Reuben Randle is 23 years old

I hope it really starts to ckick with him next season.

All other things being equal, they like to go young -- Old Man Aaron Ross not withstanding.

and then dropped 290 yds over the last 2 weeks. It was just a really unexpected end of the season from him.

It was a nice 2 game stretch where he took advantage of the attention ODB was getting and padded his final season numbers. But overall I just wasn't impressed with is season.

Name me the one skill that Randle has that really sets him apart from an average #2 WR? He's really not "great" at any one thing, and he isn't a technician either. He's just a pretty good 2/3 WR imo, he's never shown even a hint of being a true #1 WR.

Those last 2 games were nice and I'm glad he has one more season to prove me wrong. But as of right now he's just a pretty averagish player.

Don't you know you need pro bowl players at every damn position to compete in this league! The worse part of the off season is reading and listening to fans unreasonable expectations of players.

But I liked what Randle produced at the end of the year. Nothing flashy but he got the job done and I am looking forward to seeing if that continues.

In each case, an unfortunate remark from Reese/Ross created unrealistic expectations that have hung over the player for three years. Robinson was "the JPP of tight ends"; Randle was an "NFL-ready" receiver. I think it's our own fault, for attaching too much importance to press-conference remarks from team officials who probably hadn't slept in days and who were naturally happy to have landed players they had targeted.

In Randle's case, here's a pre-draft warning that seems to have hit the mark:

Quote:

Randle is still developing many of his skills and will be more a "betting on the come" prospect. He still looked uncomfortable running some routes within his route tree and isn't to a point where he is actively thinking about how to sell his corner on every play to lend to his own separation. He will take his eye off the ball across the middle and is inconsistent with his physicality. He isn't a real sudden, explosive mover and could be blanketed early on in his career.

The hype around Randle as a potential first-round pick was way off, and he had no business being in the Green Room at Radio City. (He was the last invitee to be drafted.) He does have NFL skills though. If his productivity continues to ramp up - as it surely could if he and Beckham both stay healthy - he'll become a wealthy young man next March, though possibly not here.
NFL.com Prospect Profile: Rueben Randle - ( New Window )

Robinson at least was known to be a project from Day 1. Randle didn't even have that much leeway - though he probably should have, as the 63rd pick and a very young rookie.

I also wonder how badly Randle was set back by spending his first two years with an inexperienced position coach whose main qualification appears to have been membership in the Lucky Sperm Club.

In comment 12151851 Big Blue Blogger said:

Quote:

In each case, an unfortunate remark from Reese/Ross created unrealistic expectations that have hung over the player for three years. Robinson was "the JPP of tight ends"; Randle was an "NFL-ready" receiver. I think it's our own fault, for attaching too much importance to press-conference remarks from team officials who probably hadn't slept in days and who were naturally happy to have landed players they had targeted. In Randle's case, here's a pre-draft warning that seems to have hit the mark: Quote: Randle is still developing many of his skills and will be more a "betting on the come" prospect. He still looked uncomfortable running some routes within his route tree and isn't to a point where he is actively thinking about how to sell his corner on every play to lend to his own separation. He will take his eye off the ball across the middle and is inconsistent with his physicality. He isn't a real sudden, explosive mover and could be blanketed early on in his career. The hype around Randle as a potential first-round pick was way off, and he had no business being in the Green Room at Radio City. (He was the last invitee to be drafted.) He does have NFL skills though. If his productivity continues to ramp up - as it surely could if he and Beckham both stay healthy - he'll become a wealthy young man next March, though possibly not here. NFL.com Prospect Profile: Rueben Randle - ( New Window )

This^^^ is both a point and a quote I have linked before in Randle discussions. I would add that perhaps because of Reese's quote re Randle, people compare him to Steve Smith (far more NFL ready, and a good bit quicker and faster according to his combine #s) and Hakeem Nicks (again MUCH more NFL ready and simply a better, more dominant skill set that was pretty clear from his college tape, but also a 1st round pick, not last of the 2nd round). When actually by draft position, he could be just as easily compared to Jerrel Jernigan or Ramses Barden...

