The latest GBN 1st Round Mock has the Giants selecting Devante Paker, WR Louisville at #9. I have posted in the past on how I think Parker is a close #2 WR to Cooper in this draft class and how selecting a WR at #9 makes sense if you think Parker fits the Giants scheme and if you think he is a game breaker. Not going to rehash all of that again.
If you look at Parker's performances this year you will see a dominant WR who was at his best in big games. He is also very good after the catch, which I think increases his value, especially to a team like Giants. At 6'2" 214lbs, with sub 4.5 speed, he seems to be everything the Giants hoped Reuben Randle would be and then some. With Cruz and Randle both legit question marks going into 2015 a player like Parker is certainly in the mix, particularly given Reese's comments about preferring playmakers over linemen.
Under this scenario, with Scherff going at 10 and Peat going at 11, you'd have to think the Giants either addressed the OL in FA or will draft one in round 2. I have always thought the Giants will address the starting RT/LG position in FA, leaving options open for the draft.
Colin, if you see this post, would be very interested in your reasoning on the latest projection. Thanks
1st Round Projection - (
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but at some point, this organization has to learn (if it hasn't been painfully obvious already) that without a solid o-line, this team isn't going anywhere. a good o-line is the key to the offense and the defense (in the sense that if the offense can control the ball, a lot less stress is placed on the defense).
What 5'8ft WRs have you seen mocked to Giants at #9? There's no WR under 6'0 in Colin's top 10 WRs.
Sorry, I don't think you use the #9 overall pick for a "just in case" scenario. That pick has to be one that you believe will be the best choice to improve your team.
You're a good fan. I think at the end of the day we should all feel that way.
It will make the RBs better.
It will make Eli better.
It will even make OBJ better.
No WR can do all that.
Go OLine in the 1st.
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With Cruz and Randle both legit question marks
Sorry, I don't think you use the #9 overall pick for a "just in case" scenario. That pick has to be one that you believe will be the best choice to improve your team.
I hear you, but I think another thing to consider is the anticipated increased use of 4 WR sets in the MacAdoo offense and the fact Randle is a FA after the season. This is actually a difficult scenario. If Randle regresses, why would the Giants want him back? If Randle's last two games are a forecast of the future and he busts out, do the Giants pay him the money he would command on the open market? In addition to playing making ability at a reasonable price (rookie wage scale) Parker gives you leverage and options.
It will make the RBs better.
It will make Eli better.
It will even make OBJ better.
No WR can do all that.
Go OLine in the 1st.
John, no doubt that OL in the 1st is a more than legit philosophy, it very well could be an OL if the brain trust believes that one of the available OL is the highest rated player on the board. History tells us that is a big hurdle to jump on the Giants draft board.
In response to your list, a WR can certainly do all those things, just in a different way.
1. Makes Cruz and Randle (and OBJ) better by making teams pay for double coverage. Parker is also a big YAC guy so if defenses are going to guard against the vertical routes (Randle and OBJ) Parker and Cruz make them pay.
2. Makes the RBs better by forcing the D to play coverage and leave 7 in the box
3. More top line targets for your QB always makes them better. Trust in playmaking ability is huge. Look at Peyton Manning and Denver.
4. As mentioned in point 1, it makes OBJ better
Does an OL do all those things "better". Sure, but perhaps in a different way is a better way to say it.
It will make the RBs better.
It will make Eli better.
It will even make OBJ better.
No WR can do all that.
Go OLine in the 1st.
If you have been paying attention to Reese, he has a history of filling holes in free agency so that in the draft he doesn't HAVE to overweight a need.
Plus, the Giants history of recent SB wins, doesn't support drafting OL high. It supports using free agency to build the line.
I expect the same. Reese has already said given the choice of adding a play maker or lineman he'll go for the play maker every time.
We don't have to go OL in the 1st round this year if the pick is a reach at #9.
We don't have to go OL in the 1st round this year if the pick is a reach at #9.
And they're addressed 33% of the WR group. They don't have to go WR in the first if that pick is a reach.
Also Reese is full of shit about BPA All GMs are. They try to marry need with ranking. Reese picks WRs every year and this team is full of holes Becuase of it.
We don't have to go OL in the 1st round this year if the pick is a reach at #9.
And you think we did a good job of it?
Of course we should never reach, need or not.
this is the kiss of death.
I must have read 100's of posts on here about how "the Giants aren't drafting a RB in the first round" in the weeks before the David Wilson pick.
Of course the owner wasn't commenting strictly on the draft was he?
No, he wasn't.
Ditto pass-rushing DE, linebacker.
If you have the choice of an elite player or a solid starter at a position of need, you take the elite player. If it's a choice of solid starter or solid starter, then you go for need. Which sounds like what will happen in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.
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in FA and the Draft.
We don't have to go OL in the 1st round this year if the pick is a reach at #9.
And you think we did a good job of it?
Of course we should never reach, need or not.
Schwartz was IRd virtually the whole year and the rookie Richburg was playing out of position.
You think we didn't attempt to make improvements in the offseason?
