It was interesting in the beginning of the Carl Banks report how Beningo fixated on, and rightfully so, the events that took place in the fourth quarter after Cruz dropped a six yard pass that led to the punt to Ginn and everything that transpired afterwards.
Well, without hesitation Banks blew past all of that and zeroed in on the defense. After listening to his assessment it was pretty easy to read between the lines and without mentioning his name and very tactfully I would say threw Perry Fewell and his handling of the defense under the bus.
For that matter as he went along he threw the whole coaching staff under the bus for the teams lack of preparedness.
.
he should be benched for the first half next week.
We had given up 13 points total when Cruz dropped his pass, we allowed a PR TD and then fumbled the ensuing KO.
Seems silly to blame the D for blowing the game. It's not like they gave up some long game deciding drive with the game hanging in the balance.
We had given up 13 points total when Cruz dropped his pass, we allowed a PR TD and then fumbled the ensuing KO.
Seems silly to blame the D for blowing the game. It's not like they gave up some long game deciding drive with the game hanging in the balance.
As always there's plenty of blame to pass around. It's not necessary to only discuss what you think is the primary cause of the loss.
You can have average talent and still not have people running wide the fuck open because people are confused about what should be done. Physical fuck-ups I can accept due to lack of talent. The mental fuck-ups are on the coach since they seem to happen even when the roster turns over. It's not ALL his fault because he's never really been given the players to fit the scheme he's most comfortable with. However, there's no excuse for the guys running wide open and single coverage of opposing team's best players.
Quote:
The defense wasn't perfect but the brutal ST's, turnovers and drops had way more to do with our loss than they did.
We had given up 13 points total when Cruz dropped his pass, we allowed a PR TD and then fumbled the ensuing KO.
Seems silly to blame the D for blowing the game. It's not like they gave up some long game deciding drive with the game hanging in the balance.
As always there's plenty of blame to pass around. It's not necessary to only discuss what you think is the primary cause of the loss.
Thanks for the clarification, chief.
My point was that if you're going to "fixate" on one phase of the game to point blame as intimated by Banks according to the OP, the defense probably isn't the correct place to be doing it.
I had my own gripes with the defense yesterday but I can hardly blame that unit for the loss when the most egregious errors came on ST's and offense.
We sacked Stanton 4 times and blitzed often yesterday.
They still show a lack of discipline against the run, especially on the backside and on the edge. They still, have trouble generating a consistent pass rush without blitzing. And, Hell, even yesterday was the first time in years I recall blitzing consistently resulting in anything other than the DB/LB getting blown up by an OL expecting it.
There is simply nothing special about this D and I think it is mostly on Fewell.
Not surprised Carl ripped the D.
The defense was more broken than the offense last year?
I disagree like.. one thousand percent. Not even close to true. The offense was one of the absolute worst in football last year. The defense was decent.
To me Gilbride had proven himself, and given the talent would have a good offense again. Fewell's defense has never been any good, and that includes the Super Bowl win.
One of the good things from this season is the fact that more people seem to be coming to the conclusion that Fewell needs to go.
the defense gets a pass from me. they even got the ball back one more time at the end of the game.
the offense is still broken and is the reason why the giants are 0-2.
And which crucial conversion or gamebreaking drive did they allow yesterday?
We had a lead at 14-13 and without the defense even setting foot on the field, we lost that lead. Immediately afterward, Demps fumbled the KR inside our own 25 yard line and the D held the Cards to a FG (which is all they could have done considering the Cards were already in FG range the second they took the ball)
Then, when the offense was down 8 and driving, Jennings fumbled away our last chance.
The defense was not "bad" last year. If you want to cite the competition, alright. But they were at least average if not pretty good. Certainly not on the level of the Seattles and Carolinas.. but the defense last year was good enough for this team to have been in the mix for the NFCE if the offense had been even average. The offense was SO bad last year that we just never had a chance.
It's not like 31 other teams have air tight coverage on every play but the Giants just keep leaving guys running free.
Our defense will never be more than average.
