NFT: Knicks chat 7/22

As Jackson had to convince Jordan, Fisher will have to convince Anthony that sticking with the triangle and trusting his teammates will ultimately make the game easier for him. That process of building trust and chemistry was always a work in progress with Jordan, who often fought the constraints the offense put on his one-on-one game. But Jordan had achieved more success to that point in his pro career than Anthony has. Jordan's Bulls had made three straight conference finals, losing each time to Detroit; Anthony has only been once, with the Nuggets in 2009. And Jordan had already won two of his five MVPs. "'Melo can definitely do it," Hardaway, Jr., said. "He showed it a lot in the season, believe it or not. When we was double-teamed, when he was trapped, he was always finding that open guy. It was very rare for him to shoot through three or four guys. He'll succeed through this offense. Everybody has to trust in it, not only one person, but everybody has to." NBA.com - See more at: http://hoopshype.com/rumors.htm#sthash.1A3OORvT.dpuf

There are conflicting reports regarding Steve Mills� interest in becoming the new executive director of the players� union. It has been reported that Mills, who was rehired by the Knicks last September, is a top candidate for the job. However, a league source told the Daily News that Mills recently removed his name from consideration. Mills is currently the GM under Jackson, who recently said the two are working well together. New York Daily News
Rumors tagsNew York Knicks, NBPA, Steve Mills
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There is a lot of debate on what the Knicks starting lineup is going to be this season, but I still think they have another move in them to open up playing time for Tim Hardaway Jr.

how did Hardaway's defense look? I saw his stat lines from a points standpoint, so it's clear he's doing well there

with the starting lineup. Well i guess just the SG and C position. Personally id go with Dalembert at center just to help out with D and id prolly go with JR at SG since he is the best combination of offensive/Defensive of all our 2 guards. So i guess id go:

Calderon
JR
Melo
Amare
Dalembert

With Larkin, THJR, Shumpert, Smith and Bargs as the bench.

defensively but its really hard to get a feel for that during summer league. The games are such a cluster and the quality of player is obviously not as good as it would be in the regular season.

general summer league is more fun than anything notable. Defense/pacing/talent is nowhere near NBA caliber on the whole.

I think of summer league as being close to the level of streetball when it comes to team defense, but sometimes you can see if an individual improves at all. I'm just hesitant to trade Shump if THjr hasn't improved at all on the defensive end.

Calderon
Shump
Melo
Amare
Dalembert

THJR as the 6th man. Larkin as the backup PG. Smith as the backup big, Bargs as the other big off the bench.

I think he comes off the bench with Bargnani...

Calderon
Smith
Melo
Stat
Smith

yeah id be ok with Smith starting as well, i was just going with dalembert since you have enough offense with that starting lineup to deal with Dalembert's lack of offensive. If you play him with a second unit with most likely at least larkin/shumpert his lack of offense could hurt more

In comment 11775841 kmed said:

Quote:

Calderon Shump Melo Amare Dalembert THJR as the 6th man. Larkin as the backup PG. Smith as the backup big, Bargs as the other big off the bench.

Give up the dream, my friend. J.R. is probably gonna be here for awhile.

tweeted his probable starting 5 last week and he has Bargs as the starting center. Probably just him spitballing but I took note of it.

Also... Jason Smith probably wouldn't start over Cole Aldrich either.

No shump and bargs/amare. The worst defensive team ever put on the floor.

but not right away, I don't think. So, Dalembert starts but plays limited minutes. The center spot is going to be an odd mismash, with at least Amare also getting time, and maybe even Bargnani. Jackson has said that he thinks center is Amare's best position. Maybe that helps Smith, who plays the high post with Amare down low and defends opposing centers.

And unless they come up with another 3 (and give up on Tyler at least for now), Early has to be in the mix pretty quickly. They need more size at the backup 3 against many teams than Shump or Smith. On the other hand, if Smith or Shump play really well during the exhibition season (more likely Smith), they may concede some size for the extra offense. If JR really gets on his game, and I believe he might, the extra offense at the 3 could be really helpful, especially if Hardaway is taking most of the minutes at the 2.

That's what exhibition season is for. Other than probably adding a 3, I believe they will let the 2/3 sort themselves out before doing any more trading that just brings back a pick. The pick could be a lot better than right now if either Shump or Smith raise their game with much better coaching.

minutes melo sits out you can get away with the SG's playing some SF. Its not ideal, but its def doable.

And i dont see how you can start bargs/amare together. They should almost never play at the same time. Bad rebounders and horrible defenders. Amare should only play about 25 minutes a game id guess so give the other 20-25 to bargs and let smith/dalembert split the center minutes.

50 Knicks ever, discuss (no knock on Oakley but he's too high for me).
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NESN ‏@NESN 1m
Report: Kevin Love Trade To Cavaliers �Deal Is Done�; No Timetable Given

In comment 11775895 Anakim said:

Quote:

NESN �@NESN 1m Report: Kevin Love Trade To Cavaliers �Deal Is Done�; No Timetable Given

Read the article...the source is a little know radio station in Portland..

a HUGE story if it were true.

I feel like it's pretty much expected at this point.

Rubio/Wiggins may be the greatest boom/bust backcourt of all-time if this goes through.

this season the worst frontcourt in basketball history? Trying to think of worse.

The assumption seems to be that Melo virtually never plays the 4 in this system with this roster. I don't know the triangle, but I do see the roster mismatches. Do you think that's right?

