John Mara Comments on Eli Manning

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If you have a franchise quarterback you're always going to be competitive.

*IGNORES 2013 AND 2014

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You have to understand the big picture.

when ownership feels the need to defend a coach or a player, that often indicates that there is trouble and turmoil behind the scenes.

It was proven in 2007 and 2011. Surround Eli manning with a decent line, 3 good receivers, a running game and a defense that rushes the passer. He can take you to the promised land.

Football is a simple game. Take a look at how horseshit Brady looked when his surrounding cast was injured and his line was weak.

In comment 11987061 cosmicj said:

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when ownership feels the need to defend a coach or a player, that often indicates that there is trouble and turmoil behind the scenes.

What are you thinking? Disagreement within the ranks on this issue?

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Well F me then.

nice shootin, Tex.

In comment 11987064 PetesHereNow said:

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It was proven in 2007 and 2011. Surround Eli manning with a decent line, 3 good receivers, a running game and a defense that rushes the passer. He can take you to the promised land. Football is a simple game. Take a look at how horseshit Brady looked when his surrounding cast was injured and his line was weak.

We didn't have a decent line or run game in 2011.

And pretty much every QB would succeed with all of those things. Eli doesn't need a Pro Bowl roster around him to succeed, but he can't succeed with fucking Charles Brown and John Jerry guarding him on the right side.

Hellooooooo, Mariota.

Protect Manning first and foremost. He is the one most responsible for the two titles.

In comment 11987065 Go Terps said:

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In comment 11987061 cosmicj said: Quote: when ownership feels the need to defend a coach or a player, that often indicates that there is trouble and turmoil behind the scenes. What are you thinking? Disagreement within the ranks on this issue?

It could be. In my years of sports fandom, I've noticed that often - often, not always -- when ownership feels the need to assert that person x's job is safe, it means that their job isn't safe. Why exactly would Mara feel the need to make a public statement like this?

In comment 11987053 Randy in CT said:

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You have to understand the big picture.

The last two seasons prove that statement by Mara wrong, which is an indictment on how poorly we've done in stocking talent for Eli.

In comment 11987066 Britt in VA said:

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No, Britt, I was being serious. (BTW, no personal agenda here - I support Eli.)

Guess I was wrong.

durability and everything else that comes along with him, who would you rather have? Besides Peyton, Brady, (both of whom probably have fewer years left), Rodgers and Luck(He's gonna eclipse them all, I dont know that there is anyone else who could do it here. Maybe a case for Brees. Everytime we hear that the mobile quaterback is the wave of the future we get a Michael Vick, a Robert Griffin, or a Russell Wilson or a Colin Kaepernick (I'm too lazy to spellcheck that name). I'll take his 5 int days and his 2 SB rings and the ice water in his veins.....

In comment 11987072 BrettNYG10 said:

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In comment 11987064 PetesHereNow said: Quote: It was proven in 2007 and 2011. Surround Eli manning with a decent line, 3 good receivers, a running game and a defense that rushes the passer. He can take you to the promised land. Football is a simple game. Take a look at how horseshit Brady looked when his surrounding cast was injured and his line was weak. We didn't have a decent line or run game in 2011. And pretty much every QB would succeed with all of those things. Eli doesn't need a Pro Bowl roster around him to succeed, but he can't succeed with fucking Charles Brown and John Jerry guarding him on the right side.

The running game and OL got better as the year went on in 11. Sure, they were bad to start with but Jacobs and Bradshaw got enough room to at least put the idea of run in somebody's head. Now, with sieves like jerry and brown, no ones worrying about runs.

You're right though. Eli just needs the idea of the run to be there. Won't happen unless we get an interior OL

my initial reaction would be that maybe Reese feels like it's time to move on from Manning, and Mara disagrees.

Who knows? My sense is that Eli finishes his career here. I'd bet that Phil Simms, the way he went out, and what happened afterward are probably on Mara's mind here.

when the take offers for him this offseason.

and see some of the following quarterbacks starting for teams, it's amazing any fan would even consider giving up on a 2 time Super Bowl MVP who can obviously still play and is the epitome of class on and off the field:

Zac Mettenberger
Brian Hoyer
Shaun Hill
Kyle Orton
Luke McCown
Geno Smith/Michael Vick
Ryan Mallett


Not as bad as the above mentioned but still pretty terrible:

Andy Dalton
RGIII or anything Redskins
Jay Cutler

I won't even get into the discussion of the younger quarterbacks like Bortles, Carr, Bridgewater who probably have a 5% chance to have half the career Eli has or quarterbacks we know Eli is better then (Cam, Foles, Flacco, Tannehill)

This is a such stupid conversation and one the media drums up because they need to sell papers during a 3-7 season.

