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Is Beckham already a top 10 WR in football?

dep026 : 12/9/2014 12:27 pm
It's probably really early to jump to this conclusion, however the numbers cannot be ignored. Some things to considered.

1. Rookie
2. Rookie who missed first handful of games.
3. No training camp.
4. Only viable threat on his offense.

An still yet outside the Eagles game, he has pretty dominated every defense he has seen, including Seattle's defense that has been playing lights out lately. Now when you look around the league...

1. Calvin Johnson
2. Demaryius Thomas
3. Jordy Nelson
4. Antonio Brown
5. Dez Bryant
6. Julio Jones
7. AJ Green
8. TY Hilton
9. Brandon Marshall
10. Josh Gordon

Now obviously some of the guys near the top of the list are the gold standard for top WRs in the league. However when you start getting to Hilton and below, can we not consider OBJ as their caliber, if not better? Now there are other WRs to consider like Jeffrey, Evans, Sanders, Hopkins, etc.. But its amazing that after a handful of games - we already have a rookie WR in the discussion as one of the best players at his position.
Dep: may I miller your thread?  
mrvax : 12/9/2014 12:38 pm : link
I've wanted to ask here on BBI if there is any other non-QB offensive player they would trade right now for Beckham?

I'm thinking Megatron...maybe. I see this kid as something really special and I really would not want to trade him at this point. Would you?



(Thanks, Dep)
Considering that you're the one who  
Bill in UT : 12/9/2014 12:38 pm : link
started the discussion, it's not all that amazing, lol
Based solely on talent, yes.  
BLUATHRT : 12/9/2014 12:38 pm : link
Based on the fact it has only been demonstrated for a very short time, I don't think you can go there yet. He has to stay healthy and produce with consistency.
Short answer is Yes.  
SLIM : 12/9/2014 12:39 pm : link
I think by the middle of 2015, he will have proven to be worthy of top 5.
Way too early to say he is one of the 10 best WRs  
Mike from Ohio : 12/9/2014 12:39 pm : link
Over a small sample size he is playing like one of the 10 best, but you need to sustain it for a while to be considered a top 10 player IMO.

I think at the end of next year you can better assess where he ranks against the rest of the league. For right now it is just fun to watch him and think about him only getting better.
He has the potential to be but not quite yet...  
mac attack : 12/9/2014 12:40 pm : link
Like Francesa stated yesterday... Lets give it some time! The guy has played in 1 winning football game in his career so far.

My list:

1. Calvin Johnson
2. Dez Bryant
3. Antonio Brown
4. Jordy Nelson
5. Julio Jones
6. Demaryius Thomas
7. AJ Green
8. Julian Edelman
9. TY Hilton
10. Randall Cobb

on that list i'm taking him over TY Hilton  
UConn4523 : 12/9/2014 12:41 pm : link
and possibly Marshall depending on that injury consensus + his age. Another year of similar production and I can easily see him top 10.
there isn't a GM or HC in football taking  
UConn4523 : 12/9/2014 12:43 pm : link
Cobb or Edelman over Backham. Just my 2 cents, but i don't see any possible way. Edelman is likely just a guy on any team without a top tier QB. I do like Cobb but replace him with Beckham in Green Bay and I don't even want to know how that offense is supposed to be stopped.
LOL, Yeah, they are making room for his bust in the hall right now  
ZogZerg : 12/9/2014 12:45 pm : link
Why don't you have Josh Gordon on your list? He was the leading receiver in the NFL last year.

How quickly players can fade in the NFL.
Yeah  
rocco8112 : 12/9/2014 12:45 pm : link
everything has to play out. Guy looks scary good though and the potential is there to be an all timer.

Thing that excites me the most is how he grabs the ball out of the air. I mean there was the all-universe catch, but even when he makes routine plays he just snatches it.

Perfect match for Eli who will fire it in there and let his guy make a play. It is exciting to think about all the plays those two will make in the future.

