I don't envy John Mara. I personally think love Tom Coughlin and always will. Everything Francesa said yesterday about protecting him from outside criticism and honoring him when the time comes is absolutely true. However, I think the problem ownership has is that TC has coached this team to EXTREMELY high points and EXTREMELY low points. For such a consistent hard-worker, the results in the TC era have been anything but consistent. You can't just "take out" the 2 Super Bowl titles, just like you can't "take out" his almost 2 and a half seasons of non-competitive football. There are 2 sides of the coin here which make it really difficult to know what the best move is going forward.
TC the 2-time SB Champion at his best:
-Helped re-build this team with Accorsi/Reese from the ground up in year 1 with drafting Eli
-Changed his entire philosophy on dealing with players on a personal level
-Known as one of the best in-game strategists regarding time management, preparedness, challenges, etc.
-His decision to play the last game of the season against the Pats which changed everything
-The epitome of toughness, road warriors in 07, winning all those road playoff games in 07 and 11
-The Spagnuolo hire
-Motivational, Col. Gadsen in 07, getting inside Tuck's head in 11
TC teams underachieving at his worst:
-Chronic 2nd half in-season collapses
-Hufnagel, Sheridan, Fewell, Quinn
-Non-competitive blowout losses (lately)
-Matt Dodge
-No hands team against Eagles in 2010
-His handling of the offensive line i.e. the re-insertion of O'Hara and Diehl in 2010 and 2012
-Total offensive malfunction after injury
-This season only, really poor replay decisions, flag in his sock, Andrew Luck's knee, he seems to be a step behind where he was in the past
Does this team win a Super Bowl in 07 without him playing that final regular season game? I would bet my life they don't.
On the other hand, this team had no business whatsoever missing the playoffs in 2010 and 2012, that is directly on TC.
2006 and 2009 I think were flawed/injured teams even though they were 6-2 and 5-0 respectively.
Considering where the franchise is right now and including TC's entire body of work, this is a real crossroads for the organization. The decision on going forward with TC can be argued and supported either way.
Presumably, Giants will have to make a change within the next 3 years anyway. Hasn't made the playoffs in 5 of last 6 years.
Seems like very other week that the team is non-competitive (and the other week they stink anyway).
Time is right. Make the more a year too soon (and its already "not too soon") rather than a year too late - particularly because the QB's window is closing fast (but there will still be fresh air coming in for a few years).
-Total offensive malfunction after injury
Who were the 2 great OL that got benched in favor of O'Hara and Diehl? uhhhh, Thought so.
Who were the solid depth and young draft picks that
Reese drafted or signed who could step in "after injury"? same answer
I'm edging ever so closely to the side that wants a change. But coughlin's age has nothing to do with it in my view. Giants might need to make a change 3 years from now anyway? Based on what? Coughlin at 72 may in fact still have all the energy needed to do a good job and 3 years is an eternity in the nfl anyway.
Age shouldn't be a factor in this debate.
The age discussion is kind of bothersome to me.
2. Backups struggling to grasp the TC/Gilbride system if a starter went down is well documented.
- his teams have come out focused and ready to play on thursday night games
- there have not been the same letdowns against backup QBs compared to under the fassel and parcells days
Cons
- the giants have been very slow starters on offense under his watch....it seems like there is a lot of read and react on offense as opposed to coming out and hitting the opponent in the mouth with a crisp drive filled with pre-scripted plays; this goes back to the championship seasons too, not just the last two years
- he will stick too long with his veterans whose physical skills have diminished over young guys who may have a more physical upside but may lack the experience
- there has been a disturbing number of mental mistakes/errors that fall on him as the head coach (see the breakdowns in coverage or the failure to stop the bleeding vs. seattle).
[quote] Isn't he 67?
He'll be 69 opening day kickoff 2015.
Age is a big part of the equation here, it shouldn't be "bothersome."
Historically, the franchise had a similar conundrum in 1950 with Steve Owens.
2. Backups struggling to grasp the TC/Gilbride system if a starter went down is well documented.
Then what is the excuse now for Brewer, Moseley, Brown, Herman? How about they all suck?
Boothe was a decent backup who had versatility. Locklear a journeyman too.
IMO, Coughlin is a great leader and commander at the top. However, he is not a great offensive coach, especially in this new pass-happy era. The nfl changed and Coughlin was not able to adapt.
It should also be noted that the two SBs were won by the defense, the unit least under Coughlin's supervision. I think his big mistake was not not being hands off with the offense the way he is with the defense.
The other big thing is that Coughlin's brand of football plays better in the postseason. It's too bad he was able to adapt.
That's only if you count the 8-8 seasons as losing seasons, which you conveniently are. I think year one with an expansion team is an excusable losing season, too, especially when you're in the conference title game in year two.
IMO, Coughlin is a great leader and commander at the top. However, he is not a great offensive coach, especially in this new pass-happy era. The nfl changed and Coughlin was not able to adapt.
It should also be noted that the two SBs were won by the defense, the unit least under Coughlin's supervision. I think his big mistake was not not being hands off with the offense the way he is with the defense.
The other big thing is that Coughlin's brand of football plays better in the postseason. It's too bad he was able to adapt.
Adapt? Was the NFL a passing league when the Giants won the whole damn thing in '11?
Oh, they also did that on the back of the passing game. Eli holds the NFL record for passing yards in a postseason run.
I also disagree that the Giants won championships on the back of the defense. This was certainly not the case in 2011.
but he does some brilliant things. the final game of the season against the Pats is the highlight. THAT was great coaching. i think the team is playing hard this year even though the personnel is bottom 1/5th of the league. we almost beat the cardinals. competed against seattle. could have beat the niners. that is great coaching. (i know, should have, would have, but really, we suck and we're still in games).
but the bottom line for me is that he is a HoF coach trying to win games when the personnel just isn't there.
2. Backups struggling to grasp the TC/Gilbride system if a starter went down is well documented.
100% truth. If you don't concur I don't know what to tell you. Go watch the jets.
The money will be there. They are said to be twenty million under the cap for next year so Jerry has no excuses. I don't know who you bring in as DC but Tom has really not done a particularly good job choosing them except for Spags who put up some nice numbers the two years he ran the defense.
I know a lot of people here are pining to bring him back so we'll see. But honestly if you look at the numbers and where they ranked year in and year out with Fewell as the DC I don't they've ever even been a top twenty defense. Even in 2011.
So, yeah, they can get off the field in his system.
Then you are blind. Combine what he did in Jax with what he did here and he is a sure fire hall of fame coach. Not even debatable if Parcells is a HOF coach then TC is as well as he has had as much success as Bill and did so constructing a franchise from scratch......... Literally.
2. Backups struggling to grasp the TC/Gilbride system if a starter went down is well documented.
When O'Hara was out, I don't think they let up a sack! To mess with that, was crazy. Plainly, it was not one of TC's best moments.