Is that what I am hearing now on this God forsaken site... the site I once loved, dear to my heart? Have we all become that obtuse, have we become GIANTS.COM??
2013 Eli Manning
No Offensive Line
No Run Game
Sub Par WR unit
2014 (PRE SEASON)
New OFFENSE playbook and philosophy (Important here)
New Offensive Line
New Running back unit
Still a Sub Par WR unit
So on August 20th we are calling it a fail for this season...
But feel free to overreact more than the people you're accusing of doing just that.
And it's not like I completely disagree with the doubters. I totally see where they're coming from and I see some alarming trends myself. But it's just such a kick to the nuts to come onto this site and see how down everyone is about this team.
The NFC East has always been a toss-up division and I'm hoping Eli can get it rolling as the season goes on. But right now, I just expect another down offensive season but with less turnovers and more pathetic dink-dunk drives.
yes, I think this is the first time any of us have considered the possibility.
Hopefully Eli will prove the doubters wrong. It doesn't help that other aspects of the offense are in transition to WCO/chaos/Reese can't draft.
fired for jr....
It's not inconceivable. It's happened to other excellent QBs.
It's too early to tell.
But Eli hasn't played well for a long time now.
It could very well take the better part of this year for Manning to wrap his head around the new offense and, even more importantly, for the offensive line to jell.
Its much to early to tell. I expect a bumpy road to start off the season.
Your Friends,
Kurt Warner
Curtis Painter
Ryan Nassib's mom
Or you're so used to seeing him perform miracles that anything less than that for any reason means he's lost it.
God, how could you make such pigheaded, tunnel visioned bodies Giant fans?
What were you thinking, God?
It's bad enough the OL line isn't working yet. The new hires are still tryingto figure out the new scheme.
Eli is not taking the hits because it hurt just as much in a preseason game as in a regular game.
Obviously the present giant fans and I definitely include Eric the administrator are giving up on the season before the game is played. No, they aren't giving up they're just not sure BASED ON THE PRESEASON RESULTS that Eli isn' there . AND JUST HOW WELL HAS CRUZ PERFORMED????
DAMMIT if you're going top pick on the failures then do it for the WHOLE OFFENSE. Don't just select one most apparent person and build the upside down pyramid of fault on is head.
For Pete's sake don't backtrack and say, "I meant it as a possibility" That's bullshit. If you think it then say it and I'll know you're a fair weather fan, disguises or not.
It's always a possibilty, EVERYTHING IS A POSSIBILITY!
As a fan you have every right to Criticize the team. On the other hand as a fan, I have every right to point out that your support of the team SUCKS!!
You tell me if I don't like it don't read the comments
I tell you that if you don't like my comments, don't read'em.
Snively bastids!!!!!
Haha, vince just killed it. So refreshing. I agree vince. I know a lot of these same people couldn't even hold on to any hope as a fans in the middle of our 2011 run. It's the same mentality.
I think it's pretty obvious that Eli suffered some type of injury midway through the '12 season because if people remember, he was playing lights out to begin that season. As for last season, uh, our OL was an absolute abomination. Do people have amnesia about how historically awful that line was? Don't quote me, but I think Eli was sacked five times in the first 7 or 8 minutes of that Panthers game. You also had the diva WR doing God knows what, a joke of a TE, and a running back group so strong that Peyton Freaking Hillis came in mid-season and was the best option.
Regarding this preseason, it's preseason. Am I concerned? Yeah, but I'm concerned about the whole offense, not just Eli. It was going to take time. A lot of these lineman are playing with each other for the first time & it's going to take time for them to gel & get on the same page. Eli hasn't looked that sharp, but the OL is a work in progress, Randle is MIA, & the TE position is still a joke. At least the RBs look better.
I hear people say that Eli carried this team @ points before & that's absolutely true. But what if the talent around him is so bad that he can't? Is that all of a sudden his fault?
I guess time will tell regarding Eli, but some of the stuff being thrown around here about his is lunacy. Wait until 2025 or so when we got that year's version of Geno Smith & you'll be longing for the good 'ol days of Eli.
Film Room: Eli Manning - ( New Window )
Great article, however one based upon thorough analysis deeper than that of the arm-chair QB's "eyeball test." How dare anyone suggest that Eli Manning shouldn't be expected to throw no more than 10 interceptions regardless of the the throws he's expected to make, the pressure in his face, or the shortcomings of his receivers (SARCASM).
