I'm working through mione now. I was celebrating another contract extension from one of those evil giant Pharmaceutical companies and, perhaps, overdid it just a bit. It's a lesson I very occasionally have to re-learn, but fortunately this morning's lesson is terribly taxing.
Jan 31, 2015, 7:53 AM ET A person diagnosed with measles went to Penn Station this week and boarded an Amtrak train, possibly exposing fellow passengers, New York health officials said Friday.
"Anyone traveling on Amtrak train #283 from Penn Station in NYC to Albany on January 25, 2015, and who is not immune to measles or not sure of their measles immunity, should contact their primary care physician if they become ill with fever," the New York State Department of Health said in a statement.
The person who took the 1:20 p.m. train and exited in Rhinecliff, N.Y., was previously at Bard College in Dutchess County, where the diagnosis was made. continued ... - ( New Window )
..."mine" and "isn't terribly taxing." See what I mean?
LOL, not to worry I'm the crème de la crème of typos.
I almost forgot; Goober says, "Hey!"
That sprang to mind because I suddenly remember an Andy Griffith show where the County Nurse was trying to vaccinate farmers in the area against Tetanus, and the farmers (one Rafe Hollister, I believe) used some of the same arguments we hear from the anti-vaxers (i.e., "I ain't never been sick a day in my life!")
It's kind of sad, as an above comment from Rob in CT/NY alluded to, that we're revisiting some of that same thinking in our supposedly more enlightened times.
with my wife. It was MMR, but he was a year old (minus the the six and a half weeks). Horrible reaction to the vaccine...high fever...just moaned for three straight days.
No. Why was it funny "for the Times?" The comment was neither subtle, nor particularly funny (sad, perhaps, even mind-boggling). Would you not have expected the Times to print such a statement? Your readership wants to know.
Then maybe its the hangover. Congrats on the extension. Calling your business partner "evil" in jest suggests you're working on a sense of humor.
The Times isn't known for its humor. There wasn't anything more in the parentheses. When a writer debunks its subject's quote in the very same sentence, its funny. That the subject was a sad moron makes it Onion-like.
(tho does very little actual teaching) who also doesnt vax. Its a general distrust of all things institutional. And its very much a-political. Both sides have their paranoia
Dr. Andrew Wakefield should be in prison for falsifying data Â
No. Why was it funny "for the Times?" The comment was neither subtle, nor particularly funny (sad, perhaps, even mind-boggling). Would you not have expected the Times to print such a statement? Your readership wants to know.
Then maybe its the hangover. Congrats on the extension. Calling your business partner "evil" in jest suggests you're working on a sense of humor.
The Times isn't known for its humor. There wasn't anything more in the parentheses. When a writer debunks its subject's quote in the very same sentence, its funny. That the subject was a sad moron makes it Onion-like.
Actually, I have a finely-honed sense of humour, although it can be over-subtle at times. And I disagree that The Times isn't known for humour...it just isn't obvious, like the Onion.
If we examine the entire quote, we see that humour, largely in the eye of the beholder and certainly present here, isn't so much an objective as is pointing out the sad lack of cognition on the part of Ms. McDonald and, by extension, the whole anti-vax "movement."
The fact that she states a very obvious reason for getting vaccinated, not being tossed out of school, just makes the counterpoint even more effective.
“There is absolutely no reason to get the shot,” said Crystal McDonald, whose 16-year-old daughter was one of 66 students sent home from Palm Desert High School for the next two weeks because they did not have full measles immunizations.
After researching the issue and reading information from a national anti-vaccine advocacy group, Ms. McDonald said she and her husband, a chiropractor, decided to raise their four children without vaccines. She said they ate well and had never been to the doctor, and she insisted that her daughter was healthier than many classmates. But when the school sent her home with a letter, Ms. McDonald’s daughter was so concerned about missing two weeks of advanced-placement classes that she suggested simply getting a measles inoculation.
“I said, ‘No, absolutely not,’ “ Ms. McDonald said. “I said, ‘I’d rather you miss an entire semester than you get the shot.’ “
Perhaps if Ms. McDonald had a farm, she'd better understand inter-relationships and the associated risks she's laying on her children and anyone with whom they come in contact. Instead, she winds up with egg on her face.
On an Italian Court determining a direct link between the MMR and Autism Link - ( New Window )
Ludicrous.
Hey...but didn't their legal system also convict a bunch of scientists for not predicting an earthquake that killed a bunch of people? Or was that another crazy European nation?
