NFT: Mets - Phils - Wheeler on the hound

In comment 11787118 pjcas18 said:

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has developed into a valuable reliever. He's still 24 years old, is this it for him? Not complaining just wondering. I know he was a one-time starter and then potential closer, late inning relievers are needed too, but is this where he winds up?

He's a future closer. I would honestly try mejia as a starter again. Thought familia was leading off the inning.

and has really taken to it. Why would you want to switch him yet again to a starter at this point?

Great insurance policy for Mejia - as both unquestionably have closer stuff, but have yet to prove they can handle the big stage.

everytime I see Tim Teufel I chuckle.

Phillies are imploding

.

Like this game is over. Mets batting around in the 7th

"tejada with 3 hits today.. he can't hit against anyone else, but he can sure hit the Phillies"

awesome

Familia!!!

way to go! 1st hit? 1st RBI?? I wonder

career 2-3 .667 average

Familia-Mejia need to stay where they are. Having a reliable 8th and 9th inning guy together like that is a very valuable asset. You tell your SP you just need him to get you through 6.. you mix and match your MRP's to get through the 7th and then you go to Jeurys/Jenrry to slam the door.

I think Black's stuff is just as/almost as good as those two.

It's not a bad problem to have. Bullpens can come together fast. In April, everyone was cursing Alderson saying "he STILL hasn't fixed the fucking bullpen!"

I was mad, too. I thought it was going to be a problem again all year.

where they can find a dominant left handed middle reliever.

next year Parnell and Hefner in the pen

In comment 11787106 PhiPsi125 said:

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Um, no there wasn't. I dont think ive seen a single complaint about Flores being in the lineup...EVER. So, not sure where you are seeing that at all. What I dont get is the people that are content with Tejada getting any playing time over Flores. Thats the mind boggling part.

You complain about Flores getting the start against Hamels in this thread! I just don't get that. Why wouldn't you want him to face a good pitcher?

It's mind boggling people would not be upset over a guy hitting .222 with 1 hr, 7 RBI's and 3 walks not playing every day?

Duda LAUNCHED that.

jeez

In comment 11787157 feelflows said:

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I think Black's stuff is just as/almost as good as those two.

Black-Familia-Mejia as your 7-8-9 inning guys as a group is just about as good as any in baseball.

They just need to boost the offense and they will be in contention for years.

I'm not worthy!

for the next series.

of pen talent. That's what happens when you have lots of SP prospects -- you end up with some starters hopefully, but always some decent options for the pen.

We might even be able to trade a RHP RP this offseason for help elsewhere. Would be great to see Parnell come back 100% -- get 6 great innings from young/recovering/brittle guys and turn things over to a reliable pen.

away Gee? He has a bit of injury issues and we have a glut of good young right handers in the organization.

aumont guy is brutal

You seriously can't figure out why people want to see Wilmer Flores get a shot to play SS instead of Ruben Tejada?

Aumont is in, the Phillis are basically conceding

I can understand the Tejada fatigue. It feels like he's been here forever hitting .240 with mediocre defense. But half the posts in game threads are about Flores/Tejada and Flores is having about as bad a year at the plate as you can have. I can't get worked up about our battle to hit 8th in the lineup. If Flores wants to be in the lineup he needs to get on base more when he plays.

To me the anger would be better served at the organization for saddling Collins with these options in the first place.

Is a back-up at best with a spot start here and there. Him having 3 hits today doesn't change that.

In comment 11787156 arcarsenal said:

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Familia-Mejia need to stay where they are. Having a reliable 8th and 9th inning guy together like that is a very valuable asset. You tell your SP you just need him to get you through 6.. you mix and match your MRP's to get through the 7th and then you go to Jeurys/Jenrry to slam the door.

Then trade Parnell?

if he's healthy he's at worst an 8th inning guy and Vic Black is 8th inning guy/closer potential too.

All these guys have 8th inning/closer potential and would be wasted in long/middle relief roles:

Parnell
Mejia
Familia
Black

I'm not saying to trade anyone, just not sure how you keep them all and keep them happy.

