Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

53 - Orr and Ramann both keep 4 TEs

Reale01 : 8/21/2014 2:14 pm
What say you BBIers?

I would like to see us keep 2 with Hyno as a swing man. 3 at most. They both kept just 3 RBs with Haskins/Hillis as the third RB.

I see little upside with either and would prefer they keep Cox.

My 53 going into Jets game

Manning Nassib
Jennings Williams Hillis Cox
Hyno
Donnell Robinson Fells
Cruz Randall OB2 Parker Harris Washington
Pugh Beatty Scwartz Richburg Mosely Walton Brown Brewer Jerry

McManus
Weatherford
DeOssie

JPP Moore Kiwi Ayers Jenkins Hankins Patterson Kuhn Bromley
Beason McClain Williams Kennard Paysinger Herzlich
DRC Prince Thurman Bowman James McBride
Rolle Brown Demps Berle

Notable cuts:
JJ, Jackson, Connor, Painter, Holliday, MM, Gaskins, Brown

On the Ropes
Jerry, Brewer, James, Herzlich

Pushing for spots
Jackson, JJ, Gaskins, Brown, Gaines, Reynolds
Have they ever done that before? I'm not sure I see why they'd need  
Ten Ton Hammer : 8/21/2014 2:15 pm : link
4 TEs.
TC is not cutting Brown  
Blue Blood : 8/21/2014 2:15 pm : link
for McManus...
Notes  
Reale01 : 8/21/2014 2:16 pm : link
Good chance we consider o-line, TE, and LB in the cutdowns.

Assumes Brewer injury is minor.
Blue Blood  
Reale01 : 8/21/2014 2:17 pm : link
Just a hunch - can't say I disagree with you.
Ten Ton  
Reale01 : 8/21/2014 2:18 pm : link
Not that I remember - seems like we should keep the best 53.
Where does the tight end position stand heading into fourth preseason  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 8/21/2014 2:19 pm : link
by Jordan
Where does the tight end position stand heading into fourth preseason game? - ( New Window )
Makes zero sense...  
rptl530 : 8/21/2014 2:23 pm : link
to keep 4 TE's. Less than zero, if possible.
4 TE's...  
Chris in Philly : 8/21/2014 2:24 pm : link
and none of them can play. Nice!
they had  
Giants-Bama in CO : 8/21/2014 2:24 pm : link
4 last year. Myers, Pascoe, Donnell and Robinson
It's the new math....  
Doomster : 8/21/2014 2:35 pm : link
four=one....
The recent emergence of Robinson  
BillT : 8/21/2014 2:36 pm : link
If we can call it that and it's significant enough makes 4 TE much less likely. And that it means either 3 RB or 5 WR makes it even less likely as the worst of the RB/WR are far better and more valuable than the 4th TE.
Bill T and Doomster  
Reale01 : 8/21/2014 2:41 pm : link
Doomster LOL well put.

BillT - Thats what I think. It just seems like common sense. You cut someone like Washington, Jerrnigan, or Cox to keep Fells or Williams?

I would rather take our chances on the waiver wire.
Why keep 4 TEs when none of them have much value?  
Red Dog : 8/21/2014 2:45 pm : link
Absolute effing insanity. It makes about as much sense as putting a beer vendor and a ticket clerk on the 53-man roster.

They have so many other guys at positions like WR, CB, and DL who can contribute more than a 4th TE who is a developmental guy or a marginal NFL player at best, not to mention the problems with the OL.

They really don't need more than 3 TEs anyway, and might be able to get away with just two if Hynoski can also play H-Back acceptably.
Maybe they think that 4 bad TEs = 1 good TE  
jeff57 : 8/21/2014 2:48 pm : link
.
Eric  
Reale01 : 8/21/2014 2:49 pm : link
Thanks I hadn't seen that. Its a really good article with some substance than the usual fluff. That said I still don't think we should keep 4 TEs.

I would keep Donnell, Robinson, and the best blocker of the other two.

I would love it if we could somehow get Housler out of AZ.
Actually not a bad projected 53 by the OP  
NYGmen58 : 8/21/2014 2:54 pm : link
HOWEVER, there is no chance JJ is cut. He's our 3rd WR and will be an important part of this offense so get that idea of out of your head now.

Also, I don't see how both Washington and Harris can make it. It's one or the other. Can't go into the season with 3 of your 6 WRs never having played an NFL down before.
Orr and Raanan each make a couple of mildly surprising picks on the OL  
Big Blue Blogger : 8/21/2014 3:02 pm : link
Both have Dallas Reynolds making the team. In addition, Orr has John Sullen and Raanan has Rogers Gaines. Neither has John Jerry, James Brewer or Eric Herman.

Orr's version is thin at tackle, with Brown as the only backup. I think Orr is reading a lot into the snaps that Schwartz and Mosley are taking at OT. He could be right, but is Sullen really that much of a difference maker on specials? He's a 330-pound guard; he won't be running down DeSean Jackson. Looks more like practice squad material to me.

