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Reuben Randle is 23 years old

Great White Ghost : 2/25/2015 1:35 am
And has 3 years under his belt.
Victor Cruz was 2 years older than Randle is now when he started with us.

Randle's production, by year:

2012-298 yds
2013-611 yds
2014-938 yds

1847 career yds,avg 616 yds a year, 12 career TDS
1 fumble.

His production has increased by over 300 yds a year every year.In 131 career carries he has 1 fumble.One.

JPP is more than 2 years older, and is constantly touted for how young he is and how much upside there is to him.

He's STILL one of the youngest guys on the team, of over 90+ guys listed on the roster, 6, just six, are younger.
He's 6 months older than Beckham, who just got here and is a babe by NFL standards.

And he's not damaged.If we don't resign him after the year, one in which I think he's only going to get better, I think it will be more our loss than his.I also think some people are going to be suprised at what his next contract offer is.

My question is, why does what seems to me like most of this board think this guy is done, a waste, has no upside, won't improve, but ultimately and most of all won't be resigned and don't want him resigned?


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I take it you do not believe that teams have to plan  
Bob in Newburgh : 2/25/2015 9:12 am : link
for a maximum allocation limit of their cap dollars to position?
If they drafted a WR at #9  
JonC : 2/25/2015 9:16 am : link
his relatively inexpensive cap hit would be easily cost controlled for four seasons, at the end of which Cruz will be nearing 33. Much can change in a few seasons of wear and tear. I really doubt they'd pass on Amari Cooper because Randle's on the roster ...
Randle is why I don't think the Giants will pick a WR  
SHO'NUFF : 2/25/2015 9:24 am : link
at #9...and now the Marcus Harris buzz...even if Cruz doesn't come back to form, we have some insurance at WR...besides, we have other holes to fill...
i don't know why you would want to get rid of RR  
nyynyg : 2/25/2015 9:27 am : link
he easily a great 4th option if we draft high again and we have no idea how good of a 3 he could be. With question marks everywhere, it doesn't seem logical to get rid of a 23 yr old young WR with solid game experience and has flashed.
One of the reasons I wanted RR in the draft was his youth...  
Torrag : 2/25/2015 9:28 am : link
...and upside. It has taken several years but there were signs during the second half of last season he could be turning the corner. He has the requisite physical gifts to continue improving and then we'd have a dangerous weapon.
I agree with those who say Randle has no impact at all on  
Curtis in VA : 2/25/2015 9:32 am : link
their first round selection. They will pick the best player on THEIR board, without much (but maybe a little) consideration for the position.

As far as other holes that need filling, free agency does that well - and while the pool of players available has an element of hit and miss, its a much surer thing than filling holes in the draft. The Giants have some money this off-season and I expect them to spend it.
"Marcus Harris buzz"  
drkenneth : 2/25/2015 9:33 am : link
What buzz?
Bob: Here are the cap figures for last year's #9 pick, Anthony Barr:  
Big Blue Blogger : 2/25/2015 9:50 am : link
2014: $2,317,000
2015: $2,896,250
2016: $3,475,500
2017: $4,054,750
The projected cap hits for the 2015 #9 pick are about the same - a tiny bit higher. The $2.33MM number this year wouldn't really push the Giants' allocation to WRs beyond reason, with Beckham around $2.37MM and Randle still on his cheap rookie deal at $1.04MM. Cruz is the killer at $8MM+; but given his health situation, he's currently more of an argument for drafting a WR at 9 than against it.

Positional allocation of cap dollars becomes a bigger issue for 2016. At that point, there probably won't be room for Cruz's $9.9MM cap hit and a big second contract for Randle. There might not be room for either, if the 2015 #9 pick is a WR. But that problem might solve itself, if Randle doesn't earn a big payday, or if Cruz doesn't return to form.
Toomer  
PaulN : 2/25/2015 9:51 am : link
Was a player that did not even show as much as Randle, but he worked hard and made himself into a very good receiver. It was his 4th year when he started to become what we all hoped for.
Link - ( New Window )
Cubed  
JonC : 2/25/2015 9:57 am : link
Well said as usual, thank you.
I believe dollar decisions make a far bigger impact than team's admit  
Bob in Newburgh : 2/25/2015 10:27 am : link
And it can be done in small things like tie breakers.

