What's the matter Mook? Come on man, I was just trying to tweak ya and I guess it worked. I'm cool with FSU not winning it all this year. Still basking in the glow of last year. But come on, you can't really have this level of confidence in ND... I'll tell you, Brian Kelly is a good coach... he had them well-prepared and they played their asses off. But come on... ND having ANY shot at winning the national title in the near future is clearly wishful thinking.
Mystique? Doesn't mean shit.
Why shouldn't I have this level of confidence in ND? There are two remaining games on their schedule that they could lose. AZ State and USC. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if they lost one or even both. They will absolutely not lose 3 games from here on out, like you suggested. Golson has lost exactly two games as a starter, and now he's going to lose 3 in the matter of a month when he only has two tough games?
at their roster and recruiting and what they will bring back and tell me they have no shot at winning a national championship next year. It's not wishful thinking by any means. And they were clearly good enough to play with FSU this year, and there is not one clear dominant team this year so why not them? We watched the same game tonight. There was very little to nothing that separated FSU from ND this year, the game came down to 2 yards. Notre Dame didn't get pushed around, FSU didn't outclass them with their athletes. This isn't ND of 2012, they have speed to go up against anyone. And their team is one of the youngest in the country, they bring back basically everyone next year and will add Keivarae Russell, who will be like adding a 5 star recruit.
ND played a terrific first half, and FSU showed up in the 2nd half and was clearly the better team. None of that final sequence would have happened without 1) some questionable playcalling on FSU's last possession where they conceded a 3 and out punt, an 2)a fluky 4th and 18 conversion where the ball was basically chucked up with a prayer that was answered.
Not to take anything away from ND. But they were not the better team tonight. The gave a good punch, but FSU simply has better talent top to bottom.
And FSU is not as good as they were last year. The loss of Kelvin Benjamin stung, and so does some of the offensive linemen like C Brian Stork. Defensively, they have some players but are young, and they have really been beat up by injuries this year.
I don't think FSU will repeat... they have a puncher's chance. ND is not ready for prime time. If FSU had to play Alabama right now they'd lose by at least 20. So we'll just have to see what happens. But don't hold your breath for a ND title anytime. The appearance they made a couple years ago was a joke. A bookies nightmare. You probably only made 10 cents to the dollar on the money line for that game.
ND played a terrific first half, and FSU showed up in the 2nd half and was clearly the better team. None of that final sequence would have happened without 1) some questionable playcalling on FSU's last possession where they conceded a 3 and out punt, an 2)a fluky 4th and 18 conversion where the ball was basically chucked up with a prayer that was answered.
Not to take anything away from ND. But they were not the better team tonight. The gave a good punch, but FSU simply has better talent top to bottom.
And FSU is not as good as they were last year. The loss of Kelvin Benjamin stung, and so does some of the offensive linemen like C Brian Stork. Defensively, they have some players but are young, and they have really been beat up by injuries this year.
I don't think FSU will repeat... they have a puncher's chance. ND is not ready for prime time. If FSU had to play Alabama right now they'd lose by at least 20. So we'll just have to see what happens. But don't hold your breath for a ND title anytime. The appearance they made a couple years ago was a joke. A bookies nightmare. You probably only made 10 cents to the dollar on the money line for that game.
FSU won by 4 points and 2 yards. ND outgained FSU by 100+ yards. The idea that FSU has so much more talent top to bottom is bullshit, it certainly didn't show up on the field at any point in the game. Both teams have top flight QB's. FSU may have more names, but these ND guys are going to become household names real quick, and they are insanely young.
And bullshit on Bama beating FSU by 20. The same Bama who played a mediocre at best Arkansas squad and won by a point. A&M has mailed in their season, they checked out after the Miss State game. Bama isnt anywhere near as good as the score showed today. I'd take FSU on a neutral field over Bama mostly because they have by far the best player on the field and he just so happens to play QB. When you have a top QB, you have a great shot to beat anyone
ND played a terrific first half, and FSU showed up in the 2nd half and was clearly the better team. None of that final sequence would have happened without 1) some questionable playcalling on FSU's last possession where they conceded a 3 and out punt, an 2)a fluky 4th and 18 conversion where the ball was basically chucked up with a prayer that was answered.
Not to take anything away from ND. But they were not the better team tonight. The gave a good punch, but FSU simply has better talent top to bottom.
And FSU is not as good as they were last year. The loss of Kelvin Benjamin stung, and so does some of the offensive linemen like C Brian Stork. Defensively, they have some players but are young, and they have really been beat up by injuries this year.
I don't think FSU will repeat... they have a puncher's chance. ND is not ready for prime time. If FSU had to play Alabama right now they'd lose by at least 20. So we'll just have to see what happens. But don't hold your breath for a ND title anytime. The appearance they made a couple years ago was a joke. A bookies nightmare. You probably only made 10 cents to the dollar on the money line for that game.
The 4th and 18 play was not "chucked up" Robinson was wide open, and Golson moved in the pocket and made a terrific throw with a guy about to pop him. You're acting like he threw up a hail mary and it got tipped up in the air or someone caught the ball off of his helmet.
