The future is bright

Last night was encouraging to me.

We have the 31st ranked defense - a unit that will have to undergo a major overhaul. It's not close to being good. The DC will also likely be fired.

The OL is still a mess. We have one WR who scares anyone. The RB's are OK.

Yeah, we're "close."

The future is bright

Coughlin's Rules : 10:50 am
Yes We are close. We don't need massive overhaul.


Is this Reese? fess up....

The only young stud they have is Beckam. Maybe Hankins.

That's the problem with people talking about how other teams have quick turnarounds: those teams had quite a few high-end pieces to build around and cut the fat around. The Giants don't have that; they largely have a bunch of JAGs and very few young high potential guys that will be around in the coming years for sure, lined up to have realistic potential to be highly productive.

Eric is right. Our safeties, linebackers and DEs are not effective. A ton of work to do on the defensive side of the ball. And our DC sucks.

Our O-Line might be the worst Ive ever seen on the Giants. Our TEs are just ok, our RBs are just OK and as Eric said, we have one threat at WR.

We are far from competing.

Going forward, the only clear positives I see are OBJ (obviously), DRC/Prince, Hank, Donnell, Williams, Jennings, I still think Pugh and Richburg will be good but this year has been sobering.

Now we need to fix D. O still needs some parts but it has moments that show what it will be in the future. I do not see that in D. We have some parts but scheme is wrong for our D. Need to bring in some players too.

the entire front seven has to be built. Starters and depth. We're not remotely close.

Eli has no time to throw, and this results in his boneheaded INTs. The O Line can't run block worth shit as well. So we have no running game. Outside of Beckham, what WRs scare an opposing defense?

We fixed our O? Really?

It's not as bad as some here think....

About 3-4 good players on defense and less on the offensive line being 3-8 shows they're not close to anything but the bottom of the league.

Their OL is still poor, their RBs are nothing special, and they have one single receiving threat worth a damn.

It's not healthy. DRC,Prince,Thurmond. Need healthy Lbs Beason, McLean, Jaq Will are hurt. We have guys off the street playing. Hosley is terrible in this D. Asking too much for DL. Needs help.

Yeah, I watch it.

31st ranked defense. On pace to give up over 6,000 yards for the third time in four seasons. Can't stop the run. Can't rush the passer. Can't cover. So we got that going for us.

will be required. and that is if no more drafts suck and we actually sign good free agents.

We could easily be 5-6 right now and be having a whole difference conversation. What are there, two or three good teams?? How much really separates us from the Cowboys, for example? Just fix the freaking OL finally, and we'll see what we have. It'll help the running game, passing game, and defense. Enough with the Waltons and Jerrys. Quality over quantity in free agency this offseason.

I think the D isn't that far away but they need LB, Safety and DL talent.

The offense needs another OL, WR and RB. And TE.

We basically need one player for each position. Not stars....just capable players. That's not as hard as it sounds but it's gonna require some good scouting and smart decision making.

There are some pieces in place. We have depth at RB but not enough star power or game breaking power. We have a young cost controlled star at WR. A decent but flawed talent at TE. Donnell is a nice player but not really a difference maker yet. We can live with him but hopefully he improves. Need another pass catcher at WR. Can't assume Cruz comes back but if so, great. Compliment Beckham. Make Randle the 3.

Schwartz can play. Richburg will be fine next year.Beatty isn't the worst LT in the world...but an upgrade at tackle or a guy that pushes the LT and/or RT spot is needed... One more big time talent at OL...

Work needs to be done but it's not as bad as it seems. You're only as good as your weakest link, we have too many right now. Don't need multiple stars...just players. Maybe one star on O and D then a few pluggers.

Needs one more piece. Move kid to center. Draft tackle sign guard. Let them fight it out. Pugh, Winton good building blocks, Beatty Ok Schwartz looked decent. Jennings and Williams another Rb. It's there.

are about where Dallas was at the start of this season.

We are not that far off. But lo sell hi

Unfortunately the DL probably is. Even if Bromley steps up DE is now a problem as JPP has not returned to form, Kiwi is done and Moore never arrived. The secondary is ok as is RB and TE(!) but Cruz's injury is a huge problem going forward. Kennard gives me hope at LB.

