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NFT: Fantasy Chat - 8/19

UConn4523 : 8/19/2014 10:49 am
Lastnight was very lackluster. Hard to go off of preseason but it looks like Garcon/Jackson will see a ton of looks this year regardless of RG3 or Cousins. Reed got open as well and I see him as their #2 target on the team. I'm targeting him for my 6/7th pick.

Cleveland is a mess. The mess at QB is causing a ton of issues. The majority of the passes were thrown behind the WR's, making it impossible to project the production of Jordan Cameron. I still think he's a top 10 TE, but probably closer to 10 than 5. Ben Tate had a few nice runs, but didn't get much blocking. If healthy he can be a nice player, but I doubt he plays more than 12 full games.

I'm still contemplating the #1 overall pick. McCoy apparently is very sore with turf toe. Not good. May avoid him now and go Charles definitively.
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Am I crazy  
Jerry in DC : 8/21/2014 9:10 am : link
or is Jay Cutler being really underrated? ESPN has his ADP as 15th among QBs and 107 overall. The Bears have one of the top 1-2 WR combos, a solid TE, good receiving RB, and an overall good offense.

Last year they had something like the 4th most passing yards and 5th most TDs. It was well below Peyton/Brees, but right in the mix with the other top passing offenses. If you combine Cutler/McCown from last year, that's the #3 fantasy QB. That's not entirely fair because other guys missed games, but still it would be great value.

Are people that worried about injury? Regression? I think some of it is that the Bears haven't had a fantasy relevant QB, really, ever.
Cutler has never thrown 30 TDs  
YAJ2112 : 8/21/2014 9:16 am : link
has only thrown for 4000 yards once and hasn't played 16 games since his 2009. I think there are huge trust issues with people and drafting Cutler, and I can't blame them.

That said something has to give, either Marshall/Jeffrey/Forte are being drafted to high or Cutler is being drafted too low.
Question  
CruzShip52 : 8/21/2014 9:28 am : link
Just in general wont get into full team but
I have Cutler at QB right now, pretty stacked team all around except QB, basically waited till last round for him and someone proposed me

Stafford and Fitz for Jordy

we have to start 3 WR I have antonio brown, wayne, jordy...

Id upgrade huge at QB but I think Jordy is so damn consistent in a PPR

RE: Question  
nygiants16 : 8/21/2014 9:43 am : link
In comment 11817560 CruzShip52 said:
Quote:
Just in general wont get into full team but
I have Cutler at QB right now, pretty stacked team all around except QB, basically waited till last round for him and someone proposed me

Stafford and Fitz for Jordy

we have to start 3 WR I have antonio brown, wayne, jordy...

Id upgrade huge at QB but I think Jordy is so damn consistent in a PPR


I would stick with what you got right now to be honest...If Cutler can stay healthy he has 4 good weapons in the passing game and possibly 5 with the addition of Holmes if he can stay on the straight and narrow...
I feel like a lot of recent years...  
arcarsenal : 8/21/2014 10:33 am : link
People have said "why not Jay Cutler" for fantasy. But he never really winds up being a top fantasy QB.

I think he's worthy of rostering as a QB2 but I wouldn't want him as the guy I'm starting every week.
Who is the worst offense in the league right now?  
AnotherGiantsFan : 8/21/2014 11:26 am : link
I need to pickup a defense for week 1. It's always tough the first couple of weeks because the shitty teams don't realize they are shitty yet and are running on fumes.

I still think picking a defense against Jax, St. Louis, NYJ, HOU, NYG is a fairly safe bet. I'm personally really down on that St. Louis offense, I think they are going to be ugly. I think Giants are going to be ugly too, but I'm going with my heart on this one and will give them a pass.

Philly D vs Jax

Detroit vs NYG

Minny @ St. Louis

OAK @ NYJ

WAS @ Hou

Pittsburgh vs Cleveland

I don't think Jacksonville is going to be as bad offensively this year with Bortles, but they certainly aren't starting off guns blazing either. I think I'm just going to go with Philly at home vs. a rookie QB and a white RB.

