, an excellent shooter, and one of the smartest offensive players in the NBA.

All your points are valid, but Love is a supreme talent over the players they have now, and he's only 26.

is nothing more than saying he's not going to eclipse Jordan in terms of legacy/perception. Everyone readily agrees he's an all timer. That's hardly a "no win situation" for an NBA career.

Funny to hear something framed as an "easy road" - when that something city hasnt won a title of any kind in 50 years and didnt sniff the playoffs in any of the 4 years Lebron was in South Beach. Just makes no sense.

And you cant be serious about owing Miami or Pat Riley a 'commitment' - I live down here and these fans dont deserve Lebron. Not that he was ever their's to begin with.

I'd say he played this perfectly - if he stays in Cleveland they are the Indiana Pacers/LA Clippers of recent years... fun to watch, competitive, out in the 2nd/3rd round every postseason and picking 20th-25th in the draft. By leaving they were able to accumulate assets and talent, now he comes back and will deliver a city its first title in most people's lifetimes.

that ever happened to Lebron was getting drafted by Cleveland. Set up some ludicrous expectations about what a fanbase deserves from a pro player.

In comment 11771470 chris r said:

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In comment 11771356 Chris in Philly said: Quote: by grown ass men to assign motives to every action the guy makes is bizarre. Especially fans of other teams who act like jilted lovers. I hope he defies the laws of physics and wins 100 rings just to shove it up everyone's ass. You seem to spend just about as much time defending him.

Let's count posts!

In comment 11771539 MetsAreBack said:

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Funny to hear something framed as an "easy road" - when that something city hasnt won a title of any kind in 50 years and didnt sniff the playoffs in any of the 4 years Lebron was in South Beach. Just makes no sense. And you cant be serious about owing Miami or Pat Riley a 'commitment' - I live down here and these fans dont deserve Lebron. Not that he was ever their's to begin with. I'd say he played this perfectly - if he stays in Cleveland they are the Indiana Pacers/LA Clippers of recent years... fun to watch, competitive, out in the 2nd/3rd round every postseason and picking 20th-25th in the draft. By leaving they were able to accumulate assets and talent, now he comes back and will deliver a city its first title in most people's lifetimes.

And they're still a young roster with no playoff experience. Irving and LeBron will have different peaks. They really only have one star and a lot of question marks outside of LeBron. If LeBron wanted to win a title over the next two years, his best bet may have been to stay in Miami with Bosh/Wade.

the "coming home" aspect is overplayed and this is just as much about winning as anything else. But at the same time, I really don't mind. The only reason people are complaining is because it's LeBron. Knicks fans here have been calling Carmelo a Top 5 player in the NBA.

Switch Melo and LeBron, and the Knicks and Cavs would be considered teams on roughly the same level. LeBron is simply that good. LeBron makes that much of a difference and it annoys people that he realizes that fact.

I also find the overrating of the Cavs roster laughable. People pretending like Waiters/Thompson/Bennett are anything special. Those are JAGs. Kyrie is an injury prone chucker who plays no D and who has caused locker room issues. He's basically Marbury 2.0 at this point. Kevin Love is a great player but he has never carried his teams to the playoffs and his awful play in clutch situations is a reason why. Plus, he plays absolutely no defense as well. Kyrie + Love is a very nice duo but those guys have so many question marks about them. The best defensive big on the roster would be Anderson Varajao who is a solid player but is ridiculously injury prone himself.


Kyrie/Love is a duo that plays absolutely no defense and has absolutely no playoff experience. They've also both dealt with injuries in the past and are far from iron men. So let's calm down on the Cavs hype. Switch LeBron with any player in the league besides Durant, and the Cavs probably aren't a title contender even with Love. LeBron's just that good and he knows it.

for nothing as a FA and keep Wiggins. That might be an amazingly talented team

In comment 11771573 xman said:

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for nothing as a FA and keep Wiggins. That might be an amazingly talented team

He is likely going to be traded and the team that gets him will likely have a leg up in keeping him.

a quick way to achieve glory

In comment 11771323 kmed said:

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The easiest path to a championship or the hardest path to a championship.

There's a third, apparently very difficult to see or understand option: he wants to play with other really good players, because playing with other really good players is really fun.