The perception of Eli has become one a bit of a football IQ test for NY sports fans. I can excuse the ignorance of fans across the country that may not be able to watch every Giants game but if you're a NY sports fan and genuinely think that Eli has been a responsible part of the Giants' problem....
I just cannot help but become perturbed when folks say, "the line was dreadful, he had no running game, and the receivers were directly responsible for a ton of mistakes but still...Eli played poorly." Well, how the heck can you fairly evaluate a pocket-passing quarterback in the sort of environment where nearly every single input effecting his performance goes to hell?
Good piece Peter thanks. I think one of the big things that cost KG his job is that he refused to adjust when it was obvious that the OL just could not hold on long enough to allow Eli to throw it downfield effectively. With no running game to speak of it became tee off time for opposing pass rushers. It all begins and ends with the OL, and as we have all written numerous times, Reese has failed miserably to replace the great OL from 2006-2010 as they aged.
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not sure if it has been posted here before. If so, my apologies. Film Room: Eli Manning - ( New Window )
Great article, however one based upon thorough analysis deeper than that of the arm-chair QB's "eyeball test." How dare anyone suggest that Eli Manning shouldn't be expected to throw no more than 10 interceptions regardless of the the throws he's expected to make, the pressure in his face, or the shortcomings of his receivers (SARCASM).
The perception of Eli has become one a bit of a football IQ test for NY sports fans. I can excuse the ignorance of fans across the country that may not be able to watch every Giants game but if you're a NY sports fan and genuinely think that Eli has been a responsible part of the Giants' problem....
I just cannot help but become perturbed when folks say, "the line was dreadful, he had no running game, and the receivers were directly responsible for a ton of mistakes but still...Eli played poorly." Well, how the heck can you fairly evaluate a pocket-passing quarterback in the sort of environment where nearly every single input effecting his performance goes to hell?
This
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not sure if it has been posted here before. If so, my apologies. Film Room: Eli Manning - ( New Window )
Good piece Peter thanks. I think one of the big things that cost KG his job is that he refused to adjust when it was obvious that the OL just could not hold on long enough to allow Eli to throw it downfield effectively. With no running game to speak of it became tee off time for opposing pass rushers. It all begins and ends with the OL, and as we have all written numerous times, Reese has failed miserably to replace the great OL from 2006-2010 as they aged.
This too..
Brett's hug curse is just a minor blip for Eli
He just looks a bit out of sorts.
Looking forward to seeing him play tonight. Hopefully he calms everyone down a bit.
The OLine, the wr-qb communication issues, etc. yeah I get it. Those issues have made him look way worse than he is. Last year the Oline was horrendous and it was aging the year before that. And, the year before that - well, he won a SB.
But, a human being can only play so long in this league.
He just looks a bit out of sorts.
Good points, Arc. While I'm quick to defend Eli's recent performance I wont argue that A) a more mobile QB would help to mitigate the effects of a brutal surrounding cast B) the accumulated hits and mistrust in receivers could certainly, and may have, creeped into Eli's head which could detract from his play going forward. These points dont invalidate my thesis, that contributing factors never gave Eli the chance to succeed in 2012/2013, but do present concerns going forward.
I would doubt that many would disagree that Kurt Warner was one of the best quarterbacks ever but at some point it was obvious that he was shell-shocked, prior to a revival in the desert. I dont think that we've come close to that point with regards to Eli but its surely a concern.
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Eli just isn't one of those guys. Which is fine, it's not like he was ever really a mobile QB. But to me, his pocket presence was stronger in the past than it is right now. And not just when he was getting good protection. His response to the pockets breaking down in the past just looked better footwork and delivery wise to me than it has over the last year+
He just looks a bit out of sorts.
Good points, Arc. While I'm quick to defend Eli's recent performance I wont argue that A) a more mobile QB would help to mitigate the effects of a brutal surrounding cast B) the accumulated hits and mistrust in receivers could certainly, and may have, creeped into Eli's head which could detract from his play going forward. These points dont invalidate my thesis, that contributing factors never gave Eli the chance to succeed in 2012/2013, but do present concerns going forward.
I would doubt that many would disagree that Kurt Warner was one of the best quarterbacks ever but at some point it was obvious that he was shell-shocked, prior to a revival in the desert. I dont think that we've come close to that point with regards to Eli but its surely a concern.
Burb, I definitely think with adequate protection, Eli can still be an above average QB. What worries me is that I don't think he'll get it from this current OL and I fear that another 2013-like year for him will really propel him to the end of his career in rapid fashion.