(tho does very little actual teaching) who also doesnt vax. Its a general distrust of all things institutional. And its very much a-political. Both sides have their paranoia
My sister in law does exactly the same thing...has four kids and "homeschooled" all of them because she doesn't want anyone to tell her kids what to do. Her two older kids were vaccinated and are fine. Her two youngest ones have not been vaccinated yet her youngest has autism. Even though she recognizes that vaccination had nothing to do with the autism, she still refuses to vaccinate the two younger ones.
On an Italian Court determining a direct link between the MMR and Autism Link - ( New Window )
Ludicrous.
Hey...but didn't their legal system also convict a bunch of scientists for not predicting an earthquake that killed a bunch of people? Or was that another crazy European nation?
they're kind-hearted people and they're reasonably intelligent, but it took popping a consistent fever in the 103-104 range before they took the kid to the quack and Mom is dealing with the aftermath of Lymes Disease that went untreated for too long. And the driving force behind a lot of this locally is a chiropractor's wife who frankly acts like a bully toward other moms. She and my wife are friends but her initial affinity for her seemed to have more to do with the fact that my wife can't readily detach herself from the conversation because she is handicapped. That affinity dimmed when my wife politely but insistently rebuffed her bullshit vis a vis oils and vaccines.
RE: We have friends who insist that essential oils can cure everything... Â
they're kind-hearted people and they're reasonably intelligent, but it took popping a consistent fever in the 103-104 range before they took the kid to the quack and Mom is dealing with the aftermath of Lymes Disease that went untreated for too long. And the driving force behind a lot of this locally is a chiropractor's wife who frankly acts like a bully toward other moms. She and my wife are friends but her initial affinity for her seemed to have more to do with the fact that my wife can't readily detach herself from the conversation because she is handicapped. That affinity dimmed when my wife politely but insistently rebuffed her bullshit vis a vis oils and vaccines.
I've seen that as well. Some of these people really get into the whole Life Coaching market (in which essential oil market is a huge part of it) and basically surround themselves with others with similar mentality. It's like the worst form of peer pressure and groupthink.
My kids get all of them. But, I don't get all the hoopla about the measles vaccine. Measles are not on the same level as Ebola or Smallpox; people don’t die from the measles. Sure it’s a pain in the ass and can be avoided, but it’s not that big a deal if you get them. Most of the older generation on this site had the measles while growing up (things like mumps, measles, chickenpox were all part of growing up), and I for one don't know of a single friend or relative (or anyone else) that had any long term effects from having had the measles. And yes we have a few nut jobs on this site, but I don’t think measles had anything to do with that. If you’re worried about your kids getting the measles, then get them vaccinated. But if it worries you that this particular vaccine is dangerous, then don’t let the scare mongers lie to you to scare you into doing something that you don’t want to do.
I've done a lot of reading on the internet for my various Â
health issues and have found good information. But there is a lot of BS to go through. Essential oils are good, I use a tree tea oil toothpaste because I can't tolerate most regular toothpastes. But a fever? I was sick last week with the flu (yes I had the shot, but we all know how ineffective it was). I read an article that a fever is good and you shouldn't try to bring it down. WTF? So you have to be careful about what you read and what you actually put into practice.
My kids get all of them. But, I don't get all the hoopla about the measles vaccine. Measles are not on the same level as Ebola or Smallpox; people don’t die from the measles. Sure it’s a pain in the ass and can be avoided, but it’s not that big a deal if you get them. Most of the older generation on this site had the measles while growing up (things like mumps, measles, chickenpox were all part of growing up), and I for one don't know of a single friend or relative (or anyone else) that had any long term effects from having had the measles. And yes we have a few nut jobs on this site, but I don’t think measles had anything to do with that. If you’re worried about your kids getting the measles, then get them vaccinated. But if it worries you that this particular vaccine is dangerous, then don’t let the scare mongers lie to you to scare you into doing something that you don’t want to do.
[quote]
Measles is one of the leading causes of death among young children even though a safe and cost-effective vaccine is available.
In 2013, there were 145 700 measles deaths globally – about 400 deaths every day or 16 deaths every hour.
Measles vaccination resulted in a 75% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2013 worldwide.
In 2013, about 84% of the world's children received one dose of measles vaccine by their first birthday through routine health services – up from 73% in 2000.