In comment 11771558 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:

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I also find the overrating of the Cavs roster laughable. People pretending like Waiters/Thompson/Bennett are anything special. Those are JAGs. Kyrie is an injury prone chucker who plays no D and who has caused locker room issues. He's basically Marbury 2.0 at this point. Kevin Love is a great player but he has never carried his teams to the playoffs and his awful play in clutch situations is a reason why. Plus, he plays absolutely no defense as well. Kyrie + Love is a very nice duo but those guys have so many question marks about them. The best defensive big on the roster would be Anderson Varajao who is a solid player but is ridiculously injury prone himself.

Right? People are acting like he's joining a roster with the talent and potential of, say, Portland. Or Phoenix. Or Golden State, or Memphis, or Washington. Hell, even though their 2013 season records were similar I think New Orleans' non-LeBron collection of talent dwarfs Cleveland's. And LeBron going to the freaking Cavs is somehow "the easy way out?"

rofl

And have lived in VA for some time. I rather you stuff a rake up my ass then go home at even a pay increase of 300%.

Cleveland /Akron/Whatever is a shit hole especially when you consider this guy lived in paradise, South Beach.

To each their own, but does he relish hanging out with his boyz from high school in the summer while on break or does his now $$ Mom rather hang in minus 20 fucking degree January Ohio because they had a past there...years ago.

Jesus Christ

i don't claim to know more than the next guy but I simply don't buy into the destiny of LeBron sacrificing for the good of home.

This ego-maniac will leave them high & dry after a min of two years as he simply can't help himself.

Folks, follow the $$$.

keep Wiggins. The Grantland article outlines the exact reasons why. Love is a weak defender, and has no experience in the postseason. What's the rush to make Wiggins available? Cleveland can wait a few months and see what they have in Wiggins. They have him on a cheap rookie deal, could offer multiple 1sts plus Bennett, Waiters, and Thompson. With those multiple picks and cheap, young talent, they have a better offer on the table than Golden St, because Minnesota would have to overpay to keep him. Wiggins needs some seasoning, but being around Lebron will probably expedite his learning curve. You have to figure that right off the bat, he's a good defender, rebounder, and will be a beast in transition. I wouldn't mind at all if he was a guy that only put up 12 a night. He can give Lebron a break from having to take on the best guy all the time on defense, and he's going to help out on the glass. For a guy on a rookie salary, I think he's going to provide a lot of value.

In comment 11771811 jc in c-ville said:

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And have lived in VA for some time. I rather you stuff a rake up my ass then go home at even a pay increase of 300%. Cleveland /Akron/Whatever is a shit hole especially when you consider this guy lived in paradise, South Beach. To each their own, but does he relish hanging out with his boyz from high school in the summer while on break or does his now $$ Mom rather hang in minus 20 fucking degree January Ohio because they had a past there...years ago. Jesus Christ i don't claim to know more than the next guy but I simply don't buy into the destiny of LeBron sacrificing for the good of home. This ego-maniac will leave them high & dry after a min of two years as he simply can't help himself. Folks, follow the $$$.

He actually spent a lot of time during off seasons in Akron, and continued to invest in the community. If you "follow the $$$", he's re-signing with Cleveland after 2 years, because the league will have a new CBA agreement following the heels of a mega TV deal.

Lebron didn't have the option of joining any team in the NBA. Lebron has been playing for a discount for a while now, he wanted his money(can't say I blame him), so that limited his options. So what were his options?

-Houston or another west coast team? That's a pretty hard road. You'd be battling San Antonio, Portland, Memphis, OKC and other good teams before you even got to the finals. Seems like A HARD ROAD.

-Miami? They just got obliterated in the finals and things aren't getting easier. Seems like A HARD ROAD.

Cleveland? A young ascending player in Irving that Lebron knows well. Just got the max and isn't going anywhere. Also have a ton of assets to get more pieces(hi kevin love) and some other young players who can only improve. Seems LIKE HIS EASIEST FUCKING ROAD!!

