Tell me again how Penn State faithful understand the wrongs that were done under the watchful eye of JoePa:
“He will forever stand as a great founder of our university, shoulder to shoulder with Atherton, Beaver, Pattee, Sparks and more. There will be other coaches, other presidents, other trustees and great men in Penn State’s future, but that does not mean we should forget this one man, who made Penn State great. My family and I eagerly await the future — but we will never forget to honor Joe,” said Susan Beck Wilson.
As a vocal segment of the alumni community now calls for restoration of the wins after the NCAA’s repeal of bowl and scholarship sanctions last week, there is a response from some that people are clinging to the past and not letting go.
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Yeah, good for them, poor Joe Paterno and PSU fans. Who cares that Joe Paterno and the rest of the administration let this stuff go on for years and did nothing to stop it.
You're fucking delusional
I have no ties to PSU other than several friends who love their school - and that's fine, but they lived their whole lives loving the image of what Paterno and what he means to that school was that I think they can't see that he didn't do enough. I agree Paterno did a lot for PSU, but he should have done more for the victims by acting in a timely manner, if nothing else.
Nor is the situation. At all.
Giants fans are not part of a cult. We recognize the sins of LT, and also recognize how much of those were harming mainly himself. We admit that we was wrong. PSU-ites refuse to admit that anyone did anything wrong other than Sandusky, and even some of that is offered only begrudgingly.
I never said their offenses are the same. So if you're going to pretend our fan base is immune from this, at least stop pretending I'm saying things that I didn't.
I'm an Ohio State fan. We would do this for Woody Hayes. Michigan fans would do it for Schembechler. This is the nature of being a sports fan... particularly a fan of college football.
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is not the same as turning a blind eye to pedophilia.
I never said their offenses are the same. So if you're going to pretend our fan base is immune from this, at least stop pretending I'm saying things that I didn't.
There aren't many who refuse to admit LT is a scumbag, though.
Give it another six months.
It's not the same.
Give it another six months.
This was funny.
I don't think they're turning a blind eye to Joe Pa as much as they are saying his punishment (wins record) was unfair. Most of us recognize LT was a great player, but may very well be a self-destructive ass/bad person. But good luck finding a PSU person who thinks Joe Pa should be anything less than a saint, his coaching career aside. I'm sure they're out there, but I don't know any.
Where do you come up with this asinine analogies? No Giant fan is demanding a statue of LT to be built. No Giant fan is trying to canonize LT. No Giant fan sits here blaming others for what LT did.
I don't see how one can assert such a thing.
I'm an Ohio State fan. We would do this for Woody Hayes. Michigan fans would do it for Schembechler. This is the nature of being a sports fan... particularly a fan of college football.
If Woody Hayes allowed child rape to go on without intervention, and you held a Woody-Out (er...), then you'd be an idiot too.
But, he's generally a curmudgeon towards everyone, so I don't even know if he counts.
But the rest of the PSU grads I'm around (and FFS, they're everywhere here in South Jersey -- either PSU or WVU; WTF!) still see him as the old man who everyone kept the dirty secrets from instead of the old man who had his hands on every bit of that program.
It's not the same.
That isn't the same as looking the other way as young boys are routinely raped by your staff.
But the rest of the PSU grads I'm around (and FFS, they're everywhere here in South Jersey -- either PSU or WVU; WTF!) still see him as the old man who everyone kept the dirty secrets from instead of the old man who had his hands on every bit of that program.
This! Im in SJ too and I work with a handful of them. One day, one of them actually argued that it was unfair because Paterno was literally the 85 yr old grandpa that really couldn't grasp what was going on so he didn't react. Really?
I don't see how one can assert such a thing.
None of us are asserting anything. We're responding to your assertion.
If you're looking for a better analogy (and you should be by now), it would John Mara turning a blind eye to, say, Spags being a pedophile. And I don't even really believe that Mara is what Paterno was at Penn State.
Joe Patersno was nothing but a self serving phony. He refused to retire because he couldn't bear for anybody else to have his job, his job he held for 40 or so years and won TWO national titles? That's it? Mets won 2 WS in 40 years. His whole claim to fame was "winning with class" so of course he did everything possible to have plausible deniability with Sandusky butt raping boys.