The OL is just like Eli in many ways they are learning and replacing many parts as the days go by. Why this guy or that guy has not been placed here or there due to injury or rehab along with prior position played is also a factor. I for one am not concerned about the OL if they can't run or pass block this has yet to be proven. No team has all pros or #1 picks at every OL position they will improve as time goes by. Today if you ask them to give Eli 6-8 seconds they will fail 80% of the time if not more. We all want to protect Eli then the first step is not to ask the OL to do something they can't do.
The starting WR's or RB have still not yet been consistently productive with Eli in the game. Cruz, Randle and JJ are very average at this point for starters. However the other two QB's have shown the ability to produce with 2nd and 3rd teamers on the field. Yes you can say they are subs but they are moving the chains something Eli has not been able to do.
As for the TE's I still don't understand how Robinson just fell from the top spot to the outhouse that quickly. If he looked as good as reported why is he not even 2nd or 3rd string after his OTA's and from all reports no injury. The separation he got on both passes is the best we have all seen from any of our pass receiving sections. Do we have a starter on the team it would seem like we don't yet which is a problem. None of these guys seem to be able block or catch well enough to claim the starting spot.
It's preseason we still don't know much about this offense and should we be concerned for sure. Will we really see a WCO with TC and Eli is also a big question. You will know when things are really bad if Eli starts calling out Omaha Omaha Lol. I'm not going to say we will win 4 or 12 games this season is a test for the offense and us Giants fans.
He just looks a bit out of sorts.
Looking forward to seeing him play tonight. Hopefully he calms everyone down a bit.
I hear this repeatedly on BBI that there are some QB's who can survive poor OL's yet all the elite ones in this league have MUCH better lines than Eli does currently..
I don't see any elite QB's (mobile or not)out there who don't have good OL's and by that I mean good in pass pro and run blocking..
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Eli just isn't one of those guys. Which is fine, it's not like he was ever really a mobile QB. But to me, his pocket presence was stronger in the past than it is right now. And not just when he was getting good protection. His response to the pockets breaking down in the past just looked better footwork and delivery wise to me than it has over the last year+
He just looks a bit out of sorts.
Looking forward to seeing him play tonight. Hopefully he calms everyone down a bit.
I hear this repeatedly on BBI that there are some QB's who can survive poor OL's yet all the elite ones in this league have MUCH better lines than Eli does currently..
I don't see any elite QB's (mobile or not)out there who don't have good OL's and by that I mean good in pass pro and run blocking..
See: Luck, Andrew.. Rodgers, Aaron.. Roethlisberger, Ben
All of them were good last year (Rodgers missed 7 games) despite poor OL play in front of them. Much better than Eli was.
That said, I don't feel like he's been the same player since his house was flooded. But that could just be coincidence. I think he'll turn it around this season in a big way.
You don't have to go into a detailed analysis. There are just QB's who are better at negating some bad OL play than Eli is. It doesn't mean I think Eli sucks or can't be good. But it's the truth. The guys I listed are more mobile and able to extend plays when their protections break down. Eli really doesn't have that ability. All you had to do was watch the preseason game last week. Our defense closed in on Luck multiple times and he got away and still made a play. When their guys closed in on Eli he either got picked off or went down for a sack.
Like I said, with good pass pro, I still think Eli can be an above average QB. He throws the deep ball as well as anyone in this league. I am just not confident he will get that protection this year.
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In comment 11818864 arcarsenal said:
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Eli just isn't one of those guys. Which is fine, it's not like he was ever really a mobile QB. But to me, his pocket presence was stronger in the past than it is right now. And not just when he was getting good protection. His response to the pockets breaking down in the past just looked better footwork and delivery wise to me than it has over the last year+
He just looks a bit out of sorts.
Looking forward to seeing him play tonight. Hopefully he calms everyone down a bit.
I hear this repeatedly on BBI that there are some QB's who can survive poor OL's yet all the elite ones in this league have MUCH better lines than Eli does currently..
I don't see any elite QB's (mobile or not)out there who don't have good OL's and by that I mean good in pass pro and run blocking..
See: Luck, Andrew.. Rodgers, Aaron.. Roethlisberger, Ben
All of them were good last year (Rodgers missed 7 games) despite poor OL play in front of them. Much better than Eli was.
