for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Graziano: Giants may move on from Will Beatty at LT?

Jints in Carolina : 10/25/2014 9:30 pm
Quote:
Giants 360 & #8207;@Giants360 5s6 seconds ago
ESPN's Dan Graziano thinks the Giants will move on from LT Will Beatty after this season if his play doesn't improve in the final 9 games.


In other news, I may win the lottery if I ever play it.
Pages: 1 2 <<Prev | Show All |
RE: It's  
Milton : 10/25/2014 11:31 pm : link
In comment 11940104 AcidTest said:
Quote:
been much more good than bad from Beatty this season IMO. In any event, absent a real shit show from him the rest of the year, I can't imagine the Giants cutting him. He is owed $8M next year, but it would be $8.1M in dead money to cut him. I'm not sure if that could be spread over two years if he's cut post June 1. And who would replace him?
His salary is $5.5M next year (and I'm guessing he receives another $50K-$250K in the form of an offseason workout bonus). And given that the Giants aren't in cap hell, the only real question is whether or not he is worth the $5.5M (or so) in new money that he is due to receive. And I'm guessing the Giants will view him as worth that kind of money even if they actively explore replacement possibilities (i.e., a 1st round pick).

One caveat (besides him completely shitting the bed) would be if he should once again finish the year on IR.
Baloney.  
Dry Lightning : 10/25/2014 11:35 pm : link
He has been adequate this year and we are stuck with him because of the cap. Pugh is worse. The interior of the line has had some shitty moments, but the tackleS are the problem.
Should have traded up for Lewan  
Giants2012 : 10/25/2014 11:39 pm : link
Still convinced they wanted him more than Beckum.
wrong. oline coach  
SBlue46 : 10/26/2014 12:28 am : link
For this offense...depending on who's
coaching next year
LT isn't a position you just ditch an adequate player..  
arcarsenal : 10/26/2014 2:39 am : link
...unless you're sure you've got a better or more cost efficient alternative and as far as I can tell, we certainly do not.

Beatty isn't a problem. Neither tackle spot is. We need two legitimate guards because I'm not sold on Walton and I am assuming Richburg is more likely a long-term fixture at C.

We'll have to see what we get out of Schwartz. Maybe LG will wind up being the only major hole. But I can't see us getting rid of Beatty unless we're in a spot where we think we can get a blue chip, long-term solution in the draft. I'd just hate to create another hole if we don't need to. Especially when we don't really benefit in terms of cap space from cutting ties from what I've seen.
.  
Anakim : 10/26/2014 3:10 am : link
ESPN's Dan Graziano believes the Giants could move on from LT Will Beatty after this season.
Beatty has three years and $26.5 million remaining on his current deal. The Giants can get out of his contract next offseason by making him a June 1 cut. Beatty is PFF's No. 7 left tackle through eight weeks, but has struggled with injuries and consistency throughout his career. His future with the Giants will be determined by how he plays over the final nine games.
easier said  
bc4life : 10/26/2014 5:11 am : link
than done
Imagine if  
DavidinBMNY : 10/26/2014 6:13 am : link
A true stud RT was added to the mix. Shift Pugh inside , move Richburg to center and Scwartz to RG. That looks good to me.
The Giants are going to cut their starting left tackle to save $500,000  
WillieYoung : 10/26/2014 7:36 am : link
in cap space. Graziano is so stupid he should post on this Board.
so we are going to cut  
TommyWiseau : 10/26/2014 8:16 am : link
Our LT who will cost us 7.5 mil in dead cap space and then invest another XXXX dollars into another LT? Yes Beatty is average but what better then average LT are you going to find on the FA market? Even if we do find one, we are going to pay him 7-10 mil and have 15+ mil tied up into thw LT position next year? (Beatty's dead cap space + new LT's contract). Not gonna happen. I could see us drafting his eventual replacement but that's about it
Can we draft Zach Martin in a redo  
Spock : 10/26/2014 8:21 am : link
I'm sure this has been debated enough- who would mean more to us, Martin or Beckham, but we all can agree, Zach would look good in blue.
TommyW  
gersh : 10/26/2014 8:24 am : link
Exactly!
He makes the common mistake  
River Mike : 10/26/2014 8:28 am : link
that many do. He considers the player in isolation ... the player is not great, he makes a lot of money, etc. But the total picture has to include such things as what is available to replace him, what are the other team needs, is he bad enough that replacing him becomes a priority, what are the odds that a draft choice will step in and be an upgrade, will keeping an expensive but adequate player allow you to address more pressing needs, etc. Frankly I think we have other priorities.
RE: Can we draft Zach Martin in a redo  
BigBlueShock : 10/26/2014 8:34 am : link
In comment 11940235 Spock said:
Quote:
I'm sure this has been debated enough- who would mean more to us, Martin or Beckham, but we all can agree, Zach would look good in blue.