The offensive line needs to be fixed, not the quarterback

it's time to move on from Eli when Kate jumped across the table and started choking her and John was forced to comment

that wouldn't indicate there's turmoil behind the scenes?

I'm one of the crowd who is fine with moving on from him, given where the team is currently, but there's nothing fishy about JM's response here that would indicate there's a potential move here.

And FWIW Ralph V had an article just last week that cited sources from inside the organization saying pretty much the same thing.

Football is a simple game. Take a look at how horseshit Brady looked when his surrounding cast was injured and his line was weak.


That lasted for what? A couple games? This has been going on for 3 seasons....meanwhile that Pats have gone from that to the best record in football and the Giants have gone to almost the worst in the NFC.....what is the difference in the dramatic turnaround of both teams? Must be the injurioes, because as we all know, it's not the coaching.....

If Eli is so important, you'd think they would surround him with competent lineman. You'd think.

So is TC's job and what sucks is so is JR's job and what really sucks is I'll bet Fewell is back next year too.

Brees plays in a dome, has better receivers (including the NFL's best tight end), always had a better offensive line, but if you look at the numbers, he throws a large number of INTs just like Eli does.

the Giants would never embarrass Eli publicly. I understand that and it's part of what I like about the Giants organization. I may not always agree with the decision to keep playing a player when it's obvious that player should be relegated to back-up duty (Diehl, Snee, for instance), but I understand (and like) that the Giants are a principled organization who don't sell each other out when things are going poorly. Loyalty means something to them and I respect that.

that Mara said this prior to the SF game. Therefore, Mara wasn't coming out to defend his QB after a 5 int game - he said this last week. Eli has had a very solid season up to this point (especially considering the curcumstances) and only an idiot would change his mind about the franchise QB based on his performance in one game.

In comment 11987172 Doomster said:

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Football is a simple game. Take a look at how horseshit Brady looked when his surrounding cast was injured and his line was weak. That lasted for what? A couple games? This has been going on for 3 seasons....meanwhile that Pats have gone from that to the best record in football and the Giants have gone to almost the worst in the NFC.....what is the difference in the dramatic turnaround of both teams? Must be the injurioes, because as we all know, it's not the coaching.....

Actually what helped turn it around was a defense that held the Colts to 20 points last week and one of the best rushing attacks in the league over the last 2 years..

they need to upgrade offensive line. unlike wilson, luck, or kapernick who can all pick up first downs/extend drives with their legs, eli will need a clean pocket especially as he is not getting any younger and his quickness/elusiveness will eventually be impacted by father time. this will limit a bit what they can do on the defensive side of the ball, but maybe a new head coach/defensive coordinator will bring in a different style and tone to that unit.

when drafting a QB to be their franchise QB. Now before you tell that was then and this is now, you better have QB's that win SB's then regressed to the point that they weren't able to do it again? Please don't give me fluke QB like Trent Dilfer

"Can he win a Super Bowl?"

for Craig Morton, NormSnead, Lee Grosscup, Mike Cherry, Danny Kannel, Dave Brown,Kent Graham, Jesse Palmer and a bunch of other beauties. If you think he is looking to not resign Eli, I'll leave it at that

kurt warner joe flacco russell wilson all won super bowls and i'm not sure at the time any of them were really ever considered sure shot franchise QBs.

but thanks for playing

In comment 11987064 PetesHereNow said:

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It was proven in 2007 and 2011. Surround Eli manning with a decent line, 3 good receivers, a running game and a defense that rushes the passer. He can take you to the promised land.

#TrentDifer
#DougWilliams

because that is the conservative thing to do.
Last year, we were screaming the loudest about the offense, so the OC is fired. This year, the biggest issue is the O-line but that will be a band-aid fix again so he will move onto the next biggest issue causing the embarrassment which is the defense. So, Fewell will be fired and we will bring in someone who nobody knows. Probably a guy who coached the white guys with high motors at Grambling University.

Don't expect major changes. That being said, we cannot get all pumped up with the lame changes/additions if they are exactly that....lame or unproven commodities.

As for Eli, the absolute best scenario here would be to of course keep him and drop the salary to $10mm

In comment 11987212 Headhunter said:

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when drafting a QB to be their franchise QB. Now before you tell that was then and this is now, you better have QB's that win SB's then regressed to the point that they weren't able to do it again? Please don't give me fluke QB like Trent Dilfer

there are many franchise QBs that won SBs but then after their prime were not able to make it back to the big dance especially when their surrounding talent was not as dominant (see joe montana, troy aikman even tom brady since guys like mcginiest/seymour/vrabel and others on that D retired or left)

In comment 11987209 Les in TO said:

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they need to upgrade offensive line. unlike wilson, luck, or kapernick who can all pick up first downs/extend drives with their legs, eli will need a clean pocket especially as he is not getting any younger and his quickness/elusiveness will eventually be impacted by father time. this will limit a bit what they can do on the defensive side of the ball, but maybe a new head coach/defensive coordinator will bring in a different style and tone to that unit.