Don't forget the Sixers! They'll be loaded in two years. EASY ROAD baby!

he will go to philly when he opts out in two years because he had a summer house there in 2001. #goinghome

why this is such a leap of faith for people to make. Again... nobody is saying he's wrong for going back to Cleveland. I think we're just not dumb enough to believe it's the "going home" angle that did it for him. He can write 12 letters saying the same thing. Bottom line... if Cleveland's roster stunk and was cap strapped he doesn't even consider them.

To a third team. And I think the fact that it's his home AND they have many young assets and cap space plays in his favor. One without the other, he stays in Miami. The fact that he's from Akron plays in his favor heavily though. Was it the EASIEST road? I don't think so. Toronto could've made room and that would've easily been the best option. Derrick Rose is too big of a health risk to ever be seriously considered. Atlanta would've had a nice roster with him on the team.

But he only has two roads: Miami and Cleveland. Miami would've given him the best options to win within the next 3 years or so, and a much better chance than Cleveland's young roster, especially when Miami is able to get guys like Danny granger on vet min deals.

He took the road that gave him the better prospects of winning over the next 7-8 years as opposed to the next 2-3. Miami would've gone to the finals the next 2-3 years, which you can't say for Cleveland now for sure, with or without Love.

Which brings me to the Love argument. If they were to trade Wiggins for Love, they would be putting themselves in position to win within the next 4 years or so. There's a point where love peaks and his lack of defense catches up to him. The Cavs would have a much worse defensive team than Miami with love and Irving. LeBron can't be the only one playing defense. When everyone else fails to bring offense (look back to the Finals) they are going to need defense and not just LBJ throwing up 30 Ppg to keep pace with the western conference elite.

Wiggins will be an elite defender. Use that extra cap space you got from not having love and they can flip assets like Waiters and Bennett down the road for rim protectors and complimentary scorers to Lebron.

and running with it. It was the easiest road considering his options and desire to get paid. I don't even see how that's debateable. I'm not buying this going home crap.

that there's so much debate about this. Is it really that hard to believe that he'd been thinking about going home for a while and that CLE winning the draft lottery 3 times probably set the situation up so this would happen?

Who cares whether he would've gone back to CLE if the situation was worse? Everyone who hates Riley/Miami Heat fans can hopefully watch the best player of this generation without feeling rage every time.

I still feel rage because he joined a better team now and it will make it even harder for my team, the knicks, to win. I guess I should just be happy about that because of the feel good story of him bringing championships back home to his people that he left for to chase 6 rings in miami.

smashing my keyboard and screaming "I hate you Lebron!!!"

In comment 11771811 jc in c-ville said:

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when you consider this guy lived in paradise, South Beach.

I live in Miami. South Beach is a fun place to visit, but to live here = paradise? Umm, no.

would be the same for Lebron James.

Lived a lot as life in Miami.

A cool ass*

I'm just not naive enough to be sold this coming home crap as being this noble gesture of LeBron's big heart. Spare me that crap. He went for two reasons. 1) They could pay him and 2) They're a team on the way up and Miami is on the way down.

he went for those two reasons, who cares that Cleveland never would have even been considered if he weren't from there, those were the only two reasons clearly.

This is a guy who willingly lives in Akron, Ohio every off-season. He loves it there.

that provided refuge from the challenge that he created in Miami. There were no other options for him. Good for Lebron, he just gained so many new fans because they love the storyline of him going home and winning for those desperate fans that so deserve a championship.

In comment 11772034 MookGiants said:

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he went for those two reasons, who cares that Cleveland never would have even been considered if he weren't from there, those were the only two reasons clearly. This is a guy who willingly lives in Akron, Ohio every off-season. He loves it there.

You keep bringing this up as if anyone said otherwise.

the two reasons he went there were because of money and there roster. Never mentioned anything else.

What are you going to be like kmed and act as if this hasnt been talked about that it would eventually happen over the last 2-3 years? Read Wojo's article from 2 years ago. Everyone knew he was eventually going back, except for you and kmed I guess

Not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4, not 5, not 6......



Oh wait, this is harder than I thought....I'm going home to bring a championship to my people that deserve it!
Link - ( New Window )

of arguing this anymore?

