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NFT: Heyman: Mets & Rockies quiety working on Tulowitzki deal

CromartiesKid21 : 12/19/2014 9:19 am
Quote:
CBS Sports' Jon Heyman reports that the Mets and Rockies "have been quietly discussing" a potential Troy Tulowitzki trade for weeks.
He adds that pitching prospect Noah Syndergaard "is said to be the centerpiece of discussions" of the package that would head to the Rockies. However, FOX Sports' Ken Rosenthal says the two teams have talked all offseason but no traction has been gained. A source told him he thinks the chances of the two sides completing a deal are "5-10 percent."


Makes sense as Sundergaard was rumored to be available earlier during the winter meetings. Pending on the additional pieces & if Rockies pick up some of the tab Mets might have their ticket selling centerpiece.
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Moron  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 3:51 pm : link
you said

" 1.) TDA and Flores are your 7th and 8th hitters so I don't believe you are "counting" on them to carry the team or anything. They also offer huge offensive potential, were huge prospects, and have already experienced "some" major league success in their first seasons. For a rebuilding team what else to you propose?"

and I responded saying Wilmer was never really a "huge" prospect. Why would I have to touch on TDA in order to make such a statement? If you think someone who peaked at #47, 5 years ago based on his bonus and was unranked since 2011 was a "huge" prospect I don't know what to tell you. He's never been viewed as a big time overall prospect due to his glove. Whether that view is right or wrong is besides the point.
RE: Zgiants  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 3:52 pm : link
In comment 12054386 deboGIANTS said:
Quote:
you got to relax bro.. DMM was not agressive at all


I truly was not trying to fight with him, on my life.
This  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 3:53 pm : link
has nothing to do with Wilmer Flores ability to be a good player, rather the idea he was viewed as a "huge" prospect. For all I know he'll be Fonzie 2.0 and a star. Prospect sites are great but they aren't always right.
I attacked you on a personal level?  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 3:53 pm : link
Lol. When? By asking if you were having a bad day at the office or problems with the girlfriend?? Haha. You are such a fucking pussy. Attacking you personally would be calling you a fat fuck loser 90 percent of your life and relying on baseball and arguing people behind a computer board to gain respect and how pathetic that is. That's an attack. Something I have never done.
RE: Zgiants  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 3:55 pm : link
In comment 12054386 deboGIANTS said:
Quote:
you got to relax bro.. DMM was not agressive at all


Its the constant "Not trying to get into a fight with Zgiants BUT" every day? And who immediately started with name calling and the suck a fat dicks?? DMM's not aggressive? Since when??? Holy shit.
RE: I attacked you on a personal level?  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 3:57 pm : link
In comment 12054392 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Lol. When? By asking if you were having a bad day at the office or problems with the girlfriend?? Haha. You are such a fucking pussy. Attacking you personally would be calling you a fat fuck loser 90 percent of your life and relying on baseball and arguing people behind a computer board to gain respect and how pathetic that is. That's an attack. Something I have never done.


6 feet 178 pounds my friend. Though I was 268 7/2013 so you were almost right. You are a dickhead. Somehow I "fight" with Arc and others but with you it becomes a personal thing. You must be a real joy to deal with in person. Talk about immature, I never have once gone after you on a personal level. Insecure much?
I never have either...  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 3:58 pm : link
but you repeatedly say I do when I ask you if you are having a bad day at the office??? Fucking sensitive much??
and you have no problem calling me a fucking moron  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 3:59 pm : link
and telling me to suck a dick, but suddenly everything's not ok when I ask if you are having girlfriend issues? Get a fucking life.
I  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:00 pm : link
actually specifically remember LONG conversations on here with PJ, HH, Arc etc where we would discuss scouts opinions that Flores bat was interesting but his position was a major issue. In fact, pre-2013 there was some talk of him being a platoon partner for Ike Davis. Nobody was calling Wilmer untouchable at this time last year like HUGE prospect Noah Syndergaard. In fact, unlike Thor or Wheeler or even Matz I don't recall us reading a single rumor in the entire time he's been with the Mets regarding another team "insisting" on Wilmer as part of a deal. He's never been a "huge" prospect but your ridiculously over the top sensitive reaction has me almost scared that I'm dealing with a lunatic here.
RE: and you have no problem calling me a fucking moron  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:01 pm : link
In comment 12054400 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
and telling me to suck a dick, but suddenly everything's not ok when I ask if you are having girlfriend issues? Get a fucking life.