Also, there seems to be a maturity issue with RR, that perhaps having OBJ around helps, for whatever reasons.

I like Randle well enough, not crazy about him because he has some annoying habits that hopefully are coachable. One is he tends to leap for balls and then catch them about waist high, which hurts his RAC ability. He doesn't use his length well. On the flip side, he has better than decent hands and usually hand catches balls, and he will fight for contested balls and win a good % of them, I think... I like the effort and results of his blocking, typically, so he's not a selfish guy.

is something that really bothers a lot of people. It's as if that 1 quote is the reason RR isn't up to our collective expectations. It's bizarre.

He's not going to be a great WR. But at his age I'll gladly take him as our 3rd option and even our 2nd in a pinch.

could be a very big piece to the puzzle, a huge piece

In comment 12151855 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

is something that really bothers a lot of people. It's as if that 1 quote is the reason RR isn't up to our collective expectations. It's bizarre. He's not going to be a great WR. But at his age I'll gladly take him as our 3rd option and even our 2nd in a pinch.

Yeah, I remember that and said 'Wow! We might have have that bigger bodied receiver we've been looking for.' Yikes!

Let's hope it carries over into '15.

in that case, he'll never be a good route runner because he'd be uncertain play after play.

If he just needs more time to learn the plays, he should have a breakout season coming up.

It just seems like he's a slow learner to me at home watching on TV. Could be wrong....

He has started to really flash big play ability. I think he is a lot like Toomer in that he is a long strider. I hope he stays beyond next season.

Going out on a limb and say that he should be a priority resigning for the team THIS year. He is probably going to command too much in free agency if we let him hit next year. This would be a cheap solid signing right now. The downside is that he is actually a bone head and we may (not definitely) need to absorb a modest cap hit a couple years from now.

If we can continue to get 900 yards a season from I would be happy with that. Every team needs role player guys that can produce like Randle (assuming last year was a natural progression)

It took OB's performance to wake him up. But, if Randle keeps it up from now on, we've got a solid third WR.

However, it also begs the question of what it will take to retain him a year from now.

Combined with the change of receivers coach, be part of randle's breakout? Everyone knows how difficult the route trees were in gilbrides offense. Ben Mac's offense is supposed to be receiver friendly.

I don't know too many guys who played QB that are dim bulbs. I'm not saying you need to be an Einstein, but you need something upstairs

Deal this year But they won't and then Reese will draft another WR early as a hedge. Guy is like a crack addict. He would die without spending an early

Reese has spent a huge amount of resources on that position and it's why there are huge holes at almost every other position group. But half the people here wll give him another lifetime pass for OBJ.

I'm still amazed that guys who have been playing football for 10 years aren't good route runners. It might be hard to get a whole lot faster, jump a lot higher or even to catch the ball as well as OBJ, but I'm amazed that many D-1 college guys haven't yet learned to make decisive cuts to precise places.

That said, I think RR will have an excellent year.

which shows how stupid some fans can be. Let's cut a young, cheap WR that has plenty of room to grow. Genius idea.

keeping and justifies the pick.

have an effect on their big board, even though they would probably claim otherwise.

If they feel he is at least a legitimate #2 for the 2015 season, they may not really be looking at the Big 3 wrs.

draft pick, but far from a bust either. He's developing into a solid #2 or better yet #3 WR on a contending team. I don't think he'd hit his peak yet.

If we don't draft a WR in the first few rounds, it might be a savvy move to try and extend him for a few years at an affordable rate. If he has say a 1000+ yard year this upcoming season, I wouldn't want to pay him at the UFA rate.

on whether we take WR at 9. If the Giants have Cooper/White rated highly and one is there, I'd be absolutely stunned if that wasn't the pick.

Are you going to give him a 2nd contract?

