saying that if there is not conclusive evidence they demand an apology.
he also mentioned the science of how footballs react to temperature, etc.
said the discourse has been driven by the league leaking information, etc. (excuse if i get anything wrong, i'm typing as I listen).
boy, now we'll see what the league has.
There hasn't been an official statment yet from the NFL.
People are now bactkracking...11 balls were under inflated by 1 lb, Jackson never notified anyone.
The officials have stated the balls were checked 2 1/2 hrs before the game and never left their side until 10 minutes before game time.
BB and Brady has said they have no idea why the balls were deflated other than to say neither of them doctored the balls in any way or told anyone to do it.
But somehow everyone wants to rush to judgement and tarnish people's reputation without any official statement, and what looks like faulty leaks from people with an axe to grind. OK
if the Pats are guilty it's a debacle
The League hasn't talked to Brady yet, although they have spoken to more than 40 people already. This seems to indicate they think he's complicit. But who knows. They've said nothing.
I still am convinced the air was let out intentionally and it wasn't the first time.
I think Brady likes an underinflated ball, just like Aaron Rodgers and other QB's have stated they like an over inflated ball.
Sometimes the refs add air, or take some air out if the ball doesn't feel right. I don't think this is an exact science, and I'm sure each officiating crew handles it a little differently. Some officialls have already stated they don't measure each ball.
This "Deflatgate"...is definitely the work of someone with an axe to grind. The Pats are the most successful franchise in football for the past 15-20 years. There are a lot of haters and envious people out there. This is a contrived story (witchunt) with the main intent to bad mouth the Pats brand along with the coach and QB.
I'm not ready to go there until the NFL has provided documentation without a doubt that they intentionally cheated.
There hasn't been an official statment yet from the NFL.
People are now bactkracking...11 balls were under inflated by 1 lb, Jackson never notified anyone.
The officials have stated the balls were checked 2 1/2 hrs before the game and never left their side until 10 minutes before game time.
BB and Brady has said they have no idea why the balls were deflated other than to say neither of them doctored the balls in any way or told anyone to do it.
But somehow everyone wants to rush to judgement and tarnish people's reputation without any official statement, and what looks like faulty leaks from people with an axe to grind. OK
You wouldn't happen to be a Patriot fan would you
I must say, they there is an air of confidence starting to ooze out of Brady, Beli, and now Kraft about this issue. They must have really done their internal homework - even beyond the science fair Prof. Beli gave Saturday - and feel they've got this locked down. Because right now they are basically telling Goodell and the NFL they don't need any more river cards to make their hand...
It's already been leaked the attendant brought all 24 balls into a bathroom.
The NFL is going to conclude that no relationship exists between the attendant and the Patriots. The attendant will be fired and that will be the end of this controversy.
And we will all continue to watch the NFL.
Link - ( New Window )
What other stand can they take though? No one that actually plays or coaches is going to come forward about this, so it ends up getting dumped on some low level employee who did this on his own. They already know they will be punished, so this is just a preliminary shot for PR reasons.
Now if the NFL puts out undeniable proof that the Pats cheated, then have at it. I think that Kraft, BB and TB are telling the truth.
This place would explode
I think all of their draft picks for this year should be taken away and put into a lottery with all the teams in there to see who gets what lol.
Now if the NFL puts out undeniable proof that the Pats cheated, then have at it. I think that Kraft, BB and TB are telling the truth.
What more proof do you need outside of 11 of their balls being drastically underinflated?
Quote:
Not a fan of the Patriots, I've been cheering for the Giants for longer than you have been born. My kids were all raised Giants fans. Just for 1 minute think about how you would feel if they tried to tarnish the Giants rep with this BS.
Now if the NFL puts out undeniable proof that the Pats cheated, then have at it. I think that Kraft, BB and TB are telling the truth.
What more proof do you need outside of 11 of their balls being drastically underinflated?
Drastically? The hyperbole surrounding this has really gotten silly. This is the single most overblown non-scandal I have ever seen...
Once the NFL has provided us with their findings then we can each come to our own conclusions about the Pats organization.
Tom Brady has always struck me as a class act, kind of the same way I feel about Eli. The rush to judgement on this has been ridiculous. If the media has done this to the Giants, many on here would be pissed beyond belief.
Smells like guilt to me.
Quote:
not 1 but 11 of them, are infractions of the rules. People can belittle the infraction all they want but it IS illegal under NFL rules. I'd have no problem with it if it were 1 or 2 balls, but 11 of 12 is on purpose.
Ok, so what should happen? Forfeit, cancel the Super Bowl. Suspensions. Banishment, what? Not easy is it. Unless you've been in a position of determining penalties for infractions of rules you really don't know. It's easy to do it from your couch. Doing it for real is a lot different.
I'm not doing anything from my couch. I'm simply stating they broke the rules, clearly. I have no idea what the penalty should be, not my job to either. I'm guessing the penalty won't fit the crime since it won't come before the SB.
The severity of the crime itself has never been the point.
Quote:
is that the severity of the "crime" is being overstated to the point of lunacy...
The severity of the crime itself has never been the point.
It is entirely the point...
Stephen A. Smiths argument this morning though was laughable to me. He stated why would Bill do all the nasty stuff he does to the balls in practice just to go and have the balls under inflated during the game. ITS OBVIOUS!!!
The same reason you have players put on weight when they train and then put them in the lightest uniform possible during the game. You practice with a tough ball and then you get a easier ball to play with and you go out and play like a super team. And from the turnover report compared to the rest of the NFL as of 2007 they play like a super team.