In comment 11772045 MookGiants said:

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the two reasons he went there were because of money and there roster. Never mentioned anything else. What are you going to be like kmed and act as if this hasnt been talked about that it would eventually happen over the last 2-3 years? Read Wojo's article from 2 years ago. Everyone knew he was eventually going back, except for you and kmed I guess

I never denied what you said either though. I have always said the only place he'd ever leave Miami for is Cleveland because he'd be even more villified if he went anywhere else. However... he had a plan to win in excess of 5 or 6 titles in Miami, and he leaves the first chance he gets at least 4 titles too short. That doesn't happen if the Cavs have a shit roster. He would've reupped with Miami without giving the Cavs the time of day.

LeBron has been in a lose/lose situation ever since the decision when it comes to fan perception of him. 90% of my friends who are NBA fans rag on the guy for every single fucking thing he does. Either he went somewhere that it was "too easy" to win (I guess these guys should be deliberately searching for the most difficult scenarios possible), should have never left Cleveland (because clearly, after 7 years they were giving him such a great chance to win with Larry Hughes, Mo Williams and Antawn Jamison).. then he's greedy.. but not taking enough money... leaving Miami at the first sign of trouble (I guess he should just hang out there the rest of his career regardless of how much the team around him declines)

Anything the guy does is a problem for certain people. Jordan never would have gotten a cramp in an NBA finals game! Jordan never would have left his team! (No shit, he didn't have to)

It just is what it is. Some people will never let it go.

he said something crazy in a crowd full of Heat fans right after he signed that was his plan? Hilarious.

but I don't fit into that category at all. I didn't hate him for leaving Cleveland at all. I didn't hate him for doing his show. I didn't hate him for teaming up with his boys to try and win 7 titles. That being said, I'm not buying this going home crap.

Some people will defend Lebron no matter what and fall for the BS storylines. It is what it is, some people are just fanboys.

kmed.. the whole "going home" thing is definitely part PR spin to try and reclaim his "good guy" image from pre-Miami but it's just stuff that I don't even think matters. I pay no attention to it. I don't care why he went back there I just think from a basketball standpoint it made sense and there's probably some modicum of truth to the idea that he actually does like Cleveland. If they had a shitty team, I don't think he would have gone there but why should he have? The idea is to win, so. A guy in the prime of his career needs to go somewhere that it is feasible.

Some people seem to think LeBron should just go to the worst team in the league and win a chip on his own and that's the way to prove his greatness. It's just so silly.

Those who are upset at lebron will always be upset at him and those who have forgiven are not going to suddenly unforgive him.

No amount of debating will change peoples opinions on him. Period.

I saw a thread about a potential trade (wiggins for Love) that could be the most intriguing trade of our generation considering how high Wiggins ceiling is and just wanted to see the debate on that lol.

is sort of telling about his character. When he left Cleveland, he left with a challenge of winning a plethora of championships(7+ according to Lebron). He left Cleveland because they put a bad team around him and he didn't want to wait around for them to get better. They were contenders in cleveland, but clearly they were contenders because Lebron was on the team. It would have been a challenge to stay and win, but I understand why he left.

Then the whole madness of going to miami with the show and the introduction and all that garbage. As soon as that challenge looks tough. He bolts to "go home". It just so happens that home has 3 #1 draft picks in the past 4 years. They have Kyrie locked up to a max and a plethora of assets to add talent with Lebron(as well as future assets to add). I think it's lame that he ran from another challenge, this one that HE created.

him for going back. There is definitely some truth to the letter he wrote (who wouldn't want to win for their hometown team?), but I just think it's comical how people are treating this as some kind of redemption quest when it isn't anything of the sort. He's going to a younger, more talented team than the one he's leaving. It's the right move, but just don't tell me you're going home to redeem what you did 4 years ago. It's silly. You're going home because they give you the best chance to win in the near future.

but I am not a Lebron hater by any stretch. At least not any more than I hate every other star that has beaten, beats or will beat the Knicks. I am calling this situation for what it is and despite all the people that feel the need to defend Lebron because they always defend Lebron, do not pigeon hole me as some Lebron hater. I am not a hater at all.

In comment 11772058 MookGiants said:

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he said something crazy in a crowd full of Heat fans right after he signed that was his plan? Hilarious.

Right... hilarious to take a guy at his word.

