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Eagles hot for Mariota?

DanMetroMan : 1/20/2015 1:07 pm
Eagles coach Chip Kelly frequently gushes publicly about his former Oregon Marcus Mariota, and according to one report, Kelly is already plotting privately to acquire Mariota in the NFL draft.

The Eagles have the 20th overall pick in the draft, and Mariota isn’t expected to be available by that point, but NJ.com reports that the team is already committed to trying to move up in the draft to acquire Mariota.

“From No. 20, it’s certainly not going to be easy,” an unnamed source told NJ.com. “It’s probably going to take moving up twice to do it. There’s going to be some wheeling and dealing involved. Can it happen? I don’t know. But they’re going to try.”
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was thinking of this as hypothetical  
Old Dirty : 1/20/2015 1:39 pm : link
If he slipped down to #9, what would it take for you, as the Giants GM, to trade him to the Eagles?

I would try and get this year's 1st (#20), 2nd, 4th, and next year's 1st. I didn't look at any chart or anything. I am trying to remember what we gave up to get Eli, essentially moving up from #4 to #1 pick.
RE: was thinking of this as hypothetical  
nicky43 : 1/20/2015 1:50 pm : link
In comment 12102673 Old Dirty said:
Quote:
If he slipped down to #9, what would it take for you, as the Giants GM, to trade him to the Eagles?

I would try and get this year's 1st (#20), 2nd, 4th, and next year's 1st. I didn't look at any chart or anything. I am trying to remember what we gave up to get Eli, essentially moving up from #4 to #1 pick.


Fun question. Haven't got a clue but how about a 1st this year AND next, and a second or...a first this year AND next with a 4th and 5th.
I'll take...  
Chris in Philly : 1/20/2015 1:53 pm : link
A first this year, a first next year, and Fletcher Cox.
RE: I said QB friendly, not buttfumbler friendly  
Big Blue '56 : 1/20/2015 1:54 pm : link
In comment 12102670 jcn56 said:
Quote:
:)


:)
Chris,  
Big Blue '56 : 1/20/2015 1:56 pm : link
from your understanding, was Kelly ever into Foles, especially after his 2013..CK's a hard guy for me to read
RE: Chris,  
Chris in Philly : 1/20/2015 1:58 pm : link
In comment 12102722 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
from your understanding, was Kelly ever into Foles, especially after his 2013..CK's a hard guy for me to read


I never got the sense Kelly liked Foles very much. He was always blowing smoke up Sanchez's ass while never going out of his way to talk about Foles playing well. He definitely wants a guy who can run better than Foles. And everyone should see that first Foles year was a mirage.
If you have a relatively young QB to trade, it's not that crazy.  
BeerFridge : 1/20/2015 2:04 pm : link
The Eagles do. But it would still take a lot to move up that far even including Foles. He's only on a cheap contract for one more year.

But if you don't love Mariota and need a QB, it's not crazy to take a windfall of picks and give Foles a one year audition. It's probably better than giving out a 50 Million deal to a Qb you don't think has the goods.
The rookie cap  
Randy in CT : 1/20/2015 2:08 pm : link
will prevent that huge of a risk in drafting Mariotta.
Not Happening  
ZogZerg : 1/20/2015 2:19 pm : link
Cost way too much for that move.
I can say  
chopperhatch : 1/20/2015 2:31 pm : link
that the Eagles fanbase isn't really sold on Foles after the first half of the year. He didn't look all that great when he was healthy and lived kind of a charmed life last year. His pocket presence seemed to take a dive this year.

That said, moving up from 20 to the top 5 (more likely top 2) would take a boatload. Maybe Foles another player and several picks?
RE: I can see this Happening  
moespree : 1/20/2015 2:35 pm : link
In comment 12102615 nyk33 said:
Quote:
If the Bucs don't love Mariota, and think Foles is a legit good starter. A trade of Foles and the # 20 pick in the draft I would Imagine it could happen


Bucs would be insane to essentially swap draft picks and trade for Foles. They have the number 1 pick. Moving down 20 spots and adding Foles is not an adequate trade. If the Eagles want to offer Foles and their 20 to move up to number 1, I'd want Foles, Eagles first round, second round and 2016 first round. And according to the draft pick value trade chart most of these teams use, even that's not enough.
So What Would It Cost The Eagles To Trade Up To #2  
Trainmaster : 1/20/2015 2:42 pm : link
Using Walter's Football Draft trade value as a guide

The #2 overall pick is 2600 points.