Uh Wilson and Kaepernick have 2 of the best OL's in the NFL and Luck's while not as good as their's is light years ahead of the Giants..

In comment 11987064 PetesHereNow said:

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It was proven in 2007 and 2011. Surround Eli manning with a decent line, 3 good receivers, a running game and a defense that rushes the passer. He can take you to the promised land. Football is a simple game. Take a look at how horseshit Brady looked when his surrounding cast was injured and his line was weak.

Wouldn't any QB succeed with a decent line, 3 good receivers, a running game and a defense that rushes the passer? Failing to understand the point there.

and their decline was the reason their team couldn't make it back? Maybe Jum Plunkett? Who else you got?

In comment 11987072 BrettNYG10 said:

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In comment 11987064 PetesHereNow said: Quote: It was proven in 2007 and 2011. Surround Eli manning with a decent line, 3 good receivers, a running game and a defense that rushes the passer. He can take you to the promised land. Football is a simple game. Take a look at how horseshit Brady looked when his surrounding cast was injured and his line was weak. We didn't have a decent line or run game in 2011. And pretty much every QB would succeed with all of those things. Eli doesn't need a Pro Bowl roster around him to succeed, but he can't succeed with fucking Charles Brown and John Jerry guarding him on the right side.

Harrumph!
Link - ( New Window )

That sir is a very specialized, very small group of coaches.

and I'll just add Jerry Golsteyn, Randy Dean, Bob Timberlake, Dick Shiner, Randy Johnson, Gary Wood, Dennis Shaw, Jim DelGaizo, Ed Baker, Paterson Plank Pisarcik, and every other tomato can who was here in the interregnum between Y.A. Tittle and Phil Simms. I also don't think John Mara uses the media to send double-secret, coded messages about the future of the franchise, his coach, or his franchise quarterback.

I'm reminded of Dickens' A Christmas Carol. I guess in John Mara's production, Eli is The Ghost of Superbowls Past. I'm not sure who Tiny Tim is, but we all know who plays Scrooge! ;-)

of the Past, Present, AND Future?

5 yrs 130 mil 80 mil up front and that includes the big statue in front of the stadium. Also includes another Super Bowl win.

In comment 11987312 NYGmen58 said:

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of the Past, Present, AND Future?

Here is an interesting thought: Coughlin becomes the GM and hires the new HC. Reese and the rest are history.

I watched everyone of those guys I think and there are others. Some here think you snap your fingers, get rid of Eli and voila, your new franchise QB all shiny and new gift wrapped. I hope they keep Eli 1 year too long because I'm not ready for wannabe tryouts

Thanks for those names. I have an emergency call into my therapist to remind me how to remove those mental scars, again.
On the thread: JM, for all that BBIers dump on him about how he runs the team, is NOT sending any reverse-meaning statements. He knows where the problems are, and his 'offense is broken' comment is predominately on JR, because Eli has had no OL, WR, or solid RB(due respect to Wilson and how that turned out) since mid-season of 2012, or about 28 games ago, and there is little hope in sight(WesR, JPugh, and GeoffS? side, VC? and AndreW?). TC gets much of the remaining portion of that comment next, and that is still not much.
That comment will repeat this offseason, and may be the one that accompanies JRs termination.
Or at least to have JR shake up the scouting and evaluation staff.

Thanks for those names. I have an emergency call into my therapist to remind me how to remove those mental scars, again.
On the thread: JM, for all that BBIers dump on him about how he runs the team, is NOT sending any reverse-meaning statements. He knows where the problems are, and his 'offense is broken' comment is predominately on JR.
Eli has had no OL, WR, or solid RB(due respect to Wilson and how that turned out) since mid-season of 2012, or about 28 games ago, and there is little hope in sight(WesR, JPugh, and GeoffS? side, VC? and AndreW?). TC gets much of the remaining portion of that comment next, and that is still not much.
That comment will repeat this offseason, and may be the one that accompanies JRs termination.
Or at least to have JR shake up the scouting and evaluation staff.

Coaches can coach up talent unfortunately this team is lacking in that area. It really all falls on Reese and the scouting department. There also seems to be a disconnect with TC on how to get the most out of your franchise quarterback.

to Reese talk about Kiwanuka a few years ago you would have thought you were getting the next Reggie White.