Lebron took a 2 year contract so when his contract expires the Cavs better hope the cap goes up as much as they are saying because they are going to need cap space to resign Lebron....

they wont have his bird rights so if they are over the cap h ewont be able to get the max from Cavs....they better be very smart with their spending

after 2 years, did that change?

It's no different than Melo's "letter to the fans" about how he wants to ride or die for NY. No, he wanted to get paid the most money and that was his motivation. Nothing more. The rest is nonsense. If he could have made more elsewhere, he would have been gone.

I still think Cleveland will be somewhat challenging for LeBron. I don't think they're just going to steamroll the East by any stretch. Sure, it's a promising situation with room for huge potential but from his perspective it made a ton of sense.

I don't think we should really hold it against a player for wanting to win and put himself in the best situation to do so. Is that really worse than just taking the most money and maxing out even if it means not having much chance of a chip?

I think love is a no go for them. Soon Thompson and waiters will need to get paid or traded

In comment 11772084 kmed said:

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after 2 years, did that change?

Its 3 now

For taking the most money and staying on a non contender and lebron gets bashed for taking less to go to a better situation. I don't get it

In comment 11772091 giantsfan44ab said:

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For taking the most money and staying on a non contender and lebron gets bashed for taking less to go to a better situation. I don't get it

You'll never get anything when you keep looking at things in a bubble.

is directly tied to D-Wade's health. So it's not like LeBron left Miami because they weren't good enough. He left Miami because he doesn't trust D-Wade to stay healthy. How can you possibly blame him for that?

Knicks fans have been making excuses with Melo for years because they think playing with an injury-prone Amare hurt the Knicks tremendously. But now you guys think LeBron should've stayed in Miami next to Wade? A guy who can only play 2/3rd's of Miami's games and still not be healthy for the playoffs? I don't blame LeBron one bit for not wanting to hitch his wagon to D-Wade.

It's ridiculous that you guys blame LeBron for seeing what we all see when it comes to Wade.

In comment 11772080 EricNY33 said:

Quote:

In comment 11772058 MookGiants said: Quote: he said something crazy in a crowd full of Heat fans right after he signed that was his plan? Hilarious. Right... hilarious to take a guy at his word.

If we start taking athletes at their word during parades/celebrations in front of tons of fans then get ready to rip a lot of players.

I guess when guys guarantee they're going to do it again next year after a parade in front of the fans they should be ripped to, right?

He didnt say this in a press conference with media asking questions. He said it in front of an arena full of heat fans. He was fucking around, but somehow gets ripped for it.

In comment 11772048 LawrenceTaylor56 said:

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of arguing this anymore?

LOL! Right?! That's why I've been sitting here reading this thread while shaking my head and laughing and refusing to get involved with kmed and others who insist on making sure everyone knows for a FACT that LeBron went back to Cleveland because it was easier for him (like any of us would willingly take the 'hard road') to win a championship and they could pay him and that the whole 'Going home' story is nothing but a huge bunch of crap. I came to the conclusion after the last thread about this that there's no changing kmed's, and those that agree with him, mind and to just let them stew over LeBron's choices while banging their keyboards and yelling 'I HATE LEBRON!!!'.

telling us repeatedly that they 'have no problem with what LeBron did'. LOL!

thanks.

In comment 11772086 arcarsenal said:

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It's no different than Melo's "letter to the fans" about how he wants to ride or die for NY. No, he wanted to get paid the most money and that was his motivation. Nothing more. The rest is nonsense. If he could have made more elsewhere, he would have been gone. I still think Cleveland will be somewhat challenging for LeBron. I don't think they're just going to steamroll the East by any stretch. Sure, it's a promising situation with room for huge potential but from his perspective it made a ton of sense. I don't think we should really hold it against a player for wanting to win and put himself in the best situation to do so. Is that really worse than just taking the most money and maxing out even if it means not having much chance of a chip?

But I am not ripping him for choosing Cleveland. It makes the best basketball sense. It was the right move, and one most of us would make. However... don't sell it as this noble return to my hometown because "I didn't understand how much it meant to me four years ago" Home is always home. It always means something to you. Being away does make you miss it, but it's still home. He lives there in the Summer regardless. It's not like he never went back in the 4 years he was in Miami. He chose the Cavs because they have the better situation now, which is fine.