And if you don't think that their are no ties on a big board where you are comparing apples to oranges, and everything on film is subjective analysis anyway then you are not thinking.

I would just love for the Giants to draft a WR at #9 to have that person or RR or Cruz sit on their ass all season while we stink elsewhere.
Randle being late to meeting  
ANGPASS : 2/25/2015 10:28 am : link
and running wrong routes may hurt him. If cooper or white is there, eli would be throwing to 3 number 1 WRs. That is insane. BTW the giants could draft a solid OL in round 2.
Pure bpa, like pure drafting for position  
Bob in Newburgh : 2/25/2015 10:28 am : link
is not a viable way for successful team building.
I don't advocate pure BPA  
JonC : 2/25/2015 10:33 am : link
but I do agree with drafting a WR at #9 over a RT or OG or DT, if the value/grade is virtually the same.
I don't think the Giants would 'prefer' to draft a WR #9  
Torrag : 2/25/2015 10:37 am : link
I think they'd rather have a grade on a prospect at one of several other positions such as DL/OL/S. If that isn't the case and a WR is the BPA they will take him.
I hope cooper or white is there at 9  
ANGPASS : 2/25/2015 10:40 am : link
Teams will be doubling OBJ every week. Cruz is 100% would eat everyone underneath on single coverage. Cooper/white would provide a big time threat on the other side. Randle could work in 4 wr sets or as insurance for cruz. the OL is one player away. they will get a scat back in the offseason too. This offense would be Extremely explosive.
I am still holding out hope  
gmen9892 : 2/25/2015 10:46 am : link
That Randle can turn into a solid Toomer-like receiver. The light seemed to start to come on at the end of last year and he flashed a couple of games throughout. He doesnt have to be a star when you have such a good WR in OBJ lining up on the other side. Just be reliable, and he has the hands to be that kind of receiver.

That said, I wouldnt mind taking a chance on Green-Beckham in the 2nd round if hes there, provided that we have addressed the OL or DL position in the first round.
RE: he was a major dissapointment over the first 14 games  
Great White Ghost : 2/25/2015 11:12 am : link
In comment 12151843 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:
Quote:
and then dropped 290 yds over the last 2 weeks. It was just a really unexpected end of the season from him.

It was a nice 2 game stretch where he took advantage of the attention ODB was getting and padded his final season numbers. But overall I just wasn't impressed with is season.

Name me the one skill that Randle has that really sets him apart from an average #2 WR? He's really not "great" at any one thing, and he isn't a technician either. He's just a pretty good 2/3 WR imo, he's never shown even a hint of being a true #1 WR.

Those last 2 games were nice and I'm glad he has one more season to prove me wrong. But as of right now he's just a pretty averagish player.
Ok, Granted. He isn't great at anything. Does he have to be? an avg #2 is fine by me. That makes him an above avg 3, no? I don't think he's billeted any higher than that, and he HAS shown he can exploit when attention is focused on another WR.Either way, he doesn't suck, I don't get the distatste for him, and although he did puff his stats at years end, 938yds is 938 yds any way you cut it. Most 1000 yd receivers got a little puff along the way from a softy team, just saying. Did I mention he is 23 and is only going to get better?
RE: I fear he maybe just not very bright  
Great White Ghost : 2/25/2015 11:22 am : link
In comment 12151878 mrvax said:
Quote:
in that case, he'll never be a good route runner because he'd be uncertain play after play.

If he just needs more time to learn the plays, he should have a breakout season coming up.