Have I ever talked about your personal life, family, looks etc? Yes or no?
ZGiants  
MookGiants : 12/26/2014 4:01 pm : link
doesn't need to relax, neither does DMM. Their battles are some of the best on BBI, need them to continue
I  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:02 pm : link
can honestly say in all my years on BBI I have never done such a thing to anyone on this site and never would. This is supposed to be "fun" even if it can be heated at times. No need to take it beyond that. There was one ex-poster/Mets fan who made me feel uncomfortable at times and even with him I never got personal.
RE: RE: and you have no problem calling me a fucking moron  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:03 pm : link
In comment 12054404 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 12054400 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


and telling me to suck a dick, but suddenly everything's not ok when I ask if you are having girlfriend issues? Get a fucking life.



Have I ever talked about your personal life, family, looks etc? Yes or no?


Have I?? Yes or No? Asking you if you are having a rough day at the office is personal?? You must be the biggest fucking vagina in the history of BBI.
RE: I  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:04 pm : link
In comment 12054402 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
actually specifically remember LONG conversations on here with PJ, HH, Arc etc where we would discuss scouts opinions that Flores bat was interesting but his position was a major issue. In fact, pre-2013 there was some talk of him being a platoon partner for Ike Davis. Nobody was calling Wilmer untouchable at this time last year like HUGE prospect Noah Syndergaard. In fact, unlike Thor or Wheeler or even Matz I don't recall us reading a single rumor in the entire time he's been with the Mets regarding another team "insisting" on Wilmer as part of a deal. He's never been a "huge" prospect but your ridiculously over the top sensitive reaction has me almost scared that I'm dealing with a lunatic here.


Again. Bravo. As usual a long winded paragraph regarding nothing. Thanks for that though.
You  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:05 pm : link
didn't make reference to my girlfriend and just now call me a fat loser? I need my eyes checked I guess.
He may have gotten the fat part  
kmed : 12/26/2014 4:06 pm : link
wrong, but....
RE: He may have gotten the fat part  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:07 pm : link
In comment 12054415 kmed said:
Quote:
wrong, but....


Hey I'm not the one who sold out everyone who relied on him for fantasy domination. What a dick.
"Dan  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:08 pm : link
the real reason I am leaving BBI is not because of my new job, it's because you are too awesome" Kmed
If only you  
kmed : 12/26/2014 4:08 pm : link
knew!
Zgiants  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:09 pm : link
lets just agree to fight all year. It's too much effort trying to get along with you. Deal?
RE: You  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:10 pm : link
In comment 12054414 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
didn't make reference to my girlfriend and just now call me a fat loser? I need my eyes checked I guess.


Yes you clearly fucking do. Ive never met you and have no idea what you look like. I gave you an example of what an attack would look like you fucking imbecile.

As to your gf I absolutely admit I asked you if you were having a bad day at the office or at home with the gf one day when you were being extra pricky one day. If that's an attack, then I am indeed wrong. Holy shit you are sensitive little twat.
It's a long, hopefully  
Headhunter : 12/26/2014 4:10 pm : link
A fun season. Getting into stuff like this on a personal level will dive one of you away. That would be stupid
RE: Zgiants  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:11 pm : link
In comment 12054421 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
lets just agree to fight all year. It's too much effort trying to get along with you. Deal?


lol. My god dude.
I  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:11 pm : link
have to go eat pie and get yelled at by my boss and girlfriend at the same time. Happy Holidays, let's fight again tomorrow! yes!
Wilmer and Puello  
pjcas18 : 12/26/2014 4:11 pm : link
were signed as IFA's within weeks of each other and they were two of the more prominent international free agent signings. Joffrey Marte signed the same off-season. Marte might have even been the highest rated of the three at one point. He got a 500k signing bonus. Flores got 750k. Puello got 400k I believe.

I miss those days.

But...when you read back to the scouting reports announcing the signings and even after Flores excelled in the appalachian league as like a 16 year old no one expected him to remain at SS.