In comment 11772098 MookGiants said:

Quote:

In comment 11772080 EricNY33 said: Quote: In comment 11772058 MookGiants said: Quote: he said something crazy in a crowd full of Heat fans right after he signed that was his plan? Hilarious. Right... hilarious to take a guy at his word. If we start taking athletes at their word during parades/celebrations in front of tons of fans then get ready to rip a lot of players. I guess when guys guarantee they're going to do it again next year after a parade in front of the fans they should be ripped to, right? He didnt say this in a press conference with media asking questions. He said it in front of an arena full of heat fans. He was fucking around, but somehow gets ripped for it.

Exactly

In comment 11772115 EricNY33 said:

Quote:

In comment 11772086 arcarsenal said: Quote: It's no different than Melo's "letter to the fans" about how he wants to ride or die for NY. No, he wanted to get paid the most money and that was his motivation. Nothing more. The rest is nonsense. If he could have made more elsewhere, he would have been gone. I still think Cleveland will be somewhat challenging for LeBron. I don't think they're just going to steamroll the East by any stretch. Sure, it's a promising situation with room for huge potential but from his perspective it made a ton of sense. I don't think we should really hold it against a player for wanting to win and put himself in the best situation to do so. Is that really worse than just taking the most money and maxing out even if it means not having much chance of a chip? But I am not ripping him for choosing Cleveland. It makes the best basketball sense. It was the right move, and one most of us would make. However... don't sell it as this noble return to my hometown because "I didn't understand how much it meant to me four years ago" Home is always home. It always means something to you. Being away does make you miss it, but it's still home. He lives there in the Summer regardless. It's not like he never went back in the 4 years he was in Miami. He chose the Cavs because they have the better situation now, which is fine.

I know, but that's all just PR shit. It doesn't really matter. Melo's statement was full of nonsense, too. It's just a way to "make nice" with all the fans and move on from "the decision" era for good.

In comment 11772125 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

In comment 11772115 EricNY33 said: Quote: In comment 11772086 arcarsenal said: Quote: It's no different than Melo's "letter to the fans" about how he wants to ride or die for NY. No, he wanted to get paid the most money and that was his motivation. Nothing more. The rest is nonsense. If he could have made more elsewhere, he would have been gone. I still think Cleveland will be somewhat challenging for LeBron. I don't think they're just going to steamroll the East by any stretch. Sure, it's a promising situation with room for huge potential but from his perspective it made a ton of sense. I don't think we should really hold it against a player for wanting to win and put himself in the best situation to do so. Is that really worse than just taking the most money and maxing out even if it means not having much chance of a chip? But I am not ripping him for choosing Cleveland. It makes the best basketball sense. It was the right move, and one most of us would make. However... don't sell it as this noble return to my hometown because "I didn't understand how much it meant to me four years ago" Home is always home. It always means something to you. Being away does make you miss it, but it's still home. He lives there in the Summer regardless. It's not like he never went back in the 4 years he was in Miami. He chose the Cavs because they have the better situation now, which is fine. I know, but that's all just PR shit. It doesn't really matter. Melo's statement was full of nonsense, too. It's just a way to "make nice" with all the fans and move on from "the decision" era for good.

By the way... nice to see you back around here!

Is that no one actually bought his bullshit. LeBron's bullshit has been plastered everywhere. People genuinely believe this.

I also don't understand why people are acting like posters on here are hammering LeBron because they think what he said is bullshit. I'm glad he's back in Cleveland, but also realize this was the best opportunity for him to win a championship and that was his main goal. The two don't have to be mutually exclusive.

the city absolutely detested him. The environment during those original Big 3 Heat @ Cleveland game was ridiculous. After all that abuse that he took, him coming back IS a major aspect of the story. There's no doubt that his family was against this move, they saw how he was treated when he left. LeBron had to think long and hard about going back.

LeBron "going home" being portrayed as the absolute main reason why he returned is BS. We all know it's PR spin to make him look as good as he can. We all know that he's worried about D-Wade's health and sees the Cavs as a young team on the rise if they can land Love to pair up with Kyrie. Winning was a part of his decision. But I think "going home" was still a major part of his decision as well.