It just seems like he's a slow learner to me at home watching on TV. Could be wrong....
You are probably right. The guy that said he had maturity issues is probably right. I also think he is a little older now, learbned a thing or 2, and has time and the will to learn more. sure, mebbe he's a tad slow, but he's been at it a bit and I'm hoping, thinking, he's getting it figured out, both what it takes as a person to succeed, and what needs to be done on the field. With some it happens from day one, for some it takes longer than others, for some it never happens.I think he falls into the second category, I thik that's due to his youth, ans like someone said, maybe not a rhodes scholar. Smart enough to get out of college quite a bit earlier than some of his peers, so maybe he's not that dumb after all though.Maybe he comes up short again, but I don't think so.I think he knows what he has to do at this point, it's just a matter of will and preparation from here on out.
RE: I think people are sleeping on him  
Great White Ghost : 2/25/2015 11:24 am : link
In comment 12151882 SLIM_ said:
Quote:
Going out on a limb and say that he should be a priority resigning for the team THIS year. He is probably going to command too much in free agency if we let him hit next year. This would be a cheap solid signing right now. The downside is that he is actually a bone head and we may (not definitely) need to absorb a modest cap hit a couple years from now.
This is where I'm at.If we don't resign him I think it will be more a case of ,we can't afford it, than, we can't use him.
He is only 23 y/0  
AnishPatel : 2/25/2015 12:02 pm : link
but I am still indifferent about him. Just an inconsistent player, who has the skills to be good, but just inconsistent. Not to mention, not sure what his breaking the rules and stuff was all about. This year is his contract year. Let's hope he produces and follows the rules, and doesn't have a contract year like Nicks did for us from lack of production to getting fined.

I still want another WR because I am not sure what to expect from Cruz and again, we may or may not re-sign RR. So I still want more offensive talent surrounding eli.
RE: I think RR has flashed, but the real ? is:  
Toth029 : 2/25/2015 12:05 pm : link
In comment 12151992 drkenneth said:
Quote:
Are you going to give him a 2nd contract?

I don't think so.

If he performs up to his expectations in 2015, why not?
Depends on this year.  
AnishPatel : 2/25/2015 12:07 pm : link
Also other issues we don't know on how the staff view him, and if he can get better. If not, then perhaps we go with guys that can get better YAC yards in this system.
Yes, he did  
Doomster : 2/25/2015 12:29 pm : link
jack up his stats in the last two games...in 14 games, 2 td's...last two, 1 td....in 14 games, just three games over 60 yards...in last two, 2 games....

His route running is suspect....does not possess great speed....

But, this is his 4th year....he either gets it or doesn't....it's also a contract year.....if he has a big year, it will be hard to re-sign him.....
RE: he was a major dissapointment over the first 14 games  
chris r : 2/25/2015 12:31 pm : link
In comment 12151843 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:
Quote:
and then dropped 290 yds over the last 2 weeks. It was just a really unexpected end of the season from him.

It was a nice 2 game stretch where he took advantage of the attention ODB was getting and padded his final season numbers. But overall I just wasn't impressed with is season.

Name me the one skill that Randle has that really sets him apart from an average #2 WR? He's really not "great" at any one thing, and he isn't a technician either. He's just a pretty good 2/3 WR imo, he's never shown even a hint of being a true #1 WR.

Those last 2 games were nice and I'm glad he has one more season to prove me wrong. But as of right now he's just a pretty averagish player.


I agree with you but with Beckham being great and Cruz potentially being a very good number 2, Randle being an average 2/3 is more than enough. Especially with all the other holes the team has.
When he came into the league...  
Damon : 2/25/2015 12:35 pm : link
he was 20 years old. Not your typical Rook. He will only get better. Randle should be the biggest beneficiary of OBJ and a healthy Cruz.
RE: RE: I think RR has flashed, but the real ? is:  
drkenneth : 2/25/2015 12:35 pm : link
In comment 12152424 Toth029 said:
Quote:
In comment 12151992 drkenneth said:


Quote:


Are you going to give him a 2nd contract?

I don't think so.


If he performs up to his expectations in 2015, why not?


So you pay a guy who's had 1 year out of 4 "up to his expectations"?

Does that sound like wise investment to you?
If the talent is there at a position of need when we pick...  
manh george : 2/25/2015 12:37 pm : link
I would be really surprised if we go wr. What is wrong with getting a wr who can compete strongly for #3 around the third round? Meanwhile, get an OL, DL in #1 and one of those or an LB in #2. We have greater needs elsewhere, by a lot.
The offense needs another weapon.  
drkenneth : 2/25/2015 12:47 pm : link
That's a fact. I don't give a shit whether it's a WR/RB or TE.

Ruben Randle won't be on the team in 2016. Cruz is coming off a major knee, Our RBs need an upgrade, TEs are Meh.
RE: The offense needs another weapon.  
chris r : 2/25/2015 12:50 pm : link
In comment 12152511 drkenneth said:
Quote:
That's a fact. I don't give a shit whether it's a WR/RB or TE.

Ruben Randle won't be on the team in 2016. Cruz is coming off a major knee, Our RBs need an upgrade, TEs are Meh.