In comment 11787205 butler said:

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I can understand the Tejada fatigue. It feels like he's been here forever hitting .240 with mediocre defense. But half the posts in game threads are about Flores/Tejada and Flores is having about as bad a year at the plate as you can have. I can't get worked up about our battle to hit 8th in the lineup. If Flores wants to be in the lineup he needs to get on base more when he plays. To me the anger would be better served at the organization for saddling Collins with these options in the first place.

Flores has has 90 at-bats in spot-starting/back up role.

You're not serious are you?

you know he had a .935 OPS in AAA. You can add tejada's last two seasons OPS together and it's just barely over .935 (ok slight exaggeration, but he's not good and Flores could be).

In comment 11787168 butler said:

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In comment 11787106 PhiPsi125 said: Quote: Um, no there wasn't. I dont think ive seen a single complaint about Flores being in the lineup...EVER. So, not sure where you are seeing that at all. What I dont get is the people that are content with Tejada getting any playing time over Flores. Thats the mind boggling part. You complain about Flores getting the start against Hamels in this thread! I just don't get that. Why wouldn't you want him to face a good pitcher? It's mind boggling people would not be upset over a guy hitting .222 with 1 hr, 7 RBI's and 3 walks not playing every day?

Well, then you missed the blatantly obvious sarcasm...same as last night.

I dont want to get too deep into this again because its beating a dead horse...but, Flores has raked at every level consistently for years. Yet, he gets hardly any playing time. Im not surprised his numbers arent great - he barely plays. We know what Tejada is - an adequate defender and very poor hitter (even with todays performance). Let the kid play.

Thats all I will say about that, because we've been through this enough.

In comment 11787209 pjcas18 said:

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All these guys have 8th inning/closer potential and would be wasted in long/middle relief roles: Parnell Mejia Familia Black I'm not saying to trade anyone, just not sure how you keep them all and keep them happy.

Problem will work itself out next year. If everyone is pitching well we can look to make a trade. If we're not contending, a healthy Parnell is either resigned as a closer or traded to a contender. Torres and Edgin have also contributed nicely. Really like Torres, as a non setup/closer reliever.

In comment 11787209 pjcas18 said:

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In comment 11787156 arcarsenal said: Quote: Familia-Mejia need to stay where they are. Having a reliable 8th and 9th inning guy together like that is a very valuable asset. You tell your SP you just need him to get you through 6.. you mix and match your MRP's to get through the 7th and then you go to Jeurys/Jenrry to slam the door. Then trade Parnell? if he's healthy he's at worst an 8th inning guy and Vic Black is 8th inning guy/closer potential too. All these guys have 8th inning/closer potential and would be wasted in long/middle relief roles: Parnell Mejia Familia Black I'm not saying to trade anyone, just not sure how you keep them all and keep them happy.

If Parnell has trade value, I'd move him without blinking.

is and I hate the cliche but relievers for the most part are fungible.

none of them have a ton of value unless they're a closer at the trade deadline to a contender in need of a closer.

is there a precedent of late inning relievers being traded for value?

In comment 11787157 feelflows said:

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I think Black's stuff is just as/almost as good as those two.

Not until he learns to control him. Right now, you have to keep him in that 7th inning roll.

In comment 11787135 Eric on Li said:

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Great insurance policy for Mejia - as both unquestionably have closer stuff, but have yet to prove they can handle the big stage.

I put him right up there with Familia right there with Harvey. Unless you're talking Stanton, got to keep him.

In comment 11787242 Rflairr said:

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In comment 11787157 feelflows said: Quote: I think Black's stuff is just as/almost as good as those two. Not until he learns to control him. Right now, you have to keep him in that 7th inning roll.

Talenttwise he's below familia but he's got closer potential. And he does need to have better control.

.864

Only Goldschidmt and Rizzo better among 1B in the NL.

In fact compare his numbers to Freddie Freeman. It might surprise you. With almost 100 less at bats.

Black is 26, but not a FA until 2020
Mejia is 24, not a FA until 2019
Familia is also 24, and not a FA until 2019

they'll all get good $$ in arbitration, but nice to have options.

