The Dan Reeves Era, how was it perceived?

a damn. He was a decent MLB for a few seasons before going downhill. All of the rest of them - Horan, Marshall, Croel, Treadwell, Jackson - sucked ass.

Hey, remember when Coleman Rudolph was our MLB? Good times!

article with Reeves saying that he didn't want alot of power or control but yet be bought all guys in from Denver. That was always the problem, he wanted full control..

Didn't like the Fassel but i thought he got very bad personnel to work with..Between changing the starter every year to not having any real offensive talent killed his momentum he had..

....my low point as a Giants fan was MNF versus Dallas in the 1995 season opener. I had so much hope that they turned the corner during that six game winning streak to close out 1994, and to see them so thoroughly dominated in Giants Stadium on Phil Simms' jersey retirement ceremony game? With the cameras constantly showing Jerruh chortling on the sidelines with Phil Knight and Monica Seles? God, that one hurt.

Those two teams were very different in the playoffs, I don't think venue would've mattered enough for that NYG team to win. Fans tend to overrate the '93 team largely because of the narrow loss at home to Dallas, that was a very flawed team in an era where pitiful offense didn't win in the playoffs.

it just seemed like we were stuck in the dark ages on offense. Compared to what was happening around the league with the increase in passing starting in 94 or so....we just didn't have the horses to keep up. Did we have the worst (or least dynamic) skill position players of any team in the league during that decade? I'm not sure but there couldn't be too many teams worse off than we were at RB and WR, not to mention QB.

In comment 11976238 Greg from LI said:

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....my low point as a Giants fan was MNF versus Dallas in the 1995 season opener. I had so much hope that they turned the corner during that six game winning streak to close out 1994, and to see them so thoroughly dominated in Giants Stadium on Phil Simms' jersey retirement ceremony game? With the cameras constantly showing Jerruh chortling on the sidelines with Phil Knight and Monica Seles? God, that one hurt.

I drove down from Boston with my roommates to go to that game and the plan was to stay over by my parents house afterwards because of the long drive back and it being late. I was so pissed off after that game, that I couldn't sleep so we piled back in the car and they all slept while I drove back to Boston and got back to campus at 4 AM.

that had several anecdotes and quotes about how much players disliked Reeves and his methods.

In comment 11976126 Greg from LI said:

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But he started with a fair bit of goodwill in 1993 by simply not being Ray Handley, and then that season was a good one (though the ending was tough to take). Cutting ties with Banks and Marshall wasn't popular but made some sense as those guys were nearing the end, but releasing Pepper Johnson in his prime was just flat-out dumb, and earned him a lot of fan anger. He kept letting go of longtime Giants and bringing in crappy Broncos like Mike Horan, Mike Croel, Mark Jackson, and Arthur Marshall. 1995 was a season a lot of people were hopeful for, and when it turned into a disaster, most fans were through with Reeves.

How could you leave out Tommy Maddox whom he brought in. I still remember the game when he sat Kent Graham or Dave Brown? And brought in Maddox. Then Tommy threw 4 2nd half INTs. He was fucking horrific judging players.

In comment 11976182 Scott Brunner said:

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was related at all to his attitude during the Handley/Rust era. As was mentioned in earlier thread he basically said I'll do what I want on D. My guess is Reeves didn't want someone like that on his new team. It's a shame because Pepper still had several good years left in him and was an All-Pro in 94. I always found it funny that there was a perception that Reeves didn't get enough input on personnel w/ the Giants. I'm sure GY wanted to cut Landeta and bring in Mike Horan. If they'd kept Landeta they wouldn't have had to waste a 3rd rd pick on Maynard.

Wasn't Pepper's fault. Would you listen to Rod Rust after having played for Bill B?

Was still better than watching that slop on Sunday.

was he turned into a decent player for the Steelers for a few years, before Big Ben got there.

So, from, that aspect and considering that Reeves had to look at Dave Brown under center, I guess you can understand it. Plus, he drafted the guy.

But that four INT half versus the Eagles was brutal.

And, I do believe that in Denver that Maddox was being hailed as the replacement to Elway when Elway was going thru a mid carrer down time....which of course was turned around by a runnning game and Shanahan.

was cutting Phil Simms.

Absolutely terrible. I was 13 at the time...really becoming a "fan" of the team after seeing, but being just about too young to really appreciate the 1990 Superbowl hero's. So many things to list, but like others have mentioned the #1 thing was the influx of Denver trash and the jettison of Pepper Johnson. My memory could be cloudy, but the treatment of Stephen Baker as well, as he was shown the door so we could bring in the hot garbage that was Mark Jackson.
So many others like the lack of playing time someone like Jessie Armstead received (seemed like he was always making a good play) but we needed to make sure Mike Croel saw the field. Getting rid of Phil Simms, "allowing" Rodney Hampton to be fat and look like Natrone Means. Carlton Bailey and Arthur Marshall sucked some serious ass. Oh, and getting rid of Ed McCaffrey.
If I ever see Dan Reeves on the street I'll say "Hey nice suit...but you're an asshole".