He is a disgrace, a phony, and an overrated coach...he ain't no Bear Bryant or Nick Sabol. What makes him all the more regnant are those stupid PSU fans who act like he/they are the victims. They'll defend Joe to the grave just because he coached a stupid football team. That's 100x more sickening than Ray Rice.
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Joe Paterno was PENN STATE FOOTBALL for almost 50 years.
It's not the same.
Huh? That's the tip of the iceberg. LT inadvertently hired an underaged prostitute. And he had a drug problem.
That isn't the same as looking the other way as young boys are routinely raped by your staff.
Most of us know LT's resume, good and bad deeds. Not sure of your point.
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But the idea that this type of behavior is exclusive to Penn State fans is a joke.
I'm an Ohio State fan. We would do this for Woody Hayes. Michigan fans would do it for Schembechler. This is the nature of being a sports fan... particularly a fan of college football.
If Woody Hayes allowed child rape to go on without intervention, and you held a Woody-Out (er...), then you'd be an idiot too.
Chris, I should've been clearer. I didn't mean me personally. I meant, collectively, the Ohio State fan base would've had plenty of supporters lined up for Woody... again, just like all of these college football programs with idolized figures such as Paterno.
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I don't disagree with either of you. In fact, vibe, to address your point more specifically... If the Giants had the equivalent of a Joe Pa, would our fans, collectively, a group of millions of different types of people, act any better than Penn State fans are?
I don't see how one can assert such a thing.
None of us are asserting anything. We're responding to your assertion.
If you're looking for a better analogy (and you should be by now), it would John Mara turning a blind eye to, say, Spags being a pedophile. And I don't even really believe that Mara is what Paterno was at Penn State.
Vibe, again, I agree we don't have the equivalent. That's why I think it's strange to call Penn State fans this or that as there is no reason to believe other die hard groups of fans would behave differently. Perhaps not you, but there will be plenty of assertions made about the Penn State fan base which will incorrectly distinguish them as more ignorant than other fan bases.
montanagiant : 3:58 pm : link : reply
Only If the Giants gave LT a special underage hooker banging/crack smoking office at their practice facilities for 10 years
...but part of me wonders if Parcells might have been tempted to do that.
*mostly kidding
LS : 4:01 pm : link : reply
ignorance here.
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A lot of
LS : 4:01 pm : link : reply
ignorance here.
Harvard?
I remember in HS the football coach got caught shoplifting at JCPenny. He denied it like a baby, then a bunch of similar minded fans staged a protest and boycott of JCPenny. It was and is ridicolous that some stupid jock coach can do no wrong just because he is coach.
But, sure. There are most definitely Giants fans who are as stupid as the stupidest of any other fan base. This, however, goes beyond that kind of ordinary stupidity.
I remember in HS the football coach got caught shoplifting at JCPenny. He denied it like a baby, then a bunch of similar minded fans staged a protest and boycott of JCPenny. It was and is ridicolous that some stupid jock coach can do no wrong just because he is coach.
I mean, there are people that decided this past week that NOW is the time to buy that Rice and Peterson jersey to show their support.
Oh?
Please explain.
He's just begging to be kicked in the nuts as hard as possible.
I mean, there are people that decided this past week that NOW is the time to buy that Rice and Peterson jersey to show their support.
There would be a better analogy. Dave Megget vs. Ray Rice.
And nicely done with the nearly subliminal, meta-reference to the National Organization of Women.
Just trying to help!
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.
Just trying to help!
I miss him.
There is still no comparison between the cult of LT and the cult of JoePa. Even the people who minimize LT's conduct don't pretend it is pristine. They like him because he was a good football player. They don't immortalize him as this larger than life beacon of moral virtue the way PSU fans did and do with Paterno.
No matter the city or the state, the head coach at any of those places is usually the most powerful man in the area. Especially if he's sporting a ring or two.
No matter the city or the state, the head coach at any of those places is usually the most powerful man in the area. Especially if he's sporting a ring or two.
Really? Other than Bowden, is there anyone who's name is synonymous with a major college football program the way Paterno was with PSU?
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ignorance here.
Oh?
Please explain.
He can't, drive-by post done because he lacks any cohesive point.
Ignore LS, he has been woefully idiotic on this topic before.
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is not the same as turning a blind eye to pedophilia.
absolutely. Were talking about a systematic willful acts of omission committed over decades.