Would he have gone to Milwaukee or Atlanta if they were in the same situation as Cleveland? I seriously doubt that. No fucking way he goes to Milwaukee in any circumstance. No fucking way he goes to Cleveland if he didn't like Cleveland more than the usual athlete.

Either way, I agree that we should be done with this.

So... Eric Bledsoe? WTF is gonna happen there? Notoriously Cheap Owner + An Agent everyone hates = more drama than expected. Please Based God, allow Morey to pull something crazy out of his ass! Bledsoe could easily end up being the 2nd best player from this FA class if he stays healthy.

I mean let's face it: LeBron won't be the first or last player to flee a close-to-championship-level team and sign with the perennial powerhouse that is the consummately managed Cleveland Cavaliers. They're always there to jump ship to at the first sign of a challenge, and when you bail in favor of a team stocked with a fringe top 10 player at one position and then maybe one top 30 player at the remaining four, your ring-chasing motives are transparent.

The Greek Freak is getting extended action as the PG of the Bucks. A 6'11" player with what seems like an 8' wingspan... playing PG.

For as much hype as Wiggins and Parker have received, Giannis is probably the better young prospect right now with arguably the highest ceiling of all 3. Just a crazy talent.

In comment 11772086 arcarsenal said:

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I still think Cleveland will be somewhat challenging for LeBron. I don't think they're just going to steamroll the East by any stretch.

What?? You don't mean to say that the East's hapless teams won't be steamrolled by the following historic collection of talent:

Kyrie Irving
Matthew Dellasomething
Carrick Felix
Joe Harris
Brendan Haywood
THE Anthony Bennett
Dwight Powell
Tristan Thompson
Anderson Varejao
Dion Waiters
Andrew Wiggins

Could be a transcendent 2 way player the way he is playing. He can pull up for 3s now it seems like. Looks a lot more comfortable with the ball in his hands now, granted it's just summer league but still.

And the prospect forgotten I think is Anthony Davis. He's on a level that I don't think Parker not Wiggins could ever reach. In 3 years I think he will be up there with KD and lebron and possibly griffin , and everyone else will be on the next level down.

no one else in the NBA has close to the trade value of Davis. Health is the only thing stopping him from becoming a legendary player.

.

Underperformed heavily but watching him in summer league it seems unbelievable how high his ceiling is. He's so quick and athletic and when he's on the jumper is automatic. I daresay he reminds me if D Wade with a 3 but it could still be years for him to develop fully

the "best opportunity" to win championship, which the Cavaliers decidedly don't present, and then there's the "most appealing opportunity" to win a championship. I bet winning a championship with a Cleveland team -- as hard as it will be -- is certainly a very appealing possibility to LeBron. It would be historic, and it would be sentimental to him and celebrated by others in a way it wouldn't be elsewhere.

Of course he's got to be sitting there thinking, "Holy shit, it would be so awesome to win a championship here." But he'd be silly to think, "This place presents a chance to win a championship that no one else does."

coming out. Not many prospects have the potential to participate in both the Dunk Contest and 3pt Contest. I felt like I could see McLemore in either contest one day. He just had a great combination of athleticism and shooting.

I don't think he has the handles to get to the rim at will like D-Wade or Harden or some of the other elite guards. I think that will limit him somewhat. But I still like him even after the disappointing rookie year.

In comment 11772177 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:

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coming out. Not many prospects have the potential to participate in both the Dunk Contest and 3pt Contest. I felt like I could see McLemore in either contest one day. He just had a great combination of athleticism and shooting. I don't think he has the handles to get to the rim at will like D-Wade or Harden or some of the other elite guards. I think that will limit him somewhat. But I still like him even after the disappointing rookie year.

True but he was getting compared to Ray Allen coming out and while the 3 point shot isn't there he's far more athletic. He's the type of off ball player that can become a 20+Ppg type of player.

Quote:

So... Eric Bledsoe? WTF is gonna happen there? Notoriously Cheap Owner + An Agent everyone hates = more drama than expected. Please Based God, allow Morey to pull something crazy out of his ass! Bledsoe could easily end up being the 2nd best player from this FA class if he stays healthy.

It's been said that Bledsoe is looking for 5/80 and Suns are offering 4/48. That's a pretty substantial disagreement.