The entire Eagles draft (assuming they have picks 1 - 7 at #20 each round) is only worth about 1500 points.

Aren't future years picks "discounted"? At #20 the Eagles first round is worth 850 pts, and second round is 380.

Would the Eagles 2016 first round pick be only worth around 400 points?

Sounds like the Eagles would need to be parting with multiple, high value players (McCoy?; Maclin?) to get enough value for the #2 overall.
Please  
SoZKillA : 1/20/2015 2:45 pm : link
Do it.

He's the Hawiian Rg3
Just to correct myself  
moespree : 1/20/2015 2:46 pm : link
They have the number 2 pick, I said number 1. The rest applies though. Foles and the 20 for number 2 is never going to get it done.
RE: I would never stop laughing if the Eagles traded up for him  
Josh in the City : 1/20/2015 2:47 pm : link
In comment 12102605 Go Terps said:
Quote:
I can't think someone as smart as Chip Kelly would do something so stupid.


Kelley knows the guy very well. If he thinks he can run his system and is a good fit then who are you to say it's stupid. Having the right QB is worth everything it would take to trade up to get him (case in point: Eli).
RE: The rookie cap  
BeerFridge : 1/20/2015 2:50 pm : link
In comment 12102743 Randy in CT said:
Quote:
will prevent that huge of a risk in drafting Mariotta.


Fair point.
RE: So What Would It Cost The Eagles To Trade Up To #2  
Chris in Philly : 1/20/2015 2:54 pm : link
In comment 12102805 Trainmaster said:
Quote:
Using Walter's Football Draft trade value as a guide

The #2 overall pick is 2600 points.

The entire Eagles draft (assuming they have picks 1 - 7 at #20 each round) is only worth about 1500 points.

Aren't future years picks "discounted"? At #20 the Eagles first round is worth 850 pts, and second round is 380.

Would the Eagles 2016 first round pick be only worth around 400 points?

Sounds like the Eagles would need to be parting with multiple, high value players (McCoy?; Maclin?) to get enough value for the #2 overall.


Maclin is a free agent and mccoy makes too much for a team to take on. The player that makes sense is fletcher cox.
MM going to the Eagles is my biggest fear.  
Diver_Down : 1/20/2015 2:55 pm : link
Chip views the draft as a crapshoot so he doesn't value picks in shear numbers but rather getting a known commodity. With the power move in their front office, puts Chip in charge of player acquisition. He answers to nobody except the owner. With MM running Chip's offense, that shitstain of an organization might actually compete for a SuperBowl. As a Giants fan, whether Big Blue does well in any given season, we always can take solace with the fact that they have never hoisted the Lombardi.
According to the NFL Draft "Points System" (see attached)  
Victor in CT : 1/20/2015 3:02 pm : link
The Giants Round 1 #9 pick is worth 1350 points. To get equal value, if the Eagles gave up their Rd 1 # 20 (850 pts), Rd 2 # 52 (380) and Rd 3 # 84 (170) that would be slightly above value at 1400 points.

How much realistically a team could expect to squeeze them I have no idea. I would think the Giants would want a "division rival premium"
Draft Pick Points System - ( New Window )
Mariota is not falling beyond the first 2 picks  
dpinzow : 1/20/2015 3:04 pm : link
...
seems  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/20/2015 3:06 pm : link
a bit odd to me...

If you believe Chip Kelly was possibly on the way out (I don't know if that is true or not), now the franchise might commit to a QB that the head coach desperately wants, but is the head coach still thinking about leaving? (This is why it's not a good idea not to give coaches too much say in personnel).
I don't believe it  
KWALL2 : 1/20/2015 3:06 pm : link
I have a bigger fear.

The Eagles will draft Baylor QB Petty in round 2. This is the prize QB of this draft especially if he lands with the Eagles.