Joe Patersno was nothing but a self serving phony. He refused to retire because he couldn't bear for anybody else to have his job, his job he held for 40 or so years and won TWO national titles? That's it? Mets won 2 WS in 40 years. His whole claim to fame was "winning with class" so of course he did everything possible to have plausible deniability with Sandusky butt raping boys.
He is a disgrace, a phony, and an overrated coach...he ain't no Bear Bryant or Nick Sabol. What makes him all the more regnant are those stupid PSU fans who act like he/they are the victims. They'll defend Joe to the grave just because he coached a stupid football team. That's 100x more sickening than Ray Rice.
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are no different then 95% of any collegiate fanbases. That's the sad reality of the sport.
No matter the city or the state, the head coach at any of those places is usually the most powerful man in the area. Especially if he's sporting a ring or two.
Really? Other than Bowden, is there anyone who's name is synonymous with a major college football program the way Paterno was with PSU?
Knute Rockne at Notre Dame
Enjoy thinking positively about a geriatric power broker who put his own aggrandizement ahead of the welfare of children, repeatedly.
Either he was part of it, or so willfully blind that he makes Mrs. Sandusky seem like a champion of justice, or even worse, he really was the doddering incompetent mascot who had to leave games before the half lest he shit his pants.
If hadn't croaked he should've been jailed for criminal conspiracy and accessory to Sandusky's crimes.
PSU should've lost football. This isn't about the current students - it's about the culture which swept decades of systemized child-abuse under the rug for the betterment of the football team and it's demigod leader. This is a pain point they should feel every day when they look at their shuttered stadium, and wonder why Saturdays don't feel the same as they once did.
Sometimes things are so heinous that they warrant such a permanent solution. This was one of those cases. The ball was dropped, and now the rats of PSU given an inch are looking for the whole mile.
BTW I'm a PSU alumn and I never liked Paterno. He stuck on way too long and was very stubborn. I just get annoyed when people call every PSU student and alumni disgusting and when people talk about Paterno as if they knew for sure 100% of what happened. I guess that makes me part of a 'cult?'
I'm also a Giants fan, so if I'm such a terrible person for being a PSU fan and thinking it's ridiculous that the NCAA took away Paterno's wins (Becuase those were PSU wins more than 'Paterno' wins'...also really just think of how dumb 'taking away wins' is...) i guess it doesn't translate over to Sunday's when I'm watching the Giants?
I had to listen to 1,000 RU fans chanting Ped U at me this past Saturday....I just don't quite understand then why they wouldn't call themselves Wife Beater U? Oh yeah..because it's very stupid to generalize and entire student population based on one person. Esp the acts of one sick man who happened to coach on the team 25 years ago.
It is sad to see with new evidence coming out that so many of you hang on to your misplaced hatred.
By the way are you aware that the Penn State sanctions were dropped because of a law suit being brought against the NCAA by the college. The NCAA who never conducted their own investigation, but instead tool verbatim, a flawed Freah report new they were are very shaky ground.
Paterno's wins will be restored and his statues returned to the rightful place.
The haters will continue to shout at the top of their lungs at people who support this. Because that is what people who jump to conclusions without facts do even when the truth comes out to reveal that they were wrong.
Their yelling and name calling is to avoid having to admit they were wrong, something that would be hard to do considering the amount of initial vitriol they managed to mount.
BTW I'm a PSU alumn and I never liked Paterno. He stuck on way too long and was very stubborn. I just get annoyed when people call every PSU student and alumni disgusting and when people talk about Paterno as if they knew for sure 100% of what happened. I guess that makes me part of a 'cult?'
I'm also a Giants fan, so if I'm such a terrible person for being a PSU fan and thinking it's ridiculous that the NCAA took away Paterno's wins (Becuase those were PSU wins more than 'Paterno' wins'...also really just think of how dumb 'taking away wins' is...) i guess it doesn't translate over to Sunday's when I'm watching the Giants?
I had to listen to 1,000 RU fans chanting Ped U at me this past Saturday....I just don't quite understand then why they wouldn't call themselves Wife Beater U? Oh yeah..because it's very stupid to generalize and entire student population based on one person. Esp the acts of one sick man who happened to coach on the team 25 years ago.
