If you were Reese

Fair or not, this team isn't going to part ways with him and probably not for a long time. At worst, he might have to part with Ross, but even that's probably doubtful.

Hopefully whatever HC candidate he backs and whatever QB he ties to the franchise to when he gets his crack(s) work out better than the moves that have helped lead to one of the worst rosters in the NFL, or we could be in deep shit for a long time.

and he would also point to injuries. Finally, he will say look I drafted Beckham

Mara would never do that. If he felt Reese had to defend himself in that manner, he'd fire him before making him audition like that.


But for the sake of this thread, if I was Reese I would throw Coughlin in the bus.


Coughlin is the guy who kept Matt Dodge before he cost us a playoff spot
Coughlin was the guy who kept Quinn on the team
Coughlin is the guy who kept Perry
etc
etc

How much of an impact do Coughlin or Chris Mara have on Reese's personnel decisions? How much input does the coaching staff have on the roster?

Was Reese the final say on keeping guys like Snee and Diehl a year too long? On not ponying up the money for Martellus Bennett in lieu of inexperienced draft picks?

Depending on the answers to these questions, he might have a reasonable defense of his recent performance. Combine that with unusually high losses to injury (including flukes like Chad Jones and David Wilson) and possibly throwing the coaching staff under the bus for not doing more with what he's given them, and you might have a defense for the recent troubles.

You're pro-Fewell now.

And Coughlin wasn't allegedly the guy who forced Matt Dodge; that was, from some sources, Reese/the FO really wanting him to make it, given that they spent a draft pick on him.

but it does seem very strange that these coaches cannot get output from these players. I realize that some players just are not that good but these guys look unprepared and make really bad mistakes, almost like they are just wandering through the motions of a pre-planned scheme. Several players have pointed this out, and even players from the past have called it out (Shockey, Tiki, Toomer) so you do have those that have the balls to speak out.

The really bad thing is that if the Giants have picked bad players then how do you really know without changing the coaching to find that out? A part of me finds it odd that all of these players are bad, can the organization be that incompetent?

Or do you just simply flush it all away and start over? Then there are the contracts. It is easier to send head coach and staff to the exit door. Probably a good time for TC to help the organization by retiring early and let Reese take a crack at this with a new coaching staff. We are largely at bottom now and he has the opportunity to get some new youthful ideas and players to take the team into the future. They really need an innovator from the college ranks and avoid some of these NFL retreads. Giants need the equivalent of a Jimmy Johnson during the Cowboys rebuild era to rebuild the quality that this team no longer possesses. Nothing about this team is quality and has not been for quite some time.

there with Reese for every move. He won't have to defend any thing. If you think he hasn't, you haven't been paying attention.

And his brother is the head of player evaluation.

In comment 12009492 Riggies said:

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You're pro-Fewell now. And Coughlin wasn't allegedly the guy who forced Matt Dodge; that was, from some sources, Reese/the FO really wanting him to make it, given that they spent a draft pick on him.

i dont remember reading that. please provide evidence.

Dodge was a failed experiment from the get go. He ddint fail in week 1, he consistently failed and Tom enabled him to keep failing.

it is disingenuous to assert otherwise. Everyone knew at some point if he kept kicking that it would eventually cost us a game, but Coughlin ignored all the warning signs.

In comment 12009507 Rflairr said:

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And his brother is the head of player evaluation.

That is a big problem too. Taking me back to the 70s when the Mara's were too involved in talent evaluation

But he's not a moron. Any football fan watching these games can tell that the majority of our players aren't any good. That isn't the coaches fault. It's all on Reese. If Reese is retained, I fear we are in big trouble. It would be interesting to see Maras justification.

and give TC his job.

How you treat guys now affects who you can get in the future. You can fire the GM or a coach off two bad seasons like this and the general decline we're seeing, but there's a difference between a firing and a public flogging. If you want to get the best available guys, you have to make your job look attractive. You're already in a very tough media market, with competition in your own stadium, and the Tri-state Area has a high cost of living and high taxes.

Balancing that out: The Giants are known as a class organization with good ownership. That good reputation is an asset, but it's a fragile one.

If management really did "Fire everyone now" as some have called for, that asset would be squandered. Top coaches and executives around the league would look at that and say "These guys won you two Super Bowls and you humiliate them like that? Huh. Maybe I should meet with Nebraska after all."

Also: Reese didn't hire Coughlin and probably isn't allowed to fire him. It's not an enviable situation for a GM in that respect. If Reese gets fired without ever getting to hire a coach, that will give other potential GMs -- or their lawyers and agents -- pause. People notice stuff like that.

I'd resign before I was fired! What he's done to the defence is a complete disaster!

In comment 12009524 Bold Ruler said:

Quote:

But he's not a moron. Any football fan watching these games can tell that the majority of our players aren't any good. That isn't the coaches fault. It's all on Reese. If Reese is retained, I fear we are in big trouble. It would be interesting to see Maras justification.

Did you really see today's game and think to yourself 'well, Jacksonville's just more talented than we are'?

Continuity rather than change is usually the norm and Reese probably will survive. I don't think it is as much of a give as some. There is a thin line between stability and stagnation. John Mara saw what his fathers unswerving loyalty cost the organization. 20 years of lousy football. I think he will be wary of making that same mistake

just mentioned time for TC to retire for the rebuild, also part with Eli. Pretty damning for smart guys that are careful about their comments.

if he has too

Ross makes picks 2-7

In comment 12009573 Paulie Walnuts said:

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if he has too Ross makes picks 2-7

good point. and outside the first round, our picks have been godawful.

In comment 12009573 Paulie Walnuts said:

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if he has too Ross makes picks 2-7

How much influence does TC and coaching team have on these picks? I see him at the Combine, in stands with his field glasses and watch so it can't just be the folks above him.

