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Film room breakdown of cowboys game winning drive

Giants4246 : 11/27/2014 11:36 am
Absolutely disgraceful how much time romo had and how the whole defensive series was handled.
Link - ( New Window )
Love this part  
SB : 11/27/2014 12:08 pm : link
Quote:
The blockers (including Murray, who handles Jason Pierre-Paul one-on-one) easily take care of the three rushers, allowing Romo more than enough time to get the pass out to Bryant.




Ugh.
Sickening to have  
Stufftherun : 11/27/2014 12:19 pm : link
to relive it in such a graphic manner but boy is it an indictment on so many levels.
sickening indeed  
Les in TO : 11/27/2014 12:31 pm : link
love that murray could handle JPP one on one and that on the 3 man rush where the giants had 8 in coverage to cover 4 receivers (i.e. a 2:1 ratio of defenders to receivers) they still gave up a big gain. not one blitz on that last drive. the only difference was 3 man rush and 4 man rush/medium zone/deep zone. prevent defense only prevents winning.
There is so much wrong going on in that picture  
Giants4246 : 11/27/2014 12:35 pm : link
What in the fuck are kiwanuka and rolle doing in that play exactly?
i'm guessing role  
Les in TO : 11/27/2014 12:38 pm : link
is shadowing either murray in case murray is given a dump off on a delay and romo in case he decided to run. kiwanuka was probably in one of fewell's tricky zone blitz plays, minus the blitz.
If the cowboys going 80 yards in 7 plays in 90 seconds  
Giants4246 : 11/27/2014 12:42 pm : link
Isn't enough to get fewell canned at the end of the year then this whole organization is broken.
RE: If the cowboys going 80 yards in 7 plays in 90 seconds  
Les in TO : 11/27/2014 1:06 pm : link
In comment 12003676 Giants4246 said:
Quote:
Isn't enough to get fewell canned at the end of the year then this whole organization is broken.


if that isn't enough, exhibit B is the 10 times russell wilson took a lovely stroll on the read option into an empty meadow with no defenders to interrupt his fresh air.

but again, it's not just fewell. it's coughlin that is accountable for the D too. he alluded to the fact that he was gun shy to blitz after the beasley touchdown.
Which is god awful  
AnishPatel : 11/27/2014 1:09 pm : link
because the alternative is to sit back and give Romo or any opposing QB unlimited armount of time. All this because we are afraid of giving up the big play. However, the irony is, we still do give up the home run ball. So then what?

What a shitty fucking defense, and coordinator. TC gets blame too. Something needs to change next season.
This defense and philosohy has made a complete mockery  
Giants4246 : 11/27/2014 1:15 pm : link
of the giants organization and what it stands for. A damn disgrace to the franchise.
what Giants4246 said above on both posts..  
prdave73 : 11/27/2014 1:26 pm : link
PF is a horrible DC and to think he's still employed is pathetic showing by the Giants Org..
RE: Which is god awful  
Les in TO : 11/27/2014 1:30 pm : link
In comment 12003705 AnishPatel said:
Quote:
because the alternative is to sit back and give Romo or any opposing QB unlimited armount of time. All this because we are afraid of giving up the big play. However, the irony is, we still do give up the home run ball. So then what?

What a shitty fucking defense, and coordinator. TC gets blame too. Something needs to change next season.


the whole game we were struggling to touch tony romo let alone hit or sack him....clearly the front four was not getting there...why not in that last drive (a) try moore since he is a pas rushing threat and the cowboys were most likely going to be passing the ball in a hurry up offense or (b) mix up the blitzes so at least pressure is manufactured instead of the inability for "organic" pressure from the front four to materialize. have three potential blitzers come before each play and make romo guess which one(s) is actually going to blitz and bluff. there was no blitzing or bluffing. it was death by a thousand cuts or steamboats.
RE: This defense and philosohy has made a complete mockery  
Les in TO : 11/27/2014 1:31 pm : link
In comment 12003710 Giants4246 said:
Quote:
of the giants organization and what it stands for. A damn disgrace to the franchise.


the franchise of LT, harry carson, carl banks, jim burt, leonard marshall, michael strahan, jessie armstead, etc etc.
Especially,  
Doomster : 11/27/2014 1:35 pm : link
when the Redskins gave the Giants the blueprint for getting to Romo.......

It's amazing how the Giant coaching staff, sees films of teams before playing them, and doesn't use what works against the opposition....when we played the Colts, we saw their defense had trouble coping with stacked receivers, yet we never attempted this...