ND is ready for prime time. And they will be next year, too. People keep wanting to down play this team because of what they thought of them going into the season. There is talent and speed everywhere on this team. A lot of that talent right now is freshman and sophomores getting very valuable experience. They will be pre-season top 5 easily next year and they will have earned that ranking. No team is going to bring back as many starters as they will next year.
I'm a good guy, I'd give you the benefit of the doubt anywhere I could. Do you know how much it hurts me to respect Greg? I have to, he's earned it.
What have you done, anywhere, anytime?
Ya know, fuck it, I'm not gonna do this.
Make a post, an original post that people might give you shit for and you're cool.
We don't have to agree, just post an original thought, that's all. Then maybe I'll tell you about my dinner with John Elway Franco Harris, Tommy Lasorda and Martin Mull. At the 92 Super Bowl in Minny. Elway and Harris never got a word in, Laorda was great until Martin Mull had us all pissing our pants. That's where LT stuck me with the $150 bartab. I'm connected, you're a jealous wannabe, shut the fuck up, but I mean that nicely. Waiting for your response...
No your not Rocky..You are an insecure loser who has the maturity level of a 13 year old..The mere fact that you keep trying to equate value and substance to a fucking internet message board speaks volumes of how lame you really are.
You sat here in this thread and tried multiple times to rally support to yourself with other posters and failed miserably. You don't like getting bitched slap then don't start shit, but especially don't continue to humiliate yourself by begging for help and being left stranded....Stop being a little pussy and man the hell up and handle it yourself. But when you can't handle it, don't start it if you don't want to be made the fool again.
Your opinion on what constitutes "Football knowledge" is laughable given the resume of threads you start on the subject. You literally get punk'ed on every football thread you initiate due to the asinine logic and complete lack of understanding of the game you illustrate. I mean seriously you are the laughing stock of this board at this point.
But what really made my night is knowing that I am completely in your head AFTER you tried to start shit...Now go run to the mods with that Nancy..
Oregon lost to Arizona at home. TCU lost to Baylor, who have played exactly two difficult games so far. One a last second win over TCU, and one a two touchdown loss at WVU.
Anyone who puts TCU over ND at this point needs their head examined
must have been too busy calling offensive pass interference to call a penalty on 26 for taking off his helmet.
Would have made it first and goal from the 9 yard line. Fuck I have to go to bed, this one is tough to swallow. If it's a rule, just like the pick play, then fucking call it regardless of the situation. No gray area in that one or not, he took off his helmet on the field as soon as Robinson crossed the goal line, and it wasn't called.
20 is blocking downfield well before the ball is released. It was the perfect example of a rub, pick, whatever. And honestly it didn't need to be so obvious. Robinson had such a great outside release and the throw was on the money. FSU got lucky bringing the heat. Horrible defensive call and extremely lucky to get nailed out by a penalty.
20 is blocking downfield well before the ball is released. It was the perfect example of a rub, pick, whatever. And honestly it didn't need to be so obvious. Robinson had such a great outside release and the throw was on the money. FSU got lucky bringing the heat. Horrible defensive call and extremely lucky to get nailed out by a penalty.
The defenders fucked up the coverage, too. The guy who was supposed to get Robinson ran with Fuller. He was going to be wide open with or without the pick, I know refs don't know that, but it's just a kick in the nuts. I still think it should have been offsetting penalties as Prosise got held, too.
20 is blocking downfield well before the ball is released. It was the perfect example of a rub, pick, whatever. And honestly it didn't need to be so obvious. Robinson had such a great outside release and the throw was on the money. FSU got lucky bringing the heat. Horrible defensive call and extremely lucky to get nailed out by a penalty.
The defenders fucked up the coverage, too. The guy who was supposed to get Robinson ran with Fuller. He was going to be wide open with or without the pick, I know refs don't know that, but it's just a kick in the nuts. I still think it should have been offsetting penalties as Prosise got held, too.
Its a tough call Mook. Especially in that situation. But 20 clearly interfered with 8s ability to cover 88. It was a pick. No doubt. Was there confusion by the FSU defensive backfield? Yeah. No question. They got extremely lucky. But it was the right call IMO.
8 was ever even going to try to cover Prosise, if he was he never would have initiated the contact in the first place and grabbed Prosise at the snap. I think Darby blew the coverage, and as soon as the play ended (which is the exact same point that 26 took off his helmet with no flag) the 3 defenders were yelling at each other like someone fucked up the coverage
have to move on and finally go to bed although I'm just fuckin pissed off and probably wont fall asleep for a while. All my venting hopefully out of my system. Nice chatting with everyone tonight, great game even if it felt like a kick in the nuts at the end. Didn't get the break in the end but still have a shot to get in the playoff. Go Irish. Go Giants
all the news accounts say the penalty was on Prosise. Crazy game. I don't think ND is out of the playoff at all. They are a dangerous team. After last night, I'm convinvced they can play with anybody.
what game where you watching? Of course they are ready for prime time. Just look how they played last night on the road. They have some amazing offensive talent at QB, WR and RB.
I don't think a last second loss diminishes that at all.