Thoughts?
Isn't Henne  
UConn4523 : 8/21/2014 11:31 am : link
starting?
have you seen the Philly D?  
GIANTSr01 : 8/21/2014 11:40 am : link
Out of those options I'd probably go Detroit or Pitt.
Last time I checked  
AnotherGiantsFan : 8/21/2014 11:43 am : link
It was an open competition. Bortles has been getting first team reps in practice. Either way though, the QB situation doesn't look great for week 1.
I'd go the Pats  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 11:49 am : link
D if you can get them.

I have a feeling they will be LEGIT this year even before Browner returns.

they get Wilfork and Tommy Kelly back, plys Jerod Mayo, added Revis and Will Smith to go with Chandler Jones.

they will have a NASTY D and good punt returner in Edelman and KR in Vereen/White.

the first 8 weeks the Pats play questionable offenses at best. Week 1 is Miami, and Miami can't run and revis takes away half the field.

Most people are jumping early on Seattle D, even SF, but New England might surprise some people.
Would you rather take Brees or Rodgers in the 2nd  
Miami_JintsFan : 8/21/2014 1:04 pm : link
or take Luck or Stafford in late 4 or 5th? In one mock I picked up Rodgers with my 15th pick since Manning and Brees were taken. Ended up with R.White in the 5th Rd. In another draft I picked up Stafford in the early 5th and picked up D.Thomas in the 2nd 18th overall.
Luck/Stafford in the 5th  
GIANTSr01 : 8/21/2014 1:07 pm : link
Though I'd probably wait even longer for a QB. What's the difference in points between Stafford/Luck and Dalton/Rivers/Newton/Romo/etc? All of those guys were within ~30 pts in my league last year and you can probably get the latter 4 a few rounds after Luck/Stafford.
RE: Would you rather take Brees or Rodgers in the 2nd  
arcarsenal : 8/21/2014 1:08 pm : link
In comment 11817912 Miami_JintsFan said:
Quote:
or take Luck or Stafford in late 4 or 5th? In one mock I picked up Rodgers with my 15th pick since Manning and Brees were taken. Ended up with R.White in the 5th Rd. In another draft I picked up Stafford in the early 5th and picked up D.Thomas in the 2nd 18th overall.


Brees, yes. Rodgers I don't think I would.

I took Brees in the 2nd rd of my draft and could have taken Roddy. I took VJax instead, though.

I think Stafford will have a really good year, BUT.. the difference between Brees/Stafford is likely greater than the difference between Thomas and Roddy/VJ + whoever else may be on the board.
I'm looking  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 1:13 pm : link
to get Stafford later.

I like D.Thomas and Stafford, better than Brees and White. The Saints just can't run and that's good and bad I guess.

and this is possibly impacted by the fact I owned Roddy White with a 2nd round pick last year and he was injured or dog shit all year.q
Good info...thanks guys.  
Miami_JintsFan : 8/21/2014 1:46 pm : link
You have me convinced. Unless its Manning late 1 or Brees in 2. Ill just wait for Ryan, Romo, RG3, Brady later.
Roddy wasn't dogshit the last 5 weeks or so  
YAJ2112 : 8/21/2014 1:47 pm : link
he helped me win the BBI title
Roddy White has caught  
UConn4523 : 8/21/2014 1:49 pm : link
over 80 balls a year since 2007, except for last year when he got injured. If he plays 16 games, he a lock for 80/1200/6, IMO.
I'll be targetting Roddy as a value pick, no doubt.  
kmed : 8/21/2014 1:52 pm : link
I also think Rodgers is worthy of a 2nd rd pick and he's lighyears ahead of the next tier of QB's. I'll be targetting one of the top 3 QB's with my 2nd round pick.
I was well out of it by then  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 1:52 pm : link
. I have the 2nd pick in this years draft.

My team should have been much better.

AP
McCoy
Doug Martin
Roddy White
Hakeem Nicks
Andrew Luck
etc.
but it wasn't I lost almost every week. Mostly because of White and Nicks, and of course Martin got hurt.

.  
arcarsenal : 8/21/2014 2:15 pm : link
Maybe I'm crazy or maybe biased because I have him but I think there's a pretty reasonable chance that Brees winds up being the top fantasy QB this year.
My money is on Peyton.  
kmed : 8/21/2014 2:18 pm : link
Not sure why he won't continue to do what he did last year, but I have Brees 2nd. I expect Peyton to regress(fantasy wise) slightly, but only because he put up the best season in history last year. Not sure why he won't do it again. He's got insane weapons. He's hungry after last seasons SB.
.  
arcarsenal : 8/21/2014 2:21 pm : link
I think either way, it's going to be very close. Peyton will have another great year but he's not going to throw 55 TD passes again. They'll probably both be in the 45 range, IMO.
One  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 2:26 pm : link
reason to consider Brees surpassing Peyton is the dome.