Washington blitzed, and the Cowboys couldn't handle it....we rush 4, sometimes 3.....We have the likes of Patterson, Kuhn, and Kiwi rushing, while guys like Moore and Ayers are on the sidelines.....

DRC overplayed Dez to the center of the endzone, even though Demps was there....this allowed Dez to double back on him.....

There is no excuse for giving a qb of Romo's ability 8 seconds to throw, on consecutive plays.....coaching philosophy has hit an all time low.....this is another example of Kuhn coaching scared....
Fewell,  
Doomster : 11/27/2014 1:39 pm : link
not Kuhn... :)
PF has been doing this for years  
JOrthman : 11/27/2014 1:52 pm : link
and it frustrated the hell out of me. He tries to have his D live and die by turnovers and is never aggressive.
the  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 11/27/2014 2:06 pm : link
Giants blitzed on the long Beasley touchdown.

Not defending the strategy, but when the Giants blitzed, they didn't get there.
Can you imagine a defense lawrence taylor played on  
Giants4246 : 11/27/2014 2:19 pm : link
allowing an offense to run all over them figuratively and literally the way opposing offenses have the past 3 years?
RE: the  
JOrthman : 11/27/2014 2:23 pm : link
In comment 12003740 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Giants blitzed on the long Beasley touchdown.

Not defending the strategy, but when the Giants blitzed, they didn't get there.


Eric, True, but they don't have a strong enough secondary to sit back in coverage. Their only hope is to remain aggressive.
Anyone watching the Bears-Lions game?  
PetesHereNow : 11/27/2014 2:34 pm : link
both teams are getting pressure with four guys. Why can't we do this?
PetesHereNow  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 11/27/2014 2:38 pm : link
rushing four comes down to beating the man in front of you. If you can't do it, you're not good enough.
Eric, true enough  
PetesHereNow : 11/27/2014 2:41 pm : link
but it's not as if we are devoid of talent on the DL.

JPP, first round pick.
Kiwi, first round pick.
Hankins, second round pick.
Jenkins, well thought vet who did fine with GB and PHI.
Moore, third round pick.

Where did the talent go? Clearly someone thought highly of them at one time.
The Giants never replaced  
spike : 11/27/2014 2:42 pm : link
Strahan, Tuck, and Osi.

JPP has underachieved; Kiwi is done; and Moore is looking like yet another 3rd round bust.

DEs are a priority in this upcoming draft.
RE: The Giants never replaced  
PetesHereNow : 11/27/2014 2:46 pm : link
In comment 12003761 spike said:
Quote:
Strahan, Tuck, and Osi.

JPP has underachieved; Kiwi is done; and Moore is looking like yet another 3rd round bust.

DEs are a priority in this upcoming draft.


I don't think we can call Moore a bust yet. Am willing to move on from Kiwi and JPP, unless JPP takes a really team friendly contract which I don't think he will.
Suh  
Zebra3 : 11/27/2014 2:49 pm : link
To the Giants would be my fist FA move.
RE: Eric, true enough  
ImaGiant86 : 11/27/2014 3:07 pm : link
In comment 12003760 PetesHereNow said:
Quote:
but it's not as if we are devoid of talent on the DL.

JPP, first round pick.
Kiwi, first round pick.
Hankins, second round pick.
Jenkins, well thought vet who did fine with GB and PHI.
Moore, third round pick.

Where did the talent go? Clearly someone thought highly of them at one time.


The talent is there, you need the right coach. The Lions have Jm Washburn whom all through his career has coached good defensive lines.

Look back what he did with Jason Babin.
RE: Anyone watching the Bears-Lions game?  
Bill in UT : 11/27/2014 3:40 pm : link
In comment 12003749 PetesHereNow said:
Quote:
both teams are getting pressure with four guys. Why can't we do this?


Because our 4 guys suck as pass rushers?
We should staple that picture of JPP/Murray to our  
Bill in UT : 11/27/2014 3:41 pm : link
contract offer
Disgraceful JPP couldn't obliterate murray  
Giants4246 : 11/27/2014 4:35 pm : link
One on one
6 against 3  
mdc1 : 11/27/2014 5:58 pm : link
yeah that seems like something we can overcome on that one graphic.
Giants4246  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 11/27/2014 6:12 pm : link
you are looking at a picture. My guess is that their Pro Bowl LT and JPP initiated contact and what you are now looking at is the RB chip.
RE: Giants4246  
Bill in UT : 11/27/2014 6:21 pm : link
In comment 12003914 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
you are looking at a picture. My guess is that their Pro Bowl LT and JPP initiated contact and what you are now looking at is the RB chip.


