I will go on record saying that QB is one of the top priorities for NYG heading in to next year.
1 - Yes, i know there is plenty of season left. But the statement will stand.
2 - No, this is not an "emotional" reaction. I haven't been attached to this team in that way for quite some time...I am speaking from a perspective of a NFL fan that watches several games per week. Manning is a bottom half, possibly bottom third QB in this league. He isn't young. He is very expensive. He hurts the NYG future more than he helps.
And be honest how good were we when we twice one the Super Bowls with Manning? He drains money from the rest of the team. We do not get our moneys worth
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In comment 11981556 Sy'56 said:
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Let's not be foolish. There is a lot of scouting to be done. And there are some potential QB shakeups around the league that could happen.
But the point is...an upgrade at QB is needed. I understand it won't fall in to NYG's lap...but it is a legit need.
Upgrade? Name one!
You can't name one yet. It is November. We don't know who will declare for the draft. We don't know who will be available via FA.
Respectfully, that is some piss poor logic. You have a two time Superbowl winning QB, who up until today has had a great year and you want to dump him for a rookie. You have not thought this through.
I am all for paying $20+ million to a QB that can make up for shortcomings around him and make other players appear better than they actually are.
Come on.......because his int's are way down? Wins, that what make great QB's
Brady has Gronk and a legit OL
Rodgers has 4 good WRs and a strong running game
Peyton has some of the best weapons in the game
Which QB out there actually rises above the shortcomings?
Meaning? I understand the overall frustration of NYG fans after a game like this. But if you make multiple attempts to get personal with someone over the internet...let's pump the brakes and consider what you are actually doing. Come on man. Someone has an opinion that differs from yours...and instead of discussing football you want to try and make things personal. That's just off and I hope you realize that.
The 5 INTs sucked, but he, frankly, didn't look worse today than he did at almost any point last year and he's, on the whole, been solid this season before this one given what he's been handed.
Maybe that's just my opinion, but I've had it backed up by someone who gets paid by a quality organization to judge/evaluate talent, so I'll go with it for now.
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on those statements. I believe Sy's talent evaluations are way off the mark in general.
Care to elaborate? I was killed for giving Borland a 1st round grade too. How did he do today? And last week? And the week before?
I dont give Borland a first round grade. Herzlich would probably look pretty good playing behind that SF D line
But the point is...an upgrade at QB is needed. I understand it won't fall in to NYG's lap...but it is a legit need.
Let's just hope you aren't the one doing the scouting.
To say that he is bottom 3rd is just not accurate and any of the "elite guys" would be having a tough time with this OL and complete lack of a running game..
C'mon I would hope you are better than that...
Come on.......because his int's are way down? Wins, that what make great QB's
I would consider 17TDs, 6 picks, 2,215yds, 63% completion and a 93 QBR to be a pretty darn good year!
Eli is 33 and still has plenty of good years left.
Hampton had been declining for two years and well on his way to eating his way out of a job.
Brady has Gronk and a legit OL
Rodgers has 4 good WRs and a strong running game
Peyton has some of the best weapons in the game
Which QB out there actually rises above the shortcomings?
Well...
Brady has who at RB? and WR?
How about Luck making others better.
Not sure I agree with Rodgers and having 4 good WRs...but even that asise that OL has been almost as bad as NYG for 2 years now. I think Big Ben is a guy that makes other guys better. Same with Rivers. Again...thats just the feel I get when watching these teams play.
And in the NFL today, you can do no such thing.
That may be true. Eli is in a bad spot with this line.
But back to my original point...the playcalling can't depend on him to make plays with his feet. And it seems this year he has lost his ability to move within the pocket. Several times today he was moved in the pocket but he had room to to shuffle and still throw. He couldn't do that today and he couldn't do it against PHI, IND, and SEA.
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A QB who makes up for the MASSIVE shortcomings around him.
Brady has Gronk and a legit OL
Rodgers has 4 good WRs and a strong running game
Peyton has some of the best weapons in the game
Which QB out there actually rises above the shortcomings?
Well...
Brady has who at RB? and WR?
How about Luck making others better.
Not sure I agree with Rodgers and having 4 good WRs...but even that asise that OL has been almost as bad as NYG for 2 years now. I think Big Ben is a guy that makes other guys better. Same with Rivers. Again...thats just the feel I get when watching these teams play.
Fine, we'll play this game. Brady has Gronk, who is uncoverable. Doesn't matter if you have a stud RB if your line can block, which his can. LaFell has come on as a presence outside, and Edelman is a steady slot guy who moves the chains. Also, go back to earlier in the year when Gronk was hurt, and they were missing pieces on the line...Brady stunk. So many of us expect one player to make miracles...well it's not reality.