In 2013:
Green Bay Packers were 7th in rushing in NFL avg 133.5yds/game 4.7 yds/carry
Indianapolis Colts were 21st in rushing 108.9 yds/game 4.3 yds/carry
Pittsburgh Steelers were 27th (86.4) and Giants 29th(83.3) so I will give you that one although Steelers avged 4/yds carry vs Giants 3.5..
All in all the Giants had one of the bottom 3 OL's in the NFL last year..
And all QB's need good OL's..
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In comment 11819012 JCin332 said:
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In comment 11818864 arcarsenal said:
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Eli just isn't one of those guys. Which is fine, it's not like he was ever really a mobile QB. But to me, his pocket presence was stronger in the past than it is right now. And not just when he was getting good protection. His response to the pockets breaking down in the past just looked better footwork and delivery wise to me than it has over the last year+
He just looks a bit out of sorts.
Looking forward to seeing him play tonight. Hopefully he calms everyone down a bit.
I hear this repeatedly on BBI that there are some QB's who can survive poor OL's yet all the elite ones in this league have MUCH better lines than Eli does currently..
I don't see any elite QB's (mobile or not)out there who don't have good OL's and by that I mean good in pass pro and run blocking..
See: Luck, Andrew.. Rodgers, Aaron.. Roethlisberger, Ben
All of them were good last year (Rodgers missed 7 games) despite poor OL play in front of them. Much better than Eli was.
In 2013:
Green Bay Packers were 7th in rushing in NFL avg 133.5yds/game 4.7 yds/carry
Indianapolis Colts were 21st in rushing 108.9 yds/game 4.3 yds/carry
Pittsburgh Steelers were 27th (86.4) and Giants 29th(83.3) so I will give you that one although Steelers avged 4/yds carry vs Giants 3.5..
All in all the Giants had one of the bottom 3 OL's in the NFL last year..
And all QB's need good OL's..
Run blocking and pass protection are not equal.
The 2011 Giants would be a perfect example of it. We were a terrible rushing team but the pass protection was nowhere near as bad as the run blocking was. Eli did get decent pockets.
What? It is still preseason, the blocking schemes are not necessarily the same and throw in the number of new players. Eli is a bit gun-shy, as most QB's hit that many times would be, until his protection proves itself. And please tell me what your point is regarding the new system other than it is expected to require some time to master? Where are you coming from when you say that KG's offensive game plans weren't a problem? How can anyone even think they have a clue as to what Eli will or won't do this year. If he truly still wants to win and continue playing football, watch out! This is his final year under contract. I would not even dare to bet against him if he plans on playing football beyond this year. Key points, he has never missed a regular season or playoff game due to injury, he found a way to win (2) SB's we were the underdog in, he still has a strong arm and he is still clutch. If I played behind last years OL, not only would I have done so much worse than Eli, I would have been dead by mid-season!
It's revisionist and actually insulting to what Eli (and the top three WRs, for that matter) accomplished then to now claim the OL wasn't largely shit that year in pass blocking. The OL never really being fixed from then to now may have eventually taken a cumulative toll on him and left his recovery currently questionable, but that doesn't change what actually was then, in that time frame.
My main point was; you can't necessarily assume that because a unit was poor in run blocking that they were equally poor in pass blocking.
And I didn't think just the interior was better in 2011. Wasn't Beatty's best year 2011? Or am I confusing that with 2012.
*better in 2011 than 2013.
My main point was; you can't necessarily assume that because a unit was poor in run blocking that they were equally poor in pass blocking.
And I didn't think just the interior was better in 2011. Wasn't Beatty's best year 2011? Or am I confusing that with 2012.
They were really poor in pass protection. Beatty only played ten games and then had a detached retina.
But assuming the 2011 line was equally bad at pass protecting as the 2013 line, wouldn't that mean that Eli is the variable in performance? Why did he look so awful last year and so incredible in 2013?
Shellshocked? Gun shy? Hurt? Old?
I don't know how people can say he just looks like the same guy. I don't think he does.
But assuming the 2011 line was equally bad at pass protecting as the 2013 line, wouldn't that mean that Eli is the variable in performance? Why did he look so awful last year and so incredible in 2013?
Shellshocked? Gun shy? Hurt? Old?
I don't know how people can say he just looks like the same guy. I don't think he does.
No, I think it was worse in 2013, but it was awful in 2011 too.
2012 was when he actually put up a solid, above average full year for the first (and hopefully not only) time and then was rewarded for it contractually.