But these guys will never understand what you are trying to say.
Well, Phil Rivers shredded the Seahawk defense yesterday and dumped 30 on them.. so, what happened there? How were guys getting open?
People have a lot of ideas about things they think happen to the Giants defense but don't happen to other "good" defenses.
The Golden Tate catch up the sideline from week 1... I don't see plays like that on a regular basis around the league. No one on the Giants seems to be running wide open in the secondary.
Drew Stanton threw for 167 yards and 0 TD's.
If you charted out the defense under PF's tenure, I'd be shocked if a professional head coach couldn't discern a trend similar to my observations. It's a bad re-run.
The defense picked it up yesterday when PF started calling more man and got some extra bodies dialed up on blitzes. As soon as the injuries went down, PF went back to his soft shell. It could be a logical common sense decision, but he almost always reverts to his soft shell.
And lastly, we gave up about 290 yards of total offense yesterday so I guess I am just not understanding the outrage.
I think Fewell sucks.
How did Jordy Nelson keep finding open spaces yesterday against the Jets. Doesn't Rex Ryan know what he's doing?
On Golden Tate's 44 yard catch in week 1 on 3rd & 11, there are no rookies in the secondary for the Giants. There are just experienced players who appear to have no idea what they're doing.
I am just tired of "Fewell sucks.. everything is zone coverage.. too complex... no one knows what they're doing"
They're all lazy arguments that piggyback and echo things that other people say. A lot of these things have no context and have become accepted as "fact" in this forum and it just annoys me. I just get the impression that a lot of these people would notice a lot of the same things they complain about around the league if they paid a this much attention to the other 31 teams. The pass is so damn difficult to shut down now when you get flagged for tapping a guy while he's running a route.
As far as the Tate play goes, DRC passed him off sooner than he should have. It was a fundamental error and a fuck up on his behalf. It's ok to say that DRC messed up. It doesn't mean Fewell called a coverage that was designed to have no one within 15 yards of a WR down the sideline.
Fewell for my money is an average DC. I don't think he's able to run the types of looks he really wants to consistently because he keeps losing the guys he trusts. We all know that he likes to deploy 3 safeties but when Quintin Demps is your 3rd safety, it gets a bit hard to do. You lose your main guy in the middle in Beason yesterday, you lose the promising young Kennard in week 1.
I realize adjustments need to be made but I also understand the apprehension on his behalf when it comes to isolating subpar players.
And finally, while I share the frustration of everyone about the 3rd down defense, the backup we lost to yesterday threw for 167 yards and didn't throw a TD pass. So this whole "guys are wide open all over the field left and right" just doesn't do much for me in regards to the game yesterday.
Not only is the answer to this "yes", but we probably win it by more than a TD.
I'm mystified where people are getting "read and react" from in a game where we blitzed often, hit the QB 10 times and sacked him 4. People keep calling for "aggressive".. that's not aggressive?
Like I said. There are buzzwords about this defense that people just run with even if they don't necessarily apply.
Cards shouldn't have scored their first TD - that one was on the refs. They shouldn't have scored on the punt return either - and then there was Jennings turning the ball over as the Giants were going down to score and tie the game up
That's where the game was lost - How Cruz get's blamed for the Punt return for a TD - I just don't see how that's his fault.
People, 14 points. You don't win games scoring 14 points.
some he didn't use because the outcome of game...
sounds like he lets teams dictate to us if his plan
doesnt work he sticks to it...beason gets hurt he
puts hertz in....should put mclain mlb..and paysinger
and Williams olb
The talent is there on D.
Right now, our LBers without those 2 are very bad. Very bad.
We also lost arguably the most talented player on this defense (Hill)
And our slot corner is already gone for the year.
I think we have the personnel right now to be slightly above average.
Highly disruptive? I don't know. Though I'd consider hitting the QB 10 times and sacking him 4 should probably fall under that category.
Giving up 3rd and long 1st downs is not a highly disruptive defense.
7 men on the D-line every 3rd and long in stand up blitz position. Ben did not know what was coming, that's my definition of highly disruptive.