I'd like to think after that, we'd be done with arguments he can't elevate other players.
He does have a lot of Brett Favre in him and sometimes that helps him, sometimes not. People forget that about Eli too often.
And be honest how good were we when we twice one the Super Bowls with Manning? He drains money from the rest of the team. We do not get our moneys worth
This. He's the QB of a 3-7 team, that stinks. He doesn't lift the level of play of those around him, this has always been my knock on Eli. He is not a leader of men.
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QB in the NFL that could win w this line. That doesn't mean Elinis blameless or part of the problem but even w OBJ being awesome this OL is killing the team again
That may be true. Eli is in a bad spot with this line.
But back to my original point...the playcalling can't depend on him to make plays with his feet. And it seems this year he has lost his ability to move within the pocket. Several times today he was moved in the pocket but he had room to to shuffle and still throw. He couldn't do that today and he couldn't do it against PHI, IND, and SEA.
Eli's great shortcoming has always been his inability to move. You really think he is that much slower now?
Would trade LaFell and Edelman for Randle and Parker in a heartbeat!
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LaFell and Edelman would be doing exactly what on other teams? Come on.
Would trade LaFell and Edelman for Randle and Parker in a heartbeat!
Trash for trash.
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In comment 11981724 Sy'56 said:
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LaFell and Edelman would be doing exactly what on other teams? Come on.
Would trade LaFell and Edelman for Randle and Parker in a heartbeat!
Trash for trash.
Edleman has 54 catches on the year, what are you talking about?
All I wanted to say is that the QB position needs to be upgraded from a personnel and economic perspective...and here we are talking about Edelman and Parker.
Not even close.
My argument is that Brady makes others better. Thats why he is considered one of the best of all time. To be honest...trying to compare anything Brady does to Manning in an effort to say Manning is a big time QB is foolish.
Let me ask you this...do you think Manning is a big time QB?
Which is all that really matters at this point. This is Eli's first in an offense being coached by a first year offensive cordinator. The two situations are nowhere comparable.
If you believe in Eli, you need to clean out the front office and get a new HC.
Which is all that really matters at this point. This is Eli's first in an offense being coached by a first year offensive cordinator. The two situations are nowhere comparable.
I'll partially agree with you. But a lot of what I saw in Manning's struggles last year are similar to what I see this year. Different offenses...and the one he was in last year was the one he was in for awhile.
I don''t think either of them are particularly fond of Manning. They seem to sing the praises off QBs with more mobility.
With even an average line Eli would be able to make this O a top ten offense. There are no weapons outside OBJ, jennings is good, not great, but the line is ATROCIOUS. No run game at all.
They would have rolled the Giants today.
Just not sure you know who Edelman is if he was on a team like Cincy or Dallas or Miami. Teams with solid but unspectacular QBs.
With even an average line Eli would be able to make this O a top ten offense. There are no weapons outside OBJ, jennings is good, not great, but the line is ATROCIOUS. No run game at all.
Winston in NYC? Not a chance. It's either Amari Cooper or a trade down because this team has so many holes
Brady, Rodgers and Peyton Manning are exceptions. They're special, elite QBs. So is Andrew Luck, who was the best QB prospect since maybe Elway. Any of the guys I mention in that class? Are they even in Eli's class?
The problem with it, was that very few other players got as good a grasp of it as Eli did. Those that did, thrived, those that didn't, struggled.
That's why the change to a WCO was so important. It's easier for all players to understand.
The change wasn't about the next year, it was about two years from now on and beyond.
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But its so fucking incredibly obvious that this line is responsible for this. How can you not see that?
With even an average line Eli would be able to make this O a top ten offense. There are no weapons outside OBJ, jennings is good, not great, but the line is ATROCIOUS. No run game at all.
Winston in NYC? Not a chance. It's either Amari Cooper or a trade down because this team has so many holes
I wouldn't be so sure. I think Jameis has the Jets written all over him.
Make finding a new QB a priority. That DOES NOT MEAN that the Giants get rid of Manning tomorrow or 4 months from now. But if they have a high enough grade on a guy in round 1, I say you go for it. Or if there is a value in FA or the trade market worth exploring, you go for it. 2 years ago I wouldn't say that. But I think more attention needs to be sent in that direction now.
For the record...if I had to give out grades on QBs on college right now, none of them would have a top 5 overall grade.