In comment 11997569 Coughlin's Rules said:

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Needs one more piece. Move kid to center. Draft tackle sign guard. Let them fight it out. Pugh, Winton good building blocks, Beatty Ok Schwartz looked decent. Jennings and Williams another Rb. It's there.

What are you smoking? OL is not poor? WTF?

Romo last night, but hardly played in the last drive. To be effective, the first requirement is that the coaches let a defender on the field. And just because they beat the blitz once doesn`t mean that you are never allowed to use it again.

The whole league sucks.
bceagle05 : 11:02 am : link : reply
We could easily be 5-6 right now and be having a whole difference conversation.

That's the sad part....the NFC does suck, and yet we can't beat a team with a winning record...., not to mention the easy schedule we had....

Coughlin Rules, you are a fan to the N-th degree....

Aside from the OL, the front 7 on D, Safety, WR (Beckham excepted), and TE they're knocking on the door of greatness.

Necessary to build a winning team. The D is lacking talent, scheme and fundamental play. The O is close to clicking and with a couple of upgrades it will. Your being unrealistic in your expectations. How many teams are this thin? Injuries have decimated the talent level and eroded the fundamentals of our D

In comment 11997537 Eric from BBI said:

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the entire front seven has to be built. Starters and depth. We're not remotely close.

agree..I don't get people don't see this and it isn't a 1 yr fix as most are assuming. This is a 3-4 yr fix (finding and getting right pieces) in that not only some starters need to be replace but also the depth of many positions, that has come back to haunt this team from past years 3 rd on draft bust and bad luck, that has truely affected the depth and ST's that you'd expected to get contribution from.

People are not seeing the big picture and blame the coaching such as TC and Fewell etc etc. Players are the main fault..talent and roster makeup

We need another WR, another OL, possibly a RB, at least two DL (three if JPP walks away), two LBs and a safety

That's a lot of pieces and you can't fix all of that in a year

In comment 11997644 Victor in CT said:

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Aside from the OL, the front 7 on D, Safety, WR (Beckham excepted), and TE they're knocking on the door of greatness.

You forgot our wonderful coaches

including a 4 point lead at the 2 minute warning against a team that's 8-3 and in first place. If we're miles away from competing, what does that say about Dallas??? We need a good DC - that would make a big difference. That's pretty obvious at this point.

last night played out perfectly

*The Giants lost, ensuring they will get higher picks in the 1st 2 rounds, in particular. that can be the difference between turning it around, and not turning it around.

*beckham showed he may be an all time great-type of player

*schwartz's 1st game in a Giants uniform showed he is a quality starter - got good push/seals in the run game and held up well in pass pro. may even be the RT of the future which would be a huge plus moving fwd as pugh isn't a good fit there

*The O looked generally effective from a scheme/play-calling standpoint. I'm banking on McAdoo being a solid part of the solution.

*The D looked generally ineffective which should help get Perry Fewell out the door

*Moore again flashed on the pass rush (we need this guy to be a good pass rusher)

*No serious injuries.

*The players showed they cared and were playing hard for Coughlin.

----

All in all, about as good an outcome as we could have hoped.

My one big negative right now is the play of Johnathan Hankins - he's fallen off a cliff after a nice start and we need him to be a stalwart moving fwd.

The guy who oversaw the decline of our roster the last few years? Great.

sign Suh. He'll cover a lot of warts on defense.

In comment 11997705 Mike L. said:

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We need a good DC - that would make a big difference. That's pretty obvious at this point.

It hasn't seemed obvious to TC, JR or Mara

OL is fixed, the RB issues will go away. Murray is a perfect example of what a revamped OL can do for a RB. Also, an improved running game will help the passing game.

The defense is a different issue. Yes, it is way past time for a new DC and I think there will be a new one on staff next year.

Fix the OL and get the defense from dead last to middle of the pack and they can get to the playoffs next year.

In comment 11997745 Bill in UT said:

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In comment 11997705 Mike L. said: Quote: We need a good DC - that would make a big difference. That's pretty obvious at this point. It hasn't seemed obvious to TC, JR or Mara

My guess is that Mara was infatuated with fixing the O and he either ignored the D or felt it was on par when, in fact, it isn't even close. Of course, another explanation could be that management sees this as being a two plus year project and elected to fix the O first and are now focusing on the D.