He's got the best throwing motion in the draft. He can snap out the ball on a line. While he doesn't run like Mariota, he is athletic and can make plays with his feet. As a thrower? He's much more dangerous.
In terms of future picks  
moespree : 1/20/2015 3:07 pm : link
Everyone seems to do something different using that chart. I've read Jimmy Johnson used to find the average where the team he's trading with has picked over the previous 3 seasons and used that as the base point for future years when adding the numbers. I don't know if that works anymore though, because back then he was like the only guy using the chart (since he created it) and wound up stealing first and second round picks from the following season in every draft before people caught on to the math behind it.
haven't  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/20/2015 3:07 pm : link
seen a ton of Mariota, but I don't see it with him.
RE: seems  
Chris in Philly : 1/20/2015 3:08 pm : link
In comment 12102834 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
a bit odd to me...

If you believe Chip Kelly was possibly on the way out (I don't know if that is true or not), now the franchise might commit to a QB that the head coach desperately wants, but is the head coach still thinking about leaving? (This is why it's not a good idea not to give coaches too much say in personnel).


He was on his way out because he hated bean counter in chief Howie Roseman. Now Chip won the power play and he's in charge. That is the reason it is more possible now than before.
RE: haven't  
Victor in CT : 1/20/2015 3:10 pm : link
In comment 12102839 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
seen a ton of Mariota, but I don't see it with him.


me neither
RE: Just to correct myself  
eli4life : 1/20/2015 3:11 pm : link
In comment 12102810 moespree said:
Quote:
They have the number 2 pick, I said number 1. The rest applies though. Foles and the 20 for number 2 is never going to get it done.


Tampa has number 1
Chris  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/20/2015 3:13 pm : link
So that was the main issue? Has there been any speculation that he simply wants to get back to college football?
This would bite the Eagles in the ASS hugely  
SomeFan : 1/20/2015 3:14 pm : link
I hope they pull it off for some crazy amount of compensation. This is one situation where a player (Foles) will haunt haunt them and not like Matt Dodge haunted us. Actually, Dodge haunted us when he was on teh team not after he left the team. Dodge was ass-backwards in all things.
RE: The rookie cap  
jcn56 : 1/20/2015 3:19 pm : link
In comment 12102743 Randy in CT said:
Quote:
will prevent that huge of a risk in drafting Mariotta.


Granted, it's not the risk it presented before they changed the rookie salary structure, but having a #1 overall and not coming away with a game changing player is a huge downside. Even worse when you consider it's #1 overall and the trade value is as high as they come.
Very  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/20/2015 3:20 pm : link
strange that we keep losing to this team. They aren't that good.
I hope Chip is dumb enough to do this  
BlackLight : 1/20/2015 3:21 pm : link
Philly has always tended to draft pretty well. If he gives away his entire draft for one player, that'd be huge.
20 to top 2  
stoneman0000 : 1/20/2015 3:22 pm : link
They are out of their minds if they really think they can trade into the top 5. Just think what the Giants would want for #9. I would think at least 2015 1st/2nd/3rd along with 2016 1st. 20 is a huge drop from anywhere in the top 10. Foles would not garnish even a 3nd round grade at this point.
Too early  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/20/2015 3:22 pm : link
to tell, but the QB's could slide in this draft.
I would  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/20/2015 3:23 pm : link
not make the assumption that Mariota is a top 5 pick.
Either of the 2 so called top QBs are fraught with risk. Winston  
Victor in CT : 1/20/2015 3:25 pm : link
for off the field issues and Mariota for on the field issues. It's not a year to be thrilled with the top pick if you need a QB. There is no Andrew Luck here.
Incidentally, in the Eli trade with SD, the Giants traded 3099  
Victor in CT : 1/20/2015 3:28 pm : link
total points back to SD for the 3000 points # 1 overall pick to get Eli. 1800 for their #4 overall (Rivers), 1200 for 2005 Rd1 #12 overall, 65 for 3004 Rd 3 # 65 overall and 34 for 2005 Round 5 # 144 overall.
Yup - its early  
stoneman0000 : 1/20/2015 3:32 pm : link
but I still think they both go in the top ten since there are only 2 before the big drop off.
RE: Chris  
Chris in Philly : 1/20/2015 3:41 pm : link
In comment 12102854 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
So that was the main issue? Has there been any speculation that he simply wants to get back to college football?