Timbaktu, seems to be the ones who haven't moved on are the Penn State fans planning a "Joe-Out". And it's not a very small group of people. The ones who don't defend Paterno are in the minority. I am born and raised in Pennsylvania, friends with a bunch of alumni, and I'd say at least 90% of the Penn State fans or alumni I know are complete jackasses when it comes to this entire situation and have been from the start.
Penn State fans behavior both immediately after and still to this day is exactly why they are ridiculed and deserve to be. The "Joe-Out" is even further proof of that, not that we needed any more.
And it wasn't just the actions of one sick man. It was the actions (or non-actions) of Joe Paterno, the president of the school, the AD, and many others. They decided protecting the schools image was more important than putting away a child molester. He would have been put in jail years ago if any of them cared, they did not, and as a result it continued for years longer than it needed to.
It is sad to see with new evidence coming out that so many of you hang on to your misplaced hatred.
By the way are you aware that the Penn State sanctions were dropped because of a law suit being brought against the NCAA by the college. The NCAA who never conducted their own investigation, but instead tool verbatim, a flawed Freah report new they were are very shaky ground.
Paterno's wins will be restored and his statues returned to the rightful place.
The haters will continue to shout at the top of their lungs at people who support this. Because that is what people who jump to conclusions without facts do even when the truth comes out to reveal that they were wrong.
Their yelling and name calling is to avoid having to admit they were wrong, something that would be hard to do considering the amount of initial vitriol they managed to mount.
"The Freeh Report was wrong" has the same currency as talking about melting steel. It's bullshit and it doesn't address the wider issue, one that you Kool-Aid drinking fucks cannot wrap your heads around. YOU, yes YOU, are the reason that program needed to die. It is people like you, people for whom Paterno is an honest to goodness saint, that were the reason why this shit didn't come to light years and years ago. The cult of Paterno, the importance of him and of the program to fundraising and to the school's identity, are why the administrators covered it up, and why Paterno was complicit in the same.
The school is a good academic school, but the campus fucking sucks, State College fucking sucks, central pennsylvania sucks. The football team is nothing great and hasnt been for a while. Basketball team blows. What exactly is their to be jealous about?
;)
I dislike child-rape, and the people who gloss it over in the service of a football team. If that looks to you like jealousy maybe its because your priorities are askew.
Because the efforts of Penn State and its saintly football patriarch to cover-up the efforts of one sick pedo deserve to be highlighted over and over and over again, no matter how much delusional folks like yourself try to wish it away.
Interesting that you're so defensive over some anonymous posters making comments about what may go down as one of the greatest fall of an individual everyone revered. Not to mention the despicable inaction of your school's leaders.
Haha...I'm sure that duned probably has done and will continue to do more for many people than you will ever know. But go on and act like a pissy little kid because someone said that the revered face of your school sucked.
The "new evidence"? Hah...unless it's new evidence that Joe Paterno didn't sit on an eyewitness account of child rape for a few days because he didn't want to spoil anyone's weekend, or that he did more than just make a perfunctory report to Tim Curley and then put it out of his mind....unless it has those two elements, yeah, I'm still glad that molester - enabling sack of shit is worm food.
This one and a PSU game thread.
I wonder if he and LS roomed together in Happy Valley.
Perhaps not, considering how deeply deluded and devoid of rational thought they seem to exhibit while they attempt to make PSU and Paterno the victims in this tragedy while showing minimal compassion or thought for the true victims - young, innocent children.
It's disgusting. Shameful. Pathetic. And embarrassing.
And one of you other fucking pieces of shit mentions some sort of 9/11esque conspiracy about the Freeh report? As long as we're going on specious shit, what happened to the reports that Sandusky was heading up a molestation ring of Central PA pedos whom he'd funnel children to?
As for the rest of the wins, not unless credible evidence were to come out proving that Paterno wasn't part of any coverup. I personally don't see that ever happening (regardless if he was or not).
I'm ok with people privately financing a statue for downtime. There are better things to spend your money on, but it's your money. But a JoePa-out is just a bad idea.
BTW I'm a PSU alumn and I never liked Paterno. He stuck on way too long and was very stubborn. I just get annoyed when people call every PSU student and alumni disgusting and when people talk about Paterno as if they knew for sure 100% of what happened. I guess that makes me part of a 'cult?'
I'm also a Giants fan, so if I'm such a terrible person for being a PSU fan and thinking it's ridiculous that the NCAA took away Paterno's wins (Becuase those were PSU wins more than 'Paterno' wins'...also really just think of how dumb 'taking away wins' is...) i guess it doesn't translate over to Sunday's when I'm watching the Giants?