It is probably premature right now to put him in the top ten of anything. Let at least one full season play out.
I don't see  
JOMO25 : 12/9/2014 12:45 pm : link
Edelman as a Top 10 guy and I think TY is view as better than he his since his QB is all world
Julian  
McNally's_Nuts : 12/9/2014 12:45 pm : link
Edelman isn't better than ODB.

Stop it.
Shit - you guys aren't seeing what I'm seeing  
mrvax : 12/9/2014 12:45 pm : link
I'm not trading Beckham right now for anyone not named Calvin Johnson.
Beckham  
rocco8112 : 12/9/2014 12:47 pm : link
also plays with Eli. While his natural talent is there he guys to start off his career with a real QB. That helps his performance.

Another thing is usually it take a a few seasons for WR's to hit their stride. That may be changing now as defensive back play is being made illegal, but for Beckham to start off so strong is a great sign and perhaps the most positive thing to come out of this season.

RE: on that list i'm taking him over TY Hilton  
dep026 : 12/9/2014 12:47 pm : link
In comment 12025701 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
and possibly Marshall depending on that injury consensus + his age. Another year of similar production and I can easily see him top 10.


I think you could be right, but ever since last years playoff's and this year, it would be tough to omit Hilton. His numbers are still really, really good. But I do think Beckham will be a beter player than him.

And I LOVE Cobb, but would still take OBJ over him. I think Cobb is the best slot WR in the game.
well Josh Gordon fucked himself  
UConn4523 : 12/9/2014 12:47 pm : link
so unless you can predict Beckham being that stupid or having a catastrophic injury, I really don't see any reason to not talk about his potential.

I will come back in a year to discuss, and I will also discuss now. That's the point of sports.
RE: LOL, Yeah, they are making room for his bust in the hall right now  
dep026 : 12/9/2014 12:48 pm : link
In comment 12025710 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
Why don't you have Josh Gordon on your list? He was the leading receiver in the NFL last year.

How quickly players can fade in the NFL.


Ummmm... I did?
I like Cobb as well  
UConn4523 : 12/9/2014 12:50 pm : link
but I have to add the GB buffer of having the best QB in the game (same for Edelman as I don't think he works in too many NFL offenses). Hilton I love, but from a size/speed/talent perspective, I'm taking Beckhman over him all day.

Man, I really hope we can get Cruz back at close to 100% and/or Cooper. If we are going to blow ass atleast give me guys like Beckham to watch each week.
dep  
ZogZerg : 12/9/2014 12:51 pm : link
Ooops. I was looking at the other list that someone posted.

Regardless, way too early to start ranking Beckham. He needs to prove it over a longer time frame AND stay healthy.
Edelman has developed  
LauderdaleMatty : 12/9/2014 12:54 pm : link
I to a very good WR but who is throwing him the ball helps.

Jeffrey and Marshall may be top 10 type talent are great and suffer a bit from Cutler's up and down play.

Kennan Allen is a stud IMO too but Beckham looks to be the real deal. Heck pre-injury Id say Cruz was just as good or better than both Hilton and Eddleman

Emanuel Samdwrs is killing  
LauderdaleMatty : 12/9/2014 12:55 pm : link
It this year too w Payton
No love for Larry Fitzgerald?  
BigBlueBull : 12/9/2014 12:56 pm : link
Putting Julian Edelman as a better NFL WR than Fitzgerald is downright comical.
.........  
BrettNYG10 : 12/9/2014 12:56 pm : link
Imagine how much better he'd be with a top ten QB like Rivers!
RE: Emanuel Samdwrs is killing  
Toth029 : 12/9/2014 12:58 pm : link
In comment 12025741 LauderdaleMatty said:
Quote:
It this year too w Payton

Beckham with Welker, D-Thomas, and Peyton? It would be pretty unfair.
OBJ  
stretch234 : 12/9/2014 1:02 pm : link
I think there are 6 who are at the top