In comment 11976332 Marty in Albany said:

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was cutting Phil Simms.

I thought he was saying that about McCaffrey. Simms was coming off shoulder surgery, I thought that was enough of a concern on it's own to him being able to play.

Actually, that Tommy Maddox catastrophe in Philly is what led me to the old BBHP (the proto-BBI). Wrote a very angry and profane letter to the editor.

So, for all my fans.....you have Tommy Maddox to blame for me.

Big if, but if Sherrod stays healthy they would have had a very good offense. Hampton and Tillman were running for 100 yards w/ 8 men in the box. The game in Washington were they put up 41 was probably the best offense game I'd ever seen the Giants played up to that point.

but he wanted to do George Young's job as well as his, which led to problems. If a draft pick was GY's as opposed to Reeve's choice he was in the dog house from Day 1. And the McCaffrey and Maddox decisions speak for themselves.

Made sure he never played him as walker got all the second RB load too.

Out of football entirely. Then playing in the novelty leagues. Then, against all odds, that great season for the Steelers.

was the worse qb performance by a Giant ever and my recollection goes back to '68 and there were some pretty bad qbs since then.

In 1993 the Giants played very well, almost winning the NFC East. Going 11-5. Simms was strong, the running game strong and the defense played well.

Things changed when in June of 1994, George Young, who had no clue how to deal with the first year salary cap cut Phil Simms and thus the Dave Brown era began. Brown was drafted in 1992 when a different person was head coach. He was not a Reeves guy.

So the whole off season had been planned with Simms as the QB and then he was cut. Brown was not ready for prime time and struggled.

In 1995, the team seemed promising but the defense fell apart.

Always wanted to see what this team would have done with Simms in 1994 and Mike Sherrard healthy.

With Dave Brown and Kent Graham as QB's, any coach would have failed.

For all of the Broncos east BS, Mark Jackson played one season here. Michael Brooks was strong in '93 and '94. Brad Daluiso was here for a while and kicked well.

It wasn't that much of Broncos east. Actually it was not at all...except Tommy Maddux as a backup QB.

In comment 11976092 Sneakers O'toole said:

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or "retired" I'll be upset.

Even if we go 3-13?

In comment 11976150 Blackbeard said:

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His impact on The Giants was negative. He was not admired by fans or players.

Exact reaction I had ... thank goodness there never was such a thing as a "Dan Reeves era"

Miller,Widmer
Bailey Gray
Who could forget Lurch bishop zataka,oben ,Brian Williams with one eye
Then they draft Cedrick Jones another great pick with one eye.

A lot better than this shit show we have right here today.

By a long shot.

That's kinda revisionist don't you think?

Croel stunk. Horan stunk. Arthur Marshall stunk. Treadwell stunk. Maddox was historically awful. Jackson was done when he got here. Daluiso was average. Brooks was pretty good for about a year and then he went south too. That's a lot of guys they let him bring in.

Really wanted somebody new, not a recycled Dallas and AFC guy. By the end of his third season, I thought he was a serious mistake and should be terminated. But they kept him around and he drove the team totally into the ground.

He bought a little early credibility by getting back to the playoffs with the remains of the Parcells championship teams for one more time, and I think that bought him one or two more seasons with the G-men than he would have had otherwise. But after that, it was right into the toilet, and fast at that.

It seems that GIANTS ownership won't recognize that things are going wrong until the team hits rock bottom. We've seen that with RH (didn't take long with him), Reeves, Fassel, and now Reese/Coughlin.

The only one of those Broncos who was any good was Brooks, and even he was a downgrade from Pepper. Horan fucking sucked, especially compared to Landeta who would remain a quality punter for many more years. Croel fucking sucked. Treadwell fucking sucked. Marshall fucking sucked. Jackson fucking sucked.

Chippy beat me to the punch.

And yet some of you guys complain when Eli throws a pick. It was really bad at QB after Simms.

Yeah. He brought in a ton of players. It just felt all wrong.

In comment 11976146 JonC said:

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11-5 and the Div round was very likely its full potential.

The mike sherrard injury mid way through the 93 season was an absolute crusher for that team. I still remember the play like it was yesterday. Against the eagles, sherrard catches a pass over the middle and off he goes breaking free when all of a sudden his leg (hip) sort of just popped... Non contact.. He was never the same.

Sherrard was the best NYG receiver I'd ever seen up until then. He was a true game breaker that season and had great chemistry with Phil. Mark Jackson was fine as the #2. Once mike went down the offense went from elite to just good. I still think that was one of the most crippling injuries in NYG history. It rendered a great team just good.

And fuck dan reeves. Overrated coach who rode the coattails of Elway and put himself first before the franchise. Flat out lied to the giants when he was hired. Stubborn fuck. Glad he never won a bowl as head coach.