I don't think so.

from picking a WR at #9. You upgrade talent when you can, especially premium positions when you're drafting so high. WR may very well be the BPA at #9 too, more likely than RT/OG, DT, etc. Reese will go playmaker, if one's there.

for a maximum allocation limit of their cap dollars to position?

his relatively inexpensive cap hit would be easily cost controlled for four seasons, at the end of which Cruz will be nearing 33. Much can change in a few seasons of wear and tear. I really doubt they'd pass on Amari Cooper because Randle's on the roster ...

at #9...and now the Marcus Harris buzz...even if Cruz doesn't come back to form, we have some insurance at WR...besides, we have other holes to fill...

he easily a great 4th option if we draft high again and we have no idea how good of a 3 he could be. With question marks everywhere, it doesn't seem logical to get rid of a 23 yr old young WR with solid game experience and has flashed.

...and upside. It has taken several years but there were signs during the second half of last season he could be turning the corner. He has the requisite physical gifts to continue improving and then we'd have a dangerous weapon.

their first round selection. They will pick the best player on THEIR board, without much (but maybe a little) consideration for the position.

As far as other holes that need filling, free agency does that well - and while the pool of players available has an element of hit and miss, its a much surer thing than filling holes in the draft. The Giants have some money this off-season and I expect them to spend it.

What buzz?

2014: $2,317,000
2015: $2,896,250
2016: $3,475,500
2017: $4,054,750
The projected cap hits for the 2015 #9 pick are about the same - a tiny bit higher. The $2.33MM number this year wouldn't really push the Giants' allocation to WRs beyond reason, with Beckham around $2.37MM and Randle still on his cheap rookie deal at $1.04MM. Cruz is the killer at $8MM+; but given his health situation, he's currently more of an argument for drafting a WR at 9 than against it.

Positional allocation of cap dollars becomes a bigger issue for 2016. At that point, there probably won't be room for Cruz's $9.9MM cap hit and a big second contract for Randle. There might not be room for either, if the 2015 #9 pick is a WR. But that problem might solve itself, if Randle doesn't earn a big payday, or if Cruz doesn't return to form.

Was a player that did not even show as much as Randle, but he worked hard and made himself into a very good receiver. It was his 4th year when he started to become what we all hoped for.
Link - ( New Window )

Well said as usual, thank you.

And it can be done in small things like tie breakers.

And if you don't think that their are no ties on a big board where you are comparing apples to oranges, and everything on film is subjective analysis anyway then you are not thinking.

I would just love for the Giants to draft a WR at #9 to have that person or RR or Cruz sit on their ass all season while we stink elsewhere.

and running wrong routes may hurt him. If cooper or white is there, eli would be throwing to 3 number 1 WRs. That is insane. BTW the giants could draft a solid OL in round 2.

is not a viable way for successful team building.

but I do agree with drafting a WR at #9 over a RT or OG or DT, if the value/grade is virtually the same.

I think they'd rather have a grade on a prospect at one of several other positions such as DL/OL/S. If that isn't the case and a WR is the BPA they will take him.

Teams will be doubling OBJ every week. Cruz is 100% would eat everyone underneath on single coverage. Cooper/white would provide a big time threat on the other side. Randle could work in 4 wr sets or as insurance for cruz. the OL is one player away. they will get a scat back in the offseason too. This offense would be Extremely explosive.

That Randle can turn into a solid Toomer-like receiver. The light seemed to start to come on at the end of last year and he flashed a couple of games throughout. He doesnt have to be a star when you have such a good WR in OBJ lining up on the other side. Just be reliable, and he has the hands to be that kind of receiver.

That said, I wouldnt mind taking a chance on Green-Beckham in the 2nd round if hes there, provided that we have addressed the OL or DL position in the first round.