C. Johnson, D. Thomas, AJ Green, J. Jones, D. Bryant, J. Gordon

You then have Hilton, Nelson, Sanders, Brown, Marshall

If he keep it up he will be in the group above. The top level is a tough to crack -
Brett may or may not be joking,  
GiantFilthy : 12/9/2014 1:03 pm : link
but his point is solid. Put Rivers on this team and chances are OBJ would have already eclipsed the 1,000 yard mark. Possibly by a large amount.
RE: Brett may or may not be joking,  
dep026 : 12/9/2014 1:07 pm : link
In comment 12025759 GiantFilthy said:
Quote:
but his point is solid. Put Rivers on this team and chances are OBJ would have already eclipsed the 1,000 yard mark. Possibly by a large amount.


He would have to have about 950 YAC in order to get there if Rivers was his QB.
Which he probably would,  
GiantFilthy : 12/9/2014 1:09 pm : link
due to Rivers knowing how to hit a receiver in stride.

Quote:
dep026 : 1:07 pm : link : reply
He would have to have about 950 YAC in order to get there if Rivers was his QB.
As mentioned eariler  
Stan from LA : 12/9/2014 1:39 pm : link
OBJ, RIGHT NOW, has the 7th best YPG receiving in the entire NFL.

Right now.
He's good enough  
Overseer : 12/9/2014 1:48 pm : link
that the Giants should make it a major priority to facilitate in as many ways as possible his ability to win games.

Several Ifs, but if they can patch together a decent Oline that can pass protect and set up the PA, if Cruz returns, and if they find a consistent receiving threat at TE (maybe LD, draft more likely), Beckham is going to be a superstar. Easily matching what Nicks would have been with no injuries.

They need to be aggressive getting Eli some Oline help. Otherwise 2015 is another lost year.
Maybe for this year.  
AnishPatel : 12/9/2014 1:55 pm : link
If we are talking in general, then no. Way too early. Let's see how he does his sophmore season, once teams have all these games to go over, and scout. If he can produce at an equally high level and not drop off, then sure, he can move even higher.

Right now, we are seeing great things, but we saw great things from JPP too. Let's see how OBJ does in year 2. I am curious to see how teams prepare against him next year. Also, want to see OBJ year 2, and with more reps, and healthy hamstring.
I would respond this way  
BSIMatt : 12/9/2014 1:59 pm : link
I don't think there are ten wide receivers playing at a higher level than Odell Beckham right now. I think that's a fair and accurate statement.
weren't we primarily targeting Randle  
SHO'NUFF : 12/9/2014 2:00 pm : link
vs. Philly? ughhh
This reminds me of the threads of  
GMANinDC : 12/9/2014 2:01 pm : link
who would anyone take over Eli..
RE: He has the potential to be but not quite yet...  
BSIMatt : 12/9/2014 2:07 pm : link
In comment 12025700 mac attack said:
Quote:
Like Francesa stated yesterday... Lets give it some time! The guy has played in 1 winning football game in his career so far.

My list:

1. Calvin Johnson
2. Dez Bryant
3. Antonio Brown
4. Jordy Nelson
5. Julio Jones
6. Demaryius Thomas
7. AJ Green
8. Julian Edelman
9. TY Hilton
10. Randall Cobb


The winning football game argument can be an decent argument if a player is compiling garbage time stats in meaningless blowout losses. Otherwise it is irrelevant, Beckham's play has been one of the reasons the Giants have had opportunities to win games the last several weeks. Take him off the team and then try to visualize what the Giants offense would look like...it's terrifying.
RE: Considering that you're the one who  
steve in ky : 12/9/2014 2:09 pm : link
In comment 12025693 Bill in UT said:
Quote:
started the discussion, it's not all that amazing, lol

LOL
RE: This reminds me of the threads of  
Stan from LA : 12/9/2014 2:10 pm : link
In comment 12025890 GMANinDC said:
Quote:
who would anyone take over Eli..