Only Giants fans on BBI can still be whining about screwing up a draft pick less than a week after that draft pick had a 2 TD performance. Just shut the fuck up already. It's played out, so I'm not going to get into why this is just stupid thinking, other than to simply say,moor the one millionth time,mop end WRs are much harder to come by than top end guards. Can you imagine this WR corp without Beckham? And the OL would still suck with the immortal Martin.
Jeezus you whining cunts. How about you try supporting the guys that are on the team for once?
Beatty  
stretch234 : 10/26/2014 8:42 am : link
Saying they may move on and actually finding someone better are entirely 2 different things. Any top end LT costs more than Beatty. That leaves you the draft, which the Giants are not going to be picking in the top 10.

Picking LT outside top 10 or 12 is a complete mixed bag

His pay is about 13th or 14th. That would be avg

Sans the Detroit game he has played fine. Walton is the guy who clearly has not made it all the way back
Moving forward  
oldmanTom : 10/26/2014 8:46 am : link
I see 3 positions on OL set for the near future, LT, RT, and C. Beatty is going nowhere for a few years and he is okay at LT for now. Richburg will be moving to center and, since this is his natural position, I see him playing even better than he has at LG. Pugh has struggled mightily this year. I think this may be due to opposing coaches having a full year of tape on him and now exploiting his weaknesses. Since these weaknesses tend to be the technique type they are correctable with good coaching. We have to wait and see what we have in Schwartz. If he plays well at RG we may need only one big nasty LG to be a good offensive line.
Well, this OL is nowhere near where it will be next year....  
Doomster : 10/26/2014 9:25 am : link
Next year, I think you see Rich at center, Schw at RG, Pugh at LG, and we possibly draft a tackle and pick up a free agent tackle....

Beatty is what he is....of all the OLmen, he should have been the last to be offside on a 4th and one.....he can't handle speed rushers one on one, and he is overpaid for what he produces.....so, if there is a tackle available to replace him, he could be cut, but it would be a huge loss in cap(-2M net, plus loss of a player)....I think his replacement will be on the team next year, and it's possible that he will be an overpriced backup next season.....the following season, I think he is definitely cut....

But as stated, he is the least of this OL's current problems....Rich is playing well out of position, Jerry and Walton are mistakes waiting to happen, and you have to hope it's an injury that is hampering Pugh's play thus far....add to that a lack of blocking from the TE position, and you have an OL that can't handle pressure when a DC sends exotic schemes against them....

We are still not sure of Schwatz's status.....he could be OK, or another Beason.....and I seriously doubt you will see the same Jennings when he returns.....how will that knee hold up to the pounding it will take?