#Wheretheressmoketheresfiredoesntapplytothepats
Benson can fume all he wants, and I think the league went way overboard on the punishment doled out to the Saints. But intentionally seeking to hurt the opposition is much graver than possibly manipulating ball pressure.
Quote:
In comment 12111405 Chris in Philly said:
Quote:
is that the severity of the "crime" is being overstated to the point of lunacy...
The severity of the crime itself has never been the point.
It is entirely the point...
No, it's not. I've not found a single person who's seriously trying to pretend that New England beat Indy because the footballs were underinflated.
So no, it's never been about how under-inflated footballs affected the outcome of one game. It's about deterring New England and other teams from screwing around with the rules in the future.
If the league finds out this was done with institutional approval, and they DON'T drop the hammer, then it's an implicit greenlight to all the other teams to find little ways around the rules that nobody really pays attention to, so they can have their own advantages. And suddenly, 32 NFL teams are in a race to the bottom - each trying to outdo the other with little cheat codes. I don't want to watch that league.
This is not to mention that the two "infractions" are in other galaxies...
Quote:
In comment 12111407 BlackLight said:
Quote:
In comment 12111405 Chris in Philly said:
Quote:
is that the severity of the "crime" is being overstated to the point of lunacy...
The severity of the crime itself has never been the point.
It is entirely the point...
No, it's not. I've not found a single person who's seriously trying to pretend that New England beat Indy because the footballs were underinflated.
So no, it's never been about how under-inflated footballs affected the outcome of one game. It's about deterring New England and other teams from screwing around with the rules in the future.
If the league finds out this was done with institutional approval, and they DON'T drop the hammer, then it's an implicit greenlight to all the other teams to find little ways around the rules that nobody really pays attention to, so they can have their own advantages. And suddenly, 32 NFL teams are in a race to the bottom - each trying to outdo the other with little cheat codes. I don't want to watch that league.
And it is this level of indignation over a very minor thing is going to result in a lot of upset people. I have now seen or heard people take something along the lines of pine tar and it equate it to Pete Rose's gambling allegations, a systemic program rewarding intentional injury of opponents, and Shoeless Joe Jackson.
Be prepared to pound your shoe on the table when the Pats get a slap on the wrist...
And it is this level of indignation over a very minor thing is going to result in a lot of upset people. I have now seen or heard people take something along the lines of pine tar and it equate it to Pete Rose's gambling allegations, a systemic program rewarding intentional injury of opponents, and Shoeless Joe Jackson.
Be prepared to pound your shoe on the table when the Pats get a slap on the wrist...
I'm perfectly willing to deal with the potentially negative emotional consequences of "caring too much," but let's not pretend that this has anything to do with my point or the bigger picture.
There's nothing about granting that the NFL might not deal a heavy punishment to New England that proves they shouldn't.
If the severity of the "crime" is being overstated, that's because it involves a team that has already been caught and severely punished for cheating, and because the Patriots have an enduring reputation for underhanded behavior among all the other teams in the NFL. This isn't about people hating the poor Patriots. They are getting the scrutiny and harsh judgement that they've earned.
It is because they are the Patriots and the most successful franchise in the last 15 years. Consistently competitive and seemingly always in the playoffs. Would anyone care if this was the Raiders being accused? What of Washington? Remember they were caught trying to sneak 36 million off their cap.
Also, if Bill B. decided to coach the Giants after TC retires, who would say 'no' based only on this and the 2007 infraction?
I think the biggest reason for all the indignation is the Pats success and the fact some don't want to accept that BB is the smartest guy in the room. All that success? They MUST be cheating.
And follow the old maxim. Let the punishment fit the crime. No harm no foul.
btw Giants fan since the 1970's.
The apology demand shows he has very big balls.
For the guy who's team gets special stroking from refs because they are the current 'face of football', like the 'Boys in the 90's, SF in the 80's, the Steelers in the 70s, the Pack in the 60's, he should just let it play out.
Going on the aggressive was just as stupid as Bill The science guy Belichiks presser on Saturday, filled with faulty arguments.
the reason people are more sensitive to the Pats cheating is their history, not their winning.
- taping the Rams walk through
- spygate
- tripping by the players on the sidelines during special teams play
i think Bill is a fantastic coach. i also think he's a cheater. he's both.
heard a former NFL official on the radio last night say that HALF of the complaints to from teams complaining about other teams violating rules were about the Patriots. (i can't verify that, just passing it on). they have a reputation among other teams.
maybe their innocent this time (could be, but I doubt it). the problem is, nobody would be surprised if they were guilty.
I'm glad you said that because that is important. In fact, the Boston Herald, who jumped all over it as fact, were forced to retract that during Spygate uproar.
A disgruntled former employee, Mangini, resorted to being a tattle-tale and created a mountain out of a molehill. He's even come out since and said it was overblown. And Jimmy Johnson said he did the same thing, was never caught, and knew many other teams who did the same side practice trying to steal signals...
Quote:
The Patriots never taped walkthroughs. That allegation was retracted.
I'm glad you said that because that is important. In fact, the Boston Herald, who jumped all over it as fact, were forced to retract that during Spygate uproar.
A disgruntled former employee, Mangini, resorted to being a tattle-tale and created a mountain out of a molehill. He's even come out since and said it was overblown. And Jimmy Johnson said he did the same thing, was never caught, and knew many other teams who did the same side practice trying to steal signals...
A mountain out of a molehill? Imagine that!
Couldn't agree more. They piss me off too. One of the reasons I took such a long hiatus... ;)
I was going to post the same thing.