That was a thrilling game, especially if you recorded it in advance
said that he cried to the officials earlier in the game about ND running a pick play onnone of their TD's. He said he asked them to watch for it and call it when it happened again. Watching the replay over and over, it is obvious that he alerted his players to it as well, because they made ZERO attempt to cover the receiver. Ramsey grabbed his guy and brought him in to him as soon as he recognized the play. He made no attempt to separate. As soon as the play is over, he turns to the official and throws his arms up. That was a staged play as soon as they recognized the formation, to get the call.
It was a close play, could have went either way, but FSU talked the refs into that one, which is complete bullshit. They warned them, then their players went all Hollywood as soon as they seen the formation.
who is the biggest Notre Dame shill on television said the offensive pass interference call was "obvious", yet there are those here who are still bitching about it.
said that he cried to the officials earlier in the game about ND running a pick play onnone of their TD's. He said he asked them to watch for it and call it when it happened again. Watching the replay over and over, it is obvious that he alerted his players to it as well, because they made ZERO attempt to cover the receiver. Ramsey grabbed his guy and brought him in to him as soon as he recognized the play. He made no attempt to separate. As soon as the play is over, he turns to the official and throws his arms up. That was a staged play as soon as they recognized the formation, to get the call.
It was a close play, could have went either way, but FSU talked the refs into that one, which is complete bullshit. They warned them, then their players went all Hollywood as soon as they seen the formation.
I'm an ND fan and have been since I was 6 or 7 like my Dad was - like Petesherenow - a North Jersey Irish Catholic. I also have been a FSU fan for years and had a kid graduate from there, so I was between a rock and a hard place last night. But that was an illegal pick - wasn't PI on Ramsey - Prosise and Fuller both came off the line and locked onto their defenders with Fuller pushing his almost to the endline. If it had been a sweep, it would have been a masterful piece of blocking by both players. The previous picks by ND were not so aggressive, borderline as most picks are, but still legal, well run plays.
On the play in question, Prosise was so effective that he effectively took out two DBs. Not being and Xs & Os guy, it seems Fuller prevented the outside DB from releasing to the flat; Prosise locked on to his guy head up and prevented his release toward Fuller, leaving the 3rd DB who should have picked up Prosise with an inside release with nothing to do.
That Fisher pointed out to the officials that ND was running picks is not unusual - all coaches worth a crap do the same. It is done at the NFL level too.
It is too bad that that play is the one people will chose to focus on. I wish it was a clean TD or a clean defensive play. Kelly came in with a great game plan and his team did a great job executing it. In honesty I thought ND was the better team last night.
Florida State for their program, and Notre Dame for their fans. I wanted both teams to lose. Watching it live (and on replays), I thought the pick was blatant. It very likely would have been a touchdown anyway, but it looked like an obvious penalty that has to be called.
Notre Dame is not out of the playoff hunt. That program has too many fanboys who like to see them ranked highly for nostalgic reasons or any other.
Florida State for their program, and Notre Dame for their fans. I wanted both teams to lose. Watching it live (and on replays), I thought the pick was blatant. It very likely would have been a touchdown anyway, but it looked like an obvious penalty that has to be called.
Notre Dame is not out of the playoff hunt. That program has too many fanboys who like to see them ranked highly for nostalgic reasons or any other.
Acknowledging Winston is despicable, what is wrong with the rest of the program at FSU? Are you basing disliking the program on one person? Funny but I did not see any taunting, showboating (except for Travis Rudolph's TD high step and that was not that bad)from either team last night. Just curious as to what it is you don't like, as a respectiful query. Will not criticise.
ND fans - really? Are they any different than USC, Michigan, Viginia or Texas? Why, because they have a bigger fan base of non-alumni than the rest of the NCAA? ND fans aren't bandwagon fans - they don't come and go with success. This is one "hatred" that does piss me off.
but is that a penalty in the NFL? I don't remember ever seeing that call in the pros. Well, if it's the same penalty, about once a year in the NFL they call a pick on the offense.
IMHO, if it would not have affected the outcome of the play, it should not have been called. The refs have no business determining the outcome of a game like that unless the penalty was game changing.
Reminds me of the Super Bowl loss to the Ravens where a holding call on the Giants defensive lineman that nullified a pick 6 that I think would have tied the game at the time. I don't remember ever seeing that penalty called in the NFL since then.
but is that a penalty in the NFL? I don't remember ever seeing that call in the pros. Well, if it's the same penalty, about once a year in the NFL they call a pick on the offense.
IMHO, if it would not have affected the outcome of the play, it should not have been called. The refs have no business determining the outcome of a game like that unless the penalty was game changing.
Reminds me of the Super Bowl loss to the Ravens where a holding call on the Giants defensive lineman that nullified a pick 6 that I think would have tied the game at the time. I don't remember ever seeing that penalty called in the NFL since then.
Ahhhh, the Keith Hamilton phantom hold - and yes they still call that from time to time.
Yes that pick play is a penalty in the NFL and it is called, but not often. Difference is pro players do it more cleanly. And I just remembered, the ND TE #18 was called earlier in the game for it - called it a holding penalty. It was on a pass to Fuller who only got a couple yards, iirc.
leaving for the NFL is always a possibility but I dont think it will be this off-season. He knows the type of team he is going to have at ND next year, very difficult to leave that. He has already said if he interviews for the NFL again he's pretty much gone. I think ND will tell him to take a hike if he interviews again. I don't think there will be a ton of great jobs available, either. He already turned down the Eagles. Jets and Atlanta probably best jobs that will be available and Jets almost certainly will go to the Seattle coordinator.