During 2000-2013, measles vaccination prevented an estimated 15.6 million deaths making measles vaccine one of the best buys in public health.
Measles is a highly contagious, serious disease caused by a virus. In 1980, before widespread vaccination, measles caused an estimated 2.6 million deaths each year.
The disease remains one of the leading causes of death among young children globally, despite the availability of a safe and effective vaccine. Approximately 145 700 people died from measles in 2013 – mostly children under the age of 5.
{/quote] Link - ( New Window )
Measles is one of the leading causes of death among young children even though a safe and cost-effective vaccine is available.
In 2013, there were 145 700 measles deaths globally – about 400 deaths every day or 16 deaths every hour.
Measles vaccination resulted in a 75% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2013 worldwide.
In 2013, about 84% of the world's children received one dose of measles vaccine by their first birthday through routine health services – up from 73% in 2000.
During 2000-2013, measles vaccination prevented an estimated 15.6 million deaths making measles vaccine one of the best buys in public health.
Measles is a highly contagious, serious disease caused by a virus. In 1980, before widespread vaccination, measles caused an estimated 2.6 million deaths each year.
The disease remains one of the leading causes of death among young children globally, despite the availability of a safe and effective vaccine. Approximately 145 700 people died from measles in 2013 – mostly children under the age of 5.
Measles has been theorized as the cause for the collapse of indigenous colonies in the Americas from Europe. That's a lot of death.
Measles is highly contagious; 90% of people who come in contact with someone with measles contract it, and can last up to 2 hours in the air or on surfaces. And, while measles may not be on the level of Ebola (seriously?), it often leads to secondary illnesses that do kill.
Namely, pneumonia or bronchitis.
People that "don't get" why measles are bad benefit from about a half a century of immunizations that have led to this development.
My kids get all of them. But, I don't get all the hoopla about the measles vaccine. Measles are not on the same level as Ebola or Smallpox; people don’t die from the measles.
World Health Organization ... Updated November 2014 ...
Key facts
* Measles is one of the leading causes of death among young children even though a safe and cost-effective vaccine is available.
* In 2013, there were 145 700 measles deaths globally – about 400 deaths every day or 16 deaths every hour.
* Measles vaccination resulted in a 75% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2013 worldwide.
* In 2013, about 84% of the world's children received one dose of measles vaccine by their first birthday through routine health services – up from 73% in 2000.
* During 2000-2013, measles vaccination prevented an estimated 15.6 million deaths making measles vaccine one of the best buys in public health.
------------------------------------------
Measles is a highly contagious, serious disease caused by a virus. In 1980, before widespread vaccination, measles caused an estimated 2.6 million deaths each year.
The primary, peer-reviewed literature that drives recommendations and consensus statements is referenced. You can read it to attain a comfort level with current practice patterns.
If you choose to listen to others who claim to have read the literature, and then choose to believe them without reading it yourself, do not expect any benefit from all that work that was done.
If you chose to accept something that is promoted without any basic or clinical research supporting it, just don't pretend you know anything. And if you listen to soemone who says they know something when there is no knowledge, do not expect any benefit.
If it harms you, buyer beware.
When you compare measles to Ebola or smallpox to drive your point Â
and no one ever panicked when their kids got them like it was some kiss of death. You are leaving out one key element of the research. The death rate in developed nations with low rates of malnutrition and good healthcare is extremely low (which I think the US still qualifies as a developed nation). Everyone had them when I was growing up (I had them at 4 or 5), people weren't dying, and there was never a panic. It meant you felt bad, had red dots all over, and stayed home for five days.
Simply because no one in your enclave died from them Â
doesn't mean that it's a universal truth. It happened, even in 1980's America.
Plus, what mindset is it that simply because we suffered through an illness, future generations should as well? The benefits of medical advancement are so that future generations do not have to suffer through similar afflictions that we did.
Measles being one.
For the life of me, I can't fathom the notion that because we have developed a highly successful vaccine against a highly contagious disease, because people lived through it and "no one around me died", we have an out against vaccination.
Perhaps (and maybe just perhaps), vaccinations also benefit these mal-nourished and under-developed country? Where sanitation and other health care services are nowhere near adequate? But nah, fuck them. America.
Measles in their own right are still very dangerous to those, who are already unable to get the vaccine due to compromised immune system or are too young or have allergies to the vaccine. They rely on the herd community concept to safeguard themselves from the measles. So while a normal healthy individuals may not have too much to worry about whether they have had or haven't had the vaccines as long as they have the medical resource to treat it after the fact, not everyone is able to survive (or survive without long term effects).