I hope he sticks there, and there is reason to believe he could be ok, but to say there aren't questions is optimistic and I wouldn't argue with someone who classifies him as a project.
RE: It's a long, hopefully  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:12 pm : link
In comment 12054426 Headhunter said:
Quote:
A fun season. Getting into stuff like this on a personal level will dive one of you away. That would be stupid


I'm actually really excited for the season that's the silly part. I just don't see the need to be "personal". We are discussing the Mets... in the offseason... regarding prospect status! lol I think Wilmer will hit, we will see if he can handle SS... just not more Tejada. Please.
RE: Wilmer and Puello  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:13 pm : link
In comment 12054431 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
were signed as IFA's within weeks of each other and they were two of the more prominent international free agent signings. Joffrey Marte signed the same off-season. Marte might have even been the highest rated of the three at one point. He got a 500k signing bonus. Flores got 750k. Puello got 400k I believe.

I miss those days.

But...when you read back to the scouting reports announcing the signings and even after Flores excelled in the appalachian league as like a 16 year old no one expected him to remain at SS.

I hope he sticks there, and there is reason to believe he could be ok, but to say there aren't questions is optimistic and I wouldn't argue with someone who classifies him as a project.


PJ,
I know you are consistently interested in Puello and I posted Kiley McDaniel's answer about him but I couldn't really understand his answer.
I totally am fine with not trying  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:13 pm : link
to get personal(never knew I did). Ill try to not try to ask how Dan's days are going anymore. You never know what riot might issue!!
Here it is again  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:14 pm : link
Kiley, your write-up on Puello didn’t mention the sporadic (at best) playing time he received in 2014 to the benefit of Quad A types like Brandon Allen and Anthony Seratelli. This has been a bit of a mystery amongst Mets prospect watchers; did any of the sources you talked to shed some light on that? Did Puello piss off Wally? Fall out of favor with the FO? Pour sugar in Paul Depodesta’s gas tank?


Quote:
Kiley McDaniel:
It wasn’t a bunch of glowing recommendations, more like a stern father of a kid that hasn’t met his potential, ending every sentence by throwing his hands up in the air and saying “anything could still happen, who knows?”

(The second part implies the Mets were frustrated... behaviorally? We hadn't really heard anything about that. The first part implies the scouting reports weren't good... the whole answer seems disjointed/confusing).
RE: RE: It's a long, hopefully  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:15 pm : link
In comment 12054434 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 12054426 Headhunter said:


Quote:


A fun season. Getting into stuff like this on a personal level will dive one of you away. That would be stupid



I'm actually really excited for the season that's the silly part. I just don't see the need to be "personal". We are discussing the Mets... in the offseason... regarding prospect status! lol I think Wilmer will hit, we will see if he can handle SS... just not more Tejada. Please.


We are all in agreement with that and all of us are just about on the same page with everything. The Mets are going to be good this year. No point arguing on stupid shit like is Flores a top 100 prospect or a top 50 for no reason whatsoever. You knew what my overall point was and that was that both of these guys should be getting an opportunity both with what they did last year and what they've done in the minors. At least in terms of what other options are available.
I  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:17 pm : link
never wanted Didi (though for the price I would have taken him), I like Miller but sounds like the asking price is sky high. I really don't want Asdrubal Cabrera for one year and "wait till next year". Desmond would be pretty sweet in the off-season if Flores can't handle it.
Let's back up here and get off topic  
Shecky : 12/26/2014 4:17 pm : link
DMMM - did you really lose 90 lbs in a year and a half? Holy crap, congrats. Takes a lot of effort and discipline - share your secrets if you don't mind. Seriously, never knew that - congrats.
Puello  
pjcas18 : 12/26/2014 4:19 pm : link
is one of the more surprising non-stories I can remember in Mets world in a long time.

Why wouldn't every beat writer continually ask the FO and even Wally about it?

He came off a potential career-path-altering 2013 - and then biogenesis fallout, and to come back to persona non grata status. He was losing at-bats to Cory Vaughn who the Mets waived (and then for some reason re-signed).

I expected some reason to be given and never got it, and that answer like you say doesn't help provide one.
RE: Let's back up here and get off topic  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:21 pm : link
In comment 12054445 Shecky said:
Quote:
DMMM - did you really lose 90 lbs in a year and a half? Holy crap, congrats. Takes a lot of effort and discipline - share your secrets if you don't mind. Seriously, never knew that - congrats.