Half their road games are in domes or warm weather climates too.

they play at Chicago, Pitt, Tampa, Carolina, and Cleveland (in Sep) that aren't domes.

I think Peyton regresses and Brees stays are his same level making it close.

Aaron Rodgers, if he can stay healthy could challenge them.

Wild card is Brady. with Gronk, Amendola and Vereen healthy (who wants to make a bet on that?), the addition of LaFell, White, and Dobson back I can see Brady moving back into elite fantasy territory.
I would agree with that assessment.  
kmed : 8/21/2014 2:26 pm : link
He's going to throw for 5k yards and 45 TD's with a limited amount of INT's. My money is on Peyton having the better year, but it certainly wouldn't surprise me if Brees was right there or better. I see both and Rodgers putting up great stats.
Brady is someone I am targetting late.  
kmed : 8/21/2014 2:28 pm : link
He's going really late in the mocks I've done, sometimes in rd 8. Seems like once the first wave of QB's passes in rd's 1 and 2 and then the second round of QB's pass in rounds 4 and 5, guys like Brady, Cam, Romo, Foles, Ryan, Rivers are falling to rd 8 and later.
RE: One  
arcarsenal : 8/21/2014 2:28 pm : link
In comment 11818036 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
reason to consider Brees surpassing Peyton is the dome.

Half their road games are in domes or warm weather climates too.

they play at Chicago, Pitt, Tampa, Carolina, and Cleveland (in Sep) that aren't domes.

I think Peyton regresses and Brees stays are his same level making it close.

Aaron Rodgers, if he can stay healthy could challenge them.

Wild card is Brady. with Gronk, Amendola and Vereen healthy (who wants to make a bet on that?), the addition of LaFell, White, and Dobson back I can see Brady moving back into elite fantasy territory.


It would make sense re: Brady because I had him last year and probably won't have him this year.
I do not see Brady moving back into the fantasy elite,  
kmed : 8/21/2014 2:30 pm : link
but I think he can def be a good 2nd tier QB. He was the 14th ranked QB last year and it's not like they've added Randy Moss or anything. I can see him being top 5, but not top 3, but that's just me.
I heard shoulder soreness for Brees  
UConn4523 : 8/21/2014 2:31 pm : link
and why he hasn't been very active in the offseason. Probably doesn't change where I rank him but its definitely something to look out for.
RE: I do not see Brady moving back into the fantasy elite,  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 3:01 pm : link
In comment 11818050 kmed said:
Quote:
but I think he can def be a good 2nd tier QB. He was the 14th ranked QB last year and it's not like they've added Randy Moss or anything. I can see him being top 5, but not top 3, but that's just me.


top 5, whatever, a good value pick QB, they had games last year when his receivers were UDFA kenbrell thompkins, aaron dobson, and julian edelman.

I think Brady improves a ton making him a guy I target who you can get late (as long as you're not in New England).
Well top tier QB is different than  
kmed : 8/21/2014 3:03 pm : link
top 5. Top tier is Peyton, brees and Rodgers and I think all 3 will score 100 more pts than the 4th rated QB which is why I said no to top tier. I think he's got great value where he's being drafted in teh mocks that I've done.
.  
arcarsenal : 8/21/2014 3:06 pm : link
Brady will fall in the 5-10 range this year, IMO. Probably right in the middle of it.
Nothing is  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 3:13 pm : link
as absolute as some of you make it.

Aaron Rodgers was many people's #1 last year. Everyone liked Peyton, but no one expected 55 TD's and 5500 yards - or you're a liar.

So, yeah, top tier, top 5 whatever I guarantee your top tier doesn't wind up the top 3 QB's or however many you have in your tier.

I think Brees is going to kill it  
AnotherGiantsFan : 8/21/2014 3:17 pm : link
But Brees and Rodgers is tomato and tomahto IMO. You honestly can't go wrong with any of them in the 2nd round. There's no miss out whatsoever.