But to try to use two of the most deadly diseases in human history to compare the danger of measles seems...hmmm...ridiculous? It's almost like saying living in the urban sprawls of Chicago is perfectly safe because compared to Areppo, Syria, not too many people get killed in Chicago (even though that city has one of the highest gun deaths in the nation).
Nowhere did I say that I am not against the vaccine or that because I went through it others should have to as well. My three kids have all received the vaccine, not because my wife and I were afraid of the virus, but because it is something unpleasant that my we didn’t want our kids to experience if they didn't have to. What I am against is forcing others to take the vaccine when they are afraid of it.
We homeschool and I can say that there are all types Â
We have met some people who are pretty "out there" and have all sorts of strange motivations, and yes some of those are anti many things including vaccinations. For ourselves and the families we are fiends with that homeschool we put a lot of time, effort and energy into it and it can be terrific with some real benefits. It certainly isn't for all families and not everyone is able to or is willing to put in all the time, effort and expense required. It truly takes a tremendous amount of work. And yes we have fully vaccinated our children.
Ah. So, instead of following what the experts say, we should Â
No. Why was it funny "for the Times?" The comment was neither subtle, nor particularly funny (sad, perhaps, even mind-boggling). Would you not have expected the Times to print such a statement? Your readership wants to know.
Then maybe its the hangover. Congrats on the extension. Calling your business partner "evil" in jest suggests you're working on a sense of humor.
The Times isn't known for its humor. There wasn't anything more in the parentheses. When a writer debunks its subject's quote in the very same sentence, its funny. That the subject was a sad moron makes it Onion-like.
Actually, I have a finely-honed sense of humour, although it can be over-subtle at times. And I disagree that The Times isn't known for humour...it just isn't obvious, like the Onion.
If we examine the entire quote, we see that humour, largely in the eye of the beholder and certainly present here, isn't so much an objective as is pointing out the sad lack of cognition on the part of Ms. McDonald and, by extension, the whole anti-vax "movement."
The fact that she states a very obvious reason for getting vaccinated, not being tossed out of school, just makes the counterpoint even more effective.
“There is absolutely no reason to get the shot,” said Crystal McDonald, whose 16-year-old daughter was one of 66 students sent home from Palm Desert High School for the next two weeks because they did not have full measles immunizations.
After researching the issue and reading information from a national anti-vaccine advocacy group, Ms. McDonald said she and her husband, a chiropractor, decided to raise their four children without vaccines. She said they ate well and had never been to the doctor, and she insisted that her daughter was healthier than many classmates. But when the school sent her home with a letter, Ms. McDonald’s daughter was so concerned about missing two weeks of advanced-placement classes that she suggested simply getting a measles inoculation.
“I said, ‘No, absolutely not,’ “ Ms. McDonald said. “I said, ‘I’d rather you miss an entire semester than you get the shot.’ “
Perhaps if Ms. McDonald had a farm, she'd better understand inter-relationships and the associated risks she's laying on her children and anyone with whom they come in contact. Instead, she winds up with egg on her face.
How ironic thaT her husband is a chiropractor. A group of supposed physicians whose own profession is pretty much a sham.
Nowhere did I say that I am not against the vaccine or that because I went through it others should have to as well. My three kids have all received the vaccine, not because my wife and I were afraid of the virus, but because it is something unpleasant that my we didn’t want our kids to experience if they didn't have to. What I am against is forcing others to take the vaccine when they are afraid of it.
But fear in face of overwhelming science and proof isn't a rational concept. It's born out of either willful ignorance or some other preconceived biases. So if you are going to let that fear be the pretext to your decision that may or may not impact those around you, then I have no problem with those individuals (and their kids) being forced to be vaccinated if they want to use public services. However, if you want to hole up somewhere, go ahead.
Nowhere did I say that I am not against the vaccine or that because I went through it others should have to as well. My three kids have all received the vaccine, not because my wife and I were afraid of the virus, but because it is something unpleasant that my we didn’t want our kids to experience if they didn't have to. What I am against is forcing others to take the vaccine when they are afraid of it.