Ha come on

In comment 11776077 PaulBlakeTSU said:

Quote:

this season the worst frontcourt in basketball history? Trying to think of worse.

the mere presence of Melo makes the answer "no", however outside of him? Yeah, it's pretty thin.

in the triangle is the secondary offensive option/facilitator. PG feeds the post, post feeds the scorer ala Jordan. A Marc Gasol, Greg Monroe type would be awesome. Chandler's poor passing/hands were never going to work. Amar'e potentially could do pretty well in this offense (when healthy)

is going to be our offense.

In comment 11776085 manh george said:

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The assumption seems to be that Melo virtually never plays the 4 in this system with this roster. I don't know the triangle, but I do see the roster mismatches. Do you think that's right?

To me, the key to Melo playing the 4 was the matchups. Fours can't match his quickness and threes can't match his strength. It's less important in the Triangle because the positions matter less. With the triangle, the players can all be out in the wing, or in the low post, depending on the matchups and what the defense does. It's kind of about having a three man (triangles for spacing) game and having two weak side guys. It's not unlike the spacing that the Knicks used so well with Discount double check. It's just that instead of kind of randomly passing the ball around, there's a system that dictates where the ball should go. Melo will get the ball on the wing in this system and in the post and he's excellent at both.

In that regard, it's a little like the Gilbride read and react (gulp).
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paper the defense is going to be absolutely horrendous. Hopefully the defensive scheme is good enough to improve it more than the talent.

if GW is in your franchise top 20 that says all you need to know about your franchise...I still love this damn team though.

he played in the Princeton offense in College which put him at the elbow and the offense was run through him...he found cutters and the open shooters...very good passer for a big man...

As for the big man depth on the Knicks...I think the Center spot they are ok between Dalembert, Aldrich and Smith...all 3 can do the dirty work on the boards....Dalembert isnt a complete bust on the offensive end like Chandler, Aldrich has a nice little jump hook and can do a little bit on the offensive end... Smith has a nice mid range jump shot and can rebound and is not afraid to be a physical player...

If those 3 can stay healthy center should be fine...the question is what do you do at the 4...do you start Stat and bargs off the bench and can they even stay healthy and combined play 82 games?...doubtful

Amar'e is healthy there is no way a 3/4 of Melo and Amar'e is part of any worst frontcourt in ANY team's history.

I know Amar'e isn't what he was, but it's not like he's gone from All-Star to Saer Sene.

might be 3 of the worst defensive players at their respective positions in the NBA.

but with a world-class player at the 3, and a whole bunch of viable mediocre players at the 4/5, its a lot better than teams that didn't have a star, and didn't even have quality second-tier depth at the 5--like the Knicks before Melo. 2009 Knicks? Now THAT was a lot worse frontcourt. When Earl Baron upgrades the center position, you are in very sad shape.
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In comment 11776133 kmed said:

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might be 3 of the worst defensive players at their respective positions in the NBA.

Yeah, we need to make sure that we never have more than two on the floor at the same time.

accountability should result in any group of of paid professional basketball players producing an average or slightly below average defense. That would be a decent improvement over last year's 24th ranked outfit.

In comment 11776137 BeerFridge said:

Quote:

In comment 11776133 kmed said: Quote: might be 3 of the worst defensive players at their respective positions in the NBA. Yeah, we need to make sure that we never have more than two on the floor at the same time.

With Woodson gone i dont think we will have to worry about it...I think 1 of Dalembert, Smith or Aldrich will be on the court at all times with Amare or bargs...

would improve the defense that had about 5 different people playing a different system at all times last year. Accountability will be nice as well. It's amazing to me to hear about the players doing what they wanted last year on defense and yet never one did Woodson change anything. Never once did he hold anyone accountable. Boggles my mind.

we just need to hope its close enough to average that it doesnt completely ruin our year. Everyone on the same page can make a defense average so that is what we need to shoot for. And hopefully the offense is good enough to win some games.

watching a team actually have an offensive system with ball movement and cutters not give the ball to Melo and everyone clear out and just stand there and watch...

also the defensive system i cant wait to actually watch players stay with their man rather than switch on absolutely everything...excited not to see Dalembert guarding Chris Paul

compared to the mess that the Knicks were last season, but they had the THIRD best defense last year...and it's not like they have a roster full of stoppers. System + effort should at least make us competitive on defense. At least against the bottom half of the league.

nice honor for him...
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Calderon/Dalembert were part of the 22nd ranked defense last year. And that's on a team that was contending and has a great coach. However, perhaps their numbers would have looked a lot better if they played in the eastern conference and not in a division with 4th, 6th, 13th, and 15th ranked offenses.

that defense also included Dirk in his mid 30s, Monta Ellis, and Brandon Wright playing rim protector when Dalambert was sitting. And it still ranked higher than the Knicks D.

The Legend of Earl Barron!

will only re-sign with the Pistons if Josh Smith is traded. This graph might be a reason why...

quote real?

Josh Smith is an all star level PF and a terrible SF. Can't space the floor but a beast in the post and interior defense.

and I don't ever see him a part of a winning program. He's as selfish as they come and I don't ever see him doing what it takes to win. I wouldn't take him if he cost $1 million and came as a FA, that's how much I hate him and players like him. He will never win.

Barron's name...

NBA Central ‏@TheNBACentral 10s
YAHOO: The Timberwolves are ready to agree on a trade deal if Cleveland sends Wiggins and multiple 1st Rd Picks.