Its not a fact. How many weapons does Brady have. Or Wilson last year?
Wilson had the best RB in the game.  
drkenneth : 2/25/2015 12:57 pm : link
Brady is Brady.

Look- I'm not suggesting that the OL and D don't need to be addressed.

I just find it funny that all of a sudden people think the defense is a massive train wreck. I'm not as down on the defense as a lot of folks are.

I think getting rid of Fewell is addition by subtraction, we have top CBs, JPP will be back, Hankins looks to be a legit DT, Moore/Ayers/Wynn/Kennard. It isn't THAT bad.

We get the same people who piss and moan about the LBs, when it's clear the organization doesn't value them as much. Yet, these people still scram for a LB high in the draft.
All I'm suggesting is that a WR at #9  
drkenneth : 2/25/2015 12:58 pm : link
isn't out of the question. That's all.

Randle's chances of being on this team in 2016 are minimal.
Because he is inconsistent, and was seemingly passed on the  
PatersonPlank : 2/25/2015 1:00 pm : link
depth chart by Free Agent pickups during the season. Guys like Cruz, Nicks, and OBJ came in and contributed right away.
RE: Wilson had the best RB in the game.  
chris r : 2/25/2015 1:06 pm : link
In comment 12152536 drkenneth said:
Quote:
Brady is Brady.

Look- I'm not suggesting that the OL and D don't need to be addressed.

I just find it funny that all of a sudden people think the defense is a massive train wreck. I'm not as down on the defense as a lot of folks are.

I think getting rid of Fewell is addition by subtraction, we have top CBs, JPP will be back, Hankins looks to be a legit DT, Moore/Ayers/Wynn/Kennard. It isn't THAT bad.

We get the same people who piss and moan about the LBs, when it's clear the organization doesn't value them as much. Yet, these people still scram for a LB high in the draft.


Brady and Wilson both had one elite weapon and a bunch of other average at best weapons.

We have one elite weapon and a bunch of other average weapons + Cruz being an x factor.

Another weapon would be nice but there are so many other needs I'm not sure if its a must right now.
I hear ya. I'm just not in the "sky is falling" camp  
drkenneth : 2/25/2015 1:10 pm : link
in regards to the defense. This is the NFL in 2015, the difference between 7-9 & 10-6 isn't that much.

Shit- If the D makes 2 stops last year, we probably win 2 more games.

That being said, I'm cool with adding another DL somewhere, just not sure the it will be at #9.

As of right now, it looks like WR or one of the OL is best value.

I want to see him go over  
chops : 2/25/2015 1:12 pm : link
1,000 yrds in 2015.
The claim the Giants draft BPA is unsupported by fact  
WillieYoung : 2/25/2015 4:13 pm : link
2007 team's biggest need corner (after 2 wills implode)-- Pick 25 year old corner Aaron Ross
2008 big need safety (started 7th round draft pick Michael Johnson in 2007) Pick Safety Kenny Phillips
2009 Biggest need wr after Plax arrest - - Pick Hakeem Nicks
2010 BPA Pick (JPP)
2011 Prince was a combination need/BPA pick
2012 Biggest Need running back after Bradshaw/Jacobs decline- - Pick RB Wilson
2013 Biggest need tackle - - pick T Pugh of Syracuse
2014 BPA Pick at a position of need (OBJ)
So what your saying is  
Headhunter : 2/25/2015 4:16 pm : link
the Giants no other positions of need and they had 1 hole and tried to fill it with their first around pick. Interesting
I am in the  
Doomster : 2/25/2015 4:20 pm : link
I just find it funny that all of a sudden people think the defense is a massive train wreck. I'm not as down on the defense as a lot of folks are.

I think getting rid of Fewell is addition by subtraction, we have top CBs, JPP will be back, Hankins looks to be a legit DT, Moore/Ayers/Wynn/Kennard. It isn't THAT bad.


Spag's doesn't have the horses.....

Who are your backup corners if one goes down again?

How do you know JPP will be back? And if franchised, how will he play?

Hankins is your only tested lineman....right now, Ayers can't lift a coffee cup.....Moore is not a starter, yet.....Wynn had one game he can show the grand kids.....Kennard, has to stay on the field, and if he can, has to make plays....