Despite the four TEs, Orr's roster tilts toward defense, 26-24, because he keeps ten defensive linemen and only five wide receivers. I don't think Kerry Wynn is a sufficiently compelling prospect to justify skimping at WR. Raanan's allocation of roster spots is more conservative, and more likely to be right, IMO

As for those TEs, maybe Fells or Davis will get the axe if Donnell and Robinson look good in the last two preseason games. If that happens, the guy who gets the boot will get a call the next time Robinson gets hurt or Donnell wanders out of the end zone before catching a pass. If the young guys struggle the next two weeks, the new practice squad eligibility rules make the PS an option for them, just as it is for Cox.

In any case, eight roster spots probably go to the combination of RB-FB-TE. The split can be 3-1-4 or 4-1-3. I think you can make a fair case for a fourth TE over a fourth RB, despite the talent level among the tight ends.
I don't see Jernigan being an important part of this offense at all  
Ten Ton Hammer : 8/21/2014 3:10 pm : link
.
I'll be shocked if Giants Keep 4 crappy players over  
ZogZerg : 8/21/2014 3:10 pm : link
better players. They will only keep 3 TEs.

Coughlin insists that he keeps the best players. Why would you keep 4 TEs when they all stink? It makes no sense. The Giants will keep the best 3 TEs and move forward. It's not like other teams will pick up the one we cut.
Yeah, at best these guys are 'replacement level" players  
BeerFridge : 8/21/2014 3:19 pm : link
keeping 4 is nuts. Only a writer would think that's a good idea.
RE: Actually not a bad projected 53 by the OP  
BillT : 8/21/2014 3:25 pm : link
In comment 11818113 NYGmen58 said:
Quote:
HOWEVER, there is no chance JJ is cut. He's our 3rd WR and will be an important part of this offense so get that idea of out of your head now.

Also, I don't see how both Washington and Harris can make it. It's one or the other. Can't go into the season with 3 of your 6 WRs never having played an NFL down before.


Actually, I don't think JJ is our 3rd WR any more. I think he's much closer to 7th than 3rd. And when they went 4 wides yesterday, JJ was not out there. Harris has been around for a couple if years on PS and in the arena league. I doubt they look at him like a rookie. I think he and Washington are more likely to make it than not. I'd put both in the top 5.
I can make an argument for keeping 2 TEs  
geelabee : 8/21/2014 3:31 pm : link
And 2 FBs...would rather have Hyno & Conner...rather then an extra 2 marginal TEs...Giants should keep 2 TEs and have 2 more on the practice squad..
I'd rather  
BigBlueCane : 8/21/2014 3:31 pm : link
keep 2 FB's then 4 TE's.

Makes better use of the available talent.
no way we keep four TEs....  
BillKo : 8/21/2014 3:39 pm : link
it will be Fells, Donnell, and Robinson.

You need one vet and Fells fits that.

The other two, you hope, break out eventually.
BillT: Good point about Harris.  
Big Blue Blogger : 8/21/2014 3:43 pm : link
He's not a typical rookie. He's certainly less green than Washington, and his development is probably well ahead of Beckham's at this point.

Parcells went into 1987 with three rookie WRs (Ingram, Baker and Turner), with just Manuel, Robinson and McConkey in front of them and Bavaro as the #1 target for Simms. It didn't work out very well: The Giants opened 0-2, and couldn't dig themselves out of the 0-5 hole the strike team created.

Coughlin inherited that WR draft class when he joined the Giants the following year.
If he really keeps the best 53  
Great White Ghost : 8/21/2014 3:51 pm : link
you'll have 2 FBs on the roster.
I think we go 3 TE  
aquidneck : 8/21/2014 3:51 pm : link
and only 8 OL. Only two of Brewer, Brown, Jerry make it. Maybe only one if Giants think Gaines won't be safe on the practice squad.

We'll still have the suspended Herman and should have two spots continually rotate in on the practice squad until it looks like we find keepers.

If Grimble is any good he'd be another PS candidate.
BBB  
BillT : 8/21/2014 3:58 pm : link
Yeah, I have to think Harris is pretty much a keeper. And I have trouble believing that they would let Washington go either. There are only three locks Cruz, Randle and OBJ. They have three spots to fill so they can keep Harris and Washington and still have another spot open. I think that will go to Parker but for those who like JJ there's is room for him, too.
aquidneck  
BillT : 8/21/2014 4:00 pm : link
Thats an interesting thought. They could keep only 8 OL and that would leave them room for the 4th TE until Herman comes off suspension.
Yes, I had forgotten about Herman's suspension too.  
Big Blue Blogger : 8/21/2014 4:13 pm : link
It makes Orr's idea of keeping Reynolds and Sullen even less likely. With Herman in reserve, how many G/C types do they need to get through September?
I thought this was interesting from Rotoworld  
Ten Ton Hammer : 8/21/2014 4:22 pm : link
NJ.com believes UDFA WR Corey Washington will "almost certainly" make the final roster.

