because of their charity to the community, but pro sports having a tax exemption seems wrong, really wrong. THey are there to make money for their owners. How did this come about?
It's a 501(c)(6) as opposed to a 501(c)(3) like a church
1) The National Football League Office is a tax exempt entity. The league office runs losses and wouldn't pay taxes even if the status changes. The goal of this entity is to expand exposure of the game and to promote football operations.
2) NFL Ventures is the entity that collects ticket sales, tv broadcast, advertising revenues etc. This company is a partnership and as such, the individual members (the NFL teams) absorb the tax liability.
1) The National Football League Office is a tax exempt entity. The league office runs losses and wouldn't pay taxes even if the status changes. The goal of this entity is to expand exposure of the game and to promote football operations.
2) NFL Ventures is the entity that collects ticket sales, tv broadcast, advertising revenues etc. This company is a partnership and as such, the individual members (the NFL teams) absorb the tax liability.
+1, Its not as if the money made by football is not taxed.
1) The National Football League Office is a tax exempt entity. The league office runs losses and wouldn't pay taxes even if the status changes. The goal of this entity is to expand exposure of the game and to promote football operations.
2) NFL Ventures is the entity that collects ticket sales, tv broadcast, advertising revenues etc. This company is a partnership and as such, the individual members (the NFL teams) absorb the tax liability.
This. It's just capitalizing on ignorance to make headlines.
of remove all tax exempt status, even religious institutions. I believe I read somewhere, but admit I can be wrong, that if they removed it just for religious institutions for a few years The country would be out of debt in no time.
Although correcting the tax issue is something that is a way bigger deal that we shouldn't get into here.
So if nothing else I'd even vote for like a 5 or 10 year suspension of the exemptions to help the country right itself financially.
have an opinion about whether the NFL should be tax exempt. I think it probably requires a fairly deep understanding of tax law and the financial machinations of the league. There's probably a real conversation here, but we'd need more info.
However - tying their tax-exempt status to a non-tax/financial issue is pretty terrifying and possibly unconstitutional. This is a powerful government official saying to a private group "Do X" or we're going to change the law for you and it's going to cost you millions of dollars. Now you may or may not agree with "X" in this case. But there is a 100% certainty that there are people in the government who believe things that you do not agree with. And if this is the way we're doing business now, you can be sure that those people will get in on the spoils too.
And leaving the "agreeing with the issue" idea aside, this has a lot of similarities to a shakedown. It's a "nice little league you've got there, be a shame if something happened to it," except instead of it being the mafia, it's backed by the force of law.
So what does the NFL do? Fight it? Bend to the whims of our lawmakers? Step up their "donations" to politicians?
My problem with religious organizations having tax-exempt status is...
...some of them are using their pulpit to get involved in matters they have no business being involved in. For example, it's OK for a religious leader to preach about the evils of abortion and encourage the congregation to speak to their representatives about it. But it's not OK for an religious organization to openly campaign or fundraise for a particular candidate or to say something along the lines of "God wants you to vote for Candidate A."
Those that can adhere to that, no problem with the tax exemption.
I believe I read somewhere, but admit I can be wrong, that if they removed it just for religious institutions for a few years The country would be out of debt
I'd love to see where you read that because a quick check of the numbers seems to indicate it's at best fantasy. Let's say the current budget deficit is $500 billion (that might be low). Assuming a 35% tax rate, that means that churches would have to take in around $1.4 trillion AFTER EXPENSES to generate that amount of tax. AND, that does not reduce the current outstanding national debt by a dime. So to reduce the national debt in 5 years we're probably talking taxable income of 4-6 TRILLION per year.
You really think that's happening?
RE: I'm referring to the local tax breaks on property
and even if it was, that assumes that the tax changes wouldn't produce changes in giving (they would) and that there is no tension between the Establishment Clause and freedom of religion and the power to tax, which there is.
It is probably just their purpose and other peripheral details. Neither is subject to corporate income taxes. How does the NFL lose money? Is it the massive paycheck for Roger and other executives?
I wouldn't necessarily believe the deficit point either
the nfl is a trade organization with member clubs, it is no different than any other trade org that promotes an industry.
they wouldn't pay taxes anyway, so this a publicity stunt.
however, some of the congressional leaders also want to revoke the anti-trust exemption, which is bigger issue.
note that non profit orgs don't make money and wouldn't pay taxes anyway. churches and social service groups have non profit status more for other benefits, like be able to encourage people to donate, so they can get a write off, paying discounted property tax and electric rates, etc.
A non-profit organization that paid it's commissioner
so wouldn't pay taxes anyway not really addressing the question. Through that status out the window and compute profit and loss and consider unreasonable comp matters and distributions to trade members as taxable dividends, etc.
filter through to the owners anyway? I mean the NFL itself is simply an entity that unites the teams as an organization. The teams are all taxed it is just that the league itself is more organizational and while yes it focuses on profits they are then dispersed to all the teams who will pay tax on the money.
doesnt make any sense. They dont have profit or income. A more reasonable question is whether individuals should get deductions for making donations to religious orgs -- a question which doesnt raise the problem of having gov't too involved in the management of religious entities.