They are basically dead last in the league in overall talent. They can't draft worth a damn. They let good players walk in free agency and then have to use high draft choices to replace them. The coaching is ridiculously bad and they are not developing many players. I'll stop now, but I could go on for half an hour.

In comment 11997712 area junc said:

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last night played out perfectly *The Giants lost, ensuring they will get higher picks in the 1st 2 rounds, in particular. that can be the difference between turning it around, and not turning it around. *beckham showed he may be an all time great-type of player *schwartz's 1st game in a Giants uniform showed he is a quality starter - got good push/seals in the run game and held up well in pass pro. may even be the RT of the future which would be a huge plus moving fwd as pugh isn't a good fit there *The O looked generally effective from a scheme/play-calling standpoint. I'm banking on McAdoo being a solid part of the solution. *The D looked generally ineffective which should help get Perry Fewell out the door *Moore again flashed on the pass rush (we need this guy to be a good pass rusher) *No serious injuries. *The players showed they cared and were playing hard for Coughlin. ---- All in all, about as good an outcome as we could have hoped. My one big negative right now is the play of Johnathan Hankins - he's fallen off a cliff after a nice start and we need him to be a stalwart moving fwd.

Hard to argue with that *GRIN*

I suppose you could cite Bradshaw, but he missed almost all of last year to injury and only made it about half way through this one before going down again for the duration.

Losing guys to FA really isn't a problem for this team. Not having anyone good enough to worry about potentially losing or having to lock up long-term in the first place is.

we have one of the worst OLs in the league.

We have one sure thing offensive weapon.

I'd hardly call that close.

Dallas has a big interior OL that will dominate us for years unless we beef up our DL. Suh and Hankins in the middle would be nice anchors for the next few seasons. We're in dire need of a lot of things, but impact players should always be at the top of the list, regardless of position. We often take a "quantity over quality" approach to FA, but this might be a time to swing for the fences on an All-Pro type player.

This is assuming, of course, we don't switch to a 3-4 scheme under a new DC.

Successful teams are built through the draft. Look at the Green Bay Packers. There GM very seldom goes after free agents. If they fall into his lap like Julies Peppers, fine. But the majority of the team comes the draft.

Remember the dream team in Philadelphia. The signings by the Redskins. We had what 15 free agents signed last year. Who has worked out in that bunch? - Jennings, Rodgers-Cromartie, McClain, and now possibly Schwartz.

The 15 free agents was a desperate move by Reese to save his job. It didn't work out and he has failed miserably with most of his draft picks. Yes, he has had success in the first round. But if you miss on these blue chip selections you must be pretty bad.

And of course Coughlin doesn't help matters with his reluctance to play rookies unless absolutely necessary. So players never develop.

Not a great combination.

The last time we had a two-year skid like this, we capitalized by drafting Eli, Snee, Webster and Tuck in the early rounds, then spent wisely on McKenzie, Pierce and Plax. Are we going to take advantage of our high draft picks and free agent money this time around? We brought in a bunch of guys in FA last year, but no impact guys, just solid vets like Jennings, Schwartz and an overpaid DRC. We might have to shop for a couple of big-ticket items to go with our top 10 pick, whoever that is.

Let's face it, no team solves all of its roster issues. The Cowboys are 8-3 right now with an awful defense that our shitty offense was slicing and dicing at times last night. It may be best to add a Suh or Iupati, hit on our first two picks, and let some younger, hungrier guys fill out the roster.

In comment 11997835 chris r said:

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we have one of the worst OLs in the league. We have one sure thing offensive weapon. I'd hardly call that close.

Agree on the o-line, but we have two sure thing offensive weapons when Cruz returns.

And on the o-line, I really think we're just one good guard away from being at least decent and good enough to win with. Richburg will be a good center, and Schwartz showed he can play stout. I feel his best position is on the right side. We need a left guard. Either move Pugh to LG and draft/sign a RT or LG. If we go the draft route, I would use a 2nd round pick on that. Use the first pick to sure up the D. That's the real problem with the team. We need 5-6 starters.

Or do Giants part ways and start over with new staff. If we're that far from being competitive, does the ownership look to start over? I think you would have to part ways IMO. Will be an interesting week following the Eagles game!