And 2 Super Bowl MVP's later...
RE: Maybe for this year.  
gmen9892 : 12/9/2014 2:13 pm : link
In comment 12025876 AnishPatel said:
Quote:
If we are talking in general, then no. Way too early. Let's see how he does his sophmore season, once teams have all these games to go over, and scout. If he can produce at an equally high level and not drop off, then sure, he can move even higher.

Right now, we are seeing great things, but we saw great things from JPP too. Let's see how OBJ does in year 2. I am curious to see how teams prepare against him next year. Also, want to see OBJ year 2, and with more reps, and healthy hamstring.


I think this is a different case than JPP, who was considered raw coming out of college. OBJ was considered a polished route runner coming out of school and seems to already have all the tools to succeed. Sky is the limit with this kid by the sounds of his work ethic and wanting to become great.
yep  
GMANinDC : 12/9/2014 2:13 pm : link
and most of thee threads started after the second SB..
No one is a top ten anything after nine games in the NFL.  
Riggies : 12/9/2014 2:13 pm : link
I understand why people are being so quick on this, with him in general, given how little hope/good there is with the rest of the team, but it's still okay to slow down a bit too.
Julian Edelman  
5J : 12/9/2014 2:15 pm : link
i am thinking that every time I watch a patriots game it seems like he drops a lot of passes. i just look and he's got 7 drops. the league leader has 9
and just for fun  
5J : 12/9/2014 2:17 pm : link
the WR with the most receptions without a drop is emanuel sanders. 122 targets. 86 catches. 0 drops
All of this Beckham stuff is getting way over the top  
joe48 : 12/9/2014 2:17 pm : link
Who really cares about this. He is a very good player and glad we have him but let's hope he stays healthy and helps us win some games. We need Cruz back next year and to restock this team with some football players if we are going to compete. All thses records and rankings don't count for anything.
RE: RE: Maybe for this year.  
AnishPatel : 12/9/2014 2:26 pm : link
In comment 12025926 gmen9892 said:
Quote:
In comment 12025876 AnishPatel said:


Quote:


If we are talking in general, then no. Way too early. Let's see how he does his sophmore season, once teams have all these games to go over, and scout. If he can produce at an equally high level and not drop off, then sure, he can move even higher.

Right now, we are seeing great things, but we saw great things from JPP too. Let's see how OBJ does in year 2. I am curious to see how teams prepare against him next year. Also, want to see OBJ year 2, and with more reps, and healthy hamstring.



I think this is a different case than JPP, who was considered raw coming out of college. OBJ was considered a polished route runner coming out of school and seems to already have all the tools to succeed. Sky is the limit with this kid by the sounds of his work ethic and wanting to become great.


Yeah he was raw, and then 2011, did very well. Exceeded expectations. After that injury hit, and he never really got back to that form.

Either way, I am talking more about how teams would have more tape to defend. So now OBJ, would need to hone his game, to respond. So for JPP that would be developing more moves to beat his offensive line player. Perhaps progressing mentally in terms of understanding what the OL is trying to do.

For OBJ, it may be understanding coverages, and specific techniques of Cbs. It may be getting of man press coverage even better.

So it will be interesting to see him year 2. If he can be productive again, I will be even more impressed than I am this year. So far, he has done a hell of a job.
Just check your  
stoneman : 12/9/2014 2:33 pm : link
Fantasy guide next year - that will slot him.
top 32, easy.  
mattlawson : 12/9/2014 3:11 pm : link
;)

i notice you dont have percy harvin up there. ODB could become what Percy Harvin dangles but never delivers for his teams. In a way ODB already is better.
While he can be a superstar for years to come  
Gman11 : 12/9/2014 3:34 pm : link
I can't really get excited about the future. Football has so many injuries that you just can't count on guys having a long productive career. If they do, then it's a godsend, but the ACL was not built for the NFL.
If I had to pick the cover  
Headhunter : 12/9/2014 3:35 pm : link
of Next Year's Madden....................
RE: RE: Emanuel Samdwrs is killing  
LauderdaleMatty : 12/9/2014 3:36 pm : link
In comment 12025747 Toth029 said:
Quote:
In comment 12025741 LauderdaleMatty said:


Quote:


It this year too w Payton


Beckham with Welker, D-Thomas, and Peyton? It would be pretty unfair.