So that would mean that the picture and commentary were posted by someone who intentionally distorted what happened on the play.
RE: the  
Joe in Cambridge : 11/27/2014 8:28 pm : link
In comment 12003740 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Giants blitzed on the long Beasley touchdown.

Not defending the strategy, but when the Giants blitzed, they didn't get there.
The Giants pass rush hasn't been able to win their matchups one-on-one. They need to send more people than the offense can block. It's risky and could lead to a big play. But unlike giving a QB all day to throw, it at least has a chance of working.
Fewell's 'fraidy cat defense...  
trueblueinpw : 11/27/2014 9:22 pm : link
Poster above is right on, we play a defense designed not to give up the big play and then we give up the big play anyway. Fewell's been terrible for 5 years. And its TC fault for letting this go on so long. Time to move on.
Giants D looked best  
D-Rod : 11/28/2014 4:45 am : link
in the 1st half against the Colts when they were actually aggressive. Then they went away from it again.

And I know the secondary is depleted now, but he wasn't even aggressive early in the season when they had their deep/talented corners.
Did Kiwi actually run backwards before  
Jimmy Googs : 11/28/2014 7:41 am : link
turning around in that picture?

365 days later and we are still fighting many of the same problems as last year...

- no pass rush
- can't run block worth a damn
- can't really blitz effectively with our defensive players
- running out of WRs and CBs that are healthy
- Eli still fighting lack of touch and high throws
- Romo leading his team right down the field to beat our team at the end of a game.
RE: Did Kiwi actually run backwards before  
Giants4246 : 11/28/2014 7:59 am : link
In comment 12004261 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
turning around in that picture?

365 days later and we are still fighting many of the same problems as last year...

- no pass rush
- can't run block worth a damn
- can't really blitz effectively with our defensive players
- running out of WRs and CBs that are healthy
- Eli still fighting lack of touch and high throws
- Romo leading his team right down the field to beat our team at the end of a game.


Its fucking pathetic, it seems that outside of OBJ we have literally made zero progress in becoming a better football team, in fact we may be worse.
RE: RE: Which is god awful  
HomerJones45 : 11/28/2014 8:43 am : link
In comment 12003719 Les in TO said:
Quote:
In comment 12003705 AnishPatel said:


Quote:


because the alternative is to sit back and give Romo or any opposing QB unlimited armount of time. All this because we are afraid of giving up the big play. However, the irony is, we still do give up the home run ball. So then what?

What a shitty fucking defense, and coordinator. TC gets blame too. Something needs to change next season.



the whole game we were struggling to touch tony romo let alone hit or sack him....clearly the front four was not getting there...why not in that last drive (a) try moore since he is a pas rushing threat and the cowboys were most likely going to be passing the ball in a hurry up offense or (b) mix up the blitzes so at least pressure is manufactured instead of the inability for "organic" pressure from the front four to materialize. have three potential blitzers come before each play and make romo guess which one(s) is actually going to blitz and bluff. there was no blitzing or bluffing. it was death by a thousand cuts or steamboats.
Both of these were answered but you guys don't like the answers. 1) Moore is a 3rd and long player because he can't/won't play the run and the Cowboys have this Murray guy who is pretty good. At no point were the Cowboys in third and long. 2) We do blitz, the blitzers don't get home. The assumption of the "pressure" people is that blitzing means pressure. With our shitty backers, it doesn't. It generally just leads to more holes.
Eagles secondary is just as crappy  
jeff57 : 11/28/2014 8:50 am : link
if not more so.

Dallas was passing, and did. They needed a TD not a FG. Moore should have been in there.

Where was Ayers? Why was Kuhn in there?
RE: Did Kiwi actually run backwards before  
Les in TO : 11/28/2014 9:03 am : link
In comment 12004261 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
turning around in that picture?

365 days later and we are still fighting many of the same problems as last year...

- no pass rush
- can't run block worth a damn
- can't really blitz effectively with our defensive players
- running out of WRs and CBs that are healthy
- Eli still fighting lack of touch and high throws
- Romo leading his team right down the field to beat our team at the end of a game.


don't forget communication errors on the defense leading to assignment breakdowns and "walk in" touchdowns. just a coaching disgrace by coughlin and fewell.
RE: RE: RE: Which is god awful  
Les in TO : 11/28/2014 9:06 am : link
In comment 12004278 HomerJones45 said:
Quote:
In comment 12003719 Les in TO said:


Quote:


In comment 12003705 AnishPatel said:


Quote:


because the alternative is to sit back and give Romo or any opposing QB unlimited armount of time. All this because we are afraid of giving up the big play. However, the irony is, we still do give up the home run ball. So then what?