Here are the jobs that have a shot to be available in the off-season
called? You don't actually watch much football do you?
Wow, is this a hostile thread.
You have to admit that it is called only rarely in the NFL and when a rare penalty is called to determine the outcome of a great game like that you have to question it.
If the official thought that that penalty prevented the defense from having a good shot at changing the outcome of the play, then I'm for it. If he called the penalty just because he saw an illegal action, knowing that the penalty would not have affected the play and without also considering that his flag would decide the game, he should not have thrown the flag.
It's like not calling pass interference, even though the DB clearly interfered, because the ball was uncatchable.
leaving for the NFL is always a possibility but I dont think it will be this off-season. He knows the type of team he is going to have at ND next year, very difficult to leave that. He has already said if he interviews for the NFL again he's pretty much gone. I think ND will tell him to take a hike if he interviews again. I don't think there will be a ton of great jobs available, either. He already turned down the Eagles. Jets and Atlanta probably best jobs that will be available and Jets almost certainly will go to the Seattle coordinator.
Here are the jobs that have a shot to be available in the off-season
Bills
Jets
Raiders
Atlanta
Miami
I think the Atlanta job with Ryan/Julio has a lot of appeal. But I still doubt he bolts.
ND fans - really? Are they any different than USC, Michigan, Viginia or Texas? Why, because they have a bigger fan base of non-alumni than the rest of the NCAA? ND fans aren't bandwagon fans - they don't come and go with success. This is one "hatred" that does piss me off.
Most Texas fans have a connection to Texas or are from the state. Same with Michigan, same with USC, etc. And as far as UVa goes, no one who doesn't have a personal or geographic connection would ever put themselves through the torture of being a Virginia fan.
Most Notre Dame fans, on the other hand, don't know a soul who attended one class and would be hard pressed to find South Bend, Indiana on a map. That program has been mostly irrelevant for two decades yet they get shoved down everyone's throat by NBC and college football columnists because of Knute Rockne or George Gipp or something.
If they got the coverage they merited as a middling program over the past 20 years, people wouldn't despise them so much.
definitely has a lot of appeal, and they have a good owner who is pretty patient, but who knows if they would even go after Kelly. Maybe it's wishful thinking on my part but knowing how good they can be next year I would have a real hard time seeing Kelly walk away from that team, he has been talking already how young they are this year and how good he thinks they are going to be next year.
ND fans - really? Are they any different than USC, Michigan, Viginia or Texas? Why, because they have a bigger fan base of non-alumni than the rest of the NCAA? ND fans aren't bandwagon fans - they don't come and go with success. This is one "hatred" that does piss me off.
Most Texas fans have a connection to Texas or are from the state. Same with Michigan, same with USC, etc. And as far as UVa goes, no one who doesn't have a personal or geographic connection would ever put themselves through the torture of being a Virginia fan.
Most Notre Dame fans, on the other hand, don't know a soul who attended one class and would be hard pressed to find South Bend, Indiana on a map. That program has been mostly irrelevant for two decades yet they get shoved down everyone's throat by NBC and college football columnists because of Knute Rockne or George Gipp or something.
If they got the coverage they merited as a middling program over the past 20 years, people wouldn't despise them so much.
We get it. You don't like Notre Dame. Why do you need to keep repeating it?
I had no rooting interest in the game. That being said I really thing ND got jobbed. And I said that right after that play happened.
The guy they called the penalty on got mugged by the DB. As mook clearly pointed out and I saw the same thing with the DB holding and jamming the Wr so he can't release from the line. How that is a pick I don't know.
FSU was playing man and maybe the outside DB is suppose to switch on that, but if that's a pick play how come the DB covering Robinson wasn't picked? He just got caught up in the wash, no one touched him.
And don't complain about the top Wr blocking the DB. All he did was go up the field and get in the way of the DB. If this is illegal then you need to take away 200 TDs that Peyton Manning has thrown. They run this same shit down around the goal line. They don't actually set "picks" but merely run interference by getting in the way of the DBs.
Btw, Mook I caught the guy taking off his helmet. I pointed out to the people I was watching the game. It should've been flagged for sure.
ND fans - really? Are they any different than USC, Michigan, Viginia or Texas? Why, because they have a bigger fan base of non-alumni than the rest of the NCAA? ND fans aren't bandwagon fans - they don't come and go with success. This is one "hatred" that does piss me off.
Most Texas fans have a connection to Texas or are from the state. Same with Michigan, same with USC, etc. And as far as UVa goes, no one who doesn't have a personal or geographic connection would ever put themselves through the torture of being a Virginia fan.
Most Notre Dame fans, on the other hand, don't know a soul who attended one class and would be hard pressed to find South Bend, Indiana on a map. That program has been mostly irrelevant for two decades yet they get shoved down everyone's throat by NBC and college football columnists because of Knute Rockne or George Gipp or something.
If they got the coverage they merited as a middling program over the past 20 years, people wouldn't despise them so much.
See this is where your head is up your tail pipe - They get big coverage because lots of people root for them - or against. They draw! Get it - marketing. ND has great demographics, that is why they have their own deal with NBC. Not really hard to see.