In comment 12151843 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:

Quote:

and then dropped 290 yds over the last 2 weeks. It was just a really unexpected end of the season from him. It was a nice 2 game stretch where he took advantage of the attention ODB was getting and padded his final season numbers. But overall I just wasn't impressed with is season. Name me the one skill that Randle has that really sets him apart from an average #2 WR? He's really not "great" at any one thing, and he isn't a technician either. He's just a pretty good 2/3 WR imo, he's never shown even a hint of being a true #1 WR. Those last 2 games were nice and I'm glad he has one more season to prove me wrong. But as of right now he's just a pretty averagish player.

Ok, Granted. He isn't great at anything. Does he have to be? an avg #2 is fine by me. That makes him an above avg 3, no? I don't think he's billeted any higher than that, and he HAS shown he can exploit when attention is focused on another WR.Either way, he doesn't suck, I don't get the distatste for him, and although he did puff his stats at years end, 938yds is 938 yds any way you cut it. Most 1000 yd receivers got a little puff along the way from a softy team, just saying. Did I mention he is 23 and is only going to get better?

In comment 12151878 mrvax said:

Quote:

in that case, he'll never be a good route runner because he'd be uncertain play after play. If he just needs more time to learn the plays, he should have a breakout season coming up. It just seems like he's a slow learner to me at home watching on TV. Could be wrong....

You are probably right. The guy that said he had maturity issues is probably right. I also think he is a little older now, learbned a thing or 2, and has time and the will to learn more. sure, mebbe he's a tad slow, but he's been at it a bit and I'm hoping, thinking, he's getting it figured out, both what it takes as a person to succeed, and what needs to be done on the field. With some it happens from day one, for some it takes longer than others, for some it never happens.I think he falls into the second category, I thik that's due to his youth, ans like someone said, maybe not a rhodes scholar. Smart enough to get out of college quite a bit earlier than some of his peers, so maybe he's not that dumb after all though.Maybe he comes up short again, but I don't think so.I think he knows what he has to do at this point, it's just a matter of will and preparation from here on out.

In comment 12151882 SLIM_ said:

Quote:

Going out on a limb and say that he should be a priority resigning for the team THIS year. He is probably going to command too much in free agency if we let him hit next year. This would be a cheap solid signing right now. The downside is that he is actually a bone head and we may (not definitely) need to absorb a modest cap hit a couple years from now.

This is where I'm at.If we don't resign him I think it will be more a case of ,we can't afford it, than, we can't use him.

but I am still indifferent about him. Just an inconsistent player, who has the skills to be good, but just inconsistent. Not to mention, not sure what his breaking the rules and stuff was all about. This year is his contract year. Let's hope he produces and follows the rules, and doesn't have a contract year like Nicks did for us from lack of production to getting fined.

I still want another WR because I am not sure what to expect from Cruz and again, we may or may not re-sign RR. So I still want more offensive talent surrounding eli.

In comment 12151992 drkenneth said:

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Are you going to give him a 2nd contract? I don't think so.

If he performs up to his expectations in 2015, why not?

Also other issues we don't know on how the staff view him, and if he can get better. If not, then perhaps we go with guys that can get better YAC yards in this system.

jack up his stats in the last two games...in 14 games, 2 td's...last two, 1 td....in 14 games, just three games over 60 yards...in last two, 2 games....

His route running is suspect....does not possess great speed....

But, this is his 4th year....he either gets it or doesn't....it's also a contract year.....if he has a big year, it will be hard to re-sign him.....

In comment 12151843 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:

Quote:

and then dropped 290 yds over the last 2 weeks. It was just a really unexpected end of the season from him. It was a nice 2 game stretch where he took advantage of the attention ODB was getting and padded his final season numbers. But overall I just wasn't impressed with is season. Name me the one skill that Randle has that really sets him apart from an average #2 WR? He's really not "great" at any one thing, and he isn't a technician either. He's just a pretty good 2/3 WR imo, he's never shown even a hint of being a true #1 WR. Those last 2 games were nice and I'm glad he has one more season to prove me wrong. But as of right now he's just a pretty averagish player.