Rodgers is going to be an awesome consolation prize for a lot of people.
Agree on both of them  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 3:21 pm : link
my only point is if you prognosticate the top 3 QB's are Peyton, Brees, and Rodgers, and no one else is close.

I will right now, today, guarantee, GA-RON-TEE you that there will be a different QB in that tier.

who knows, maybe Stafford, Newton, Ryan, Romo, Luck, Foles, Brady, etc.

I will bet you that those three are not the top 3 Fantasy football QB's at the end of the season.

That's my point. Just because someone says "they're the top tier" doesn't mean it ends up that way, and when you can identify those guys who aren't "supposed" to be in that tier, that's when you have an advantage.
That pj, great stuff.  
kmed : 8/21/2014 3:28 pm : link
Shit, why even rank anyone then. Nobody knows who will end up where.
Might as well take Alfred Morris in rd 1 too,  
kmed : 8/21/2014 3:29 pm : link
I GUA-RON-TEE that charles, mccoy, forte and AP don't end up as the top 4 RB's.
yeah  
UConn4523 : 8/21/2014 3:34 pm : link
i'm going off of what I see not joe schmoe's rankings. To me there is a very clear cut top 4 RB's and top 3 QB's. Whether or not they perform up to that level is the whole point of playing the games.
I would bet that those 3 QB's end up as the top 3,  
kmed : 8/21/2014 3:37 pm : link
but if one gets hurt like last year(Rodgers) and someone else is top 3, I'd also bet that the QB is nowhere close to Peyton and Brees numbers.
LOL  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 3:40 pm : link
I'm not saying it effects your rankings.

I am saying it does effect your draft strategy.

Picking chalk you may as well auto-draft. apply some intelligence.

last year is a major outlier for Peyton.
when do you not pick chalk in the first few rounds of a draft?  
YAJ2112 : 8/21/2014 3:45 pm : link
If you want to win, you aren't taking Jay Cutler in the 2nd round even if you are convinced he will be the best FF QB ever.
first 4  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 3:49 pm : link
or so, is kind of a no-brainer, but when it gets to the Calvin Johnson, Peyton Manning, Demaryius Thomas, Demarco Murray, etc, level is when it gets tricky.

The Broncos play the NFC West and AFC East this year.

That is NOT conducive to Peyton duplicating his 2013 numbers. You all saw how uncomfortable he was in the SB. The Patriots got revis and Browner because of Peyton. The Jets are the jets, so who know what do expect, but they're usually not pushoevers on D. and the NFC West is the best defensive conference in football.

My point is because Peyton is the #1 QB, I'd almost rather get a guy like Brandon Marshall and go Tom Brady or someone later.

but yeah, I'm not saying take Demarco Murray #2 overall.
If Brandon Marshall is the best WR on the board  
YAJ2112 : 8/21/2014 3:50 pm : link
and you take him over Manning, you are still going chalk.
Not if Manning  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 3:51 pm : link
is your overall 6th ranked player, for example, and you have Marshall 7th or 8th.

it means you're going off-rankings and drafting with a strategy.
If you take Marshall over Manning  
YAJ2112 : 8/21/2014 3:53 pm : link
then you really have Marshall ranked higher than Manning.
can we all agree pj  
kmed : 8/21/2014 3:54 pm : link
is an idiot?
that isn't true  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 3:56 pm : link
at all.

I can have Peyton rated 5th overall. but take someone else at a different position and that doesn't mean I had them rated higher than peyton. It means I can fill that position later.

I was in a league with Kmed once and he came in dead last, so despite the expert talk, not a lot of backup to it.
No way would I ever come in last, you made that up.  
kmed : 8/21/2014 3:57 pm : link
I've won 8 years in a row.
RE: No way would I ever come in last, you made that up.  
pjcas18 : 8/21/2014 3:58 pm : link
In comment 11818242 kmed said:
Quote:
I've won 8 years in a row.


TBONE won, your team was awful.
That must have been 9 years  
kmed : 8/21/2014 3:59 pm : link
ago then.
what's the point of doing rankings  
YAJ2112 : 8/21/2014 3:59 pm : link
if you aren't going to follow them?

The only time I go away from my rankings is if it's a positional issue - ie QB is highest ranked but I have a QB already, or I know I'm much higher on that player than everyone else and I'm willing to gamble that he slides to my next pick.
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