And yeah, gee a whole lot of Catholics, especially Irish - you know 26% of the US population - identify with ND. We're a clanish group.
There is a mythical baseball team from the Bronx we root for that are almost always the biggest draw opposing teams have each year. Whether they are god or bad, people come to see the Yankees. Good or bad, people come out to see ND.
I apologize in advance for my condescending tone, but you got my Irish up.
My mom's family is Irish Catholic from Kilkelly and Ballina
when people like Greg call myself and other ND fans bandwagon fans, then in the same breath talk about how ND has been irrelevant for 20+ years. I'm 27 years old, so according to him they've been irrelevant since I was at least 7, yet I'm a bandwagon, even though my entire existence as an ND fan has been nothing but heart break or shitty seasons.
RE: They get the media coverage because they still
I compare Notre Dame fans to Cowboy fans. I thought that both were frontrunners who would desert the teams if they ever just became mediocre.
Well both became mediocre for decades and still have fans all out of proportion to their win-loss records.
I credit the fans for sticking with their teams after they went from legendary to irrelevant.
Reeces - difference is that Cowboy fans ARE bandwagon. ND is not. The ND fans don't leave - like Giants fans they suffer through Jerry Faust, Ty Willingham (I liked him), Charlie Weiss... we Giants had he whom shall remain nameless..
eh, it is all irrelevant because we could discuss this every week.
"Actually I have less clarity...Florida State blew the coverage and got rewarded for it."
No one on FSU was ever attempting to cover Robinson. His defender never got picked because his defender never existed. Frustrating as shit.
I think because the guy that should have had Robinson was being shoved to the back of the endzone by Fuller. I would think the outside DB would have rotated to the flat; whomever was over Prosise would rotate to Fuller and the inside DB to Prosise. But I'm not certain. And Prosise did his job so well, he actually took out the inside DB too.
But it would be nice for somebody semi-official to draw it up and explain the coverages and why it was PI since it was such a big play.
"Actually I have less clarity...Florida State blew the coverage and got rewarded for it."
No one on FSU was ever attempting to cover Robinson. His defender never got picked because his defender never existed. Frustrating as shit.
I think because the guy that should have had Robinson was being shoved to the back of the endzone by Fuller. I would think the outside DB would have rotated to the flat; whomever was over Prosise would rotate to Fuller and the inside DB to Prosise. But I'm not certain. And Prosise did his job so well, he actually took out the inside DB too.
But it would be nice for somebody semi-official to draw it up and explain the coverages and why it was PI since it was such a big play.
As far as their defensive call, yes Darby should have had Robinson, but he runs with Fuller and never tries to play Robinson, Darby blew the coverage, as soon as Fuller went inside Darby followed and then thats when the contact came
Mystique? Doesn't mean shit.
Why shouldn't I have this level of confidence in ND? There are two remaining games on their schedule that they could lose. AZ State and USC. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if they lost one or even both. They will absolutely not lose 3 games from here on out, like you suggested. Golson has lost exactly two games as a starter, and now he's going to lose 3 in the matter of a month when he only has two tough games?
Got me there moookman
Continue to argue with Jim, who actually believes that Winston didn't have his way with that girl.
I understand though, done the same thing myself too many times.
Can't help you though, not that you would need it, lol, I got to get to bed.
Something about some team called Dallas or something...
Not to take anything away from ND. But they were not the better team tonight. The gave a good punch, but FSU simply has better talent top to bottom.
And FSU is not as good as they were last year. The loss of Kelvin Benjamin stung, and so does some of the offensive linemen like C Brian Stork. Defensively, they have some players but are young, and they have really been beat up by injuries this year.
I don't think FSU will repeat... they have a puncher's chance. ND is not ready for prime time. If FSU had to play Alabama right now they'd lose by at least 20. So we'll just have to see what happens. But don't hold your breath for a ND title anytime. The appearance they made a couple years ago was a joke. A bookies nightmare. You probably only made 10 cents to the dollar on the money line for that game.
Not to take anything away from ND. But they were not the better team tonight. The gave a good punch, but FSU simply has better talent top to bottom.
And FSU is not as good as they were last year. The loss of Kelvin Benjamin stung, and so does some of the offensive linemen like C Brian Stork. Defensively, they have some players but are young, and they have really been beat up by injuries this year.
I don't think FSU will repeat... they have a puncher's chance. ND is not ready for prime time. If FSU had to play Alabama right now they'd lose by at least 20. So we'll just have to see what happens. But don't hold your breath for a ND title anytime. The appearance they made a couple years ago was a joke. A bookies nightmare. You probably only made 10 cents to the dollar on the money line for that game.
FSU won by 4 points and 2 yards. ND outgained FSU by 100+ yards. The idea that FSU has so much more talent top to bottom is bullshit, it certainly didn't show up on the field at any point in the game. Both teams have top flight QB's. FSU may have more names, but these ND guys are going to become household names real quick, and they are insanely young.