Good lord. Maybe people can educate themselves instead of being scared of life-saving medicine? Them not getting vaccinated affects everyone, not just their selfish, ignorant family. I will give you credit for dismissing hundreds of years of data on measles death because nobody you know died from it, though. Kudos.
then why is it that the guys in the rubber suits from the health dept. don’t show up on door steps and quarantine homes when someone comes down with it. If you worried about someone else “selfishly” spreading it to your family, then do the responsible thing and get your family vaccinated; that’s what I did. But you can bet if I thought for even a second that I would have been endangering any of my children more by giving them the vaccine (right or wrong), they would not have gotten it; and no there’s no one that could have forced me.
then why is it that the guys in the rubber suits from the health dept. don’t show up on door steps and quarantine homes when someone comes down with it. If you worried about someone else “selfishly” spreading it to your family, then do the responsible thing and get your family vaccinated; that’s what I did. But you can bet if I thought for even a second that I would have been endangering any of my children more by giving them the vaccine (right or wrong), they would not have gotten it; and no there’s no one that could have forced me.
Maybe my children are too young or have compromised immune systems and can't get vaccinated, genius...
I think there is a certain small percentage in which the vaccination may be ineffective and that is why it is so important most everyone does vaccinate for it to be truly effective for the general population. That and infants under the age of the schedule for vaccination who would all be at risk.
Quote:
If you worried about someone else “selfishly” spreading it to your family, then do the responsible thing and get your family vaccinated; that’s what I did.
PS I doubt there is anyone here that would do something to their children if they truly believed it would harm them, you aren't alone in that.
Fuck it. Why listen to doctors and the weight of evidence? Â
Then you have more than measles to worry about. Maybe we should mandate that everyone wear surgical masks and rubber suits when going into public.
Kicker it’s called personal freedom/choice, my body is my body and I have the right to decide what goes into it; and I owe no one an explanation when I say no. Would you rather let the government health system decide and determine what vaccinations we all should be subject to and then mandate them? And what about those who choose not to comply? Send out the goon squads to hold them down and forcibly vaccinate them. Once you give that freedom up, what’s next?
RE: If your children have compromised immune systems Â
Then you have more than measles to worry about. Maybe we should mandate that everyone wear surgical masks and rubber suits when going into public.
Kicker it’s called personal freedom/choice, my body is my body and I have the right to decide what goes into it; and I owe no one an explanation when I say no. Would you rather let the government health system decide and determine what vaccinations we all should be subject to and then mandate them? And what about those who choose not to comply? Send out the goon squads to hold them down and forcibly vaccinate them. Once you give that freedom up, what’s next?
Personally I'm more concerned with the precedent it would set if we allow the government to dictate what must go into our bodies.
FWIW, I'm very pro vaccine.
I like the idea of making it a tax, similar to the ACA.
Get vaccinated or pay a tax that will help offset the costs of public health.
And, of course, is based on no science that is credible. And, unfortunately, those who choose not to comply don't suffer the consequences of their actions; innocents (children) do, including those who aren't their children.
You are buying into the hysteria that the vaccine is Â
dangerous. It's not, not to 99.99999999 of the people. The risks of getting a disease, whether it's small pox or measles or any of them is much greater.
No one is saying that measles is Ebola or something that you will definitely die from. But people DO die from it. And having it is no picnic. Plus the fact that healthy kids not getting vaccinated will likely get exposed and can spread it to other kids who can't get vaccinated and who's health is not as good.
And let me ask you, if you are so concerned about vaccines Â
what do you feed your kids? Do you make sure every meal is sourced properly from approved foods? Do you smoke in the house? Do you use cleaning products that might cause issues? Do you let your kids play sports where they could get injured? Do you let them use computer screens that could screw up their brains? I mean, how far are you going to take this?
I'm working through mione now. I was celebrating another contract extension from one of those evil giant Pharmaceutical companies and, perhaps, overdid it just a bit. It's a lesson I very occasionally have to re-learn, but fortunately this morning's lesson is terribly taxing.
LOL, not to worry I'm the crème de la crème of typos.
A person diagnosed with measles went to Penn Station this week and boarded an Amtrak train, possibly exposing fellow passengers, New York health officials said Friday.
"Anyone traveling on Amtrak train #283 from Penn Station in NYC to Albany on January 25, 2015, and who is not immune to measles or not sure of their measles immunity, should contact their primary care physician if they become ill with fever," the New York State Department of Health said in a statement.
The person who took the 1:20 p.m. train and exited in Rhinecliff, N.Y., was previously at Bard College in Dutchess County, where the diagnosis was made.
continued ... - ( New Window )
Quote:
..."mine" and "isn't terribly taxing." See what I mean?