We had two games, where we were healthy enough, where Eli could possibly have won games, if we were not so stubborn to maintain balance between rushing and passing the ball....we should have set up the run with the pass, instead of the other way around.....I think it's too late now....I don't think this PF defense has a remote chance of stopping Luck, or any good QB.....Our offense will be forced to play catch up, and defenses will concentrate on OBj to take away the long pass....there are no other burners on this team.....
he's still  
area junc : 10/26/2014 9:51 am : link
very inconsistent
as pointed  
area junc : 10/26/2014 9:53 am : link
out, the team was looking at last week as a "must win" and beatty played like Shit. people notice
arc, you don't think Pugh has been a problem this year?  
Greg from LI : 10/26/2014 9:57 am : link
Gonna have to disagree with you there.
Pugh has struggled  
AnishPatel : 10/26/2014 10:02 am : link
and it led to the shit show of an Eagles game. The Dallas game wasn't anything to rave about. However, he is a young player on a work in progress offense. So it's going to take some time for everyone.
RE: Isn't he rated as like a top OT on PFF?  
LauderdaleMatty : 10/26/2014 10:03 am : link
In comment 11939984 Anakim said:
Quote:
We have much bigger issues and needs than LT


That was games ago and if that doesn't tell you how stats can be skewed I don't know what else can convince people not to over rate PFF analysis.

He's not the worst OL This year like he was last year hit he's one of the most over paid players on the roster. Reese has no one else on the roster who can play LT even at the mediocre level Beatty has shown so he's safe for another season. He will be 30 next year. They better draft a LT/RT player high next year.
The really depressing thing about the OL  
Greg from LI : 10/26/2014 10:07 am : link
Is the complete lack of decent backups. The starters have been terrible, yet benching someone isn't an option because the backups are that much worse.
OK....  
gersh : 10/26/2014 10:10 am : link
So he's an average LT being paid average LT money.

We don't have anyone on the current roster better than him.
Any hopes of Pugh being the answer at LT have been dampened a bit by his seeming regression at RT (maybe injury related? maybe because he's playing next to Jerry?)

The only way to upgrade outside of Pugh is to pay a FA (no way we take the cap hit and pay huge money for a LT) or
Draft a LT (we won't be picking in the top 5 and hopefully not the top 10)

Beatty is our LT. Accept reality
Greg,  
AnishPatel : 10/26/2014 10:11 am : link
Yeah sometimes you read stuff where a fan says bench him. Problem is we have garbage backing us up. It's amazing how far our OL has slipped from the days where we can run against anyone.

I hope we actually draft and upgrade it even more this off season.
If NYG winds up with a top 10 pick  
JonC : 10/26/2014 10:19 am : link
with which to acquire a blue goose, then it's fair to say it could very well accelerate Beatty's departure as a June 1 cut. He's been ok but still inconsistent, especially in the running game where he's not showing much improvement in moving defenders. No blue goose in the draft, he probably gets one more year.
Is there a difference in dead cap $  
Giantology : 10/26/2014 10:34 am : link
if Beatty is a June 1st cut? Cuz there is no way in hell we're cutting him if the dead cap money is that bad of a hit. That's just stupid.

Beatty hasn't been great but he's been more than serviceable.
Graziano  
Giantology : 10/26/2014 10:46 am : link
is my least favorite ESPN Giants reporter, ever
Have people seen what LTs make these days?  
jcn56 : 10/26/2014 10:56 am : link
It sounds like Beatty robbed the Brinks truck, but his contract isn't out of line with his production.
I was hoping for a new OL coach  
fkap : 10/26/2014 11:06 am : link
during last year's shakeup of the staff. He allegedly has a good reputation, but it's been a while since he's coached up a winner. We were hoping Pugh would be one, but he doesn't seem to have taken a second year step up.

I'm convinced that position coaches get input on acquisitions (would be a fucked up organization if he doesn't), so he isn't blameless on the players brought in.

All in all, it's been a long time since we've had a competent OL.