That question is really tied into the question of whether you should get write-offs for any charitable giving. There are decent arguments both ways, but I'm firmly in the camp that says we're better off with the deductions than we are without, since charitable giving would dry up and government would just have to step into that breach (probably at more cost to the taxpayer).
$9B or so in revenues, if I recall correctly. Noone is saying that the sport does not generate enormous profits. As I noted above about the corporate structure, the League Office is not the profit generating entity.
Goodell's salary is a different debate all together. Regardless if you think he is overpaid, by paying that salary to him, that money is getting taxed. So it is even morese counter intuitive to the discussion at hand.
1) The National Football League Office is a tax exempt entity. The league office runs losses and wouldn't pay taxes even if the status changes. The goal of this entity is to expand exposure of the game and to promote football operations.
2) NFL Ventures is the entity that collects ticket sales, tv broadcast, advertising revenues etc. This company is a partnership and as such, the individual members (the NFL teams) absorb the tax liability.
It's posts like this which keep me coming back to BBI. Thank you for the information.
1) The National Football League Office is a tax exempt entity. The league office runs losses and wouldn't pay taxes even if the status changes. The goal of this entity is to expand exposure of the game and to promote football operations.
2) NFL Ventures is the entity that collects ticket sales, tv broadcast, advertising revenues etc. This company is a partnership and as such, the individual members (the NFL teams) absorb the tax liability.
It's posts like this which keep me coming back to BBI. Thank you for the information.
Excellent point, but carry the question one step further. If the NFL Office will not incur any taxes with the change in status, why would anyone oppose it? The PR from that move would be very favorable
RE: RE: RE: This is just publicity for the congressmen.
Excellent point, but carry the question one step further. If the NFL Office will not incur any taxes with the change in status, why would anyone oppose it? The PR from that move would be very favorable
Actually, if the NFL Office is operating at a loss, wouldnt you expect it to be restructured so that the loss could be passed thru to the profitable teams? Im not a tax guy, so maybe that's nuts.
have an opinion about whether the NFL should be tax exempt. I think it probably requires a fairly deep understanding of tax law and the financial machinations of the league. There's probably a real conversation here, but we'd need more info.
However - tying their tax-exempt status to a non-tax/financial issue is pretty terrifying and possibly unconstitutional. This is a powerful government official saying to a private group "Do X" or we're going to change the law for you and it's going to cost you millions of dollars. Now you may or may not agree with "X" in this case. But there is a 100% certainty that there are people in the government who believe things that you do not agree with. And if this is the way we're doing business now, you can be sure that those people will get in on the spoils too.
And leaving the "agreeing with the issue" idea aside, this has a lot of similarities to a shakedown. It's a "nice little league you've got there, be a shame if something happened to it," except instead of it being the mafia, it's backed by the force of law.
So what does the NFL do? Fight it? Bend to the whims of our lawmakers? Step up their "donations" to politicians?
An intelligent, thoughful comment on the message board. Hope you don't get banned.
Thanks for the link. You will see that despite running a profit of $9M in the current year (a loss of $77M in prior year), they have a large accumulated deficit, which means if they were a tax paying entity they would likely have large net operating loss carryforwards (NOLs) and would still not pay taxes.
Considering they provide financing for the teams to build stadiums, I am sure there is some tax incentive...I just believe it is probably de minimis. Hard to tell without seeing the individual team tax returns.
As an aside -- I do know that every NFL team falls under the same licensing agreement, with the exception of the Dallas Cowboys. If you want to manufacture and sell Cowboys merchandise, you have to deal with Jerry directly.
unreasonable comp and are distributions deducted for purposes of the deficit. If taxable, they would run things differently and have more checks on what they do.
unreasonable comp and are distributions deducted for purposes of the deficit. If taxable, they would run things differently and have more checks on what they do.
Actually, they would have fewer checks on what they do. As a 501(c)6 entity, they are required to publicly report their finances, salaries and such. As a private company, that would not be the case.
2) NFL Ventures is the entity that collects ticket sales, tv broadcast, advertising revenues etc. This company is a partnership and as such, the individual members (the NFL teams) absorb the tax liability.
2) NFL Ventures is the entity that collects ticket sales, tv broadcast, advertising revenues etc. This company is a partnership and as such, the individual members (the NFL teams) absorb the tax liability.
+1, Its not as if the money made by football is not taxed.
2) NFL Ventures is the entity that collects ticket sales, tv broadcast, advertising revenues etc. This company is a partnership and as such, the individual members (the NFL teams) absorb the tax liability.
This. It's just capitalizing on ignorance to make headlines.
Agreed on that score, it's borderline extortion on some of them.
Although correcting the tax issue is something that is a way bigger deal that we shouldn't get into here.
So if nothing else I'd even vote for like a 5 or 10 year suspension of the exemptions to help the country right itself financially.
However - tying their tax-exempt status to a non-tax/financial issue is pretty terrifying and possibly unconstitutional. This is a powerful government official saying to a private group "Do X" or we're going to change the law for you and it's going to cost you millions of dollars. Now you may or may not agree with "X" in this case. But there is a 100% certainty that there are people in the government who believe things that you do not agree with. And if this is the way we're doing business now, you can be sure that those people will get in on the spoils too.