LOL, not to worry I'm the crème de la crème of typos.
I almost forgot; Goober says, "Hey!"
That sprang to mind because I suddenly remember an Andy Griffith show where the County Nurse was trying to vaccinate farmers in the area against Tetanus, and the farmers (one Rafe Hollister, I believe) used some of the same arguments we hear from the anti-vaxers (i.e., "I ain't never been sick a day in my life!")
It's kind of sad, as an above comment from Rob in CT/NY alluded to, that we're revisiting some of that same thinking in our supposedly more enlightened times.
Quote:
Was that just flat out funny then?
No. Why was it funny "for the Times?" The comment was neither subtle, nor particularly funny (sad, perhaps, even mind-boggling). Would you not have expected the Times to print such a statement? Your readership wants to know.
Then maybe its the hangover. Congrats on the extension. Calling your business partner "evil" in jest suggests you're working on a sense of humor.
The Times isn't known for its humor. There wasn't anything more in the parentheses. When a writer debunks its subject's quote in the very same sentence, its funny. That the subject was a sad moron makes it Onion-like.
Quote:
In comment 12116755 WideRight said:
Quote:
Was that just flat out funny then?
No. Why was it funny "for the Times?" The comment was neither subtle, nor particularly funny (sad, perhaps, even mind-boggling). Would you not have expected the Times to print such a statement? Your readership wants to know.
Then maybe its the hangover. Congrats on the extension. Calling your business partner "evil" in jest suggests you're working on a sense of humor.
The Times isn't known for its humor. There wasn't anything more in the parentheses. When a writer debunks its subject's quote in the very same sentence, its funny. That the subject was a sad moron makes it Onion-like.
Actually, I have a finely-honed sense of humour, although it can be over-subtle at times. And I disagree that The Times isn't known for humour...it just isn't obvious, like the Onion.
If we examine the entire quote, we see that humour, largely in the eye of the beholder and certainly present here, isn't so much an objective as is pointing out the sad lack of cognition on the part of Ms. McDonald and, by extension, the whole anti-vax "movement."
The fact that she states a very obvious reason for getting vaccinated, not being tossed out of school, just makes the counterpoint even more effective.
“There is absolutely no reason to get the shot,” said Crystal McDonald, whose 16-year-old daughter was one of 66 students sent home from Palm Desert High School for the next two weeks because they did not have full measles immunizations.
After researching the issue and reading information from a national anti-vaccine advocacy group, Ms. McDonald said she and her husband, a chiropractor, decided to raise their four children without vaccines. She said they ate well and had never been to the doctor, and she insisted that her daughter was healthier than many classmates. But when the school sent her home with a letter, Ms. McDonald’s daughter was so concerned about missing two weeks of advanced-placement classes that she suggested simply getting a measles inoculation.
“I said, ‘No, absolutely not,’ “ Ms. McDonald said. “I said, ‘I’d rather you miss an entire semester than you get the shot.’ “
Perhaps if Ms. McDonald had a farm, she'd better understand inter-relationships and the associated risks she's laying on her children and anyone with whom they come in contact. Instead, she winds up with egg on her face.
Quote:
On an Italian Court determining a direct link between the MMR and Autism Link - ( New Window )
Ludicrous.
Hey...but didn't their legal system also convict a bunch of scientists for not predicting an earthquake that killed a bunch of people? Or was that another crazy European nation?
My sister in law does exactly the same thing...has four kids and "homeschooled" all of them because she doesn't want anyone to tell her kids what to do. Her two older kids were vaccinated and are fine. Her two youngest ones have not been vaccinated yet her youngest has autism. Even though she recognizes that vaccination had nothing to do with the autism, she still refuses to vaccinate the two younger ones.
That entire family is just a damn mess.
Well...that explains how stupid that legal systems is then.
Quote:
In comment 12116674 NYG11 said:
Quote:
On an Italian Court determining a direct link between the MMR and Autism Link - ( New Window )
Ludicrous.
Hey...but didn't their legal system also convict a bunch of scientists for not predicting an earthquake that killed a bunch of people? Or was that another crazy European nation?
Sick Sad World - ( New Window )
I've seen that as well. Some of these people really get into the whole Life Coaching market (in which essential oil market is a huge part of it) and basically surround themselves with others with similar mentality. It's like the worst form of peer pressure and groupthink.