In comment 11997538 Bold Ruler said:

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Eli has no time to throw, and this results in his boneheaded INTs. The O Line can't run block worth shit as well. So we have no running game. Outside of Beckham, what WRs scare an opposing defense? We fixed our O? Really?

Maybe he is confusing our issues with the OL with the Cowboys, which they fixed, resulting in 8 seconds for Romo in the pocket.

We have no talent on either side of the ball. It's 1 WR, 1 QB, and that's it. Our OL stinks, and our defense is even more god awful.

We are 2-3 years away, assuming we draft well, and sign FA that can stay healthy and provide an impact.

Resign: Bowman, Thurmond, JPP, Rolle

Sign: Suh, LB, Vet OL, Vet Safety to replace Demps


Draft: (1) Landon Collins, (1b) Trade Next years first for late pick draft Ladarious Green-Beckham, (2) Best OL/Passrusher, (3) Best OL/passrusher (4) Scat back (5-7) BPA

Boom haha

Then we can have the Beckham's on the outside..Imagine

.

In comment 11997712 area junc said:

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last night played out perfectly *The Giants lost, ensuring they will get higher picks in the 1st 2 rounds, in particular. that can be the difference between turning it around, and not turning it around. *beckham showed he may be an all time great-type of player *schwartz's 1st game in a Giants uniform showed he is a quality starter - got good push/seals in the run game and held up well in pass pro. may even be the RT of the future which would be a huge plus moving fwd as pugh isn't a good fit there *The O looked generally effective from a scheme/play-calling standpoint. I'm banking on McAdoo being a solid part of the solution. *The D looked generally ineffective which should help get Perry Fewell out the door *Moore again flashed on the pass rush (we need this guy to be a good pass rusher) *No serious injuries. *The players showed they cared and were playing hard for Coughlin. ---- All in all, about as good an outcome as we could have hoped. My one big negative right now is the play of Johnathan Hankins - he's fallen off a cliff after a nice start and we need him to be a stalwart moving fwd.

I agree with almost all of this.

and I'd agree they need to decide first how to proceed, ie, replace Fewell and determine which scheme and philosophy they're deploying with his successor.

We have significant needs at DE, DT, LB, S, and given the rash of injuries at CB, it's also in the mix.

Offense ... OL needs at least one more piece at OG, WR, and some AA at TE.

That's a couple of offseasons.

In comment 11997527 Coughlin's Rules said:

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Now we need to fix D. O still needs some parts but it has moments that show what it will be in the future. I do not see that in D. We have some parts but scheme is wrong for our D. Need to bring in some players too.

Are you kidding me. The OL is still a mess. Inconsistent pass blocking and no run blocking. Constant missed assignments. Last year's rebuild was a flop.

The future is dark...

and general organizational issues at almost every headcount. It's going to take a few offseasons before we dig ourselves out from under this one.

I know everyone's focussed now on who we're going to draft but the paramount issue facing the owners and Reese is locating the next Bill Belichick. That's job one.

In comment 11997562 bceagle05 said:

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We could easily be 5-6 right now and be having a whole difference conversation. What are there, two or three good teams?? How much really separates us from the Cowboys, for example? Just fix the freaking OL finally, and we'll see what we have. It'll help the running game, passing game, and defense. Enough with the Waltons and Jerrys. Quality over quantity in free agency this offseason.

The Cowboys are loaded with talent. They are not that good either. Their schedule has been weak with only quality win over Seattle. They will lose by second round of playoffs when they face the better quarterbacks.

In comment 11997569 Coughlin's Rules said:

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Needs one more piece. Move kid to center. Draft tackle sign guard. Let them fight it out. Pugh, Winton good building blocks, Beatty Ok Schwartz looked decent. Jennings and Williams another Rb. It's there.

I do not agree that we need one more piece. I am not sold on Pugh and Richburg. Schwartz played his first game last night. Who knows at this point how good he is. We have no push on our front line and one more piece is going to fix that.

In comment 11997584 BillT said:

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Unfortunately the DL probably is. Even if Bromley steps up DE is now a problem as JPP has not returned to form, Kiwi is done and Moore never arrived. The secondary is ok as is RB and TE(!) but Cruz's injury is a huge problem going forward. Kennard gives me hope at LB.