In any event. Even if Eli were to get the same level of protection in 2014 that he got in 2011, something tells me his numbers wouldn't reflect it at all.
In any event. Even if Eli were to get the same level of protection in 2014 that he got in 2011, something tells me his numbers wouldn't reflect it at all.
I agree with that.
I personally feel Eli has lost something. I can't pinpoint why or what. But I don't think he's the same QB we won a Super Bowl with in February of 2012. Doesn't mean I think he sucks or shouldn't play or has lost it completely. I don't think any of those things. I do think something's off, though.
He was 27/47 with 400 yards, 2 TDs and 1 INT.
But beyond that, I have never seen a Giants QB have such success in a game where he was under such pressure. This in particular was one of those games that Gilbride's offensive strategy really paid off. Eli had NO time to get rid of the ball. He was under duress on almost every single drop back. What saved him, in my opinion, was an incredibly in-sync game with his wide receivers. Eli had to consistently make throws when the receiver hadn't even made the final maneuver in his route yet. Everyone had to trust each other and have reason for that trust, otherwise we would've been blown out of the water offensively.
Additionally, even with that in-sync relationship, Eli was making INCREDIBLE throws off his back foot. The pass rush from Dallas that day was endless and Eli stood up to it as successfully as I've seen. Throw in the fact that he had to lead two TD drives in the final five minutes to save a would-be Superbowl season and, looking back, I can't recall a better performance from #10.
It's not inconceivable. It's happened to other excellent QBs.
It's too early to tell.
But Eli hasn't played well for a long time now.
Eric, I was very surprised to read your recent statements regarding concerns about Manning. For me, in order for there to be a concern about a player, the concern has to be accompanied with a reasonable explanation of causation.
A top flight athlete doesn't just stop being a top athlete for no reason at all.
Age? Well, Manning isn't 40.
Injury? None that I've heard about.
Never was a good football player and the SB years were flukes? I'm not buying into that.
So, what is the causation of this sudden "not any good"? I don't believe there is any cause because I reject the premise. Give Manning the OL from 2007, a healthy Jacobs and Ward, Nicks/Cruz/and Manningham in their prime - and guess what - you're going to get the SB performing Eli Manning. And if you (generic "you"), don't think so, I don't know what to say to you other than to ask what you're smoking, because there is NO reason to believe Eli wouldn't perform when surrounded with great talent.
Manning isn't a player like Peyton who is going to carry a bad team on his back and possibly win all by himself. He needs a supporting cast. A solid supporting cast. But give him that supporting cast and he's the same player who brought home two SB trophies and will bring home another. There simply isn't ANY reason to believe otherwise. At least not until you surround him with that supporting cast and he fails. Until then, it's pure speculation - and unfair speculation at that.
But 2011, thus far, has been a peak year for Eli. It's an outlier. I don't expect a 2011 or 2013 type year again. It's not that I think he lost anything, just that he's going to 'mean revert' to where he's historically been numbers wise.
Additionally, this comment:
I wouldn't call the 2011 Giants a "bad team" (no team to win the Super Bowl) is. however:
- They are the only 9-7 team to win a Super Bowl
- The are the only team to win a Super Bowl in a season where they lost 4 straight
- They are the only team to have won a Superbowl while giving up more points than they scored.
Point being, I certainly think Eli is the type of QB who can take a bad team on his back and win all by himself. The fact that he is not Peyton has nothing to do with that fact.
The question, IMO, is "is Eli, even if you assume an average to above average OL, worth ~$20m/yr against the cap going forward?"
I love Eli, but that answer for me is no. And it isn't very close. While we have had a couple of special playoff runs that I wouldn't trade for anything (sports-wise), $20M a year for his production (even in his better years) is just too much in today's game. He has always turned the ball over way too much for that kind of money.
Especially considering that he'll probably be looking for 5-7 more years, I don't think the giants would be totally crazy to walk away at the end of this contract. (Having said that, I don't think they WILL walk away).
It's one thing for him to stand on his head and cover for a poor OL for one season (2011), but when the team follows it up with an extremely up/down OL (2012), then again with a putrid one (2013), then yet again seemingly not likely fixing anything significantly (2014)... it's only natural that it's some degree of scarring, especially with all the other issues on offense (horrible TEs, WR problems, etc) in play.
If any QB can overcome though, bounce back when it doesn't seem likely, it might as well be Eli.