Reeves refused to adjust.

a laughing stock by only letting him run one play all the time.
In comes Wheatley and everyone knows sweep. He got killed but I blame Reeves.
the kid was a big back with speed

In comment 11976547 gtt350 said:

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a laughing stock by only letting him run one play all the time. In comes Wheatley and everyone knows sweep. He got killed but I blame Reeves. the kid was a big back with speed

Wheatley went on to Oakland and played well there! Wish we could've had that Wheatley! Reeves f%&ked with him while he was here!

53 man roster. Landetta was a bad cut, I agree. Brooks was fine. He became useless when they transitioned from the 3-4 to a 4-3. Croel was a bust but was one player and no player worth while was cut. Arthur Marshal was traded for a 7th round pick. Hardly a massive issue. Treadwell was solid in '93. Was no better or worse than Matt Bahr had played in '92.

Seriously, how are things different if Simms is here in '94? Keep in mind that '94 was the first year of the cap and the free agents the Giants had who were starters in '93 were:

Bob Kratch
Eric Moore
Bart Oates
Brian Williams (Resigned)
Myron Guyton
Greg Williams
Mark Collins

So for all of you living in fantasy land Reeves had a tough hand. I agree he was not great but considering the joke the team became in '91 - '92 he did a great job in '93 and even '94 with Dave Brown went 9-7.

To replace Ed McCafferey, who Reeves cut.

I thought he was going to be a stud.

The "Wheatley was great in Oakland!" myth has been going strong here for about 15 years. He had one good season as a Raider, and the rest of his career was the same uninspired performance he displayed as a Giant. The guy just didn't like football that much.

One small step up from Keanu Reeves.

I'm sure the Pepper Johnson dismissal is discussed above--haven't read it all. It was just one of many mistakes Reeves made in terms of personnel, but he WAS given a pretty lousy hand.

He reinstated Phil Simms as the starter and brought the old guys back to relevance. I think we all loved the guy until that point late in the Dallas game.

The Giants were somewhere around the Dallas 14 late in the 4th, down by 3, and a touchdown away from having a real shot of stealing the NFC East away from the heavily-favored Cowboys. .

Reeves went conservative and ran Hampton up the gut on third down instead of letting Simms take a shot at the endzone and maybe winning the game. I believe he called a run on second down too.

HE WAS TOO AFRAID TO TAKE A SHOT AT WINNING A HUGE GAME WITH PHIL SIMMS AT QB! HE PLAYED FOR THE TIE!

At least that was the perception by the fans and media. And you know what they say about "perception."

It was at that moment where our appreciation of how his competence as a coach revived our old warriors lost importance.

It was at that moment where we said "PARCELLS WOULD HAVE TAKEN A SHOT IN THAT SPOT!"

It was at that moment where we all shouted "F**KING REEVES!" at the TV screen.

It was at that moment that we all realized why Dan Reeves
never won, and never would win a championship.

Up until that exact moment in that exact drive, we liked him.

It still pisses me off when I think about it. He didn't give Simms a shot to win that game for him, the team, or for us.

Loser.

with no loyalty to the giants as an organization. He was a turd

for example, he questioned why given all the rigorous screening of draft picks - no one knew that Cedric Jones was virtually blind in one eye.

He also complained that players would be taken off the draft board due to questionable rationales.

Didn't like the idea either but Pepper was reportedly running his mouth a lot and considered a disruptive force inside the locker room- referring to the team as the NY Broncos. Think his mouth was what got him released, although they said it was due to his limitations is pas coverage.

but he acknowledged that he was not playing his best position.

Worst part of the Reeves era was when he was quoted as not re-signing because he needed the job or something to that effect. At the end, it got ugly for the franchise.

One mistake he corrected was not staring Jesse Armistead. If memory serves JA was only playing specials, then he got an opportunity and the rest is history. Reeves acknowledged he should have been starting sooner.

looked dumb when it happened and looked even dumber during his tenure in Denver.

That's the fundamental disagreement I have with the '93 squad. Fans tend to overrate it partly due to the season ending loss to Dallas, and the tendency to remember something more fondly and less accurately as time passes. That was a good, aging, not remotely great team that struggled terribly to score points. In that era, pitiful offense didn't win in the playoffs.

The 2008 team was a true loss for fans, that team should've won it all.

had an impact in spots, but he's another trait of that team fans seem to overrate and remember as more impactful than he actually was. Imv. Dallas and SF were easily the two best teams in football during that stretch.

cursed by injuries. Only player with a worse curse was Yatil Green.

you don't think the 93 Giants could have beaten Dallas in that last game if they have Sherrard? That's all it might have taken to host an NFC title game in NY.

With Sherrard that team had a chance to be special. Without him they were just a very solid team but one that lacked a true play maker.

They barely lost without Sherrard. They might win with him. Granted, they still have to beat Dallas and probably San Fran in the postseason but what a different outlook if the Giants have a first round bye and don't have to travel.

They left everything on the field against the Vikes in the wild card game.