Who is your MLB? Who are your starting safeties? You will need two DE's, one DT, and you will need backups everywhere...
No Headhunter  
WillieYoung : 2/25/2015 4:34 pm : link
what I'm saying is that if the Giants are drafting BPA, it is an astonishing coincidence that the BPA in almost every year since Reese took over filled a major need. I don't believe in coincidences
What if the sky falls?  
drkenneth : 2/25/2015 5:18 pm : link
What if our #1 pick gets hits by a bus?

What if?
What if  
Doomster : 2/25/2015 5:43 pm : link
the Giants win the SB? I've been told TC wins one every four years....it's a fact....NOT!
RE: No Headhunter  
Great White Ghost : 2/26/2015 12:56 am : link
In comment 12152949 WillieYoung said:
Quote:
what I'm saying is that if the Giants are drafting BPA, it is an astonishing coincidence that the BPA in almost every year since Reese took over filled a major need. I don't believe in coincidences


we need a RC, and Wison is BPA. we desperately need a OL the next year after diehl and snee are gone, Pugh is BPA. Next year, Nicks leaves,we take a WR#1,because hey, BPA. My ass.

BPA is subjective, players are ranked by tier, not in some strict numerical order.they can take whoever they like from a row of players and call him BPA without technically lying.
The Giants BPA is based on their assessment  
blueblood : 2/26/2015 9:40 am : link
and their board.. which we dont see.. and honestly I dont think they have to go through any smokescreen to convince the fans.. They pick who they pick..

RE: RE: RE: I think RR has flashed, but the real ? is:  
Ten Ton Hammer : 2/26/2015 9:46 am : link
In comment 12152490 drkenneth said:
Quote:
In comment 12152424 Toth029 said:


Quote:


In comment 12151992 drkenneth said:


Quote:


Are you going to give him a 2nd contract?

I don't think so.


If he performs up to his expectations in 2015, why not?



So you pay a guy who's had 1 year out of 4 "up to his expectations"?

Does that sound like wise investment to you?


I don't understand why you think this is so crazy.

He's improved year to year, and it's not like he's going to command a ton of money to re-sign unless, like many receivers, he suddenly has a breakout year in year 4.
With Randle it all comes down to attitude and desire  
Coach Mason : 2/26/2015 10:37 am : link
to get better. He has a bit of that diva gene and you wonder how he will react once he gets paid. The Giants at the end of year will decide if he is worth the gamble to give big $$$ to.
TTH: If he gets his head out of his ass,  
drkenneth : 2/26/2015 10:43 am : link
and doesn't break the bank, fine. But as it stands right now, there is no way they pay him.
Randle wont get a big contract  
NYG007 : 2/26/2015 11:59 am : link
anywhere, let alone from us for 2016. He'll be had for about the same deal Mario go in SF when he left. The only team that will overpay for him will be The Redskins (if RR has a decent year with us next year).

I'm also extremely confident our pick at #9 is Fowler, Cooper or White. I dont think anyone outside those 3 is worthy of our 9th pick.

We could drop down a few and get Shaq still if those 3 are gone
Never say Never  
blueblood : 2/26/2015 12:05 pm : link
Randle hopefully has matured and realizes that he can be a big part of the offense and a player in this league... I am hoping that he is turning the corner. That will only help us for 2015.
Randle Maturing > - ( New Window )
NYG007: The Manningham comp has one crucial flaw.  
Big Blue Blogger : 2/27/2015 4:19 am : link
Yes, their stats through three years are strikingly similar, they make the same type of mental mistakes, and they both raised expectations by putting up big numbers at the end of their third seasons.

The key point to remember about Manningham is that he struggled through an injury-plagued contract year, opening the door to Cruz's breakout season. His knee problems go all the way back to 2006, and he entered free agency as damaged goods - Super Bowl hero or not. Say what you will about Randle; he's really durable. Has he ever missed a game at any level? That's a huge difference between him and Mario, and suggests that he will be able to stay on the field and continue his improvement in 2015. Randle also doesn't carry the drug risk that has dogged Manningham throughout his career, nor does he bear the stigma of a Wonderlic score more befitting a parakeet than a human being.

If Randle raises his receiving total by 300 yards this season, as he has in each previous year of his career, or even by 200, he will be very popular next March. While that's a big "if", obviously. it's well within the realm of possibility.
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