Of course. But that doesn't man Sanders isn't a very good to great player. .Nor did I say he was better than OBJ. More on who might be a top 10 type WR. And I'd rate him over Edelman and Hilton too IMO.

we're arguing about definitions  
chris r : 12/9/2014 3:43 pm : link
do you mean has he been a top 10 WR this year (discounting games missed)?

Is he one of the 10 most talented WRs?

Is he likely to be a top 10 WR going forward?
I think he's likely to be a top 10 WR next year  
chris r : 12/9/2014 3:46 pm : link
i.e. he has top 10 talent and a good enough QB to take advantage of it.

What's been amazing about him this year is how he's produce so efficiently (his catch/target ratio is one of the best among top WRs) with no threat across from him.
At his age  
Headhunter : 12/9/2014 3:51 pm : link
there is no one on that list that I would trade him for
Let me dispute your #4  
ImaGiant86 : 12/9/2014 3:58 pm : link
by saying just as easily someone could say player A is shut down because he is in fact his offense's only weapon, thus allowing the defense to focus on them.
Whose better, OBL or Victor Cruz?  
WideRight : 12/9/2014 4:00 pm : link
Sort of forgot about him, eh?
Who is  
Headhunter : 12/9/2014 4:01 pm : link
OBL?
I like Cruz, but even before the injury, there really isn't a  
Riggies : 12/9/2014 4:12 pm : link
comparison between him and OBJ, this year.

People constantly used the idea of coverage being so focused on him as to why Cruz was dropping passes, not getting open, or only catching an inefficient 55% of his targets, but Beckham, already, draws generally the same or more focus and has none of those problems -- he's catching a terrific 72% of his targets, tied for third best in the NFL.
ODB, he's knocking on the door  
giantgiantfan : 12/9/2014 4:37 pm : link
next year he's busting it down.
RE: While he can be a superstar for years to come  
UConn4523 : 12/9/2014 4:41 pm : link
In comment 12026214 Gman11 said:
Quote:
I can't really get excited about the future. Football has so many injuries that you just can't count on guys having a long productive career. If they do, then it's a godsend, but the ACL was not built for the NFL.


That's such a miserable way to look at the game. No one wants to see injuries. They do happen though, and often to great players. That shouldn't stop you from being excited for his career as a Giant.
Beckham  
Chaka : 12/9/2014 4:49 pm : link
has been one of the best PLAYERS in the league

i'm not saying he has scaled that height permanently, but fingers crossed, maybe he has

RE: At his age  
Stan from LA : 12/9/2014 4:49 pm : link
In comment 12026263 Headhunter said:
Quote:
there is no one on that list that I would trade him for


Yup.

The only negative for OBJ coming out of college was that he was short at 5'11". But everything else(athleticism, speed, quickness, intensity, hands, competitiveness) was off the charts. Looks like he's made up for the lack of height...
Playing with OBJ was like playing with LT  
Stan from LA : 12/9/2014 4:51 pm : link
It's like having an extra player on the field since the other team has to account for him with extra guys. And even then, they still make plays. Hard to find guys like that.
The only one on that list is  
Headhunter : 12/9/2014 4:52 pm : link
AJ Green, he is a beast and is relatively young. I still prefer OBJ
OBJ's catching radius  
Headhunter : 12/9/2014 4:53 pm : link
has to be that of someone 6'4 or 6'5
RE: Shit - you guys aren't seeing what I'm seeing  
Great White Ghost : 12/9/2014 5:17 pm : link
In comment 12025715 mrvax said:
Quote:
I'm not trading Beckham right now for anyone not named Calvin Johnson.
So what is is that Johnson brings to the table that outweighs the fact you have yo pay him out the ass ( while Beckham makes peanuts on a rookie contract)and we'll get 7 less years from him, seeing as Beckham is 7 years younger? You'd rather have Johnson, really? Guess you think we are ready to win it all soon.I'll take the 7 years younger and many times cheaper Beckham, thank you.
How about we give it another year  
GMANinDC : 12/9/2014 5:24 pm : link
when other teams defenses have tape on him before we put him in the top 10??