He wanted control. He got it. He can get any college job he wants and most pro jobs too. He had a lot of leverage and Lurie through his little buddy under the bus and gave Chip the keys.
For Reference  
I wanna be Torbor, sucka : 1/20/2015 3:45 pm : link
The Falcons traded their 1st (27 overall), 2nd, and 4th in 2011, and their 1st and 4th in 2012 to move up to the 7th pick and get Julio Jones.

27 to 6 is a big jump.

The biggest hurdle for the Eagles could be that this story is leaking now. The top 2 teams have every incentive to drool over Mariota, to try and bait an offer they could not refuse, because I agree that Mariota does not knock my socks off as a prospect. That said, QBs don't tend to fall in the lead up to the draft.
RE: Very  
Greg from LI : 1/20/2015 3:55 pm : link
In comment 12102863 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
strange that we keep losing to this team. They aren't that good.


Tell me about it. Particularly in the first game this year, when the Giants made their crappy defense look like tthe '85 Bears. That was just weird.
RE: was thinking of this as hypothetical  
81_Great_Dane : 1/20/2015 5:10 pm : link
In comment 12102673 Old Dirty said:
Quote:
If he slipped down to #9, what would it take for you, as the Giants GM, to trade him to the Eagles?
If he slipped to #9, and the Eagles were to phone, JR should slam down the phone and call the Browns.

A more likely scenario is the Eagles offer Foles and picks to Tampa and/or Tennessee and/or Jets.
RE: Very  
jcn56 : 1/20/2015 5:16 pm : link
In comment 12102863 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
strange that we keep losing to this team. They aren't that good.


Honestly, those are the games where I feel we're not getting enough out of our talent. I get that we have plenty of weak spots on the team, and a couple of units are seriously below where they need to be, but there was no excuse for that first disaster against Philly. They looked unprepared and got their asses handed to them.
Read that he supposedly likes Hundley  
jeff57 : 1/20/2015 5:20 pm : link
and might take him at 20.
RE: haven't  
AcidTest : 1/20/2015 5:31 pm : link
In comment 12102839 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
seen a ton of Mariota, but I don't see it with him.


He's good, but also helped by the fact that it's a QB driven league, and this is a really weak year for QBs. As far as him sliding out of the top five, I don't think he will, just because there is a huge drop off after him and Winston. But nothing in the draft surprises me.

We are entering the season of disinformation. The idea that the Eagles would try and move all the way up to get Mariota just because he and Kelly are from Oregon seems like a smokescreen. But I'd love it if Mariota fell to us, and we could trade back for a ton of picks.
RE: RE: was thinking of this as hypothetical  
JayBinQueens : 1/20/2015 5:38 pm : link
In comment 12103051 81_Great_Dane said:
Quote:
In comment 12102673 Old Dirty said:


Quote:


If he slipped down to #9, what would it take for you, as the Giants GM, to trade him to the Eagles?

If he slipped to #9, and the Eagles were to phone, JR should slam down the phone and call the Browns.

A more likely scenario is the Eagles offer Foles and picks to Tampa and/or Tennessee and/or Jets.


I can see the Jets trading down with a package of Foles and picks, but not all the way to 20
Mariota  
Percy : 1/20/2015 5:43 pm : link
Is attractive. Strong arm, accurate, quick release, very few INTs, steady under pressure, quick on his feet and in his brain. Maybe Eli Model # 2. Mariota might be worth whatever it is the Eagles have to part with to get him. Hard to pass up at 9 (unthinkable for him to make it that far). After all, Eli at 34 has some wear on the tires. Maybe one has to plan for him to stop in, say, 2017.
Think it will be  
TMS : 1/20/2015 5:53 pm : link
big trouble for the NFC East if they get him. Kelly is a hell of a HC and offensive mind. Look what he has done already. They would be highly competitive instantly in our division next year. Thats the only piece they need to be favorites to win it. Hate that team do not want to see this happen, no matter what they give up.
RE: Very  
mattlawson : 1/20/2015 10:12 pm : link
In comment 12102863 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
strange that we keep losing to this team. They aren't that good.


i know, its mental. that game in philly this year, from the first snap you could tell the Giants were not mentally prepared for the game. they did not believe they could win.
RE: Read that he supposedly likes Hundley  
mattlawson : 1/20/2015 10:13 pm : link
In comment 12103061 jeff57 said:
Quote:
and might take him at 20.


Todd Hundley to Philly? Nah....
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