Parnell is 29 and still not a FA until 2016

You know their agents want them to start, or worst case close, middle relievers must make a fraction of the money of starters and closers.

Literally 1 month ago I was crushing him because his stats were average at best, and as Francesa says seemingly "empty", but I was 100% wrong. Over this past month he has shown growth and patience that completely justify the argument the Mets tried to make in the first place - that his previous splits when he played 1B and personality indicated that he could see improvement if given time and patience in that role. He could still revert but the point is he's now shown, beyond any doubts, the promise to justify being given the bigger opportunity.

Almost hard to believe how much improvement has occurred with TDA and Duda over the last month.

No hyperbole, either.


Freeman 411 AB, 70 R, 117 H, 29 2B, 15 HR, 59 RBI, 56 BB, 91 K
Frazier 405 AB, 60 R, 113 H, 17 2B, 20 HR, 55 RBI, 33 BB, 96 K
Morneau 337 AB, 38 R, 105 H, 21 2B, 13 HR, 62 RBI, 19 BB, 40 K
Duda 319 AB, 45 R, 83 H, 22 2B, 18 HR, 57 RBI, 44 BB, 79 K
LaRoche 312 AB, 43 R, 84 H, 13 2B, 13 HR, 55 RBI, 52 BB, 67 K

If he could have LaRoche's career except with a bit more power and staying healthy, you have to love that.

100% buying Lucas Duda. His "decline" coincided with 1) being out of position 2) A return to the patient/piss over Keith/Gary/Ron approach he showed earlier in his career

knock on Duda but Frazier is doing this while playing 3b (above average there no less). Duda has been very good, Frazier significantly more valuable.

if no one else has been good for Duda. He appears to have got him away from just sitting there looking at pitches.

He attacks now. That hit against the lefty today. He didn't sit there and let the lefty get up on him with 2 strikes. He was aggressive.

In comment 11787275 EmpireWF said:

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If he could have LaRoche's career except with a bit more power and staying healthy, you have to love that.

I'd be decently happy with that. Love is a strong word. They're already similar. Laroche is a career 265/339/471/810 hitter who averages 26 HR per 162 games. Duda is a 249/345/441/786 hitter, 22 HR/162. Because Laroche played in the juiced era to start, OPS+ favors Duda 120-113. Duda's WAR this season already exceeds every WAR for Laroche except his career year in 2012.

But I'm holding out hope that Duda can be one of those "out of nowhere guys" (who arent actually out of nowhere) that puts together a solid 3-5 year stretch of star level production before fading. One of those guys with great prime years but otherwise meh career. Used to see more of this from 27-30 year olds.

used to call Duda "poor man's Giambi" as a compliment. Still think he can be that.

just tweeted that Harvey is cleared to throw on a mound.

And my eval of Duda might be a little unique. he need to play average all around 1B - that's a given offense and defense, but I don't care how he compared to GoldSchmidt, Freeman, or anyone except Ike Davis. As long as he's better than Davis this is a win-win, addition by subtraction, plus addition by addition if that makes sense.

I'm developing Man Love for Lucas Duda

really sure why (not aimed at you PJ) but for some reason people don't notice/realize/accept how great Goldschmidt is. He's one of the current GREAT offensive players in baseball. Not good, GREAT.

Duda hitting the other way, bye-bye shift. He hit a Lefty

In comment 11787340 DanMetroMan said:

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really sure why (not aimed at you PJ) but for some reason people don't notice/realize/accept how great Goldschmidt is. He's one of the current GREAT offensive players in baseball. Not good, GREAT.

Who doesnt get this? He's obviously the best NL 1B over the past few seasons. Though I think offensive players get shortchanged right now because everyone still remembers the steroids era. Tough to get amped about guys leading the league in HRs w/ 36 after the Bonds/Sosa/McGwire and even Ryan Howard years.

the mets have one less hole to fill.

Duda is our 1B until Smith is ready to take over in 4-5 years

Evan Roberts for one suggested Niese and "secondary prospects" for Goldschmidt as if that was reasonable.