We had Nicks in the top 10 after his first year also..
the saddest part  
giantfanboy : 12/9/2014 5:31 pm : link
cruz and beckham were on the field barely a half of football

imagine what a tandem we would have if cruz did not get hurt
He has to be in  
Bradshaw #44 : 12/9/2014 7:58 pm : link
the discussion....
there are no top 10 WR in football anymore  
RasputinPrime : 12/9/2014 8:58 pm : link
because the rules have made it too easy for just about anyone to put up numbers.
RE: RE: Shit - you guys aren't seeing what I'm seeing  
mrvax : 12/9/2014 9:27 pm : link
In comment 12026458 Great White Ghost said:
Quote:
So what is is that Johnson brings to the table that outweighs the fact you have yo pay him out the ass ( while Beckham makes peanuts on a rookie contract)and we'll get 7 less years from him, seeing as Beckham is 7 years younger? You'd rather have Johnson, really? Guess you think we are ready to win it all soon.I'll take the 7 years younger and many times cheaper Beckham, thank you.


He's the only guy I'd consider. I like a lot about Beckham so maybe I hang onto him too. It's just crazy we have such a player that we can actually talk about not trading him for any other non-QB offensive player and be serious. This is F-ing great. Fantastic draft pick.

I'm glad they didn't listen to my Aaron Donald choice.
Close, but needs another dominant year  
dpinzow : 12/9/2014 10:08 pm : link
to get in that class for sure
I'm not trading Beckham  
GiantJohn : 12/10/2014 4:49 am : link
For anybody right now. He stays healthy for next 5 years we are all going to enjoy watching this...
If healthy  
Headhunter : 12/10/2014 5:21 am : link
we get to view over the next few years an offense that will never see 8 in the box daring us to beat them through the air.
RE: While he can be a superstar for years to come  
Sonic Youth : 12/10/2014 6:00 am : link
In comment 12026214 Gman11 said:
Quote:
I can't really get excited about the future. Football has so many injuries that you just can't count on guys having a long productive career. If they do, then it's a godsend, but the ACL was not built for the NFL.

Man, if OBJ doesn't get you excited for the future, you need to lighten up.

If he doesn't get you pumped, nobody will. Just give up trying to muster up excitement over anything in football. man, another bad post by gman11
...  
SanFranGiantsFan : 12/10/2014 6:30 am : link
Yeah, if watching Beckham doesn't excite you, what's the point of watching football? The dude is freaking electric.
RE: RE: While he can be a superstar for years to come  
Gman11 : 12/10/2014 8:26 am : link
In comment 12027097 Sonic Youth said:
Quote:
In comment 12026214 Gman11 said:


Quote:


I can't really get excited about the future. Football has so many injuries that you just can't count on guys having a long productive career. If they do, then it's a godsend, but the ACL was not built for the NFL.


Man, if OBJ doesn't get you excited for the future, you need to lighten up.

If he doesn't get you pumped, nobody will. Just give up trying to muster up excitement over anything in football. man, another bad post by gman11


What's the difference between that and people saying, "If he stays healthy?" I enjoy watching him play, but I also enjoy watching Cruz play. Look at what happened to him. Steve Smith had a Pro-Bowl year and look at what happened.

I'll bet Houston was excited about having Clowney and Watt together. Now he's having microfracture surgery and I would think that his future is in doubt.

So, you can get all giddy about him in the future. I am guarded because I know what happens to people in this league. Injuries aren't only a part of the game. They are too much of a part of the game.
beckham is  
Les in TO : 12/10/2014 8:30 am : link
probably in the 7-10 range at the moment.
Cruz is going to enjoy being on the field with OBJ  
Ira : 12/10/2014 9:23 am : link
next season.
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