At this point, I'd dump the coach before I dumped Beatty.
The only reason they'd put that out there is if  
#10* : 10/26/2014 11:10 am : link
they have already identified a few tackles that are viable options for the 1st or 2nd round.
Ideally...  
ZGiants98 : 10/26/2014 11:33 am : link
Shwartz will take over at RG and Richburg will slide in to center. I want to draft a mauling guard next year early.
I agree, Problem isn't Beatty  
EddieNYG : 10/26/2014 12:23 pm : link
It's the interior.
RE: Ideally...  
Anakim : 10/26/2014 12:48 pm : link
In comment 11940370 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Shwartz will take over at RG and Richburg will slide in to center. I want to draft a mauling guard next year early.


Or move Pugh to LG and draft/sign a RT
Of course we are assuming,  
Doomster : 10/26/2014 1:23 pm : link
that Schwartz will be healthy, and play much better at RG than he did at LG....
to be fair  
msh : 10/26/2014 1:49 pm : link
they have pugh out of position at RT he is a guard at nfl level,beatty is a problem you need your LT to be your strongest OL player when he isnt you get the poor running game the giants have had with beatty there past 3 seasons

i do agree that walton and terry are the bigger problems right now but if they draft an OT beatty might make a better OG than an OT

would probably need to be a first round pick at OT you dont get good OT in round 2 very often they need 2 OL with the first 3 picks this year and either a LB or DE depending on which is the better guy with the other pick
I would sign RT Bryan Bulaga in offseason  
EddieNYG : 10/26/2014 2:04 pm : link
Move Pugh to LG. Draft a G on day two and a T/G tweener project type on day 3.

Beatty, Pugh, Richburg, Schwartz, Bulaga

That's a much better OL than what we have now.
Do You Folks Watch the Games?  
Samiam : 10/26/2014 2:15 pm : link
Thought I've seen it all. Move Beatty inside? The Giants won a SB with David Diehl as a LT and another with Beatty. You don't need a star at LT. For sure, Beatty's performance last year was horrible but if you think that he hasnt improved this year big time, you're not watching the games. The Giants OL was most effective over the years when they had guards who could pull effectively and Snee and McKenzie who could pretty much move the pile on 3rd and short makeable first downs. The team is now part of the way back assuming Pugh's recent decline is injury related and Schwartz plays to expectations and Jennings can stay healthy. But, the notion of replacing Beatty, unless the team totally falls apart and we draft something like top 5-7, is typical Graziano trolling to bust chops.
Samiam  
EddieNYG : 10/26/2014 2:21 pm : link
Beatty was placed on IR in 2011 after suffering a detached retina. David Diehl was the LT in both our Super Bowl wins.
Link - ( New Window )
This makes zero sense  
beatrixkiddo : 10/26/2014 2:29 pm : link
Beatty and Richburg have been the only bright spots on this O-line all season. If anyone warrants getting cut, it sould be Walton or Jerry. This team continues to ignore the fact that it is the interior of this unit that is the problem.

Pugh may be beat up so I don't know what to expect from his performance. I would still love that K-Mac type mauling RT their and maybe slide him to the interior in the future to help the run gam, and provide better pass pro in the middle. Beatty is fine IMO, He's not a top LT, but he doesn't have to be. I think he plays fine, and he's not really overpaid for his performance. Getting rid of him, unless its for a trade for a high pick, it makes no sense.

I think a future OL of Beatty/Pugh/Richburg/Schwartz/(FA or Draft Pick) looks promising, and would solidify the true weakness of this OL which is the middle.The sooner Richburg moves to C, the better. I don't know where Graziano is gettng this info from, but it seems off to me.
I love how some of the dumbest comments  
David in LA : 10/26/2014 2:52 pm : link
come from a poster named "Spock". Seriously, still lamenting taking Zach Martin? Our offense would look like a fucking joke without Cruz and Beckham.
The real problem is that we have been talking about this problem..  
EricJ (formerly Tyleraimee) : 10/26/2014 3:26 pm : link
for the past few years. The way I see it, our situation can be one (or more) of these three.

1. We have selected (drafted or free agent) players who were "misses".
2. We selected players who can do the job but they are not being coached effectively.
3. We have been ignoring the problem or not truly taking it seriously.