Eli's 2011 was just an epic year in which he carried a 5 win team to the playoffs, and then once the rest of that team lived up to its potential in the playoffs he led them to a Super Bowl. Eli's 2011 goes down as the Clutchest QB Season since the turn of the Millennium. He was just absolutely money that year.
But that year just looks a little like a slight anomaly. Eli just doesn't seem like the same guy he was in 2011 when he was able to make up for a horrid OL. Sure having Nicks and Cruz both at their peak made a difference. Those two made so many brilliant plays for us on 50-50 balls. But Eli was just throwing absolute darts that year and just in a season-long rhythm.
Eli showed in 2011 that he can play behind a garbage OL and win a Super Bowl with them. But he just doesn't look like the same guy. I'm praying that 2011 Eli makes a return, because this team goes from 6-10 to 10-6 immediately with 2011 Eli. Just praying it happens but I don't expect it.
Eli's 2011 was just an epic year in which he carried a 5 win team to the playoffs, and then once the rest of that team lived up to its potential in the playoffs he led them to a Super Bowl. Eli's 2011 goes down as the Clutchest QB Season since the turn of the Millennium. He was just absolutely money that year.
But that year just looks a little like a slight anomaly. Eli just doesn't seem like the same guy he was in 2011 when he was able to make up for a horrid OL. Sure having Nicks and Cruz both at their peak made a difference. Those two made so many brilliant plays for us on 50-50 balls. But Eli was just throwing absolute darts that year and just in a season-long rhythm.
Eli showed in 2011 that he can play behind a garbage OL and win a Super Bowl with them. But he just doesn't look like the same guy. I'm praying that 2011 Eli makes a return, because this team goes from 6-10 to 10-6 immediately with 2011 Eli. Just praying it happens but I don't expect it.
Great points on Eli.
Not to miller the thread, but at some point it needs to be viewed as a negative with Nadal with all his injuries and the amount of grand slams he misses. Federer plays in ALL of them.
Both both OLs were subpar. In one of those seasons Eli was exceptional. In the other he looked like a young David Carr. Now to call Eli done based on that one bad season is unfair, but to entirely disregard it is naive.
At this point, as strange as it is to say, nothing Eli does should really surprise anyone. This is a very uniquely unknown season we're about to witness.
You simply can't remove both those elements from the equation and expect to have any reasonable level of sustained success.
And when both those situations are allowed to get progressively worse over that period, you shouldn't be surprised if they start to take a physical and mental toll on your QB.
To flip it back to Eli...
Pro-Football Reference has a stat called Adjusted Net Yards per Pass Attempt (ANY/A). It's just another way to measure QBs. I would take it with a (large) grain of salt, but I find it to be a better stat than QB Rating or any other fantasy football measure. Football stats only tell you so much, but still this is where Eli ranks each season since 2005 (min. 350 pass attempts)...
2005: 13th
2006: 14th
2007: 16th
2008: 16th
2009: 10th
2010: 13th
2011: 4th
2012: 10th
2013: 22nd
His 2011 season sticks out so much. The only QBs ahead of him that year in this stat were the Rodgers/Brady/Brees HOF trio (Peyton was out this year). So Eli ranked 4th in 2011 based on simple stats. But if you take into consideration his absolutely historic 4th quarter performance, his absolutely dreadful OL, and his Super Bowl ring... you could argue that Eli Manning was the best QB in football in 2011. I think Rodgers or Brady probably deserve that title, but Eli went through both of their teams to win his ring.
Eli has always been a hot/cold player but in 2011 he just stayed hot. 2011 Eli is one of the finest seasons from a single athlete I've ever seen from start to finish. I will always defend Eli from the blind haters because of what he did in 2011. He put this team on his back and carried them to a title. Just legendary stuff.
Throughout his career, Eli has arguably been the most impressive "Clutch" QB in the league statistically so the ANY/A rankings underrate him a bit. But statistically and visually, 2011 just looks like an anomaly in his career. Outside of 2011 he has just been a good-but-not-great QB who is better than his fantasy football numbers indicate but worse what BBI Eli homers think.
That being said his fall from "arguably the best QB" in the game to "awful" in 2 years is just insane. It's scary how far he has fallen in 2 years. But Eli has always zigged when people expected him to zag, so I'm hoping he shocks the world one more time and gets back to being a stud. But that's just wishful thinking on my part, because I haven't seen anything this pre-season to suggest that 2011 Eli will be making a return.