What a shitty fucking defense, and coordinator. TC gets blame too. Something needs to change next season.



the whole game we were struggling to touch tony romo let alone hit or sack him....clearly the front four was not getting there...why not in that last drive (a) try moore since he is a pas rushing threat and the cowboys were most likely going to be passing the ball in a hurry up offense or (b) mix up the blitzes so at least pressure is manufactured instead of the inability for "organic" pressure from the front four to materialize. have three potential blitzers come before each play and make romo guess which one(s) is actually going to blitz and bluff. there was no blitzing or bluffing. it was death by a thousand cuts or steamboats.

Both of these were answered but you guys don't like the answers. 1) Moore is a 3rd and long player because he can't/won't play the run and the Cowboys have this Murray guy who is pretty good. At no point were the Cowboys in third and long. 2) We do blitz, the blitzers don't get home. The assumption of the "pressure" people is that blitzing means pressure. With our shitty backers, it doesn't. It generally just leads to more holes.
there was not a single blitz by the giants on that last drive. and while murray is a threat, the cowboys were more likely going to throw in that last drive with the game on the line, limited time on the clock and the need to march down the field. i don't think the cowboys were going to change their pass/run ratio just because moore was in the game at that stage.
But TC did.....  
Doomster : 11/28/2014 9:17 am : link
He thought they would have balance out there in the last drive, because that's the way he does it...
That photo is perfect..  
EricJ (formerly Tyleraimee) : 11/28/2014 9:59 am : link
yeah Kiwi and Rolle sitting there protecting a dump off or a QB run and why when the Cowboys clearly need to go down field and they also need to stop the clock.

So, you basically have two guys doing NOTHING. It is like we are playing with 9 on the field at that point.

You see JPP there who is unable to run over a guy who weighs at least 50 lbs less than he does. Does he lift weights? Has he been taught ANY kind of moves since he has been on the team? Can apply those two questions to others on that line too.
Can give leeway to lack of sacks, but  
Jimmy Googs : 11/28/2014 10:00 am : link
cannot give any excuse to not put pressure on a QB to throw any earlier than 6-7 seconds.

It was like our guys were going up against the great wall of China.

Absolutely zero reason to give JPP anything more than good/decent contract. Knowing some moron team (can you hear me Oakland?) will give him more, expect him to leave.

Kiwi is so done it has become embarrassing watching him try to get pressure. At least Ayers has the motor, but obvious other shortcomings. Does D Moore even play because he blends in so much like the others I can't even tell.

To sit here in November and wonder how/where the Giants will find 2 new Def Ends, 2 new LBs (one that can bring a pass rush), least 1-2 more Offensive Lineman, a TE and Safety in the off-season seems a daunting task...

RE: That photo is perfect..  
Giants4246 : 11/28/2014 11:37 am : link
In comment 12004348 EricJ (formerly Tyleraimee) said:
Quote:
yeah Kiwi and Rolle sitting there protecting a dump off or a QB run and why when the Cowboys clearly need to go down field and they also need to stop the clock.

So, you basically have two guys doing NOTHING. It is like we are playing with 9 on the field at that point.

You see JPP there who is unable to run over a guy who weighs at least 50 lbs less than he does. Does he lift weights? Has he been taught ANY kind of moves since he has been on the team? Can apply those two questions to others on that line too.


Thats exactly the point i was trying to make earlier in the thread when i questioned exactly what the fuck those 2 are doing on that play. The cowboys had to go 80 yards and score a TD, they weren't looking to have romo or murray run with the ball.
This group isn't a good blitzing unit at all  
JonC : 11/28/2014 11:40 am : link
they don't consistently even beat the man in front of them, one-on-one all that often. Talent-deficient at DE, across the board at LB, and currently at CB and S with the injuries factored in.

Throw in PF's frequent tone-deaf gameplans and in-game calls, and you've got mediocrity personified.

The good news is this is more evidence it's time for big changes on defense, PF being replaced included.
and the DTs have been a big disappointment this season, aside from  
JonC : 11/28/2014 11:41 am : link
Hankins, and he looks gassed.
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