I agree with you but with Beckham being great and Cruz potentially being a very good number 2, Randle being an average 2/3 is more than enough. Especially with all the other holes the team has.

he was 20 years old. Not your typical Rook. He will only get better. Randle should be the biggest beneficiary of OBJ and a healthy Cruz.

In comment 12152424 Toth029 said:

Quote:

In comment 12151992 drkenneth said: Quote: Are you going to give him a 2nd contract? I don't think so. If he performs up to his expectations in 2015, why not?

So you pay a guy who's had 1 year out of 4 "up to his expectations"?

Does that sound like wise investment to you?

I would be really surprised if we go wr. What is wrong with getting a wr who can compete strongly for #3 around the third round? Meanwhile, get an OL, DL in #1 and one of those or an LB in #2. We have greater needs elsewhere, by a lot.

That's a fact. I don't give a shit whether it's a WR/RB or TE.

Ruben Randle won't be on the team in 2016. Cruz is coming off a major knee, Our RBs need an upgrade, TEs are Meh.

In comment 12152511 drkenneth said:

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That's a fact. I don't give a shit whether it's a WR/RB or TE. Ruben Randle won't be on the team in 2016. Cruz is coming off a major knee, Our RBs need an upgrade, TEs are Meh.

Its not a fact. How many weapons does Brady have. Or Wilson last year?

Brady is Brady.

Look- I'm not suggesting that the OL and D don't need to be addressed.

I just find it funny that all of a sudden people think the defense is a massive train wreck. I'm not as down on the defense as a lot of folks are.

I think getting rid of Fewell is addition by subtraction, we have top CBs, JPP will be back, Hankins looks to be a legit DT, Moore/Ayers/Wynn/Kennard. It isn't THAT bad.

We get the same people who piss and moan about the LBs, when it's clear the organization doesn't value them as much. Yet, these people still scram for a LB high in the draft.

isn't out of the question. That's all.

Randle's chances of being on this team in 2016 are minimal.

depth chart by Free Agent pickups during the season. Guys like Cruz, Nicks, and OBJ came in and contributed right away.

In comment 12152536 drkenneth said:

Quote:

Brady is Brady. Look- I'm not suggesting that the OL and D don't need to be addressed. I just find it funny that all of a sudden people think the defense is a massive train wreck. I'm not as down on the defense as a lot of folks are. I think getting rid of Fewell is addition by subtraction, we have top CBs, JPP will be back, Hankins looks to be a legit DT, Moore/Ayers/Wynn/Kennard. It isn't THAT bad. We get the same people who piss and moan about the LBs, when it's clear the organization doesn't value them as much. Yet, these people still scram for a LB high in the draft.

Brady and Wilson both had one elite weapon and a bunch of other average at best weapons.

We have one elite weapon and a bunch of other average weapons + Cruz being an x factor.

Another weapon would be nice but there are so many other needs I'm not sure if its a must right now.

in regards to the defense. This is the NFL in 2015, the difference between 7-9 & 10-6 isn't that much.

Shit- If the D makes 2 stops last year, we probably win 2 more games.

That being said, I'm cool with adding another DL somewhere, just not sure the it will be at #9.

As of right now, it looks like WR or one of the OL is best value.

1,000 yrds in 2015.

2007 team's biggest need corner (after 2 wills implode)-- Pick 25 year old corner Aaron Ross
2008 big need safety (started 7th round draft pick Michael Johnson in 2007) Pick Safety Kenny Phillips
2009 Biggest need wr after Plax arrest - - Pick Hakeem Nicks
2010 BPA Pick (JPP)
2011 Prince was a combination need/BPA pick
2012 Biggest Need running back after Bradshaw/Jacobs decline- - Pick RB Wilson
2013 Biggest need tackle - - pick T Pugh of Syracuse
2014 BPA Pick at a position of need (OBJ)

the Giants no other positions of need and they had 1 hole and tried to fill it with their first around pick. Interesting

I just find it funny that all of a sudden people think the defense is a massive train wreck. I'm not as down on the defense as a lot of folks are.