In comment 12009528 mdc1 said:

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and give TC his job.

This would be a very smart move. Coughlin is the one who made this team great not Reese. A novice GM who was a questionable hire in the first place.

...that Coughlin's time has passed. Its time for new blood. He is the past, and its time to look to the future. It can't get any worse at this point. Even nh wife who never watches football said today...dont they want to play anymore?

Mara didn't want to fire Coughlin. Reese got the job over Chris Mara because J. Mara didn't want to lose him and Reese was okay with Coughlin staying. Basically, he had little say over his coach and the HC gained new input which Accorsi didn't really give him. EA was very open about the situation. Chris Mara first move probably be to fire TC and rehire Jerry. I don't think front offices around the league view the Giants coaching staff in high regards.

In comment 12009539 jcn56 said:

Quote:

In comment 12009524 Bold Ruler said: Quote: But he's not a moron. Any football fan watching these games can tell that the majority of our players aren't any good. That isn't the coaches fault. It's all on Reese. If Reese is retained, I fear we are in big trouble. It would be interesting to see Maras justification. Did you really see today's game and think to yourself 'well, Jacksonville's just more talented than we are'?

They were better then us today. They are the worst team in football.

It is hard to have endless depth when you have a franchise quarterback that won two Super Bowl's and the cap Management starts with that #

Coughlin is *NOT* a GM and his time has passed.

More dignity in getting out now than a management coup with dubious probable results within the Giants organization.

Coughlin can be special consultant, GM of organizational excellence or something like that if he and everyone else is amenable.

In comment 12009616 Bold Ruler said:

Quote:

In comment 12009539 jcn56 said: Quote: In comment 12009524 Bold Ruler said: Quote: But he's not a moron. Any football fan watching these games can tell that the majority of our players aren't any good. That isn't the coaches fault. It's all on Reese. If Reese is retained, I fear we are in big trouble. It would be interesting to see Maras justification. Did you really see today's game and think to yourself 'well, Jacksonville's just more talented than we are'? They were better then us today. They are the worst team in football.

They played better than us today. We've got a better QB under center and better talent overall. We were outcoached today more than ever before, starting with trying to kill the clock yet again the second we took the field in the second half.

In comment 12009633 jcn56 said:

Quote:

In comment 12009616 Bold Ruler said: Quote: In comment 12009539 jcn56 said: Quote: In comment 12009524 Bold Ruler said: Quote: But he's not a moron. Any football fan watching these games can tell that the majority of our players aren't any good. That isn't the coaches fault. It's all on Reese. If Reese is retained, I fear we are in big trouble. It would be interesting to see Maras justification. Did you really see today's game and think to yourself 'well, Jacksonville's just more talented than we are'? They were better then us today. They are the worst team in football. They played better than us today. We've got a better QB under center and better talent overall. We were outcoached today more than ever before, starting with trying to kill the clock yet again the second we took the field in the second half.

10000000000000000000% agreed

over...get Mara's son out of the front office.
Get rid of the Jpp of GM's and get a new head coach.
If the UCLA qb slips to 5-6 who knows.

resign.
And Tell JM to get rid of CMara and MRoss.
'But will you still give me a good reference?'.

In comment 12009528 mdc1 said:

Quote:

and give TC his job.

I could live with that long enough to see if it could work.He had total control in Jacksonville and built that franchise from the ground up.He is at least as qualified as Reese was when he was hired.

His time hasn't passed,the talent has,Unfortunately you need more than Eli & Odell.

In comment 12009703 jpat54 said:

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His time hasn't passed,the talent has,Unfortunately you need more than Eli & Odell.

Touche'

After the SB season, the team was 6-2 and blew a 10pt 4th qtr lead to Pitts. Team was 7-3 and lost 4th qtr lead to Was. Finished 9-7 but missed playoffs. began rebuilding by getting rid of Canty, Osi, Bernard, Bradshaw, Boley

2013:

Played majority of season with 3rd C, 3rd RG, and lost top 4 RB for most of season. Continue with rebuilding by getting rid of Tuck, Baas, Snee, Deihl, Webster, Boothe, Ross, Thomas

Lose franchise WR to injury and never recovered.

2014: Draft Beckham, Richburg, Williams & Kennard, who have all played significant time

Brought in FA help in Schwartz, Thurmond, McClain, Jennings, DRC, Ayers, Bowman

Change over offensive scheme with new OC

QB is not in decline. Developed No 1 WR, developed a TE. Lost Cruz, and Wilson retirement

Injuries really robbed us of Nicks, and thus having to use draft assets to replace.

In defense of OL: Drafted a 1,2,2,4,4,5,7. Depth was upgraded with young veterans in Jerry and Walton (both 3rd rd).

Despite record games w/AZ, Dal, Dal, SF, Sea were all 4th qtr games

Mara: What changes for 2015

What about Head Coach - could keep due to OC/QB development. If new, must have similar philosophy with changes

New DC - paramount, New ST coach paramount, New OL coach

Strengthen interior OL - Richburg needs to be C, Walton b/u. Schwartz need to be RG. Sign vet G and draft top OL in round 2. Get a pure speed WR as a 4th WR. RB depth

Defense: Resign JPP, Thurmond, Ayers. Get more speed at LB and draft a DE. Redo Rolle or move on

Team not far off

Looking at our last 2 losses, we had the lead at half time. Then the opposing coaches make half time adjustments and our great coach goes into a conservative mode and we fall apart. A few wks ago TC stated our DC is doing a GREAT job??

the fact is
in last years WR rich draft
he picked the best one of them all
that might be rookie of the year

that in itself will keep him as GM for Giants