The 6'4/215 Washington has come from tiny Newberry College to emerge as one of the stars of Giants camp. Per beat man Jordan Raanan, people inside the organization are intrigued by his unique ability to make plays in the air. We've seen that in each of the three preseason games, as Washington has posted a 7-116-3 line on seven targets. He'll likely open the season as the Giants' No. 5 wideout and should be on deep Dynasty radars. Aug 21 - 9:05 AM
Source: NJ.com
RE: Where does the tight end position stand heading into fourth preseason  
SGMen : 8/21/2014 4:27 pm : link
In comment 11818018 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
by Jordan Where does the tight end position stand heading into fourth preseason game? - ( New Window )
Eric, I still have high hopes that the "light" goes off in Robinson's head and he finally shows why he was drafted in the 4th round. This is his first full camp and I loved the way he burst down the seem against Indy. A playmaker is needed. Even if he starts the season as a 3rd and long TE.
You know the old saying,  
Exit 172 : 8/21/2014 4:30 pm : link
"If you have four tight ends...you have no tight ends."
Good thoughts  
Reale01 : 8/21/2014 4:51 pm : link
Thanks for the input. Its funny to look at how things seem to shift as the pre-season takes shape.
my current 53 going into jet game  
CGiants07 : 8/21/2014 5:10 pm : link
QB Eli, NAssib
RB/FB-Jennings, Williams, Hillis, Cox, Hynoski
WR- Cruz, Randle, Beckham jr, Washington, Harris, Parker
TE-Donnell, Davis, Robinson
OL-Beatty, Pugh, Schwartz, Walton, Richburg, Mosley, Brown, Jerry, Brewer
DL-Jpp, Kiwanuka, Moore, Ayers, Jenkins, Hankins, Bromley, Kuhn, Patterson
LB-Beason, McClain, Williams, Kennard, Paysinger, Adkins
DB-Cromartie, Amukamara, Thurmond, Bowman,Rolle, Brown,Demps, Jackson, Berhe, James
K-Brown
P-Weatherford
L/s-DeOssie
2QB,4RB,1FB,6 WR,3 TE,9 OL,9DL,6LB,10 DBS,1K,1P, 1LS
Keeping 4 TE's  
OC : 8/21/2014 5:11 pm : link
That,at a stretch, might be mediocre is plain ridiculous.

Anybody care to opine on Wynn? Haven't seen much preseason.

Also, the Hyno idea sounds doable.
That would be Bromley  
OC : 8/21/2014 5:12 pm : link
Not Wynn.
Don't think they'll keep 5 DE  
BillT : 8/21/2014 5:33 pm : link
Wynn is a PS type. Good potential but one too many for the 53 man.
The projection of four TE's is more a case of the beat writers...  
Milton : 8/21/2014 6:04 pm : link
...not having a beat on who among the three behind Donnell has an edge on the other two. And this is equally true of us fans. But the coaches have much better insight into what distinguishes the number 3 o the depth chart from the number 4 on the depth chart. And the number 4 guy will not make the team.

The only monkey wrench is that the number 4 guy appears to be Robinson (going by when he was used in the preseason games) and he is also the most physically gifted of the four and the highest draft choice. But I don't think that's enough of a monkey wrench to keep a player who can't rise above the likes of Donnell, Davis, and Fells (and maybe even Cunningham) through his play on the field (whether in practice or games).

Bottomline--this is a decision we can only make a wild guess at. There are too many details that we are not privy to which will ultimately decide it.
real  
SBlue46 : 8/21/2014 6:23 pm : link
Send fells to ir....put Washington as te...
add talley to wr..
grimley ..ps
Cox is now eligible for the practice squad  
Blue21 : 8/21/2014 6:24 pm : link
under the new rules. My guess is that's where he ends up. I can't see them keeping more than 3 TE's. Hyno can help in the TE role so no need for 4.
CG and blue  
Reale01 : 8/21/2014 6:44 pm : link
CG GMTA - same as mine except kicker (u may be right) and Davis instead of Fells (I have no problem with that either).

Blue so if I net it out you are saying 2 TE and 7 WR? Tally in and Fells out?

Washington at TE is an interesting thought. Certainly not an in-line TE, but maybe he and Hyno could do some of the other stuff.
blue  
Reale01 : 8/21/2014 6:46 pm : link
I do think they would keep JJ or Holliday (for PR) over Tally if they went with 7 since we already would have 4 rookies. Tally has to beat out Parker Harris or Washington IMO.
Although McAdoo could theoretically give Washington some routes...  
Big Blue Blogger : 8/21/2014 8:22 pm : link
...that the playbook assigns to a TE, you can't really count him as a TE in roster math because he can't do any of the dirty work a TE has to do. He also hasn't been in Gilbride's meeting room, so he has no clue about any reads or adjustments this offense requires from the TE position. His head is probably spinning already from all the stuff Sean Ryan is throwing at the receivers.

I'm completely on-board with a youth movement at WR - especially since a new offense reduces the edge that guys like Manningham and Jernigan would otherwise enjoy. But let's keep it somewhat real. There's more to being a tight end than measuring 6'4".
RE: You know the old saying,  
vibe4giants : 8/21/2014 8:32 pm : link
In comment 11818312 Exit 172 said:
Quote:
"If you have four tight ends...you have no tight ends."


Or a boy band.
Back to the Corner