Shecky,
Yeah. Thanks. Quit drinking soda 100% (replaced it with seltzer and water), avoid pizza and pasta (though once in a while I have it), replaced "bad" snacks with veggies and nuts and I go to the gym 3-4 times a week. I had no miracle diet, I don't count calories or anything. I just try and be smart.
Puello  
Shecky : 12/26/2014 4:21 pm : link
In all his years in theMets system, have you ever heard one good comment about him by anyone inside or outside the organization? He is insanely toolsy, and could see him somewhat blossoming somewhere else. But he is the crazy talented kid in little league that no one wanted on their team.

Look at Nimmo as the perfect contrast. He doesn't eventually want to be a Met. He is already preparing for starting and being successful one day. I don't think Puello is capable if ever thinking that far ahead...
Other than Tulo and Profar  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:21 pm : link
(and both would have to check out physically in spring training or into the season) for a package around Syndergaard I can't think of anybody I'd rather have at SS over Flores. This constant pissing and moaning about him every day however is getting so tired. The team is pretty much set. It has been for a while. There are really no holes on this team. We need to find a taker for Gee and add some minor league depth ala Dice-K/Lannan types. That's about it.
RE: Puello  
DanMetroMan : 12/26/2014 4:22 pm : link
In comment 12054448 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
is one of the more surprising non-stories I can remember in Mets world in a long time.

Why wouldn't every beat writer continually ask the FO and even Wally about it?

He came off a potential career-path-altering 2013 - and then biogenesis fallout, and to come back to persona non grata status. He was losing at-bats to Cory Vaughn who the Mets waived (and then for some reason re-signed).

I expected some reason to be given and never got it, and that answer like you say doesn't help provide one.


kiley is actually a fantastic prospect writer too. I just don't understand his answer at all.
RE: Puello  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:27 pm : link
In comment 12054455 Shecky said:
Quote:
In all his years in theMets system, have you ever heard one good comment about him by anyone inside or outside the organization? He is insanely toolsy, and could see him somewhat blossoming somewhere else. But he is the crazy talented kid in little league that no one wanted on their team.

Look at Nimmo as the perfect contrast. He doesn't eventually want to be a Met. He is already preparing for starting and being successful one day. I don't think Puello is capable if ever thinking that far ahead...


The thing that eats at me regarding Puello is that we don't know if his 2013 was steroid related or not. The Biogenesis plant closed down the year prior and I highly doubt he was roiding out in 2013 with a spotlight on him knowing a suspension was about to be handed down. He played inconsistently last year but he still mashed lefties. He's is also playing very well in the winter leagues. He's out of options and its going to hurt if he turns into the player he was in 2013 with somebody else.
ZG  
pjcas18 : 12/26/2014 4:29 pm : link
I think you're overstating the pissing and moaning about Flores.

Maybe one person on the thread pissed or moaned about him.

I think 100% of the Mets fans on here prefer Flores all season long with no adjustment as the starter over Tejada and anyone else on the roster.

That being said many people would support a trade for Tulo.

I don't consider that pissing and moaning.

When the GM sums up his support for Flores at SS as "I wouldn't panic if Flores was the opening day SS" I'd say the fans have reacted to the prospect of that happening very well.
Sandy actually did  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:29 pm : link
mention Puello as somebody who would be in the mix in spring training although I see no purpose of him making the team with Mayberry Jr. I guess if Puello was on fire in spring training, we COULD send Cambell back to AAA although I don't think that would be ideal.
RE: ZG  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:32 pm : link
In comment 12054463 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
I think you're overstating the pissing and moaning about Flores.

Maybe one person on the thread pissed or moaned about him.

I think 100% of the Mets fans on here prefer Flores all season long with no adjustment as the starter over Tejada and anyone else on the roster.

That being said many people would support a trade for Tulo.

I don't consider that pissing and moaning.

When the GM sums up his support for Flores at SS as "I wouldn't panic if Flores was the opening day SS" I'd say the fans have reacted to the prospect of that happening very well.


Well I agree that YOU feel that way but I don't think you are speaking for everyone here. Also the constant comments about needing more upgrades mostly all derive around SS. There is nowhere else really to make a move. The entire roster is set. And its the best roster we've had since 2008!
Puello in Binghamton  
pjcas18 : 12/26/2014 4:33 pm : link
(not Vegas) had a .950 OPS.

Granderson and Cuddyer block him, and he's still young enough you want him to play every day, but I'd take a long look at him in spring training.

However, he's 24 around opening day and he's probably player #38 or #39 on the 40-man so at some point they need to figure out he's part of the solution going forward or showcase him for a trade.