And leaving the "agreeing with the issue" idea aside, this has a lot of similarities to a shakedown. It's a "nice little league you've got there, be a shame if something happened to it," except instead of it being the mafia, it's backed by the force of law.
So what does the NFL do? Fight it? Bend to the whims of our lawmakers? Step up their "donations" to politicians?
Those that can adhere to that, no problem with the tax exemption.
I'd love to see where you read that because a quick check of the numbers seems to indicate it's at best fantasy. Let's say the current budget deficit is $500 billion (that might be low). Assuming a 35% tax rate, that means that churches would have to take in around $1.4 trillion AFTER EXPENSES to generate that amount of tax. AND, that does not reduce the current outstanding national debt by a dime. So to reduce the national debt in 5 years we're probably talking taxable income of 4-6 TRILLION per year.
You really think that's happening?
But aren't those breaks going to the teams, which are taxable entities? Those really have no relation to 501(c) status.
the nfl is a trade organization with member clubs, it is no different than any other trade org that promotes an industry.
they wouldn't pay taxes anyway, so this a publicity stunt.
however, some of the congressional leaders also want to revoke the anti-trust exemption, which is bigger issue.
note that non profit orgs don't make money and wouldn't pay taxes anyway. churches and social service groups have non profit status more for other benefits, like be able to encourage people to donate, so they can get a write off, paying discounted property tax and electric rates, etc.
Claims that the NFL is using a tax exemption to avoid paying the tax due on these revenues are simply misinformed - ( New Window )
That question is really tied into the question of whether you should get write-offs for any charitable giving. There are decent arguments both ways, but I'm firmly in the camp that says we're better off with the deductions than we are without, since charitable giving would dry up and government would just have to step into that breach (probably at more cost to the taxpayer).
Goodell's salary is a different debate all together. Regardless if you think he is overpaid, by paying that salary to him, that money is getting taxed. So it is even morese counter intuitive to the discussion at hand.
2) NFL Ventures is the entity that collects ticket sales, tv broadcast, advertising revenues etc. This company is a partnership and as such, the individual members (the NFL teams) absorb the tax liability.
It's posts like this which keep me coming back to BBI. Thank you for the information.
Link - ( New Window )
Quote:
1) The National Football League Office is a tax exempt entity. The league office runs losses and wouldn't pay taxes even if the status changes. The goal of this entity is to expand exposure of the game and to promote football operations.
2) NFL Ventures is the entity that collects ticket sales, tv broadcast, advertising revenues etc. This company is a partnership and as such, the individual members (the NFL teams) absorb the tax liability.
It's posts like this which keep me coming back to BBI. Thank you for the information.
Excellent point, but carry the question one step further. If the NFL Office will not incur any taxes with the change in status, why would anyone oppose it? The PR from that move would be very favorable
Excellent point, but carry the question one step further. If the NFL Office will not incur any taxes with the change in status, why would anyone oppose it? The PR from that move would be very favorable
Actually, if the NFL Office is operating at a loss, wouldnt you expect it to be restructured so that the loss could be passed thru to the profitable teams? Im not a tax guy, so maybe that's nuts.
However - tying their tax-exempt status to a non-tax/financial issue is pretty terrifying and possibly unconstitutional. This is a powerful government official saying to a private group "Do X" or we're going to change the law for you and it's going to cost you millions of dollars. Now you may or may not agree with "X" in this case. But there is a 100% certainty that there are people in the government who believe things that you do not agree with. And if this is the way we're doing business now, you can be sure that those people will get in on the spoils too.
And leaving the "agreeing with the issue" idea aside, this has a lot of similarities to a shakedown. It's a "nice little league you've got there, be a shame if something happened to it," except instead of it being the mafia, it's backed by the force of law.
So what does the NFL do? Fight it? Bend to the whims of our lawmakers? Step up their "donations" to politicians?
An intelligent, thoughful comment on the message board. Hope you don't get banned.
Link - ( New Window )
Thanks for the link. You will see that despite running a profit of $9M in the current year (a loss of $77M in prior year), they have a large accumulated deficit, which means if they were a tax paying entity they would likely have large net operating loss carryforwards (NOLs) and would still not pay taxes.
Considering they provide financing for the teams to build stadiums, I am sure there is some tax incentive...I just believe it is probably de minimis. Hard to tell without seeing the individual team tax returns.
As an aside -- I do know that every NFL team falls under the same licensing agreement, with the exception of the Dallas Cowboys. If you want to manufacture and sell Cowboys merchandise, you have to deal with Jerry directly.
obviously there is a huge benefit for the NFL
or the NFL would not fight so hard to keep non profilt status.
so either you believe that NFL is a non profit
or it is not.
if you believe it is not really a non profit then it 's status should be revoked.
Actually, they would have fewer checks on what they do. As a 501(c)6 entity, they are required to publicly report their finances, salaries and such. As a private company, that would not be the case.