They're both outliers. I expect Eli to have a stronger 2014 than 2013, but we really haven't seen or read anything that suggests a much better Eli in camp or pre-season.
I will never doubt Eli. I still believe that once he gets in a rhythm in the new offense, he could look a hell of a lot better. But it's just scary how awful this offense sounds/looks entering this season.
This is a football site so every is performance related, but there is something else that is really different about Eli: He's now 33 with a wife and kids, 100M in the bank and two SB MVPs. Careers arc, and its only evident when you see more in the rearview mirror than over the dashboard. He's got a lot to look forward to in life, but football is a smaller part of it than ever before. I think he can still put on a great show, lead a team and everything, but I just don't think we'll see anymore 4th quarter superbowl heroics, and he knows it. There are hungrier guys out there and that makes a difference.
To flip it back to Eli...
Pro-Football Reference has a stat called Adjusted Net Yards per Pass Attempt (ANY/A). It's just another way to measure QBs. I would take it with a (large) grain of salt, but I find it to be a better stat than QB Rating or any other fantasy football measure. Football stats only tell you so much, but still this is where Eli ranks each season since 2005 (min. 350 pass attempts)...
2005: 13th
2006: 14th
2007: 16th
2008: 16th
2009: 10th
2010: 13th
2011: 4th
2012: 10th
2013: 22nd
His 2011 season sticks out so much. The only QBs ahead of him that year in this stat were the Rodgers/Brady/Brees HOF trio (Peyton was out this year). So Eli ranked 4th in 2011 based on simple stats. But if you take into consideration his absolutely historic 4th quarter performance, his absolutely dreadful OL, and his Super Bowl ring... you could argue that Eli Manning was the best QB in football in 2011. I think Rodgers or Brady probably deserve that title, but Eli went through both of their teams to win his ring.
Eli has always been a hot/cold player but in 2011 he just stayed hot. 2011 Eli is one of the finest seasons from a single athlete I've ever seen from start to finish. I will always defend Eli from the blind haters because of what he did in 2011. He put this team on his back and carried them to a title. Just legendary stuff.
Throughout his career, Eli has arguably been the most impressive "Clutch" QB in the league statistically so the ANY/A rankings underrate him a bit. But statistically and visually, 2011 just looks like an anomaly in his career. Outside of 2011 he has just been a good-but-not-great QB who is better than his fantasy football numbers indicate but worse what BBI Eli homers think.
That being said his fall from "arguably the best QB" in the game to "awful" in 2 years is just insane. It's scary how far he has fallen in 2 years. But Eli has always zigged when people expected him to zag, so I'm hoping he shocks the world one more time and gets back to being a stud. But that's just wishful thinking on my part, because I haven't seen anything this pre-season to suggest that 2011 Eli will be making a return.
He didn't single handedly carry the team on his back. Far from it. He played with the greatest WR corp in Giants history (bar none) and probably the best trio, as a group, in pro football that year. Give Eli those three WR playing the way they played - and he'll give you the same results every year. You can disagree but what you can't do is prove me wrong. Because Eli's only had bad performances when he has had bad support. I tend to believe what I see and I think I'll wait to see Eli play poorly when surrounded by great talent before I write him off.
This is a team sport so when I say "singlehandedly" I don't literally mean singlehandedly. But Eli and the passing game were the only consistent positives on this team that year until the D stepped up late in the year. No QB can truly singlehandedly carry a team to a Super Bowl. But Eli came damn close.
This is a team sport so when I say "singlehandedly" I don't literally mean singlehandedly. But Eli and the passing game were the only consistent positives on this team that year until the D stepped up late in the year. No QB can truly singlehandedly carry a team to a Super Bowl. But Eli came damn close.
Osi, I don't disagree that Eli had a great year. I'm just disputing the suggestion that he's a different player today. Here's what I saw in 2013. An OL that was arguably worse than my town's pee wee team that led to:
1. A complete inability to run the ball.
2. A complete inability to pass protect.
3. Result? Defenses smothered the short and medium routes leaving nobody open. Ever. And Manning didn't have time to attempt longer passes.
If you can imagine a scenario in which NFL teams were promised a huge reward (say 10 billion dollars) to play all out against my team's pee wee team - and then you put any QB in the history of the NFL on that pee wee team - and then "judge" that QB based upon his play in those games. That's what's happened to Manning. Manning may be done. But I'd argue there isn't anyone on earth who has any basis to make that conclusion - at least not based on 2013.