I had to listen to 1,000 RU fans chanting Ped U at me this past Saturday....I just don't quite understand then why they wouldn't call themselves Wife Beater U? Oh yeah..because it's very stupid to generalize and entire student population based on one person. Esp the acts of one sick man who happened to coach on the team 25 years ago.
Well said. I think when someone does so much good over such a long period oftime, it's hard for people to believe that SAME person could have failed so miserably to stop such a horrible thing. I support Penn State Football because I went there and I'm a sports fan. In no way do I support or defend what Joe Paterno did or failed to do. I never realized how many people on this forum have a hatred for PSU and their fans.
The school is a good academic school, but the campus fucking sucks, State College fucking sucks, central pennsylvania sucks. The football team is nothing great and hasnt been for a while. Basketball team blows. What exactly is their to be jealous about?
Really?? The campus sucks?? State College sucks?? It's a town filled w/18-23 year olds with awesome bars, entertainment, and fun/cheap places to eat. What college kid wouldn't like that?? It's a fantastic time. Too fun actually, as I had to transfer and graduate from a less tempting school. Called Montclair State.
Granted, I think this happens at the majority of big schools, but moreso at penn state because of its insanely large student body and profound sense of community (e.g. they possess the largest student run philanthropy organization in the world-- and i'm talking $$$)
is that an indictment of the school? Hell no. They should be celebrated for creating that community, and the fact that the student body now raises 10mm a year for children's cancer research and family support far outweighs whatever garbage was collected by the football program.
Gee thanks for clearing that one up we never would have guessed!
And one of you other fucking pieces of shit mentions some sort of 9/11esque conspiracy about the Freeh report? As long as we're going on specious shit, what happened to the reports that Sandusky was heading up a molestation ring of Central PA pedos whom he'd funnel children to?
We never got to the bottom of this. It was conveniently swept under the rug..
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I mean, there are people that decided this past week that NOW is the time to buy that Rice and Peterson jersey to show their support.
There would be a better analogy. Dave Megget vs. Ray Rice.
And nicely done with the nearly subliminal, meta-reference to the National Organization of Women.
Isn't Dave Megget a serial rapist?
As for the rest of the wins, not unless credible evidence were to come out proving that Paterno wasn't part of any coverup. I personally don't see that ever happening (regardless if he was or not).
I'm ok with people privately financing a statue for downtime. There are better things to spend your money on, but it's your money. But a JoePa-out is just a bad idea.
I think wiping away wins is Orwellian and stupid, but to be fixated on that ("now that THAT's in our rearview, let's get our WINS back!") is just as misplaced in terms of priorities.
As was said, they were all protecting the brand and no child molestation was going to get in the way of that!! Joe couldn't let that happen!!
http://deadspin.com/penn-state-to-alums-please-stop-being-crazy-truthers-1631071842 - ( New Window )
I think wiping away wins is Orwellian and stupid, but to be fixated on that ("now that THAT's in our rearview, let's get our WINS back!") is just as misplaced in terms of priorities.
See I agree the wins penalty is bizarre and rather ridiculous, but I still think it is needed. The inaction and feigned ignorance of the school about what was going on is bizarre and ridiculous. It is a black eye on the program and school forever.
When someone brings up wins that no longer "exist" they bring up this tumultuous period where despicable things happened. Taking the wins away makes it impossible to forget or hide the fact about what happened. As long as PSU fans continue to bring up the wins they continue to make their program and school look awful. PSU deserves relentless ridicule until they no longer bring up Joe Paterno as a decent human being and accept him for what he truly was.
Personally I would rather they re-instate the wins and kill the program but we all know that would never happen.
I agree with Matt Millen when he said Joe Paterno died of a broken heart. There's not much left to debate.
I agree with Matt Millen when he said Joe Paterno died of a broken heart. There's not much left to debate.
Meh...reputation takes a life time to build but a single moment to destroy. In Paterno's case, this single moment was despicable in an epic manner. So yeah, I'm ok with ignoring all of the good he did.
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but prior to his death, he admitted to making a serious mistake. You're going to condemn him and ignore all the good things he did?
I agree with Matt Millen when he said Joe Paterno died of a broken heart. There's not much left to debate.