People do die from the measles. Do some research.
Measles is one of the leading causes of death among young children even though a safe and cost-effective vaccine is available.
In 2013, there were 145 700 measles deaths globally – about 400 deaths every day or 16 deaths every hour.
Measles vaccination resulted in a 75% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2013 worldwide.
In 2013, about 84% of the world's children received one dose of measles vaccine by their first birthday through routine health services – up from 73% in 2000.
During 2000-2013, measles vaccination prevented an estimated 15.6 million deaths making measles vaccine one of the best buys in public health.
Measles is a highly contagious, serious disease caused by a virus. In 1980, before widespread vaccination, measles caused an estimated 2.6 million deaths each year.
The disease remains one of the leading causes of death among young children globally, despite the availability of a safe and effective vaccine. Approximately 145 700 people died from measles in 2013 – mostly children under the age of 5.
{/quote]
Link - ( New Window )
Measles is one of the leading causes of death among young children even though a safe and cost-effective vaccine is available.
In 2013, there were 145 700 measles deaths globally – about 400 deaths every day or 16 deaths every hour.
Measles vaccination resulted in a 75% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2013 worldwide.
In 2013, about 84% of the world's children received one dose of measles vaccine by their first birthday through routine health services – up from 73% in 2000.
During 2000-2013, measles vaccination prevented an estimated 15.6 million deaths making measles vaccine one of the best buys in public health.
Measles is a highly contagious, serious disease caused by a virus. In 1980, before widespread vaccination, measles caused an estimated 2.6 million deaths each year.
The disease remains one of the leading causes of death among young children globally, despite the availability of a safe and effective vaccine. Approximately 145 700 people died from measles in 2013 – mostly children under the age of 5.
Measles is highly contagious; 90% of people who come in contact with someone with measles contract it, and can last up to 2 hours in the air or on surfaces. And, while measles may not be on the level of Ebola (seriously?), it often leads to secondary illnesses that do kill.
Namely, pneumonia or bronchitis.
People that "don't get" why measles are bad benefit from about a half a century of immunizations that have led to this development.
World Health Organization ... Updated November 2014 ...
Key facts
* Measles is one of the leading causes of death among young children even though a safe and cost-effective vaccine is available.
* In 2013, there were 145 700 measles deaths globally – about 400 deaths every day or 16 deaths every hour.
* Measles vaccination resulted in a 75% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2013 worldwide.
* In 2013, about 84% of the world's children received one dose of measles vaccine by their first birthday through routine health services – up from 73% in 2000.
* During 2000-2013, measles vaccination prevented an estimated 15.6 million deaths making measles vaccine one of the best buys in public health.
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Measles is a highly contagious, serious disease caused by a virus. In 1980, before widespread vaccination, measles caused an estimated 2.6 million deaths each year.
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If you choose to listen to others who claim to have read the literature, and then choose to believe them without reading it yourself, do not expect any benefit from all that work that was done.
If you chose to accept something that is promoted without any basic or clinical research supporting it, just don't pretend you know anything. And if you listen to soemone who says they know something when there is no knowledge, do not expect any benefit.
If it harms you, buyer beware.
Plus, what mindset is it that simply because we suffered through an illness, future generations should as well? The benefits of medical advancement are so that future generations do not have to suffer through similar afflictions that we did.
Measles being one.
For the life of me, I can't fathom the notion that because we have developed a highly successful vaccine against a highly contagious disease, because people lived through it and "no one around me died", we have an out against vaccination.
Perhaps (and maybe just perhaps), vaccinations also benefit these mal-nourished and under-developed country? Where sanitation and other health care services are nowhere near adequate? But nah, fuck them. America.
But to try to use two of the most deadly diseases in human history to compare the danger of measles seems...hmmm...ridiculous? It's almost like saying living in the urban sprawls of Chicago is perfectly safe because compared to Areppo, Syria, not too many people get killed in Chicago (even though that city has one of the highest gun deaths in the nation).
1) Science
2) Statistics
3) Medicine
People are scared because they are ill-informed (or mis-informed), which is why we have experts to help guide us to the correct decisions.
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In comment 12116756 BMac said:
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In comment 12116755 WideRight said:
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Was that just flat out funny then?
No. Why was it funny "for the Times?" The comment was neither subtle, nor particularly funny (sad, perhaps, even mind-boggling). Would you not have expected the Times to print such a statement? Your readership wants to know.