Sitting him in Vegas - behind the likes of Cory Vaughn is stupid IMO.
the rotation might be the best  
pjcas18 : 12/26/2014 4:36 pm : link
since the mid-80's, but the lineup still isn't as good as 2009.

Reyes, Wright, Beltran, Delgado, Pagan, Sheffield, it was just a better lineup.

injuries killed that lineup.
RE: Puello in Binghamton  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:37 pm : link
In comment 12054473 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
(not Vegas) had a .950 OPS.

Granderson and Cuddyer block him, and he's still young enough you want him to play every day, but I'd take a long look at him in spring training.

However, he's 24 around opening day and he's probably player #38 or #39 on the 40-man so at some point they need to figure out he's part of the solution going forward or showcase him for a trade.

Sitting him in Vegas - behind the likes of Cory Vaughn is stupid IMO.


PJ. He is out of options. He either has to make the 25 man or he's gone.
RE: the rotation might be the best  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:38 pm : link
In comment 12054477 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
since the mid-80's, but the lineup still isn't as good as 2009.

Reyes, Wright, Beltran, Delgado, Pagan, Sheffield, it was just a better lineup.

injuries killed that lineup.


No of course not but that lineup was still living off one of the best lineups in the history of the Mets in that 2006-2008 era. Those days are gone and we don't need anywhere near that lineup in todays MLB. We have a very solid lineup for todays game.
RE: RE: Puello in Binghamton  
pjcas18 : 12/26/2014 4:39 pm : link
In comment 12054478 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
In comment 12054473 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


(not Vegas) had a .950 OPS.

Granderson and Cuddyer block him, and he's still young enough you want him to play every day, but I'd take a long look at him in spring training.

However, he's 24 around opening day and he's probably player #38 or #39 on the 40-man so at some point they need to figure out he's part of the solution going forward or showcase him for a trade.

Sitting him in Vegas - behind the likes of Cory Vaughn is stupid IMO.



PJ. He is out of options. He either has to make the 25 man or he's gone.


I read that, but I also read he cannot refuse an outright assignment. What does that mean?
He'd have to be exposed  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 4:41 pm : link
to waivers which means anyone could claim him(and I believe somebody would). If he's not claimed we could outright him to AAA and he can't refuse.
I always miss the dmm/zg fights  
Eric on Li : 12/26/2014 4:59 pm : link
but hopefully this year they won't be the most entertaining part of baseball season.
Mets will have a top 5 NL lineup and this is why....  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 5:06 pm : link
And I think this is conservative not pie in the sky/best case scenario.
Career average offensive years from Duda,Granderson,Wright,Cuddyer, and Murphy. League average(100 wRC+) years from TDA and Lagares, and 10% below average from Flores(90 wRC+).
Odds are some guys deviate from career norms, such as Wright(under), Duda(over), so they offset. Good chance Travis is better, perhaps significantly, than average(over) while lagares may slip a little(under, his BABIP was likely unsustainable in '14).
So in aggregate, a team with a wRC+ in the 96-97 range, good for 5th in the league.The obvious key is Wright not being a 100 wRC+ hitter again-we'll need 115, minimum, but we should be able to get that. The other less-noted key is the swing in production from the tandem of CY/EYJ to Cudyer/Mayberry. Huge swing expected there, accounting for several points of team wRC+.
and btw....somebody else brought this up in another thread...Regarding Cuddyer...  
ZGiants98 : 12/26/2014 5:09 pm : link
1. Justin Upton, .812 OPS over past 3 seasons, .753 road, 15 million $ in 2015, then a free agent, high K Totals against, package cost recent 1st rounder Max Fried among others...
2. Wil Myers, .724 OPS so far, .748 on the road, coming off wrist injury, high K totals against, Package cost last year's 1st rounder Trea Turner among several others.
3. Matt Kemp, .842 OPS so far, .869 on the road (including 1.042 in over 100 AB at Coors), package included 2010 1st rounder Yasmani Grandal among others. He'll cost the Padres 15 million in 2015 and the 4 years after that - while hoping his body holds up.
4. Cuddyer has the lowest K rate among these 4, the highest OPS (.887) total, the 2nd highest road OPS (.795 with most road games in extreme pitcher parks), will cost the 2nd lowest money total over the next two years and also only cost one young prospect instead of 3+ and the lowest 1st rounder of the 4...
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