And bullshit on Bama beating FSU by 20. The same Bama who played a mediocre at best Arkansas squad and won by a point. A&M has mailed in their season, they checked out after the Miss State game. Bama isnt anywhere near as good as the score showed today. I'd take FSU on a neutral field over Bama mostly because they have by far the best player on the field and he just so happens to play QB. When you have a top QB, you have a great shot to beat anyone
Not to take anything away from ND. But they were not the better team tonight. The gave a good punch, but FSU simply has better talent top to bottom.
And FSU is not as good as they were last year. The loss of Kelvin Benjamin stung, and so does some of the offensive linemen like C Brian Stork. Defensively, they have some players but are young, and they have really been beat up by injuries this year.
I don't think FSU will repeat... they have a puncher's chance. ND is not ready for prime time. If FSU had to play Alabama right now they'd lose by at least 20. So we'll just have to see what happens. But don't hold your breath for a ND title anytime. The appearance they made a couple years ago was a joke. A bookies nightmare. You probably only made 10 cents to the dollar on the money line for that game.
The 4th and 18 play was not "chucked up" Robinson was wide open, and Golson moved in the pocket and made a terrific throw with a guy about to pop him. You're acting like he threw up a hail mary and it got tipped up in the air or someone caught the ball off of his helmet.
ND is ready for prime time. And they will be next year, too. People keep wanting to down play this team because of what they thought of them going into the season. There is talent and speed everywhere on this team. A lot of that talent right now is freshman and sophomores getting very valuable experience. They will be pre-season top 5 easily next year and they will have earned that ranking. No team is going to bring back as many starters as they will next year.
I'm a good guy, I'd give you the benefit of the doubt anywhere I could. Do you know how much it hurts me to respect Greg? I have to, he's earned it.
What have you done, anywhere, anytime?
Ya know, fuck it, I'm not gonna do this.
Make a post, an original post that people might give you shit for and you're cool.
We don't have to agree, just post an original thought, that's all. Then maybe I'll tell you about my dinner with John Elway Franco Harris, Tommy Lasorda and Martin Mull. At the 92 Super Bowl in Minny. Elway and Harris never got a word in, Laorda was great until Martin Mull had us all pissing our pants. That's where LT stuck me with the $150 bartab. I'm connected, you're a jealous wannabe, shut the fuck up, but I mean that nicely. Waiting for your response...
No your not Rocky..You are an insecure loser who has the maturity level of a 13 year old..The mere fact that you keep trying to equate value and substance to a fucking internet message board speaks volumes of how lame you really are.
You sat here in this thread and tried multiple times to rally support to yourself with other posters and failed miserably. You don't like getting bitched slap then don't start shit, but especially don't continue to humiliate yourself by begging for help and being left stranded....Stop being a little pussy and man the hell up and handle it yourself. But when you can't handle it, don't start it if you don't want to be made the fool again.
Your opinion on what constitutes "Football knowledge" is laughable given the resume of threads you start on the subject. You literally get punk'ed on every football thread you initiate due to the asinine logic and complete lack of understanding of the game you illustrate. I mean seriously you are the laughing stock of this board at this point.
But what really made my night is knowing that I am completely in your head AFTER you tried to start shit...Now go run to the mods with that Nancy..
Oregon lost to Arizona at home. TCU lost to Baylor, who have played exactly two difficult games so far. One a last second win over TCU, and one a two touchdown loss at WVU.
Anyone who puts TCU over ND at this point needs their head examined
Would have made it first and goal from the 9 yard line. Fuck I have to go to bed, this one is tough to swallow. If it's a rule, just like the pick play, then fucking call it regardless of the situation. No gray area in that one or not, he took off his helmet on the field as soon as Robinson crossed the goal line, and it wasn't called.
Fuck. Go Irish
The defenders fucked up the coverage, too. The guy who was supposed to get Robinson ran with Fuller. He was going to be wide open with or without the pick, I know refs don't know that, but it's just a kick in the nuts. I still think it should have been offsetting penalties as Prosise got held, too.
Quote:
20 is blocking downfield well before the ball is released. It was the perfect example of a rub, pick, whatever. And honestly it didn't need to be so obvious. Robinson had such a great outside release and the throw was on the money. FSU got lucky bringing the heat. Horrible defensive call and extremely lucky to get nailed out by a penalty.
The defenders fucked up the coverage, too. The guy who was supposed to get Robinson ran with Fuller. He was going to be wide open with or without the pick, I know refs don't know that, but it's just a kick in the nuts. I still think it should have been offsetting penalties as Prosise got held, too.
Its a tough call Mook. Especially in that situation. But 20 clearly interfered with 8s ability to cover 88. It was a pick. No doubt. Was there confusion by the FSU defensive backfield? Yeah. No question. They got extremely lucky. But it was the right call IMO.
Not one referee saw him take off his helmet?
Ramsey clearly holding Prosise
Ramsey clearly holding Prosise
Or fighting to get outside as he is allowed to do since Prosise came off the line blocking...
I don't think a last second loss diminishes that at all.
End zone view - ( New Window )
It was a close play, could have went either way, but FSU talked the refs into that one, which is complete bullshit. They warned them, then their players went all Hollywood as soon as they seen the formation.
It was a close play, could have went either way, but FSU talked the refs into that one, which is complete bullshit. They warned them, then their players went all Hollywood as soon as they seen the formation.