The LAST thing this team needs is another damn WR. They've already got a dozen of them. What they don't have is a dominant OLT or a starting Guard to go with Schwartz.
In this scenario, an OL is an absolute no brainer.
How many other injuries has Parker had? That is the most serious one he suffered, it's not like he's injury plagued.
The LAST thing this team needs is another damn WR. They've already got a dozen of them. What they don't have is a dominant OLT or a starting Guard to go with Schwartz.
In this scenario, an OL is an absolute no brainer.
YES. We don't have a single dominant OL. Haven't somce Snee before the injuries. The OL w 2 high picks in the last two years is still one of the worst. This team needs to better on both lines. How many play off wins does Atlanta have. Their OL and DL are a disaster. . It got their coach fired.
No clue why fans constantly don't understand that a) OL has a high bust rate and b) you don't have to use your high first round pick on the OL to improve it.
The Patriots have one 1st round OL on their team. Solder. Stork is a 4th round rookie.
Why not use the Pats as your example instead of Atlanta? It's not exactly like Brady's any more mobile than Eli.
The player the Giants draft needs to be worthy of the spot he is drafted in. It is a bad spot for a reach pick based on need.
I'd love to have "more toys for Eli", but you also have to realize where the playing with the toys, and having the D makes stops so the O sees the field, starts, and that's with the less sexy, less glamourous picks are made. Reese has lost sight of that and I'm not sure TC is so happy about that.
As someone above said, if the line(s) is/are addressed in FA, ok.
btw, JonC, I saw a reply long after you made it as I returned to the thread, and I think it dovetails with the gist here, when you said Reese did what he could with the $$ and FA available--but that's what happens when you shortchange your roster into a corner and leave few if any appealing options. Reese struck out in his re-making of the lines in 2014 (save and except, we hope, Richburg). At some point....
Peat's father, Todd, played six NFL seasons as a squatty guard for the Cardinals and Raiders.
"He's got everything," one scout said. "Size, the bend, the feet, the tenacity."
David Shaw:
"I don't know if there's been anybody else in our conference, in the last eight years, that is as good as Andrus Peat has been and can be. In my entire career, nine years in the NFL, the only offensive lineman that was a step above of where Andrus can be is Jonathan Ogden -- one of the best tackles to ever play," Shaw said Thursday at Pac-12 Media Days. "Besides that special, special player, he's the most talented I've ever been around.
"And he's still scratching the surface. He can be phenomenal. Hopefully we have him for two more years."
Boylhart:
Andrus has the overall athletic talent, size, lateral agility and techniques to be one of the top left tackles who can actually play Left Tackle at the next level for the team that selects him in this draft. His pass blocking techniques are excellent and his ability to mirror his opponent in this draft is one of the best. Andrus seems to take pride in his play and seems to have the mental toughness needed to be a Left Tackle for the next level. What I see when evaluating Andrus on film is the consistency he has in the use of technique with his hands and feet. That is very impressive and very unusual for any offensive tackle at any level. The value of offensive linemen will be very high in this draft no matter what position they play and Andrus will be one of those very highly valued players.
Will this be the year the stars align and the Giants finally draft the best LT they have had since Jumbo?
The LAST thing this team needs is another damn WR. They've already got a dozen of them. What they don't have is a dominant OLT or a starting Guard to go with Schwartz.
In this scenario, an OL is an absolute no brainer.
If you're going to make a fucking point, you'd be better off without the hyperbole. Where's the half dozen WR's on our roster? After Odell all we have are question marks at the position. A good way for GM's to get fired is to bank on players bouncing back from severe injury or hoping an inconsistent performer puts everything together. I wouldn't be opposed to taking a lineman, but to pigeonhole your options to say "OLT or bust" is a good way to set your team back by reaching for a player that doesn't warrant where they are picked.
There's a chance Yat
Had a bit of an underwhelming year relative to previous so that may drop him. He is also viewed as slightly developmental (as Tyron was) so that may drop him down as well.
This past year was unusual with so many receivers blossoming into standouts as rookies. Normally, a first round wideout doesn't begin making an impact until the 2nd half of their rookie seasons. Also, injuries happen in the NFL.
I really want Cooper to fall though I know he won't fall as far as #9 but if the Giants draft board has Parker at the top when their pick comes so be it.
I'd prefer veteran relief for the OL because Eli deserves as much. If the OL is shuffled as Beatty-Schwartz-Richburg-UFA-,Pugh we may have the ability to RUN and PASS.
I can see us taking Peat #1 as well. Or Scherff even. Or Collins. Or Flowers. I mean, at this point it is too early to truly tell.
Orlando Franklin and then Peat@9 and your line becomes:
2015:
Beatty-Pugh-Richburg-Schwartz-Franklin
-With Peat being coached up & ready to jump in in case of injury (Franklin can shift to Gaurd to allow Peat to play RT in case of injury to Pugh or Schwartz).
2016:
Peat-Pugh-Richburg-Schwartz-Franklin
or
Peat-Franklin-Richburg-Schwartz-Pugh
-Save roughly 7 mill in cap space by letting Beatty go.