He sees high ceilings in guys others don't.Reese shaking up the staff isn't enough. He has to go.

In comment 11987053 Randy in CT said:

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You have to understand the big picture.

The big picture is a mess. We're not watching some elaborate game of chess unfolding on levels we couldn't possibly understand. That, in two years, will suddenly reveal itself and we'll all think 'Ah, that sly devil. The poor drafts. The undisciplined play. The veneer of too often appearing unready to compete. The whole which-facet-of-the-team-will-let us-down this week. That was the plan.

Maybe it's much simpler. Maybe it's just like it looks from here. A team that's made mistakes on every level. That's catching some bad breaks, where just a few years ago, they were breaking to the good. And no one, least of all the big picture thinkers on here, really has any idea where the bottom is or how long it will take to get up.

In comment 11987044 BrettNYG10 said:

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Quote: If you have a franchise quarterback you're always going to be competitive. *IGNORES 2013 AND 2014

Or, it implies that in Mara's mind that the Giants should have been competitive the last two years.

If Donnell comes down with the ball MAYBE none of the thousands of words written, never get written. That thin, thin line between euphoria and despair

How is that working out draft room?

I forgot George Shaw, Lee Grosscup, Glyn Griffing, Gary Lane, Henry Schictle, Scott Brunner, and, get ready, Dave Brown. And let us not forget the high draft choices we threw away acquiring some of these guys, directly or through trades. I saw them all, too, those that actually made the field. Bad, stupid, ill-advised, panicked decisions about quarterbacks haunt teams for decades (e.g the Washingtons). It used to be us. Then we got Phil Simms and then we got Eli Manning. I hope Eli plays 'til he's 40.

In comment 11987464 Headhunter said:

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If Donnell comes down with the ball MAYBE none of the thousands of words written, never get written. That thin, thin line between euphoria and despair

And if Tony Romo doesn't overthrow Miles Austin by three inches...

(All sorts of alternative realities. And yes, in the ones where the Giants current woes don't run a a hell of a llot deeper than a dropped pass, everyone's happier.)

...back to this reality.

.

To this day I throw up in my mouth a little when I think about what we paid for Craig Morton, the "Manster" Randy White. Morton sucked, Manster Hall of Fame

Randy Dean, Steve Ramsey, and Tommy Maddox

In comment 11987548 Reb8thVA said:

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Randy Dean, Steve Ramsey, and Tommy Maddox

Let us not forget Dick Shiner, Randy Johnson Gary Ward! Get rid of Eli this us what we'll see for years! Rebuild the OLine with young guys and Eli will be around to usher in his replacement in 5 yrs! After another Super Bowl ;-)

Assuming he doesn't get hurt in his older years, he has four more solid top tier years left in him.

I am adamant that if the following things happen we'll have a superb offense next year:

1. Victor Cruz must recover fully. He is the slot guy we are truly missing right now. What a shame.

2. UFA RT - we need an OL that can block for the run and pass. We can move Pugh inside to OG where he'll be an upgrade over Jerry; Richburg to OC; and Schwartz plays OG. Beatty is serviceable. We draft an OT in round #1, preferably one that can play both tackle spots and let him learn as a rookie and play as needed since injuries happen, especially with this team.

3. TE Donnell and hopefully Robinson develop and become players of note.

4. RB Williams improves by leaps and bounds AND we get a rookie with speed who can play as a rookie and not sit around and watch. Losing RB David Wilson hurt.

5. WR Randle, Washington, Beckham must all continue to grow together in this offense.

STAY HEALTHY in CAMP and beyond! Please dear Lord!

We make some good off-season moves, draft well, stay healthy we'll have an offense Eli can really lead.

In comment 11987071 Britt in VA said:

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nice shootin, Tex.

I spit out my drink. LMAO

think that if Eli is released, we end up with Jerry Goldsteyn. Didn't the Giants at one time draft Phil Simms and Jeff Hostetler? And while not in their league, didn't they sign Terry Collins who took them to a Super Bowl? The really bad years spanned '65 thru '79 and were due to Wellington Mara thinking that he was qualified to make player and coaching decisions simply because he owned the team. Provided his son, John, doesn't labor under similar delusions and instead trusts his football people, I see no reason to expect disaster once Eli is gone.

right up to today, the Giants drafted and developed two franchise, championship quarterbacks -- Simms and Manning. That's two in 50 years. It's not so easy.

In comment 11987634 BlueHurricane said:

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In comment 11987071 Britt in VA said: Quote: nice shootin, Tex. I spit out my drink. LMAO

I'm glad somebody got the obscure Ghostbusters reference. It's a classic.