Meh...reputation takes a life time to build but a single moment to destroy. In Paterno's case, this single moment was despicable in an epic manner. So yeah, I'm ok with ignoring all of the good he did.
It's not a "single moment." He passed it up the chain. He then saw Sandusky on campus innumerable times thereafter, presumably in the company of children sometimes too.
Boo hoo, he died of a broken heart. Fuck him and fuck Matt Millen
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In comment 11867927 PeterS said:
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but prior to his death, he admitted to making a serious mistake. You're going to condemn him and ignore all the good things he did?
I agree with Matt Millen when he said Joe Paterno died of a broken heart. There's not much left to debate.
Meh...reputation takes a life time to build but a single moment to destroy. In Paterno's case, this single moment was despicable in an epic manner. So yeah, I'm ok with ignoring all of the good he did.
It's not a "single moment." He passed it up the chain. He then saw Sandusky on campus innumerable times thereafter, presumably in the company of children sometimes too.
You know what I mean. And yes, what you just stated backs up the adage above...his reputation was sullied ages ago by his continued inaction. So his reputation means jack and shit to most people, who don't have a personal allegiance to the school and the football program.
Actually, they haven't. That was deadspin's take on it. It says for them to be civil. Nothing more, nothing less.
Reading this brought Major Tom up in my mind...
Ground control to Major Tom - ( New Window )
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That's how batshit crazy they've become. http://deadspin.com/penn-state-to-alums-please-stop-being-crazy-truthers-1631071842 - ( New Window )
Actually, they haven't. That was deadspin's take on it. It says for them to be civil. Nothing more, nothing less.
Yeah, I wonder what in the world they could be referring to.
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not sure why anyone would be jealous of Penn State.
The school is a good academic school, but the campus fucking sucks, State College fucking sucks, central pennsylvania sucks. The football team is nothing great and hasnt been for a while. Basketball team blows. What exactly is their to be jealous about?
Really?? The campus sucks?? State College sucks?? It's a town filled w/18-23 year olds with awesome bars, entertainment, and fun/cheap places to eat. What college kid wouldn't like that?? It's a fantastic time. Too fun actually, as I had to transfer and graduate from a less tempting school. Called Montclair State.
Compare that to UCLA, not even close. Please define "awesome" bars and entertainment.
Boo hoo, he died of a broken heart. Fuck him and fuck Matt Millen
FTW
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In comment 11867851 Wuphat said:
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That's how batshit crazy they've become. http://deadspin.com/penn-state-to-alums-please-stop-being-crazy-truthers-1631071842 - ( New Window )
Actually, they haven't. That was deadspin's take on it. It says for them to be civil. Nothing more, nothing less.
Yeah, I wonder what in the world they could be referring to.
Telling them to be good examples for the students and not reacting to the vitriol like what has been exhibited on this thread. Not too difficult to figure out.
FOR SHAME.
I agree with Matt Millen when he said Joe Paterno died of a broken heart. There's not much left to debate.
He was an 85-year-old man who died of cancer. That "died of a broken heart" remark is exactly the kind of cliche, sentimental drivel you'd find in a biopic written by one of his sycophants.
Like on this thread?
I agree with Matt Millen when he said Joe Paterno died of a broken heart. There's not much left to debate.
Should read that:
He died of a broken heart due to the understanding that his inaction ruined children's lives, and that he failed to adhere to the same standards of ethics and integrity he forced on to young men playing for him.
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...
Like on this thread?
Yes. Joe Outs and assholes dressed like Paterno and scheming to re-erect a statue to their beloved JoePa are the reason why people on this thread are steeped in vitriol.
There no comparison to his and Paterno's actions. Woody lost his cool. JoPa, over a period of years was complicit in a well thoughtout plan to cover up heinous crimes against children.
OSU brought back Woody to dot the i much later. I can easily forgive someone for not exercising proper judgement and acting like a responsible adult and role model in one instance as opposed to what dear old gramps did.
Someone who prefers to no longer be addressed by his real name on here and changed his handle.
Anyway, my stance has been that I was waiting for more information. At best, he was ignorant and failed to follow up. At worst, he helped cover things up to protect the football team. I continue to believe the truth lies somewhere in the middle. I'm hopeful that that truth will come out, but not optimist.