Then maybe its the hangover. Congrats on the extension. Calling your business partner "evil" in jest suggests you're working on a sense of humor.
The Times isn't known for its humor. There wasn't anything more in the parentheses. When a writer debunks its subject's quote in the very same sentence, its funny. That the subject was a sad moron makes it Onion-like.
Actually, I have a finely-honed sense of humour, although it can be over-subtle at times. And I disagree that The Times isn't known for humour...it just isn't obvious, like the Onion.
If we examine the entire quote, we see that humour, largely in the eye of the beholder and certainly present here, isn't so much an objective as is pointing out the sad lack of cognition on the part of Ms. McDonald and, by extension, the whole anti-vax "movement."
The fact that she states a very obvious reason for getting vaccinated, not being tossed out of school, just makes the counterpoint even more effective.
“There is absolutely no reason to get the shot,” said Crystal McDonald, whose 16-year-old daughter was one of 66 students sent home from Palm Desert High School for the next two weeks because they did not have full measles immunizations.
After researching the issue and reading information from a national anti-vaccine advocacy group, Ms. McDonald said she and her husband, a chiropractor, decided to raise their four children without vaccines. She said they ate well and had never been to the doctor, and she insisted that her daughter was healthier than many classmates. But when the school sent her home with a letter, Ms. McDonald’s daughter was so concerned about missing two weeks of advanced-placement classes that she suggested simply getting a measles inoculation.
“I said, ‘No, absolutely not,’ “ Ms. McDonald said. “I said, ‘I’d rather you miss an entire semester than you get the shot.’ “
Perhaps if Ms. McDonald had a farm, she'd better understand inter-relationships and the associated risks she's laying on her children and anyone with whom they come in contact. Instead, she winds up with egg on her face.
How ironic thaT her husband is a chiropractor. A group of supposed physicians whose own profession is pretty much a sham.
But fear in face of overwhelming science and proof isn't a rational concept. It's born out of either willful ignorance or some other preconceived biases. So if you are going to let that fear be the pretext to your decision that may or may not impact those around you, then I have no problem with those individuals (and their kids) being forced to be vaccinated if they want to use public services. However, if you want to hole up somewhere, go ahead.
Good lord. Maybe people can educate themselves instead of being scared of life-saving medicine? Them not getting vaccinated affects everyone, not just their selfish, ignorant family. I will give you credit for dismissing hundreds of years of data on measles death because nobody you know died from it, though. Kudos.
What is the point of this? The more people that are vaccinated, the closer we get to herd immunity.
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when someone comes to teh US who has not vaccinated.
What is the point of this? The more people that are vaccinated, the closer we get to herd immunity.
For some reason, I get the vibe the answer includes some version of "shoot Hispanic immigrants".
This is a problem of empty headed affluent people for the most part.
And this is why we have anti-vax dipshits.
Maybe my children are too young or have compromised immune systems and can't get vaccinated, genius...
PS I doubt there is anyone here that would do something to their children if they truly believed it would harm them, you aren't alone in that.
Kicker it’s called personal freedom/choice, my body is my body and I have the right to decide what goes into it; and I owe no one an explanation when I say no. Would you rather let the government health system decide and determine what vaccinations we all should be subject to and then mandate them? And what about those who choose not to comply? Send out the goon squads to hold them down and forcibly vaccinate them. Once you give that freedom up, what’s next?
Kicker it’s called personal freedom/choice, my body is my body and I have the right to decide what goes into it; and I owe no one an explanation when I say no. Would you rather let the government health system decide and determine what vaccinations we all should be subject to and then mandate them? And what about those who choose not to comply? Send out the goon squads to hold them down and forcibly vaccinate them. Once you give that freedom up, what’s next?
Personally I'm more concerned with the precedent it would set if we allow the government to dictate what must go into our bodies.
FWIW, I'm very pro vaccine.
I like the idea of making it a tax, similar to the ACA.
Get vaccinated or pay a tax that will help offset the costs of public health.
And, of course, is based on no science that is credible. And, unfortunately, those who choose not to comply don't suffer the consequences of their actions; innocents (children) do, including those who aren't their children.
No one is saying that measles is Ebola or something that you will definitely die from. But people DO die from it. And having it is no picnic. Plus the fact that healthy kids not getting vaccinated will likely get exposed and can spread it to other kids who can't get vaccinated and who's health is not as good.