I think getting rid of Fewell is addition by subtraction, we have top CBs, JPP will be back, Hankins looks to be a legit DT, Moore/Ayers/Wynn/Kennard. It isn't THAT bad.


Spag's doesn't have the horses.....

Who are your backup corners if one goes down again?

How do you know JPP will be back? And if franchised, how will he play?

Hankins is your only tested lineman....right now, Ayers can't lift a coffee cup.....Moore is not a starter, yet.....Wynn had one game he can show the grand kids.....Kennard, has to stay on the field, and if he can, has to make plays....

Who is your MLB? Who are your starting safeties? You will need two DE's, one DT, and you will need backups everywhere...

what I'm saying is that if the Giants are drafting BPA, it is an astonishing coincidence that the BPA in almost every year since Reese took over filled a major need. I don't believe in coincidences

What if our #1 pick gets hits by a bus?

What if?

the Giants win the SB? I've been told TC wins one every four years....it's a fact....NOT!

In comment 12152949 WillieYoung said:

Quote:

what I'm saying is that if the Giants are drafting BPA, it is an astonishing coincidence that the BPA in almost every year since Reese took over filled a major need. I don't believe in coincidences

we need a RC, and Wison is BPA. we desperately need a OL the next year after diehl and snee are gone, Pugh is BPA. Next year, Nicks leaves,we take a WR#1,because hey, BPA. My ass.

BPA is subjective, players are ranked by tier, not in some strict numerical order.they can take whoever they like from a row of players and call him BPA without technically lying.

and their board.. which we dont see.. and honestly I dont think they have to go through any smokescreen to convince the fans.. They pick who they pick..

In comment 12152490 drkenneth said:

Quote:

In comment 12152424 Toth029 said: Quote: In comment 12151992 drkenneth said: Quote: Are you going to give him a 2nd contract? I don't think so. If he performs up to his expectations in 2015, why not? So you pay a guy who's had 1 year out of 4 "up to his expectations"? Does that sound like wise investment to you?

I don't understand why you think this is so crazy.

He's improved year to year, and it's not like he's going to command a ton of money to re-sign unless, like many receivers, he suddenly has a breakout year in year 4.

to get better. He has a bit of that diva gene and you wonder how he will react once he gets paid. The Giants at the end of year will decide if he is worth the gamble to give big $$$ to.

and doesn't break the bank, fine. But as it stands right now, there is no way they pay him.

anywhere, let alone from us for 2016. He'll be had for about the same deal Mario go in SF when he left. The only team that will overpay for him will be The Redskins (if RR has a decent year with us next year).

I'm also extremely confident our pick at #9 is Fowler, Cooper or White. I dont think anyone outside those 3 is worthy of our 9th pick.

We could drop down a few and get Shaq still if those 3 are gone

Randle hopefully has matured and realizes that he can be a big part of the offense and a player in this league... I am hoping that he is turning the corner. That will only help us for 2015.
Randle Maturing > - ( New Window )

Yes, their stats through three years are strikingly similar, they make the same type of mental mistakes, and they both raised expectations by putting up big numbers at the end of their third seasons.

The key point to remember about Manningham is that he struggled through an injury-plagued contract year, opening the door to Cruz's breakout season. His knee problems go all the way back to 2006, and he entered free agency as damaged goods - Super Bowl hero or not. Say what you will about Randle; he's really durable. Has he ever missed a game at any level? That's a huge difference between him and Mario, and suggests that he will be able to stay on the field and continue his improvement in 2015. Randle also doesn't carry the drug risk that has dogged Manningham throughout his career, nor does he bear the stigma of a Wonderlic score more befitting a parakeet than a human being.

If Randle raises his receiving total by 300 yards this season, as he has in each previous year of his career, or even by 200, he will be very popular next March. While that's a big "if", obviously. it's well within the realm of possibility.