Furthermore, I am in favor of returning Paterno's wins from 1998 to 2000 or 2002 or the season before the shit hit the fan with McQueary. This is simply because it didn't make any sense, seeing that the legal process was followed here.
Now, do I think the rest of Paterno's wins should be returned? As recently as 24 hours ago, I would have said only if credible evidence comes out that shows the Paterno wasn't part of any cover-up.
When I first heard about a Joe-out, I was disgusted. This group constitutes a small percentage of PSU students, alumni, and fans. However, they are very vocal and very annoying. They are the living embodiment of every negative stereotype being spewed about Penn Staters right now. The rest of us were very disappointed by the actions of certain people. We recognize that the only victims of this whole ordeal were the children whose innocence was destroyed by Jerry Sandusky. Our continued support for the university and its athletic program is due to the positive memories and experiences we had from our time there, not because we bow down to "Saint Joe." Yet when these idiots organize a Joe-out, no one condemns the actions of those few. They condemn all of us.
My tipping point was hit last night. I've mentioned before that I have a friend who worships on the alter of Paterno. And when he mentioned the Joe-out, he said "I'll be there with my JoePa shirt on." This was too much for me. He is a friend, so I resisted publicly shaming him. I did private chat with two mutual friends about my anger, and both felt the same way. And then in my anger, I got to thinking.
Let's say that Paterno wasn't part of any cover-up. Everything he had said on the topic was the complete and utter truth. In which case, here are the facts.
FACT: Paterno met with McQueary, and knew that something unappropriate has occurred between Sandusky and an unknown boy. Paterno said he didn't comprehend exactly what it was.
FACT: Paterno said that McQueary was very clearly upset about this. This was a day after the incident.
FACT: Paterno convened a meeting for the next business day between himself, the athletic director, and the administrator who oversees the university police. Even though he waited until after the weekend, he apparently saw enough urgency that it needed to be told the very next work day.
OK, so at the best, Joe Paterno, beloved in central Pennsylvania, respected throughout the country, and the originator of the "Grand Experiment," (which stated that a football could stress academics but still be successful in big time college football), knew something inappropriate happened that greatly upset McQueary, met with the AD and head of the police 48 hours later, and then essentially said, "Well, I did my job" and wiped his hands clean of the matter. Never once saw the need to ask ANYONE about it, especially as Sandusky continued to hand around. Just "I did my job and there's nothing more required of me." This is unacceptable for any public figure with a position of authority, and especially for a man with the reputation that Paterno had.
Paterno was not a victim in this at all. He was a villain. What differs is how much of a villain he was. So no, he should not get his wins back. And if these morons insist of having their Joe-out on Saturday, then "Go UMass." Karma is a bitch, after all.
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Now, if these people really want to have a Joe-out to honor the coach, here's the right way to do it. First, cancel this one. Schedule the real one for later in the season. Create memorabilia. Hats, t-shirts, etc. The sheep will definitely buy it, and a few others as well. Then donate the proceeds to organizations that support and counsel people who were abused as children. Essentially, don't celebrate this because he was a great coach. Celebrate this because he was supposedly to mean something, and by turning this into something positive, maybe he can someday mean something again.
I'm going to assume that he meant just field hockey with the assumption that people will understand that it's a women's sport...or maybe they do have a bunch of college guys bent over running around the field fighting for the ball. NTTAWWT...amirite, Brett?
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And one of you other fucking pieces of shit mentions some sort of 9/11esque conspiracy about the Freeh report? As long as we're going on specious shit, what happened to the reports that Sandusky was heading up a molestation ring of Central PA pedos whom he'd funnel children to?
We never got to the bottom of this. It was conveniently swept under the rug..
Yes. Where are we on this? The whistleblower made that accusation as part 2. Nothing came of it. Very eyes wide shut
Their very devotion to Joe Paterno, a man so powerful on the campus that he flat out refused to be fired OR resign, is proof-positive that there's no such thing as "up the chain" for Joe Paterno in State College, PA.
The guy who has the statue and the buildings named after him is the one at the top. Period.
I am a huge fan of penn state football and think this Joe Out thing is a bad idea. Folks just need to move on support Coach Franklin (who I think is just great) and the current players.
No one is judging...well other than Rocky
If any school ever deserved the death penalty, it is so obviously PSU. The fact they have a team is a testament to how corrupt the NCAA is.