Which is it? Is there another option?
I can't stay if Graziano's plugged in on this  
JonC : 10/26/2014 4:00 pm : link
but, with a handful of seasons with NYG, the coaches and brass know what they have. If the inconsistency continues, they could jettison Beatty if the draft produces a blue goose. His pass pro remains better than his run blocking. Bad football teams tend to pull the plug and eat dead money. Pugh is better suited to OG, imo, and potentially replacing both OTs in one offseason isn't likely, and it's uncertain NYG is bad enough to get a pick high enough to grab a blue goose. That, and the WB's dead money could buy him one more season. Multiple moving parts ...
can't say  
JonC : 10/26/2014 4:00 pm : link
...
Doesn't seem like Graziano has a good read on this team  
David in LA : 10/26/2014 4:03 pm : link
this sounds like he's recycling last year's notes on Beatty. He's arguably been our best OL.
alot of you have aboslutely no paitence and its annoying...  
Rory : 10/26/2014 4:08 pm : link
Yea, lets continue to scapegoat our proven, affordable growing starting LT and replace with some unproven prospect LT out of college who needs 3 years to develop.

Cause that 2013 - 2014 LT class is working out so well.

G. Robinson starts season as a reserve then to LG in StL
J. Matthews cant beat out either of the Falcons tackles (arguably the worst in the league)
T. Lewan penciled in back up guard in Tenn
E. Fisher has been injured and had surgeries since last year for chiefs.
L. Joeckel - struggling mightily in Jax
Dj. Fluker - Only one that stands out starting in the position
Where are we going to  
TMS : 10/26/2014 4:48 pm : link
find his replacement? LT is tough spot to fill even with a 1st round pick in the draft. A lot of 1st rounders do not work out either. Nobody gives a good one up if they have one. This is nonsense and speculation.
RE: alot of you have aboslutely no paitence and its annoying...  
LauderdaleMatty : 10/26/2014 6:01 pm : link
In comment 11940836 Rory said:
Quote:
Yea, lets continue to scapegoat our proven, affordable growing starting LT and replace with some unproven prospect LT out of college who needs 3 years to develop.

Cause that 2013 - 2014 LT class is working out so well.

G. Robinson starts season as a reserve then to LG in StL
J. Matthews cant beat out either of the Falcons tackles (arguably the worst in the league)
T. Lewan penciled in back up guard in Tenn
E. Fisher has been injured and had surgeries since last year for chiefs.
L. Joeckel - struggling mightily in Jax
Dj. Fluker - Only one that stands out starting in the position


Affordable? 8 mil is not affordable. Proven. He's proven he's mediocre at best. Growing? Most players are at the top of their game at 30. He's not getting better next year. He' ll be the same mediocre up and down guy. Lastly, Most tackles done play well into to their 30s.

They most likely won't let him go because Reese is going to draft other positions and it's a lot of dead money. 2016 though if he's still mediocre 8 mil is a lot for a guy who wl never make a pro bowl
Beatty  
stretch234 : 10/26/2014 7:00 pm : link
LT salaries are high - fact of the NFL.

18 LT are making over 6.9M

Then you have rookie cap LT (Joeckel, Johnson, Fisher, Robinson) who are at 5M with 100% guaranteed contract

You can continue to bitch about his salary, but that is what LT make.

Draft a LT early, and if he is not the sure thing, you will be giving him more guaranteed money than Beatty will have gotten as 1st rd players have 100% guaranteed contracts

Look how many bad RT are making 6M per year
Can't get Zac Martin but you can have Jonathan Martin  
Jupiter : 10/27/2014 11:49 am : link
He meets all the Giants criteria for a tackle.
1. Can't figure out where to play him.
2. Mental rehab project. Perfect to overpay for him.
3. Needs to re-earn respect.
4. Former high draft pick who never lived up to his press clippings.
5. Oh yeah, and he is smart, college team leader, good family, not from the 'Hood.
Pages: 1 2 <<Prev | Show All |
Back to the Corner