JPP returning to form is not happening. He had great year because he was surrounded by good players. If he gets some help he may get more pressure. He is what he is.

JERRY. REESE.

We fixed the O? Really? Reese, is that you??

The problem is that we're closer to the bottom of the league in terms of talent than we are to the last playoff/wildcard team. We have to leapfrog a lot of teams and our arrow is actually pointing down due to a false start rebuilding effort this past offseason. We just added a lot of trash that we'll have to cut or plan to cut over the next year or two. Won't be till 2016 that we field a good team - and that's only if we make a lot of good moves between now and then. Even the 1st and 2nd year players, outside of Beckam and maybe Richburg (maybe maybe Pugh), may be trash that we have to work around. That's a scary thought.

Some of you can't see the picture because you are blinded by unrealistic expectations but when you really look at it you will see the value. Still needs work yes and I agree about 2 yrs. next year playoffs and year after Supe. We will have an explosive O. Look at what Coughlin has done in the past if you don't believe me. Our D needs a new scheme the Tampa 2 should be dead and buried by now. Look we have talent in secondary when healthy. We just need another LBr and DE to go along with JPP, Demontre and Ayers. I like the tackles.

for a cpl yrs at least. Get some late fall early winter Sunday hobbies if you dont have them yet.

Passionate fans get caught up in the score. The offense is starting to pick up the new system. The OL is still weak but there is room for hope with Richburg, Beatty, Pugh, and Schwartz. OBJ is awesome. TE's are getting better.

The defense doesn't have to be all-world to win a championship, they just need a few pieces and a new DC. If healthy, the secondary has the potential to be very good.

Ultimately each year comes down to injuries, but with a franchise QB in place the Giants will always be a factor if they can stay relatively healthy. That hasn't been the case these past two years.

If Cruz can return to health, the WR duo of him and OBJ as Mr. Outside and Mr. Inside will be difficult to defend, and if they can add a tall WR in the 2nd round of next year's draft and a stud OL in the 1st round, the offense can be one of the best in the NFL if it stays healthy.

On defense, the return of Prince will give the Giants a pretty good pair of CB's. If they can add just one big-ticket free agent to the front seven and then complement that with some reliable veteran additions and better coaching, the defense can be good enough. It's not like this year's Super Bowl contenders can boast a top-shelf defense.

p.s.-- As bad as this year's team is, if the Giants hadn't lost Prince and Cruz to season ending injuries, their recent losses to Seattle, San Fran, and Dallas might've gone a lot differently.

In comment 11997515 Doomster said:

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The future is bright Coughlin's Rules : 10:50 am Yes We are close. We don't need massive overhaul. CLOSE TO WHAT????? Is this Reese? fess up....

I gotta wear shades.



An all-time grate song by the TimBuk3.

and whether he agrees to a deal that gives the team cap room to address the many weak areas we have. Many have said his agent won't let that happen but if he doesn't, his chances for a 3rd SB win look pretty slim.

Since this is generally called green bays offense for obvious reasons keep in mind when it was installed there they went 4-8 to start. Then got better.

The D not so much. It's hard to figure out since so many are hurt but adding a suh couldn't hurt

Whoever wrote it Bravo
Only a fool would think about getting rid of Eli Manning especially with a full blown star in Beckham coming of age. Look at what Manning does with that one star receiver on the roster capable of opening the playbook. Plaxico SB 42. Hakeem SB 46. Eli has three rings written all over him and that third ring has Odell Beckham written all over it. Give Eli a decent line and watch.

Three of the greatest catches in NFL history have spun off of Eli Manning’s hand. Giants fans really don’t deserve this, but if their GM can fix that OLINE and Dline, they’re getting that fifth ring.

and D gives it away. It is the D! Even with the shtty OL we had the past few games we were still in position to win the game! It is the D.

Our game play against Romo should have been to blitz him into retirement, what do we do nothing sit back. Talent or no talent bring pressure!

SF had game but could -guess what cover the middle of the field and cover the QB boot.

Jax couldn't cover the middle of the field of 2 2nd and longs, give the QB rook time to boot.

The D scheme does not work. Injuries are an issue but there is more to it.