In comment 11772086 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

It's no different than Melo's "letter to the fans" about how he wants to ride or die for NY. No, he wanted to get paid the most money and that was his motivation. Nothing more. The rest is nonsense. If he could have made more elsewhere, he would have been gone. I still think Cleveland will be somewhat challenging for LeBron. I don't think they're just going to steamroll the East by any stretch. Sure, it's a promising situation with room for huge potential but from his perspective it made a ton of sense. I don't think we should really hold it against a player for wanting to win and put himself in the best situation to do so. Is that really worse than just taking the most money and maxing out even if it means not having much chance of a chip?

On point! 👌

Thread Over..

In comment 11772164 santacruzom said:

Quote:

In comment 11772086 arcarsenal said: Quote: I still think Cleveland will be somewhat challenging for LeBron. I don't think they're just going to steamroll the East by any stretch. What?? You don't mean to say that the East's hapless teams won't be steamrolled by the following historic collection of talent: Kyrie Irving Matthew Dellasomething Carrick Felix Joe Harris Brendan Haywood THE Anthony Bennett Dwight Powell Tristan Thompson Anderson Varejao Dion Waiters Andrew Wiggins

Lebron took alot lesser talent in both Cleveland (and arguably Miami last year with a broken down Wade and a bunch of spare parts) to the finals.

This team if the young guys develop is likely better than Miami was last year and most definitely the Cleveland team he took to the finals.

I'd like to officially change my stance now. The cast in Cleveland blows and he is taking on a massive challenge.

Too late kmed! You're stuck with him now!

In comment 11772021 kmed said:

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would be the same for Lebron James.

As opposed to any other city in this country? It's not like Lebron couldnt nail the hottest girl / model in a bar in NYC... or LA... or Vegas.. or Dallas.. or Houston...

so, stupid point, kmed

In comment 11772274 Big_Blue_Wrecking_Crew said:

Quote:

In comment 11772164 santacruzom said: Quote: In comment 11772086 arcarsenal said: Quote: I still think Cleveland will be somewhat challenging for LeBron. I don't think they're just going to steamroll the East by any stretch. What?? You don't mean to say that the East's hapless teams won't be steamrolled by the following historic collection of talent: Kyrie Irving Matthew Dellasomething Carrick Felix Joe Harris Brendan Haywood THE Anthony Bennett Dwight Powell Tristan Thompson Anderson Varejao Dion Waiters Andrew Wiggins Lebron took alot lesser talent in both Cleveland (and arguably Miami last year with a broken down Wade and a bunch of spare parts) to the finals. This team if the young guys develop is likely better than Miami was last year and most definitely the Cleveland team he took to the finals.

Right, because he's that good. But the roster without him isn't some loaded destination that presented him with the easiest route to a championship.

However, I *do* think it presented him with some fun, appealing components. But then, the next thing you know people will be blasting him for wanting to have fun playing the game.

In comment 11772381 MetsAreBack said:

Quote:

In comment 11772021 kmed said: Quote: would be the same for Lebron James. As opposed to any other city in this country? It's not like Lebron couldnt nail the hottest girl / model in a bar in NYC... or LA... or Vegas.. or Dallas.. or Houston... so, stupid point, kmed

I think his point was that Lebron would experience a much different Miami than either you or I would.

In comment 11772026 dep026 said:

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Lived a cool ass life in Miami.

And Henrik Lundqvist lives a cool ass life in NYC
And Kobe and Shaq have apparently lived cool ass lives in LA
And Wilt Chamberlain lived a cool ass life everywhere he played

I get that Miami is a fun place to visit. So is Vegas - i guess that makes Vegas a "paradise" to live in?

As a US professional player i'd be kind of annoyed if its the kind of town where the day after you leave if you're walking the streets you'll hear more discussion about Brazil's world cup meltdown than you did about Lebron leaving. This fan base and city never deserved Lebron.

And Fuck Pat Riley

Wasn't even worth me trying to explain.

what Lebron can accomplish without even playing a game. He's already elevated Anthony Bennett and Dion Waiters from "bust" and "selfish headcase" to "promising young players".

People talk about how superstars can improve the players around them. Usually that's done on court. But Lebron is so powerful, he can get it done 3 months before tipoff.