I'm an ND fan and have been since I was 6 or 7 like my Dad was - like Petesherenow - a North Jersey Irish Catholic. I also have been a FSU fan for years and had a kid graduate from there, so I was between a rock and a hard place last night. But that was an illegal pick - wasn't PI on Ramsey - Prosise and Fuller both came off the line and locked onto their defenders with Fuller pushing his almost to the endline. If it had been a sweep, it would have been a masterful piece of blocking by both players. The previous picks by ND were not so aggressive, borderline as most picks are, but still legal, well run plays.
On the play in question, Prosise was so effective that he effectively took out two DBs. Not being and Xs & Os guy, it seems Fuller prevented the outside DB from releasing to the flat; Prosise locked on to his guy head up and prevented his release toward Fuller, leaving the 3rd DB who should have picked up Prosise with an inside release with nothing to do.
That Fisher pointed out to the officials that ND was running picks is not unusual - all coaches worth a crap do the same. It is done at the NFL level too.
It is too bad that that play is the one people will chose to focus on. I wish it was a clean TD or a clean defensive play. Kelly came in with a great game plan and his team did a great job executing it. In honesty I thought ND was the better team last night.
Notre Dame is not out of the playoff hunt. That program has too many fanboys who like to see them ranked highly for nostalgic reasons or any other.
Notre Dame is not out of the playoff hunt. That program has too many fanboys who like to see them ranked highly for nostalgic reasons or any other.
Acknowledging Winston is despicable, what is wrong with the rest of the program at FSU? Are you basing disliking the program on one person? Funny but I did not see any taunting, showboating (except for Travis Rudolph's TD high step and that was not that bad)from either team last night. Just curious as to what it is you don't like, as a respectiful query. Will not criticise.
ND fans - really? Are they any different than USC, Michigan, Viginia or Texas? Why, because they have a bigger fan base of non-alumni than the rest of the NCAA? ND fans aren't bandwagon fans - they don't come and go with success. This is one "hatred" that does piss me off.
IMHO, if it would not have affected the outcome of the play, it should not have been called. The refs have no business determining the outcome of a game like that unless the penalty was game changing.
Reminds me of the Super Bowl loss to the Ravens where a holding call on the Giants defensive lineman that nullified a pick 6 that I think would have tied the game at the time. I don't remember ever seeing that penalty called in the NFL since then.
IMHO, if it would not have affected the outcome of the play, it should not have been called. The refs have no business determining the outcome of a game like that unless the penalty was game changing.
Reminds me of the Super Bowl loss to the Ravens where a holding call on the Giants defensive lineman that nullified a pick 6 that I think would have tied the game at the time. I don't remember ever seeing that penalty called in the NFL since then.
Ahhhh, the Keith Hamilton phantom hold - and yes they still call that from time to time.
Yes that pick play is a penalty in the NFL and it is called, but not often. Difference is pro players do it more cleanly. And I just remembered, the ND TE #18 was called earlier in the game for it - called it a holding penalty. It was on a pass to Fuller who only got a couple yards, iirc.
And for people saying ND isn't ready for primetime? Um, yes they are. They're very, very good.
And for people saying ND isn't ready for primetime? Um, yes they are. They're very, very good.
If Golson stays, they'll be a top 5 team.
Quote:
God damn I'm still pissed. ND was the better team, but FSU won & credit to them.
And for people saying ND isn't ready for primetime? Um, yes they are. They're very, very good.
If Golson stays, they'll be a top 5 team.
I think they likely drop one more game, either to Arizona State or USC. They'll finish the regular season 10-2.
But as Mook said, they're very young & will be only better next season. ND is back. I just hope Kelly doesn't bolt to the NFL.
Here are the jobs that have a shot to be available in the off-season
Bills
Jets
Raiders
Atlanta
Miami
Wow, is this a hostile thread.
You have to admit that it is called only rarely in the NFL and when a rare penalty is called to determine the outcome of a great game like that you have to question it.
If the official thought that that penalty prevented the defense from having a good shot at changing the outcome of the play, then I'm for it. If he called the penalty just because he saw an illegal action, knowing that the penalty would not have affected the play and without also considering that his flag would decide the game, he should not have thrown the flag.
It's like not calling pass interference, even though the DB clearly interfered, because the ball was uncatchable.
You know, in the big games, let them play.
Here are the jobs that have a shot to be available in the off-season
Bills
Jets
Raiders
Atlanta
Miami
I think the Atlanta job with Ryan/Julio has a lot of appeal. But I still doubt he bolts.
Most Texas fans have a connection to Texas or are from the state. Same with Michigan, same with USC, etc. And as far as UVa goes, no one who doesn't have a personal or geographic connection would ever put themselves through the torture of being a Virginia fan.
Most Notre Dame fans, on the other hand, don't know a soul who attended one class and would be hard pressed to find South Bend, Indiana on a map. That program has been mostly irrelevant for two decades yet they get shoved down everyone's throat by NBC and college football columnists because of Knute Rockne or George Gipp or something.
If they got the coverage they merited as a middling program over the past 20 years, people wouldn't despise them so much.
Quote:
ND fans - really? Are they any different than USC, Michigan, Viginia or Texas? Why, because they have a bigger fan base of non-alumni than the rest of the NCAA? ND fans aren't bandwagon fans - they don't come and go with success. This is one "hatred" that does piss me off.