I doubt we see that all year from this defense.
Also, the D backs of the Ravens were hitting the helmets off the Pitt receivers when they got a first touch on the ball - highly disruptive regardless of front formation type.
The had 1 pick off Ben and 2 forced fumbles, highly disruptive.
They allowed 380 yards of offense, didn't force a turnover and lost the game.
I don't like PF as a DC. His defense is more often then not, bend but don't break mentality which is not what a disruptive D is, its about dictating the tempo from that side of the ball.
The body of work for PF has a long history, many games.
His history also includes being a top 5 NFL defense in turnovers forced in 2010 (1st overall) , 2011 (t- 5th) and 2012 (3rd). They were tied for 8th in the NFL last year.
But since they haven't forced a turnover in a whopping 2 games this year, we're not "disruptive" enough now.
Drew Stanton threw for 167 yards and didn't throw a TD pass. I'm not sure what more you were expecting. 50 passing yards?
Oh.. and he was never a baseball player. That was Drew Henson.
The Giants defense plays reactive football, you can quote any stat you want, enjoy yourself into believing that this Giants defense plays DISRUPTIVE FOOTBALL under PF.
Have it your way guy.
Did you really read my posts? I referenced NFL game 2 Steelers - Ravens, nothing more.
The Giants defense plays reactive football, you can quote any stat you want, enjoy yourself into believing that this Giants defense plays DISRUPTIVE FOOTBALL under PF.
Have it your way guy.
Sure, or I can just start calling for "DISRUPTIVE" defense and create my own definition of it to fit my arguments like you are.
Which, by the way.. all of your arguments are awful. First you cite them forcing turnovers as the key to their "disruption" and then you say the Giants haven't been "disruptive" in years.. meanwhile they've been top 5 in turnovers forced in 3 of the 4 years Fewell has been here and top 10 in all 4 of them.
You use Baltimore as this model disruptive defense even though they got fucking smoked by Cincy in Week 1 and didn't force ANY turnovers.
But hey, their front 7 all stand up on 3rd downs and they knocked someone's helmet off so they're DISRUPTIVE.
Its about being physical against the run, with run blitz schemes, its about hitting hard when the receiver first touches the ball, its about confusing the QB with coverage reads that are constantly changing.
With a PF defense its a 4 man rush and zone coverage that often mis-communicates on zone split routes, time and time again. Not much variation.
And again. If all you see are 4 man rushes and zone coverages you simply do not know what you are watching. We sent extra men numerous times yesterday on blitzes and a bunch of them got there. We hit Stanton 10 times and sacked him 4.
The problem with guys like you is that you don't understand that we cannot play man coverage on every down nor does any NFL defense. You especially can't do it when you lose your middle linebacker and are already down another and then lose your slot CB on top of it. You wind up with guys who can't cover 1 on 1 against fast backs or TE's who are mismatches for them and guys get open easily.
This isn't Madden.
The problems have been too many bad mistakes at crucial times. And it's all around the team.
I referenced as an example what I saw in the Steelers - Ravens game - nothing more.
There is nothing awful about my reference, but if you want to go on believing that PF and the Giants play disruptive football on defense then go ahead and delude yourself with your stats. I am not here to convince you. I know what I know and see what I see.
Good night
You're also making up your own definitions of what is "disruptive" and what isn't.
How did LeSean McCoy do against us last year? Jamaal Charles? Adrian Peterson? Matt Forte?
Keep telling me we're not physical against the run. I'll keep naming guys that we've held far below their standards recently.
Whoopty damn do.
I've spent way too much time on this thread today. I'm over it.
They held Charles and Forte? You are AWFUL, if that's the stuff you can spew on here with confidence trying to make a point then have at it with others that won't call your BS.
I said clearly, what my eyes told me with a 1 game reference, but you have to pull stats to defend the PF defense????
You are delusional if you or any other Giants fan thinks PF plays a disruptive defense style. It's READ and REACT, BEND and not BREAK. Ohhhhh