Most Texas fans have a connection to Texas or are from the state. Same with Michigan, same with USC, etc. And as far as UVa goes, no one who doesn't have a personal or geographic connection would ever put themselves through the torture of being a Virginia fan.
Most Notre Dame fans, on the other hand, don't know a soul who attended one class and would be hard pressed to find South Bend, Indiana on a map. That program has been mostly irrelevant for two decades yet they get shoved down everyone's throat by NBC and college football columnists because of Knute Rockne or George Gipp or something.
If they got the coverage they merited as a middling program over the past 20 years, people wouldn't despise them so much.
We get it. You don't like Notre Dame. Why do you need to keep repeating it?
I had no rooting interest in the game. That being said I really thing ND got jobbed. And I said that right after that play happened.
The guy they called the penalty on got mugged by the DB. As mook clearly pointed out and I saw the same thing with the DB holding and jamming the Wr so he can't release from the line. How that is a pick I don't know.
FSU was playing man and maybe the outside DB is suppose to switch on that, but if that's a pick play how come the DB covering Robinson wasn't picked? He just got caught up in the wash, no one touched him.
And don't complain about the top Wr blocking the DB. All he did was go up the field and get in the way of the DB. If this is illegal then you need to take away 200 TDs that Peyton Manning has thrown. They run this same shit down around the goal line. They don't actually set "picks" but merely run interference by getting in the way of the DBs.
Btw, Mook I caught the guy taking off his helmet. I pointed out to the people I was watching the game. It should've been flagged for sure.
Quote:
ND fans - really? Are they any different than USC, Michigan, Viginia or Texas? Why, because they have a bigger fan base of non-alumni than the rest of the NCAA? ND fans aren't bandwagon fans - they don't come and go with success. This is one "hatred" that does piss me off.
Most Texas fans have a connection to Texas or are from the state. Same with Michigan, same with USC, etc. And as far as UVa goes, no one who doesn't have a personal or geographic connection would ever put themselves through the torture of being a Virginia fan.
Most Notre Dame fans, on the other hand, don't know a soul who attended one class and would be hard pressed to find South Bend, Indiana on a map. That program has been mostly irrelevant for two decades yet they get shoved down everyone's throat by NBC and college football columnists because of Knute Rockne or George Gipp or something.
If they got the coverage they merited as a middling program over the past 20 years, people wouldn't despise them so much.
See this is where your head is up your tail pipe - They get big coverage because lots of people root for them - or against. They draw! Get it - marketing. ND has great demographics, that is why they have their own deal with NBC. Not really hard to see.
And yeah, gee a whole lot of Catholics, especially Irish - you know 26% of the US population - identify with ND. We're a clanish group.
There is a mythical baseball team from the Bronx we root for that are almost always the biggest draw opposing teams have each year. Whether they are god or bad, people come to see the Yankees. Good or bad, people come out to see ND.
I apologize in advance for my condescending tone, but you got my Irish up.
No one on FSU was ever attempting to cover Robinson. His defender never got picked because his defender never existed. Frustrating as shit.
I compare Notre Dame fans to Cowboy fans. I thought that both were frontrunners who would desert the teams if they ever just became mediocre.
Well both became mediocre for decades and still have fans all out of proportion to their win-loss records.
I credit the fans for sticking with their teams after they went from legendary to irrelevant.
I compare Notre Dame fans to Cowboy fans. I thought that both were frontrunners who would desert the teams if they ever just became mediocre.
Well both became mediocre for decades and still have fans all out of proportion to their win-loss records.
I credit the fans for sticking with their teams after they went from legendary to irrelevant.
Reeces - difference is that Cowboy fans ARE bandwagon. ND is not. The ND fans don't leave - like Giants fans they suffer through Jerry Faust, Ty Willingham (I liked him), Charlie Weiss... we Giants had he whom shall remain nameless..
eh, it is all irrelevant because we could discuss this every week.
No one on FSU was ever attempting to cover Robinson. His defender never got picked because his defender never existed. Frustrating as shit.
I think because the guy that should have had Robinson was being shoved to the back of the endzone by Fuller. I would think the outside DB would have rotated to the flat; whomever was over Prosise would rotate to Fuller and the inside DB to Prosise. But I'm not certain. And Prosise did his job so well, he actually took out the inside DB too.
But it would be nice for somebody semi-official to draw it up and explain the coverages and why it was PI since it was such a big play.
Quote:
"Actually I have less clarity...Florida State blew the coverage and got rewarded for it."
No one on FSU was ever attempting to cover Robinson. His defender never got picked because his defender never existed. Frustrating as shit.
I think because the guy that should have had Robinson was being shoved to the back of the endzone by Fuller. I would think the outside DB would have rotated to the flat; whomever was over Prosise would rotate to Fuller and the inside DB to Prosise. But I'm not certain. And Prosise did his job so well, he actually took out the inside DB too.
But it would be nice for somebody semi-official to draw it up and explain the coverages and why it was PI since it was such a big play.
As far as their defensive call, yes Darby should have had Robinson, but he runs with Fuller and never tries to play Robinson, Darby blew the coverage, as soon as Fuller went inside Darby followed and then thats when the contact came